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mmmmalo posted:On the subject of connecting the mundane stuff to the rest: One thing that struck me about the movie was that while I expected Miles's performance as Spiderman to be a mirror of his school problems, the situations don't actually seem to be in agreement? The "all wrong answers means you knew all the answers" scene with his teacher shows that Miles is sabotaging himself because he wants out, while his experience as Spiderman comes off as more mundane learning pains. You might be able to reconcile these by saying that Miles is (subconsciously I guess?) sabotaging himself as Spiderman like he does at school, implying that there's something about the possibility of success as Spiderman that terrifies him? Whatever that something might be. I take the failing/unfailing scene as short version his own 'Wrestling with Macho Man' moment. He inherently misunderstands his position and situation in the world, and tries to uses his ability to purely profit himself. There isn't really a scene where Miles is conflicted about being Spider-Man, or where is powers causes him honest-to-god trouble. He's always confident in his abilities and role as Spider-Man. It's his familial connections, his anchors to both the real world and his ability to affect people is where his issues are. It's the inverse of the traditional Spider-Man conflict, where he would rather throw away the book bag and the uniform in a trash can and be 'Miles Morales No More'. It's only in the end where he confronts his symbolic anchor, his Dad, and both acknowledge and affirm his existence and connection that his conflict is resolved.
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Dec 23, 2018 03:17
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mmmmalo posted:I see what you mean now; Miles using his smarts to get out of private school is a misusing-his-powers scene, like Toby Macguire looking for quick cash. I'm not sure what you mean by Miles misunderstanding his position? He seems to understand well enough that he's 'moving up' in some way, and that he has the potential to excel there, but he doesn't want to. Regarding my phrasing, 'Misunderstanding his position', it's just a fancy way of saying he doesn't understand his privilege (a.k.a. His Power) and responsibility. He has the intelligence and the institution to better himself, but he chooses not to take advantage due to his social struggle (and not realizing that this is an artificial conflict he is creating for himself). It's a part of my theory that it's Miles' personhood is his great power, not his role as Spider-Man. As for his conflict regarding his abilities and role as Spider-Man, I kinda disagree that he is struggling with being Spider-Man. My read is that from moment one, once he understands that he has Spider-Man's powers, he is always confident that he can be, and is striving to become, Spider-Man. There are momentary scenes where he struggles against his powers and against the other Spider-Men's perception of him, but I don't read this as inner turmoil about becoming his universe's Spider-Man. It's not like Indiana Jones is struggling with his role as Nazi Puncher when he is struggling to hold onto a Jeep or a Tank. Everything Miles does in the movie is attempt to understand what his Super-Powers are, and how he can apply that to be like his Peter Parker. Infact, I would say the biggest filmic 'Self-Doubt' scene is when Peter B. Parker webs Miles to the chair. What was he doing before that? Insisting he partake in the climax. What does he do immediately after he gets free? Makes his way towards the climax. Miles-as-Spider-Man's conflict is proving himself worthy to people who think otherwise. Miles-as-Miles-Morales' conflict is to understand his worth to the 'real' world. Especially to his father. And this is represented in the film as the academy, where once he comes to respect his father and his desires then Miles finally participates earnestly in his studies and his student body. I will say, the Dad stuff is fairly messy in the first place. Mainly in the last act where resolution is found, despite little action or cause-and-effect change. It's an oddly messy strand for a very well constructed feature.
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Dec 23, 2018 23:46
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Pick posted:Into the Spider-Verse: Well it was fairly evident that Peter B. uses the shower/tub as a safe space for emotional healing (See: sadness montage). Likely it's a place he views as a home separate from the outside world where he feels free to feel vulnerable due to it's shelter. In order to feel 'normal' and 'functioning' in a time of emotional crisis, of course he would irrationally recreate traditions in the one place he feels safe. As for the cat, it's a comics reference to his on-again-off-again romance with Catwoman-ripoff, Black Cat. Hopefully this thread will be picked up on in the sequel, if only due to it's implications.
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Dec 30, 2018 03:50
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did they forget to include the origin story??
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I think about anthology films a lot. I'm not sure if Hollywood would go for them anymore, at least for big budget type features. I think most producers would get cold feet just due to the lack of traditional rise-and-fall storylines, and instead left with disjointed stories where audiences fell they were 'done' with the film, only for even more stories to pop up. Maybe a good framing device would negate it, but I'm not convinced it could happen.
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Dec 30, 2018 05:17
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Plus, the whole 'Miles is not worthy' plotline works a hell of a lot better with a range of completely different, experienced Spider-Men declaring the standards, rather than two miserable grumps being a dick to a kid for little reason. Individually, they don't add a whole lot to the story. But collectively, they bring a lot more legitimacy to the plot and themes of the film. Not to mention that, despite the fact they don't motivate the macro story in proactive ways, they have a lot of influence on the micro plot in every scene they're in. And even considering the fact that maybe 'Peter Porker' or 'Penni' or 'Noir' are interchangable, that ignores their purpose to bring visual splendor and diversity to the film. It's like complaining that the Enterprise's disk and sticks shape is relatively pointless for the story of Star Trek. But it's purpose is to diversify a universe full of unique species with individual quirks and design philosophies, and to bring a familiar central icon that the audience can instantly recognize. And I would say that the trio were picked to be instantly iconic and recognizable as both Spider-Man, and to be completely unfamiliar to the traditional Spider-Man mold. It brings the film back to it's final and central thesis: Spider-Man can be many things, and anyone can be Spider-Man.
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Jan 1, 2019 05:19
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Stop letting the BotL re-reg poo poo up the thread with racism. Put him on ignore, let everyone know, and keep talking about how loving cool this movie is. Edit: Content https://twitter.com/skeletoon/status/1081560093378789379 SomeJazzyRat fucked around with this message at 02:21 on Jan 8, 2019 |
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Jan 8, 2019 02:18
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I'll be upfront dude, that's a little 'old man yells at clouds'-y type of generalization. In any case, I think Miles' personal conflict is in part due to Lord and Miller's fascination with oblivious protagonists who don't realize how much they suck until they have to start not sucking. See: Cloudy, Lego, 21 Jump Street
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Mar 2, 2019 23:58
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Suck is probably a bad word choice by me. It's more that they're universally characters who are ignorant of their situation and what is necessary of them. Instead they choose to believe their status quo will get them through their extreme circumstances, until the third act revelation where they are faced with the need to change their perspective to be able to overcome their conflict. But until then, they are ignorant of how ill-equipped they are to deal with their situation. Thus: They suck at hero-ing until they come to the realization that their limited view of hero-ing isn't who they need to be. Thus they stop sucking at it. This could just be a reflection of western storytelling, I don't know, I never read Hero with a Thousand Faces.
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Mar 3, 2019 00:46
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It's kind of a knee jerk reaction to the common refrain 'New Generation isn't capable of good things because generalized trait'. Even if it's trying to offload the fault to elders, it's still kind of a gross misinterpretation of a large portion of the world. Not to mention ignoring larger societal and economic forces that is actively trying to artificially create a lost generation. I don't doubt that lack of preparation is a real phenomenon that individuals are facing, but to write off a generation's lack of success to upbringing seems stretching.
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Mar 3, 2019 08:22
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Legit. In the theatre, watching it for the first time, I was constantly commentating under my breath 'This Movie is so goddamn cool' and 'This Movie is so goddamn good'. Also, I may never feel the same level of joy as I did when I saw the Spider-Buggy and the post-credits.
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Mar 17, 2019 04:27
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If we're going to derail and talk about comics, I'm just going to use this platform to discuss the Ultimate So let's be clear, the ultimate universe (1610) was a very much a post 9/11 product. It carried a 'Not your papa's' attitude that is nearly as campy as the earnest stuff they were shying away from. Some of them did a decent job of working within those limitations and achieving it's own kind of timeless, like Brian Michael Bendis' Ultimate Spider-Man. Some of them definitely didn't. Take the Universe's take on the Avengers, The Ultimates and their take on Captain America. The WWII style righteous hero, defender of the innocent, wasn't as relevant in the era of the Iraq war. So, to reflect the new, Iraq war era of military, some writers played up the American Jingoism of the day. With some, I'm not 100% certain some were being ironic. Point being, the two universe's take on the character was best exemplified in this compairison of panels.  I bring this up to explain the actual best moment from that comic 
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Jun 29, 2019 20:13
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Ultimate FF (2014), I think issues 4-6.
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Jun 29, 2019 21:38
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Nor Cat-ian America
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Jun 29, 2019 23:05
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I thought I remember hearing that Brian Michael Bendis called him Jefferson as an attempt to 'Take It Back' from the racists, or maybe just to make them mad. Which is sad and hilarious, but not in any way he intended. Unless I'm wrong and that's not the reason.
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Aug 9, 2019 04:05
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I though Marvel Studios also contributed some creative staff as well, house writers and such. Though they could have been consultants so the movie would have contained consistant continuity with the rest of the MCU.
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Aug 24, 2019 20:00
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FilthyImp posted:Pete fell into a bunch of genetically irradiated spiders and they merged/ate him/whatever so it's a hive mind kind of thing going on where they full the suit collectively. I, too, read Swamp Thing
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Nov 3, 2019 07:21
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Why is it a stretch that a kid would be psyched as hell to see a cool rear end superhero, who reminds them of themselves and the people around them, getting complete center stage as opposed to 7th rank in the Avengers? And is also allowed to be a fallible human, and be legitimately funny? Have any major superhero aside from Dominic Toretto (shut up, we all know those are superhero movies now) listened to Rap and Hip Hop? The representation that ITSV, especially on a major platform, was unprecedented. The closest is Black Panther, which honestly was huge. But it also told black kids "Oh, you aren't a prince? poo poo, guess your out of luck." Not to mention the fact that kids aspire to be cool older kids more immediately than they do cool adults. So a kid, who looks like them and lives a life not too dissimilar to them, going out into the world in a complete power fantasy that suggests that they too are allowed to be special? That's huge to kids who are often forgotten because they are not 'The Default'.
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May 7, 2020 04:26
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Okay, name one other Black Superhero like Miles that someone under the age of 12 could have realistically seen.
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May 8, 2020 04:15
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But don't you see, there are 12 year olds who have definitely watched an Eddie Murphy movie. Thus racism doesn't exist anymore, Miles is not a cool character, and Trump was never elected!
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May 10, 2020 21:20
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He too ate his uncle. That's why we don't see the corpse again.
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May 30, 2020 10:39
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I hope this collab means Insomniac's next Spider-Man game is actually a tie in to Spider-Verse 2. Not that I think anything is wrong with the current Spider-Man game series, but the feeling just from someone else recreating "What Up Danger" gives me them good chills.
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Nov 13, 2020 08:33
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