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RareAcumen posted:Name them Berserk, Rage of Bahamut, Attack on Titan. It is funny that this studio's previous output is Fairly Oddparents and Adventure Time
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Jul 8, 2021 12:43
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Deadwood is probably the single greatest TV show ever produced so if that’s what you’re holding Castlevania up against then I’m pretty ok with that being the standard against which all other TV shows are judged.
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Jul 8, 2021 12:49
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Bust Rodd posted:Dialogue complainers: which shows do you think have better dialogue and character interplay than this show? I want to hear what you think smooth, natural dialogue sounds like. Dang this escalated quickly. No one is even saying the dialogue is actually bad. Sometimes curses make dialogue better, more natural and more pressing. And sometimes it's superfluous. I personally feel that the last season had a little too much of it which made some of it sound cheapish or try hard. roomtone posted:I wasn't going to reply about this but since its been posted several times I wanted to clarify. It isn't about the swearing itself, it's the repetitive and obvious way it gets used. Nobody gives a gently caress about swearing one way or the other. If you think that's what I'm criticising and the other couple of people who get it are talking about then you've got a blindspot. You expect a sailor to be cursing all day long. You don't expect Sypha to curse all day long, so when she suddenly does break out in curses we care. Not because she cursed, but because she never cursed before. It says something about her at that point.
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Jul 8, 2021 12:56
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I personally think the relentlessness of the swear words is what makes them feel like they are contributing to the atmosphere of poo poo and death and less like sprinkles of flavor to spice up dialogue. Vlad doesn’t swear, because he wouldn’t waste a single breath on us swine if he can help it. CSG only swears when he’s talking about something disdainful or beneath him, like when he refers to the common folk around or when he’s talking down to vampires. Trevor swears like a soldier, it’s as much a part of him as his vampire hunting. Sypha swears because she is MAD and GRUMPY and TIRED and PREGNANT… I dunno, I really can’t think of anyone whose swearing I would call unnatural, but again, I’m from New York and taught in Philadelphia public schools, and absolutely everyone in Philadelphia has the foul mouth of trucker. Gosh, I think Isaac might say “poo poo” as a no sell in one scene but otherwise he doesn’t swear either, I think for the same reasons as Dracula. Isaac isn’t one for wasted motion or worthless efforts. Swearing doesn’t serve a purpose for Isaac, so he would never do it.
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Jul 8, 2021 13:05
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Shageletic posted:Trevor versus the monsters invading the Belmont castlve. Breathtaking poo poo. Same. I enjoyed that they always made it clear that Trevor was having to bust his rear end to hold his own against all the demons and monsters and what not. It never looked effortless the way it does for Alucard or even Sypha to some extent (by S4 at least). Trevor was constantly getting the poo poo kicked out of him or knocked around in just about every fight but uses everything at his disposal - skills, weapons, and the environment - to get the win. With that in mind I wonder how they will distinguish Richter's fighting style, given that he'll have the benefit of being a magic user as well as training under whatever monster hunter knowledge that the new village will have between Alucard, Trevor, and Sypha but not the Vampire Killer or Morningstar whips (at least until he finds them in the castle). I don't see him being the same sort of brawler as Trevor. Bust Rodd posted:I personally think the relentlessness of the swear words is what makes them feel like they are contributing to the atmosphere of poo poo and death and less like sprinkles of flavor to spice up dialogue. Vlad doesn’t swear, because he wouldn’t waste a single breath on us swine if he can help it. CSG only swears when he’s talking about something disdainful or beneath him, like when he refers to the common folk around or when he’s talking down to vampires. Trevor swears like a soldier, it’s as much a part of him as his vampire hunting. Sypha swears because she is MAD and GRUMPY and TIRED and PREGNANT… That might be part of the reason that the swearing seems so pronounced by S4; most of the more "refined" or restrained characters have been shuffled off the board to some extent. Bust Rodd posted:I dunno, I really can’t think of anyone whose swearing I would call unnatural, but again, I’m from New York and taught in Philadelphia public schools, and absolutely everyone in Philadelphia has the foul mouth of trucker. This explains a lot.
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Jul 8, 2021 14:09
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Bust Rodd posted:Again, it’s funny to critique Ellis for his dialogue, it’s like critiquing Gaiman for his stories being too whimsical or critiquing Moore because his stories are too cerebral… that’s literally the thing he is most famously known for doing better than literally anyone else in their industry. I think Chip Zdasrsky is known for doing patter, and then there are people like Pat Mills and a few others who are know for dialogue too. Ellis i always thought was known for his fascination with detail, and his long periods of dialogue-less action. When the dialogue does turn up, it's strong and pithy (it'd have to be, right?), but yeah, when people say Ellis i don't think dialogue. Quite the opposite.
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Jul 8, 2021 14:18
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I think some red headed lady swearing as she shoots someone in the head, maybe a bloody in there too
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Jul 8, 2021 14:41
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Bust Rodd posted:Dialogue complainers: which shows do you think have better dialogue and character interplay than this show? I want to hear what you think smooth, natural dialogue sounds like. quote:Again, it’s funny to critique Ellis for his dialogue, it’s like critiquing Gaiman for his stories being too whimsical or critiquing Moore because his stories are too cerebral… that’s literally the thing he is most famously known for doing better than literally anyone else in their industry. "You can criticize something because it's like that on purpose" is not an argument. Also the Castlevania IP is not his. You could have an adaptation that's not like this at all. quote:Gosh, I think Isaac might say “poo poo” as a no sell in one scene but otherwise he doesn’t swear either, Spermando fucked around with this message at 15:25 on Jul 8, 2021 |
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Jul 8, 2021 15:18
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Spermando posted:Fate: Zero, Futurama, Attack on Titan, Devilman... I'm not the biggest fan of the dialogue in those shows, but there's a much bigger effort to make everyone sound different and the writing has more tricks than self-aware quips and edgy dialogue. You mean the translation.
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Jul 8, 2021 16:08
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It's not a good look if the facsimile of a product has more nuance than an all-original product.
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Jul 8, 2021 16:36
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Spermando posted:It's not a good look if the facsimile of a product has more nuance than an all-original product. Stories get looser in the retelling of them, that's all I'm saying.
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Jul 8, 2021 16:53
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Attack on Titan is just a bunch of ppl screaming. Just typical shounen stuff. Fate Zero is alot better. But its great regarding characterization and the brutality of the plotting. It never delighted in its own dialogue like Castlevania did, and it never even got close to making me laugh. E: Devilman is the grimmest loving thing I've ever seen
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Jul 8, 2021 16:59
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Devilman: Crybaby is awesome but yeah, I wouldn’t recommend to most people, only true freaks
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Jul 8, 2021 17:02
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Bust Rodd posted:Devilman: Crybaby is awesome but yeah, I wouldn’t recommend to most people, only true freaks It's literally the only one in that list I'd recommend LOL
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Jul 8, 2021 17:04
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I would absolutely not want that to be someone’s first exposure to anime
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Jul 8, 2021 17:17
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Bust Rodd posted:I would absolutely not want that to be someone’s first exposure to anime Depending, of course, on what they were previously into before you recommended it to them. It's a surefire rec for anyone who's really into surreal horror.
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Jul 8, 2021 17:52
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devilman was something. the way it utterly destroys the typically protected characters had me laughing in disbelief towards the end. heads on sticks. psycho storytelling. i should watch that again someday.
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Jul 8, 2021 17:59
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Bust Rodd posted:I would absolutely not want that to be someone’s first exposure to anime Nah it'd be good for a laugh.
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Jul 8, 2021 18:11
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How about anime classic Cyber City Oedo 808? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2Q6AwrGUkQ
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Jul 8, 2021 20:11
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Yeah this is simply how people talk in animation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZADmRukyvA
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Jul 8, 2021 20:16
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Mat Cauthon posted:Same. I enjoyed that they always made it clear that Trevor was having to bust his rear end to hold his own against all the demons and monsters and what not. It never looked effortless the way it does for Alucard or even Sypha to some extent (by S4 at least). Trevor was constantly getting the poo poo kicked out of him or knocked around in just about every fight but uses everything at his disposal - skills, weapons, and the environment - to get the win. Same. While everyone looked amazingly badass I found that I was always looking forward more to Trevor's fights purely because of the physicality of it. Despite looking thoroughly outmatched compared to his peers he manages to kill just as much rear end. The flips, the whips the throwing of whatever was at hand. It's good choreography. What I also keep liking is how (despite the variable length of the whip) he was always stepping on the whip to change the direction, swinging it behind him, wrapping his arm. It made it seem like he was actually controlling it instead of the whip just magically following his will. It's the living embodiment of what he says to Alucard. "Killing you was the point, walking away a bonus." Or something like that.
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Jul 9, 2021 07:28
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zoux posted:Yeah this is simply how people talk in animation Still the gold standard in Animation Swearing. Highly recommended.
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Jul 9, 2021 17:58
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Darth TNT posted:Same. While everyone looked amazingly badass I found that I was always looking forward more to Trevor's fights purely because of the physicality of it. Despite looking thoroughly outmatched compared to his peers he manages to kill just as much rear end. The flips, the whips the throwing of whatever was at hand. It's good choreography. What I also keep liking is how (despite the variable length of the whip) he was always stepping on the whip to change the direction, swinging it behind him, wrapping his arm. It made it seem like he was actually controlling it instead of the whip just magically following his will. So I was in the circus and can do a lot of the same tricks that Trevor was doing. The animators are quite familiar with rope-darts, which aren’t really shaped like whips. A whip with a heavily waited tip would not work as a whip anymore, it would become a flail, but the way Trevor pinches the lead with his elbow, the fancy footsteps, wrapping it around parts of his body to adjust where the tip lands, all of that is actually a really old form of martial arts using the dart as a ceremonial weapon, mixed in with a bunch of the more dramatic flourishes developed by circus performers and fire clowns over the last several years that have no real combat application but look sick. Whoever animated those sequences is up to date on the most modern moves with those toys.
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Jul 9, 2021 18:16
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That's really awesome to know actually. I just thought all of that was to spice up the regular whip attacks that the games always have but it's cool to know there's actually a purpose behind all of it.
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Jul 9, 2021 20:17
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Bust Rodd posted:So I was in the circus and can do a lot of the same tricks that Trevor was doing. The animators are quite familiar with rope-darts, which aren’t really shaped like whips. A whip with a heavily waited tip would not work as a whip anymore, it would become a flail, but the way Trevor pinches the lead with his elbow, the fancy footsteps, wrapping it around parts of his body to adjust where the tip lands, all of that is actually a really old form of martial arts using the dart as a ceremonial weapon, mixed in with a bunch of the more dramatic flourishes developed by circus performers and fire clowns over the last several years that have no real combat application but look sick. Whoever animated those sequences is up to date on the most modern moves with those toys. There was a video I came across a while back of someone doing rope-dart moves, and even watching it in very slowmotion I am utterly convinced at one point it passes clean through his torso. Fancy rope-dart is the best.
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Jul 9, 2021 20:26
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Those are called “false knots”, where you gather the lead in two pinches at one point on your body, and they are the basis for all the most theatrical moves. You keep one pinched lead on your thumb and build more pinches, wrapping tighter and tighter so it looks like you’re completely wrapped up, but releasing the tension on your one thumb releasing all the coils, and if you’re moving when it happens then yes, it creates an optical illusion of the rope “breaking” exactly like those old dollar store magic rope kits. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1xSCXnc4Pk Bust Rodd fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Jul 9, 2021 |
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Jul 9, 2021 20:29
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Bust Rodd posted:Those are called “false knots”, where you gather the lead in two pinches at one point on your body, and they are the basis for all the most theatrical moves. You keep one pinched lead on your thumb and build more pinches, wrapping tighter and tighter so it looks like you’re completely wrapped up, but releasing the tension on your one thumb releasing all the coils, and if you’re moving when it happens then yes, it creates an optical illusion of the rope “breaking” exactly like those old dollar store magic rope kits. Cool yeah! And awesome about your circus background. I knew it was based on something real, because I remember seeing it once on some x got talent show. Didn’t remember the name though. Well that and even higher level Yo-yo people use other parts of their bodies to make it go in new directions. Obviously what Trevor does is impossible considering the length but rooting it in realism like this makes it just that much more awesome and…I guess believable? It helps my suspension of disbelief.  I was disappointed when Trevor started using his sword more. The whip is where it’s at.
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Jul 9, 2021 20:42
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Open Source Idiom posted:I think Chip Zdasrsky is known for doing patter, and then there are people like Pat Mills and a few others who are know for dialogue too. Ellis i always thought was known for his fascination with detail, and his long periods of dialogue-less action. Pretty much, Ellis falls into the camp with the likes of Bendis and Millar. The dialogue sounds snappy and flows yeah, but the more you listen/read it the more it feels like everyone is talking in the same 'voice' and most lines could be said by anyone without any effort.
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Jul 9, 2021 23:07
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I finished season 3. As usual the animation went super hard the last 2 eps. Also a lot more nudity than expected. I didn’t really buy the Japanese duos turn on Alucard, that was the only part of the season the seemed to come out of nowhere and not feel natural to the characters. Alucard felt superfluous this season.
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Jul 10, 2021 01:09
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Macdeo Lurjtux posted:Pretty much, Ellis falls into the camp with the likes of Bendis and Millar. The dialogue sounds snappy and flows yeah, but the more you listen/read it the more it feels like everyone is talking in the same 'voice' and most lines could be said by anyone without any effort. Isaac and Dracula were the real standouts in terms of tone of dialogue. S3 St. Germain, as well
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Jul 10, 2021 20:26
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Characters just kinda blurt out what they're thinking/doing all the time. Like, I'm having a hard time coming up with a moment in the show where someone isn't literally spelling out their motivations or thoughts.
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Jul 10, 2021 20:51
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Sypha really seemed to love killing monsters as she rode around with Trevor in season 3. They joked about all the crazy poo poo they came across and snuggled. A couple minutes into season 4 she’s killing goblins and swearing and saying he ruined her life by making her into a monster hunter. I know bad stuff happened in the previous town but like... I thought monster killing was her kinda thing?
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Jul 11, 2021 04:36
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Ccs posted:Sypha really seemed to love killing monsters as she rode around with Trevor in season 3. They joked about all the crazy poo poo they came across and snuggled. A couple minutes into season 4 she’s killing goblins and swearing and saying he ruined her life by making her into a monster hunter. I know bad stuff happened in the previous town but like... I thought monster killing was her kinda thing? Monster killing is her thing. Monster killing for 4 weeks straight is not her thing.
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Jul 11, 2021 05:54
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As Trevor said: 'Killing Dracula is the plan. Surviving is just a bonus' They were still riding the high of actually having won that fight with no casualties.
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Jul 11, 2021 06:08
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It's not just slaying monsters but the whole events of the season 3 finale, and that they've been having to break up literal death cults of regular humans sacrificing each other the whole time too. Kinda the whole point is that the fight is wearing on everyone; even Alucard outright realises he's becoming more like Belmont because he's just at the end stage of the journey they're on, dealing with the idiocy and monstrosity of humans as well as monsters.
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Jul 11, 2021 06:11
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Yeah having to go around killing people and watching people die was clearly weighing on her. There's also a big difference between "We'll kill this monster and then everything will be fixed" and "We'll kill these monsters then kill some other monsters and keep reacting to monsters in other places forever".
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Jul 11, 2021 12:25
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Also pretty funny with the lady who has the guts to march up to literal Dracula's castle (I suppose something in common with Alucard's mom, eh?) and note that the dreaded dhampir lord is a depressed, drunken wreck who really just needs someone to talk to and something to do other than be an attractive nuisance. I feel like relationships and community is a big theme in season 4, with every character starting to be defined by their relation to others- their friends, family and found family, lords and masters, and romantic partners. The vampire sisters having their own relationships and dynamics that they realise too late have become toxic; Hector and Isaac seeming to realise that despite their differences, they're still peers as demon forgemasters and among the few people they can really talk to on the same level...
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Jul 11, 2021 13:16
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Ghost Leviathan posted:It's not just slaying monsters but the whole events of the season 3 finale, and that they've been having to break up literal death cults of regular humans sacrificing each other the whole time too. Kinda the whole point is that the fight is wearing on everyone; even Alucard outright realises he's becoming more like Belmont because he's just at the end stage of the journey they're on, dealing with the idiocy and monstrosity of humans as well as monsters. She was also pregnant at the time, so it's possible she's just feeling everything more than she would because of all the extra hormones that's stimulating in her body. It's probably more meant to emphasize just how tired she is and how Trevor has rubbed off on her (just like he rubbed off on Alucard), and the pregnancy thing might not even have occurred to anyone but it might be part of it too.
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Jul 11, 2021 15:18
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I feel that's more, you hang out with someone long enough, you start talking like they do, that's how speech works. She just notices more because she's a Speaker, that's kind of her thing.
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Jul 11, 2021 15:35
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Was St Germain's girlfriend even real or was that all part of Death's plans? They never referred to her name and she didn't have any speaking lines. For all we know the memory of her could have been completely fabricated.
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Jul 11, 2021 19:37
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