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Max
Nov 30, 2002



I claimed 3p because I am.

Thatís more tinfoil theories. Are you going to look at my play this game and reconcile being scum with hal and kB or not?

And I thought you said clord was who you could see being scum. Where did that read go?

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Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

Toalpaz posted:

What's the town angle on claiming 3rd party?

You're anticipating being copped, although for all you should know as town (being the cop) is that you won't be copped.

You claimed 3rd party survivor hoping town cops or trackers wouldn't 'waste' their n1 on you while knowing scum wasn't going to hit you. Scum Imo.

##vote Max

uuughhhhhhhh, this makes such good sense. Damnit!

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

Max posted:

I claimed 3p because I am.

Thatís more tinfoil theories. Are you going to look at my play this game and reconcile being scum with hal and kB or not?

And I thought you said clord was who you could see being scum. Where did that read go?

ahhh, my mind put back at ease by reason

Max
Nov 30, 2002



AA I claimed cop to you say 2, yes?

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

Max posted:

AA I claimed cop to you say 2, yes?

Yeah he began day 2 with the claim. Paraphrased:
Cops, I am also one.
I didn't want you to kill me, but this is why I asked who you would investigated.
ASF isn't scum.

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

During thanksgiving he says(paraphrased):
AA if you were a cop
an investigation on sal wouldn't be a bad idea right
hmmm
i'm going to post
I've indulged in spirits and need to engage to curb this boredom

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

It would have been a flawless crumb trail on his part. I mean it IS possible, but I believe he's been sincere.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



A few choice Toal quotes about KB:

Toalpaz posted:

Yeah I don't have a firm grasp on when KB is acting scummy or not tbh so I'd have to trust other reads there. A lot of KB's posting is just :lofty: statements and votes that I find somewhat incomprehensible but end up being decently well reasoned later. (Because he likes playing word games and actually setting traps rather than playing the good town strat of just being honest.)

Toalpaz posted:

I said I found you hard to read cause I don't understand your posting on a meta level. So I don't have a solid read of you this game. If you don't like my comment about word games that's really outside the bounds of this game, and isn't necessarily connected to any one thing you wrote in this game.

I've seen you play scum and town and I can't really notice the difference like in the same way I feel I can with certain players, thats all.

These are the two posts about KB you made. I see, mostly, waffling back and forth on how you have trouble reading KB here without ever committing to KB as someone you are suss on, a courtesy you only extended to him as you pressed other players for opinions and came up with cases on them. You did vote for KB, but only after an investigation was revealed.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Reasoning for this push: Either Toal is in extreme tinfoil land and I'm hoping they get back to looking at posting and not just thinking up ways people could possibly be scum.

Or Toal is scum, saw me claim the cop, and now suddenly has a problem with me and wants me voted out, especially since I've clearly thrown in with town at this point and won't be helpful to the scum team anymore as an extra vote in end game.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Anyway, I think I'm going to ##vote Toal

Max
Nov 30, 2002



What are other people's thoughts on this?

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

What if masonry is actually scumdoc?

It seems like a hell of a gambit.

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

SalTheBard posted:

What if masonry is actually scumdoc?

It seems like a hell of a gambit.

Lmao no, but that would have been good.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Yeah I guess, ask yourself if everything I've done this game is one big gambit for no reason whatsoever.

ASF already claimed a one shot redirect, there was a scum godfather, and now a town visitor. In a game with enough bullshit to screw up an investigation, I would not need to be as paranoid as Toal is painting me, and I certainly wouldn't have pulled everything that I have to put the spotlight on myself constantly.

chaoslord
Jan 28, 2009

Nature Abhors A Vacuum




Here is where I'm at with everyone:

AA: I toyed with the idea that "Max 3p claimed and AA scum claimed and they came to an understanding", but Max was way too aggressive in pursuing scum for that to make any sense.

b-minus1: Town result per max.

chaoslord: I'm useless this game

Max: I believe Max and think he is throwing his lot in with town. I had some ~game theory~ about voting him but imo it's not a worthwhile way to go.

Nep-nep: Doc

Sal: Vigged a scum, became a miller.

Hawke: Told me he wasn't scum :hfive: Also caught a scum.

Toal: Messenger that has been accounted for sending a message every night I believe. Was roleblocked on the night with no kills, but there was a doc protect that night too.

Looking over things....

If there is only one scum left, I don't know who it could possibly be.

If there are two scum left? At that point I'm in on Toal. The other half is interesting though.

Has anyone else besides ASF and Toal been roleblocked this game? ASF claimed a failure N2 and then was responsible for Toal's failure. With as few VTs as there are I would expect more success out of a RB if it was an every night thing. If not, I wonder if it's a scum JOAT. Could it be a Sal gambit? Killing a teammate is always a risky proposition for scum but I can think of multiple games where scum did it and rode the credit for a long time, including to wins.

IDK. Looking at the claims I am coming around on there being 2 scum left. I suspect if that is the case that I will be lunched after Toal and that is fine, I have been garbo we have a mislunch in our pocket.

I guess the other possibility that jumps to my mind is dual godfathers and it's toal/b- but I doubt that one.

Hm. Yep, that's all I got. Ok, back to work, I'll be tossing these ideas around in my head.

b-minus1
Jul 24, 2008

She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before


Asiina was roleblocked n1

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

Lol clord are you saying I'm scum and max is de facto scum by his wincon.

So long as you acknowledge he is 3p this let's me know you are scum like I've suspected all along

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

I got docced not roleblocked or jailed and both town and scum blocks are dead soooo. You played yourself

##vote clord

He acknowledges max is 3p

chaoslord
Jan 28, 2009

Nature Abhors A Vacuum




Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Lol clord are you saying I'm scum and max is de facto scum by his wincon.

So long as you acknowledge he is 3p this let's me know you are scum like I've suspected all along

I think you misread my post, but thatís fine, I am going to be voted out either today or tomorrow and thatís ok, itís not gonna hurt anything

chaoslord
Jan 28, 2009

Nature Abhors A Vacuum




b-minus1 posted:

Asiina was roleblocked n1

Thanks! Shoots Sal down, then.

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

chaoslord posted:

Thanks! Shoots Sal down, then.

Yeah. I think me claiming the Hal kill should've done that but w/e

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

chaoslord posted:

I think you misread my post, but thatís fine, I am going to be voted out either today or tomorrow and thatís ok, itís not gonna hurt anything

I did, my bad!

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

##vote toal

This is still the best, imo. Why would max come out as non-town to me not knowing anything about the cop economy in this game, AND also aggressively pursue scum...

Toalpaz
Mar 20, 2012

Peace through overwhelming determination


I dunno my guys, I'm just trying to understand the game. Clord is my best guess after Max. But like... Yeah. The case against Clord is that he's lurking low effort disheartened scum. I am a messenger, and have no other roles or alignment other than town. I couldn't have framed n3 and been rb by ASF confirmed town, I also don't think scum would be able to kill and message, I don't really know where to start but after Clord and the masonry are the least confirmed as town of all of us.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



In a game where night actions are not making sense, maybe take a step back from them and look at posting?

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Why couldn't you have been framed and roleblocked?

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Oh no, I see, you couldn't have framed and roleblocked, now I get it.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Hmmmmmmmmmm

Toalpaz posted:

Clord is my best guess after Max. But like... Yeah.

Toalpaz posted:

Clord is the only person that makes sense to me as scum this game at this point. The lack of cases and setup spec that's easyish to contribute, even if you're scum being cornered by town confirming itself. It's looking like there's two scum left and since CLord is only one poster it has me asking questions about who scum team is.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



This is a bad gambit for scum. I'm going to flip cop and then Toal is going to be in some poo poo unless they can successfully argue that I was lying about my results, or he'll shrug his shoulders and go "hmm, I guess something else caused the result to be wrong, oh well"

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Night actions aren't making sense and clord hasn't been playing very well and could very well be scum. Let's kill Max.

I don't get it.

Toalpaz
Mar 20, 2012

Peace through overwhelming determination


I mostly voted cause AA voted me and it gave me the scarios considering how many times we've turbod peeps this game (2 right?),

b-minus1
Jul 24, 2008

She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before


ok i've put off reading this thread all day. time to get caught up.

b-minus1
Jul 24, 2008

She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before


there is no way that we have 4 investigative roles in this setup without a scumcop or sanity fuckery.

SHALASHASKA HAWKE
Nov 9, 2016

No child soldier in poverty by 1990


if you míre Needs. DEsires, force you to play night Action Bingo you probably want to test that Chaoslord Claim. Hold it up to the camera for Applause; and receive jeers from all the girls.

if you want to play some god-drat Mafia; ##vote Nep Np

Nep-Nep
May 15, 2004

Just one more thing!


Though I'm in disagreement with his vote I think Hawke has the right of it in that with something fishy going on with the night actions we shouldn't be basing our voting decisions purely on night results, though they can provide some context.

Right now looking at Max there's the claim of cop. So far that has lead to an ML, but that isn't particularly telling in any direction right now. Their argument with Toalpaz looks good, in general tells a consistent story and fairly dismisses possible theories against as tinfoil. It is possible Max is scum? Maybe, but right now I'd say it's not enough to vote for.

Clord has been a bit more active today than I can remember previous days. In terms of his content, I don't get the insistence on why the scum team must be a certain size or why it is so hard to believe a scum messenger couldn't kill and message at the same time, in part because I was in a game where I think it was the case that such a thing could happen. I'm not certain if this is a "too informed" situation to defend a teammate or just being set on one's opinion. I do note that he acknowledges the possibility of Toal being scum if there is another scum team member.

Toalpaz overall I feel has been kinda going for weird gambit theories:

Day 2

Toalpaz posted:

This is also ignoring the fact that clever and daring scum could have actually killed Flerp, and some other party killed Hal. Hal's death led to you opportunistically claiming to have killed Hal. You survive, and whoever kills Hal doesn't kill you yet because they're x-shot or 3rd party trying to blend in.


But that's just :tinfoil: theory.

Honestly believe the Sal is prob town, I just think that you and others shouldn't consider it outside the realms of possibility that Sal could be scum.

I don't have much to add on this one since Toal describes it as a :tinfoil: theory on their own.

Not a theory but also odd play from that day imo

Toalpaz posted:

Yeah I'm going to leave a vote on ##vote B- just for this cause it's annoying and if B- really is scum I'm not getting owned like this:

This was in reference to b-minus openly stating "I'm scum"

and then some stuff jumps out at me here from today

Toalpaz posted:

Imo, Max could be the framer. The cop claim was because scum team lost a few members early and needed safe claims, and they could pocket townies with 'results' on them. AA even floated the idea of 2 godfathers for balance so they could push B- or ASF in the future (maybe the Max floated the idea first in masonry/scumdoc, who knows). It was quite convenient at the time that everyone 'AA' or Max had copped was in the game and hadn't died yet, and claiming to have copped Reggae was safe scum result cause they would know (as scum) scum had also framed Reggae and correctly anticipated Hawke copping Reggae.

This is mostly omgusy because Max is claiming a second scum result and its on me, another town. But I think it has to be one of the mason players. I encourage you all to make your own reads on the players rather than rely on the unreliable cops for now.

For the record I think AA's posting has been very different from what I'm used to but at times it has reminded me of his scumplay in Buffy. I know this is because the Mason chat is toning him down, but his arguments with Reggae remind me of that.

So day 2 Toal establishes a foundation for why it could be worth pushing Sal late in the game, downplays it in the same post as a tinfoil theory, but then shades AA for doing something similar with the 2 godfathers idea to "push b- or asf."

Ignoring the kinda hypocrisy there, I have a problem with this assertion- Max was the one who investigated b- and asf. Why bother coming up with this theory at all when the simpler thing to do would be to claim something like "n1 I investigated hal, but he died. N2 I investigated kb to see if hawke was playing us" and leave us in the dark about b-minus and asf? Then there would be no need to sell us on some 2 godfather idea to maybe get us to vote out players they're clearing? It's too complicated.

In general I feel like a lot of Toal's arguments rely on proposing players acted in ways that are significantly more complicated than other choices they could have made without having a substantial increase in payoff.

##vote Toal

b-minus1
Jul 24, 2008

She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before


##vote toalpaz

SHALASHASKA HAWKE
Nov 9, 2016

No child soldier in poverty by 1990


Nep-Nep posted:

Though I'm in disagreement with his vote I think Hawke has the right of it in that with something fishy going on with the night actions we shouldn't be basing our voting decisions purely on night results, though they can provide some context.

Right now looking at Max there's the claim of cop. So far that has lead to an ML, but that isn't particularly telling in any direction right now. Their argument with Toalpaz looks good, in general tells a consistent story and fairly dismisses possible theories against as tinfoil. It is possible Max is scum? Maybe, but right now I'd say it's not enough to vote for.

Clord has been a bit more active today than I can remember previous days. In terms of his content, I don't get the insistence on why the scum team must be a certain size or why it is so hard to believe a scum messenger couldn't kill and message at the same time, in part because I was in a game where I think it was the case that such a thing could happen. I'm not certain if this is a "too informed" situation to defend a teammate or just being set on one's opinion. I do note that he acknowledges the possibility of Toal being scum if there is another scum team member.

Toalpaz overall I feel has been kinda going for weird gambit theories:

Day 2


I don't have much to add on this one since Toal describes it as a :tinfoil: theory on their own.

Not a theory but also odd play from that day imo


This was in reference to b-minus openly stating "I'm scum"

and then some stuff jumps out at me here from today


So day 2 Toal establishes a foundation for why it could be worth pushing Sal late in the game, downplays it in the same post as a tinfoil theory, but then shades AA for doing something similar with the 2 godfathers idea to "push b- or asf."

Ignoring the kinda hypocrisy there, I have a problem with this assertion- Max was the one who investigated b- and asf. Why bother coming up with this theory at all when the simpler thing to do would be to claim something like "n1 I investigated hal, but he died. N2 I investigated kb to see if hawke was playing us" and leave us in the dark about b-minus and asf? Then there would be no need to sell us on some 2 godfather idea to maybe get us to vote out players they're clearing? It's too complicated.

In general I feel like a lot of Toal's arguments rely on proposing players acted in ways that are significantly more complicated than other choices they could have made without having a substantial increase in payoff.

##vote Toal

thatís Too Many. words for someone to be wrong

SHALASHASKA HAWKE
Nov 9, 2016

No child soldier in poverty by 1990


[b]##vote toal[/b[

chaoslord
Jan 28, 2009

Nature Abhors A Vacuum




SHALASHASKA HAWKE posted:

[b]##vote toal[/b[

do you want me to fix this for you hawke?

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Toalpaz
Mar 20, 2012

Peace through overwhelming determination


Lol I'm at - 1 play the day out you silly billies.


http://imgur.com/QlnGLke

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