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Teenage Fansub
Jan 28, 2006



Before the end of Doomsday Clock reboots us all...

Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 09:38 on Jan 3, 2019

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frameset
Apr 13, 2008



You needn't worry, it seems like Doomsday Clock will never end.

As I said towards the end of our last thread, I'm still disappointed in the ending of Superman and Action Comics double shipping.

Which books are still double shipping from Rebirth?

Teenage Fansub
Jan 28, 2006



frameset posted:

Which books are still double shipping from Rebirth?

Justice League, Batman, Detective Comics, Wonder Woman, Flash, Nightwing, Titans, Harley Quinn. I think that's it.

I dropped Jurgins' Action quick-smart, so the Bendis Supes rate is right-on to me.

Roth
Jul 9, 2016


Why did OP post a selfie?

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012


HiC is bad and King should stick to one shots or longer arcs without major characters or longer arcs with major characters in a non-canon neck of the multiverse.

Space Fish
Oct 14, 2008

The original Big Tuna.

Two Tone Shoes posted:

Also Donna's confessional may be the one I hate the most. Hijacking a character as a mouthpiece for you to poo poo on the character is so obnoxious. Thanks, King, you're the first one to point out how Donna's origin is hosed up because asinine writers like you only define her by her origin being messed up. All of that in the sordid package of a lovely understanding of archaeology and history to boot. 

Like the point of these confessionals is about these characters airing their traumas and Donna's trauma is...not even a thing. It's a loving reference to poo poo that happened two universes/reboots ago. "A confusion between two old storytellers who got mixed up," -- who the gently caress is Donna referencing? I mean, I know King is referencing Haney being confused by Wonder Girl not being a separate character, but what is Donna saying from her point of view as a character? 

It's fourth wall breaking nonsense without any strong themes or storytelling or character insight attached to it. Just baby's first Donna Troy opinion shoved out of Donna's throat.

I disliked the confession for a similar but different reason, as I read it as a commentary about Booster and Harley each being under suspicion for the murders - two mixed-up storytellers. But if these confessions took place while everyone was in Sanctuary (again, a core piece of table dressing that the story has yet to provide), then the connection only works as Tom King breaking the fourth wall to reiterate his story to us... from within the story... to not reveal anything.

Also, I generally love Abhay Khosla's stuff, but gently caress that "discrediting Tom King but not really but what if??" garbage. All speculation and no homework.

Jordan7hm
Feb 17, 2011

MENS REA? LOL MORE LIKE CHRIS REA AM I RITE





Lipstick Apathy

I like Clay Mannís art a lot from what Iíve seen, but the Ivy (cover?) page in particular was gross.

I am very happy that not only am I not reading Heroes in Crisis, I donít know anything about it beyond the scraps you guys post about it here. It seems like Identity Crisis 2.0, and thatís one of the worst comics Iíve ever read.

Down to one DC book these days - Catwoman, only because of how good Joelle Jones is. And I guess Doom Patrol if thatís still coming out once every few
months.

Looking forward to the next reboot.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006






I only have excellent ideas


Space Fish posted:


Also, I generally love Abhay Khosla's stuff, but gently caress that "discrediting Tom King but not really but what if??" garbage. All speculation and no homework.

Maybe I was just young at the wrong time but this line gave me a small heart attack, killed all the plants in my house, and turned my dogs evil:

quote:

Fans similarly seemed overly-excited that Gerard Way was formerly in some ska band.

Mr Hootington
Jul 24, 2008

et tu hootay



The murderer is Wally west. The stress of being preflashpoint and knowing everything he knew and loved was erased by his father figure got to him.

Lol just kidding it is the reader because are you not entertained!

Alaois
Feb 7, 2012

D U S T M A N


Archyduchess posted:

Maybe I was just young at the wrong time but this line gave me a small heart attack, killed all the plants in my house, and turned my dogs evil:

hi, you have spread the evil to my home, and now snakes manifest physically from my computer monitor

Jordan7hm
Feb 17, 2011

MENS REA? LOL MORE LIKE CHRIS REA AM I RITE





Lipstick Apathy

The whole King was in the CIA thing is really weird, theyíre not wrong about that part of it

ďI used to run agents in terrorist networks and had a bounty on my headĒ doesnít sound like the kind of thing someone would say only 10 years out from having done so. But then again Fleming made bank off of the mystique of being a spy, and that lent extra credibility to his characterizations. So who knows.

Teenage Fansub
Jan 28, 2006



Jordan7hm posted:

Looking forward to the next reboot.

Apart from a growing disappointment in King, and being a bit bummed at G Willow Wilson not immediately knocking WW out of the park, Iím pretty happy with the slate right now.

I think at least one of Bendisí Superman comics is rolling along well, apparently his Batman Walmart thing is great, and Iím preliminarily into all of these Young Justice Wonder Comics things. Until he heads up a terrible event, Iím pro DCBMB.

We got a good, crazy Morrison comic.

Johns might have a winning, fun-rear end book in Shazam if he doesnít quit after an arc, like Superman.

Wild Storm is one of the best comics being published anywhere.

The Border Town situation probably isnít good for the look of the new Vertigo, but Iím loving The Dreaming.

Edit: barf
https://twitter.com/TonyDanielx2/st...856186176585728
Imagine thinking of replacing this with that.

Teenage Fansub fucked around with this message at 19:16 on Jan 3, 2019

Mr Hootington
Jul 24, 2008

et tu hootay



"Former War Criminal" is all the experience you need to be a top tier comic book writer

Open Marriage Night
Sep 18, 2009

"Do you want to talk to a spider, Peter?"

Jordan7hm posted:

The whole King was in the CIA thing is really weird, theyíre not wrong about that part of it

ďI used to run agents in terrorist networks and had a bounty on my headĒ doesnít sound like the kind of thing someone would say only 10 years out from having done so. But then again Fleming made bank off of the mystique of being a spy, and that lent extra credibility to his characterizations. So who knows.

He knows what heís allowed to talk about, and isnít shy about it. I give him credit for saying that Trump acts like someone whoís being worked by foreign agents.

His Word Balloon interviews are really good. Super nice guy.

BrianWilly
Apr 24, 2007

Only a Sith deals in absolutes.

I really like Tom King's personality. I seriously wish that every writer in the industry had his personality.

His writing, on the other hand, I would only wish on a very select few of my worst enemies.

TwoPair
Mar 28, 2010

Pandamn It Feels Good To Be A Gangsta


Grimey Drawer

BrianWilly posted:

I really like Tom King's personality. I seriously wish that every writer in the industry had his personality.

His writing, on the other hand, I would only wish on a very select few of my worst enemies.




It's weird 'cause I liked Vision and like maybe a few issues of Batman but the rest has been a hot mess

site
Apr 6, 2007

Trans pride, Worldwide
Bitch


tom king was a phase 1 russian psyop using ike perlmutter to infiltrate the us comic industry

Teenage Fansub
Jan 28, 2006



I might still like Grayson above everything.

And I loved Mister Miracle while while the dregs of Batman and Hi-C were going on, so I still believe in ya, Tommy.

X-O
Apr 28, 2002

Long Live The King!



I thinking these days Grayson was mainly due to Seeley. I see none of the fun stuff I liked about that book in anything else King does.

Open Marriage Night
Sep 18, 2009

"Do you want to talk to a spider, Peter?"

Letís not pretend that Tom King didnít win an Eisner with an Ace the Bathound story, and knock a Batman/Elmer Fudd special into the stratosphere.

Android Blues
Nov 22, 2008



King is good in general, he's just awful on Heroes in Crisis. Also, his style being so sparse and decompressed works better for some projects than others.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012


He's going to be the writing equivalent of Liefield isn't he? Great guy to work with, delivers on time consistently, questionable quality of work.

Madkal
Feb 11, 2008

It was all going well, and then the parademons showed up


Fallen Rib

Yea let's not do the whole "I don't like this one book by the creator so everything the creator has ever done is terrible". King's Sheriff of Babylon, Omega Men, Vision, and some issues of Batman have been top notch.

Open Marriage Night
Sep 18, 2009

"Do you want to talk to a spider, Peter?"

Good writer writing a crappy event? I feel like this happens several times a year.

Mr Hootington
Jul 24, 2008

et tu hootay



Madkal posted:

Yea let's not do the whole "I don't like this one book by the creator so everything the creator has ever done is terrible". King's Sheriff of Babylon, Omega Men, Vision, and some issues of Batman have been top notch.

His omega men isn't very good.

Madkal
Feb 11, 2008

It was all going well, and then the parademons showed up


Fallen Rib

Mr Hootington posted:

His omega men isn't very good.

I will fight you!

(actually I won't fight you)

BrianWilly
Apr 24, 2007

Only a Sith deals in absolutes.

I'm not jumping on any bandwagons here. I have been saying since Omega Men that I don't understand why people like that book. All it does is depower and mischaracterize Kyle Rayner up and down the street for the sake of gratuitous navel-gazing about misery and suffering and let's be honest about that sounding super familiar to everyone at this point since it's literally King's one and only trick and that's been apparent since 2015 at the least.

And I don't mean to say that he's not, in general, quite good at writing about gratuitous misery and suffering. His writing always feels evocative and effective. But if gratuitous misery and suffering is the only thing that he's going to do...if that's the only thing that he can do...then I stand by what I said about not wanting anyone else to write like he does.

Jordan7hm
Feb 17, 2011

MENS REA? LOL MORE LIKE CHRIS REA AM I RITE





Lipstick Apathy

The Vision and Mr Miracle are superb. The dad stuff in Mr Miracle in particular.

I'm happy to read his off beat character / family stuff.

Madkal
Feb 11, 2008

It was all going well, and then the parademons showed up


Fallen Rib

For me Omega Men was great as a self contained storyline taking place in a part of the DC universe that isn't really explored that much outside of Green Lantern book. The Kyle stuff for me was fine as I don't really recall anything being done with the character before and he was used more as a audience surrogate than anything else.
I thought the characters were really well fleshed out with their backstories and the planets and the people described in the comics give everything a great "lived in" feel. The storyline itself I really enjoyed and yes I can see how it would come across as "misery porn" but I felt it was fairly realistic in the way that everyone thinks about the revolution but gives no thought about the opportunists and fallouts that happen afterwards. I was glad that things weren't just given a nice shiny bow on top and said "all was right with the planets now". It is also important to note how everything we are given is from the perspective of the Omega Men so we don't really know the full story of the planets except for their experiences, which leads to a lot of nuance in motivation.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012


Madkal posted:

For me Omega Men was great as a self contained storyline taking place in a part of the DC universe that isn't really explored that much outside of Green Lantern book. The Kyle stuff for me was fine as I don't really recall anything being done with the character before and he was used more as a audience surrogate than anything else.
I thought the characters were really well fleshed out with their backstories and the planets and the people described in the comics give everything a great "lived in" feel. The storyline itself I really enjoyed and yes I can see how it would come across as "misery porn" but I felt it was fairly realistic in the way that everyone thinks about the revolution but gives no thought about the opportunists and fallouts that happen afterwards. I was glad that things weren't just given a nice shiny bow on top and said "all was right with the planets now". It is also important to note how everything we are given is from the perspective of the Omega Men so we don't really know the full story of the planets except for their experiences, which leads to a lot of nuance in motivation.

The fact that it's in this isolated sector in a part of the DCU that no one cares about made it really hard to actually care about the Omega Men in the first place. They're not really all that endearing despite them being the apparently less bad side in their revolution. There doesn't need to be a bow on it, but like his Mister Miracle, there's a bit of empty "The End. No Moral." to it. The existence of Kyle in all of it was also unnecessary since if his role is audience surrogate, then it could literally be any character old or new that could've done the same job.

King definitely likes taking his own spin on the characters in the DCU and its universe, but it's definitely off from preexisting canon that doesn't settle well, at least in the stuff he's done recently. There's definitely introspective stuff that he likes/wants to do but the characters he's doing them with feel like the wrong ones, at least in the way he does it. Characters like Martian Manhunter, Swamp Thing, Animal Man or even John Constantine seem more apt for the navel gazing stuff that he wants to do.

Mr Hootington
Jul 24, 2008

et tu hootay



The imperialist oppressors are bad, but so are the oppressed.

Edit: Kyle is King. The Omega Men are terrorists King trained in Afghanistan. Citadel is the US military.

Mr Hootington fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Jan 4, 2019

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006






I only have excellent ideas


Mr Hootington posted:

The imperialist oppressors are bad, but so are the oppressed.

Say, maybe he did work for the CIA after all!

Mr Hootington
Jul 24, 2008

et tu hootay



Archyduchess posted:

Say, maybe he did work for the CIA after all!

Well seeing as the moral of omega men is that the foreigners Vegans will genocide themselves unless america the citadel stops them with enslaving.

Madkal
Feb 11, 2008

It was all going well, and then the parademons showed up


Fallen Rib

Mr Hootington posted:

The imperialist oppressors are bad, but so are the oppressed.

Edit: Kyle is King. The Omega Men are terrorists King trained in Afghanistan. Citadel is the US military.

I wouldn't say the oppressed were bad or good as there were different fractions fighting alongside for a common cause. I mean if you want to use the middle east as an example (which seems to be the direction this is heading) you can look at all the different fractions fighting around there and come up with something more than a black and white/this side is bad this side is good take from it. Some will be fighting for freedom, some will be fighting hoping to get some sweet land/power when the war is ended, some will be fighting for revenge. Each motivation of the Omega Men was different depending which world they came from and how the imperialists treated them, so to assume they would all be altruistic would seem kind of unrealistic.
Anyway, I am happy to go on discussing this or whatnot but hopefully won't fall into some kind of DT "this is why my favourite comic is the best all listen to me" rant.

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

....?


I hope for the next reboot/reset of the multiverse, we find out that Promethea created the Watchmen universe, which created the main DC universe. That way maybe we'll get some artists trying their best to emulate peak JH Williams III spreads in every event comic, and the nine panel grids can take a breather.



Also it's sure to be another way to piss off Alan Moore again, which apparently never gets old.

Wheat Loaf
Feb 13, 2012

by FactsAreUseless


Nuns with Guns posted:

I hope for the next reboot/reset of the multiverse, we find out that Promethea created the Watchmen universe, which created the main DC universe. That way maybe we'll get some artists trying their best to emulate peak JH Williams III spreads in every event comic, and the nine panel grids can take a breather.

Superboy-Prime tears off his Superboy costume.

He has been wearing a Kid Miracleman outfit under it the entire time.

This leads to JLA/Avengers 2, which both companies have been keeping under wraps somehow.

Teenage Fansub
Jan 28, 2006



Young Justice preview: https://www.dccomics.com/reader/#/comics/442257





Looks like Gleason's trying out a sketchier style/inker.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012


Which Robin is this? Tim?

Teenage Fansub
Jan 28, 2006



Yep.

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Open Marriage Night
Sep 18, 2009

"Do you want to talk to a spider, Peter?"

Points for using Gemworld. Is Amethyst joining Young Justice?

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