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Gatts
Jan 2, 2001

Goodnight Moon


Nap Ghost

teagone posted:

I thought I read somewhere WB might have been using the reaction to Apokolips War as a barometer to guage the potential reception to Snyder's Justice League? Or was that just a straight up unfounded rumor?

Supposedly Apokolips War cribs from what Snyder had wanted to do with his JL trilogy. Superman leads a charge against Darksied, fails and we get the future vision. Then Flash goes back in time to warn Bruce to save Lois or something.

The other possibility is fans hate Snyder because for once a Superhero movie showed how terrifying, disastrous and damaging it would be to have superheroes in the real world and were shook at not being given a pat on head hope,

Itís also funny because as we see with Star Wars that when they listen to the fans it turns out to poo poo. They donít like a new direction like with TLJ, hated Rise of Skywalker, and the only thing they were okay was a complete rehash of the original bullshit in The Force Awakens. They only want superficial touches of all their favorites that does nothing to examine or go anywhere. Itís like they want the Jeph Loeb of their properties (all your favorites in a bland paper thin story smashing each other) than a Morrison or Hickman or anything good

Gatts fucked around with this message at 20:50 on May 21, 2020

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hiddenriverninja
May 10, 2013

life is locomotion
keep moving
trust that you'll find your way


Broom Boy 2017 never forget

Xealot
Nov 25, 2002

Showdown in the Galaxy Era.



Vintersorg posted:

Ah, I remember a neighbor showing me bootleg VHS of Vampire Hunter D and Guyver - I had never seen such violence. It was amazing.

gently caress yes. I loved Guyver so much. That must have been their US marketing strategy, because my neighbor also showed me a bootleg VHS. Our neighbors were all US Renditions brand reps.

WeedlordGoku69
Feb 11, 2015

A DAILY DOSE
OF OLD SHOOTERS


PLAY NOW MY LORD



The late-80s early-90s Guyver OVA whips so much rear end, and no version of it before or since has ever been as good.

(The live-action movies are also fun, if you can find the uncut version of the first one, but not as much so, and the 2005 anime is... fine but really slow-paced and kinda uggo.)

e: Side note to kinda bring this back on-topic: the first Guyver live-action movie is probably the only case I can think of where the "director's cut" is a heavily censored version and not the uncut. The theatrical had a bunch of fun monster gore in it, and got an early-90s PG-13, and they decided to submit the DC for a MPAA rating in 2005ish when they reassembled it... at which point standards had changed drastically and the gore made it an R. So they hacked all the gore out and made it PG-13 again, and that's why the version you can get on DVD in 2020 is boring as poo poo.

WeedlordGoku69 fucked around with this message at 23:45 on May 21, 2020

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



Gatts posted:

Supposedly Apokolips War cribs from what Snyder had wanted to do with his JL trilogy. Superman leads a charge against Darksied, fails and we get the future vision. Then Flash goes back in time to warn Bruce to save Lois or something.

The other possibility is fans hate Snyder because for once a Superhero movie showed how terrifying, disastrous and damaging it would be to have superheroes in the real world and were shook at not being given a pat on head hope,

Itís also funny because as we see with Star Wars that when they listen to the fans it turns out to poo poo. They donít like a new direction like with TLJ, hated Rise of Skywalker, and the only thing they were okay was a complete rehash of the original bullshit in The Force Awakens. They only want superficial touches of all their favorites that does nothing to examine or go anywhere. Itís like they want the Jeph Loeb of their properties (all your favorites in a bland paper thin story smashing each other) than a Morrison or Hickman or anything good

I think it's not quite so simple. It's the case of "people who like something are usually far, far, far more quiet than people who hate something or feel aggrieved by something." There are a lot of people who just plain don't care but they are not getting online to post their opinions with rabid fury and focused fan campaigns for the most part. Those people are still fans of something who will loyally go and see the next one but it's the people with the time, energy and effort to launch mass campaigns over long periods of time who gain the most notice.

This is not saying a fan campaign is bad. Stuff like the Snyder Cut or the Sonic the Hedgehog thing were obviously very successful. It's just that you need an absolutely abnormal amount of attention to something fictional to be angry about it years later. Even people who didn't like The Last Jedi were probably not the same people who pushed them to make sure Rose had 4 lines and 35 seconds of screentime.

Basically it's the difference between fans and fantatics/superfans/whatever you want to call it.

Mr. Apollo
Nov 8, 2000



The official AT&T twitter account replying time people asking for the Ayer cut of SS.


https://twitter.com/att/status/1263628506048708608?s=21

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.




WeedlordGoku69 posted:

The late-80s early-90s Guyver OVA whips so much rear end, and no version of it before or since has ever been as good.

(The live-action movies are also fun, if you can find the uncut version of the first one, but not as much so, and the 2005 anime is... fine but really slow-paced and kinda uggo.)

e: Side note to kinda bring this back on-topic: the first Guyver live-action movie is probably the only case I can think of where the "director's cut" is a heavily censored version and not the uncut. The theatrical had a bunch of fun monster gore in it, and got an early-90s PG-13, and they decided to submit the DC for a MPAA rating in 2005ish when they reassembled it... at which point standards had changed drastically and the gore made it an R. So they hacked all the gore out and made it PG-13 again, and that's why the version you can get on DVD in 2020 is boring as poo poo.

With Venom doing pretty well, now would be a good time for another attempt at Guyver.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_tffYhyRg8

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017



Crows Turn Off posted:

Mortal Kombat Legends: Scorpion's Revenge is probably right up your alley.

I saw that one recently because I find myself oddly liking Mortal Kombat despite never really playing it. For a movie that's supposed to be all about Scorpion, Johnny Cage still ends up stealing every scene. I suppose just being the normal movie star dude surrounded by martial arts movie protagonists and commandos automatically gives him a hilarious niche.

Oasx
Oct 11, 2006

Greetings from Asbury Park

Apokolips War sounds a lot more grimdark than it is, almost all the gory stuff happens in the first few minutes, after that it is pretty normal dark future stuff.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

Changeman! And Not A Moment Too Soon!


Oasx posted:

Apokolips War sounds a lot more grimdark than it is, almost all the gory stuff happens in the first few minutes, after that it is pretty normal dark future stuff.

Also, and this is what surprised me from the normal stuff like it- and what elevates it in my eyes.

Those heroes all live. And they get to BE heroes again. Sure only Wonder Woman has a big hero moment, but Kory and Nightwing are together at the end, for all that they lost. There's something sweet to that. Also loving hilarious, given that I had no idea why Kory got brought to Apokalips and never dreamed they'd actually drag Dick out of his basement.

And their cyborg freak selves actually look pretty cool, as opposed to the bother eye bullshit.

Oasx
Oct 11, 2006

Greetings from Asbury Park

Itís been many years since I read DC comics but I remember Doomsday as the big bad that killed Superman, and this movie has a whole army of them. The problem is that they soon turn into chumps because you have some magic users that kill them instantly, and then everyone gets kryptonite weapons, making the threat even less menacing

Burkion
May 10, 2012

Changeman! And Not A Moment Too Soon!


Oasx posted:

Itís been many years since I read DC comics but I remember Doomsday as the big bad that killed Superman, and this movie has a whole army of them. The problem is that they soon turn into chumps because you have some magic users that kill them instantly, and then everyone gets kryptonite weapons, making the threat even less menacing

Look, Doomsday is allowed like, three good showings.

He's a Rocky villain. Round one is a tie that Doomsday kind of wins by technicality, round 2 Superman wins, round 3 there's a bunch of Doomsdays and they all have different powers and one of them wants to kill all the others and all of reality and Superman kind of saves him and wants to redeem Doomsday and then the New 52 happened


Only in between rounds 2 and 3 people miss the loving point of Doomsday and just make him a Big Threat (by cloning him and robbing him of what made him a big threat in the first place)

In one of the Superman Batman crossover stories there's just an army of SUPER easy to kill Doomsdays hanging out who kill almost no one of note except a character who hadn't been relevant since Snowflame was a thing. But every few years they trot out the original Doomsday to try and be a heavy because of his One Important Moment and it's just all so much bullshit. At least Post Crisis Darkseid had a reason to want to weaponize Doomsday- he got the poo poo kicked out of him by the guy when he tried to use him the first time.

John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

The plan here is to reinvent Rin Tin Tin as a modern action star, the John Wick of dogs.


Round 4 Doomsday dies in the ring in a charity match from a roided out Russian

McCloud
Oct 27, 2005



It's happening

https://twitter.com/TheCulturedNerd...0070414336?s=19

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017



Gonna be lol if they try to relaunch their cinematic universe with retcons

Grendels Dad
Mar 5, 2011

Popular culture has passed you by.

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Gonna be lol if they try to relaunch their cinematic universe with retcons

If they set it up as Flash-induced time travel shenanigans, would it be all that different from how Endgame sets up things in the new MCU? Lots of characters coming back from the dead due to alternative dimensions/timelines is pretty much the same as a retcon.

Mr. Apollo
Nov 8, 2000



This is really cool and I'm genuinely interested to see how they all fit together.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017



Grendels Dad posted:

If they set it up as Flash-induced time travel shenanigans, would it be all that different from how Endgame sets up things in the new MCU? Lots of characters coming back from the dead due to alternative dimensions/timelines is pretty much the same as a retcon.

Actually the funny thing is Flash-induced time travel shenanigans is exactly what's implied to set the whole thing up

And eh, maybe but not really? Endgame made it clear that everything happened, everyone that died a certain way came back the same way, and didn't really dwell on the consequences or take much advantage of it beyond suspending character development for everyone but the characters they wanted it for during the timeskip.

John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

The plan here is to reinvent Rin Tin Tin as a modern action star, the John Wick of dogs.



That article is speculation. Some decent evidence it might be true but definitely not confirmed.

I hope it is. If WB really wants to go back and had these directors finish, maybe they've had a philosophical change where they've decided it's better to let a director succeed or fail than to interfere and be themselves directly responsible for the failure.

And you know what else also? Release the Whedon cut of Age of Ultron, Disney.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

Changeman! And Not A Moment Too Soon!


I hadn't even considered they'd revert Steppenwolf to his original intended design. I really hope it hews closer to the BvS look, since I really liked that idea

ThermoPhysical
Dec 26, 2007





https://screenrant.com/justice-leag...er-cut-release/

Supposedly, the re-release isn't the original? Who knows. It at least won't be all Whedon'd up.


McCloud posted:

Has like 90% on the 🍅 score lol

(And it's poo poo)

(Disclaimer: haven't seen it)

Apokolips War is gory garbage. If you've ever read and hated Ultimatum from Ultimate Marvel, you will hate Justice League Dark 2. It's like Ultimatum but 10x worse in terms of...pretty much everything. The ONLY reason this is true is because it's the last animated DC movie in that universe so they decided to "go all out".

John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

The plan here is to reinvent Rin Tin Tin as a modern action star, the John Wick of dogs.


If I recall the concept art correctly it was somewhere in between

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017



ThermoPhysical posted:

https://screenrant.com/justice-leag...er-cut-release/

Supposedly, the re-release isn't the original? Who knows. It at least won't be all Whedon'd up.


Apokolips War is gory garbage. If you've ever read and hated Ultimatum from Ultimate Marvel, you will hate Justice League Dark 2. It's like Ultimatum but 10x worse in terms of...pretty much everything. The ONLY reason this is true is because it's the last animated DC movie in that universe so they decided to "go all out".

Seems as likely Snyder has decided to change a few things himself in between now and then.

And at least maybe Apokolips War might have gotten it all out of their system and DC can make some good animation again.

dublish
Oct 31, 2011



ThermoPhysical posted:

https://screenrant.com/justice-leag...er-cut-release/

Supposedly, the re-release isn't the original? Who knows. It at least won't be all Whedon'd up.

That says it's not the "original vision", the pre-BvS-backlash plan that never made it past a script. What we're getting is the version that was originally filmed, with ~$30 million in reshoots and post-production added on. It all depends on how you define "original".

Spacebump
Dec 23, 2003

Dallas Mavericks: Generations


I donít understand why fans keep adding Green Lantern to Snyder cut posts on Instagram. They are going to be real disappointed when the cut doesnít add a GL to the team.

Mr. Apollo
Nov 8, 2000



Spacebump posted:

I donít understand why fans keep adding Green Lantern to Snyder cut posts on Instagram. They are going to be real disappointed when the cut doesnít add a GL to the team.
I thought the SC had a post credits scene where Bruce wakes up in the middle of the night and there are two Lanterns in his bedroom and they tell him he's going to need their help or something like that.

John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

The plan here is to reinvent Rin Tin Tin as a modern action star, the John Wick of dogs.


GL will be in the history lesson scene I'm pretty sure, not part of the team. Joining the team was part of an unrealized draft from when it was a two parter. Lanterns are already in the history lesson scene but I expect that sequence will be extended a bit and feature them a little more.

Yeah and what you said about the epilogue scene

WeedlordGoku69
Feb 11, 2015

A DAILY DOSE
OF OLD SHOOTERS


PLAY NOW MY LORD



ThermoPhysical posted:

Apokolips War is gory garbage. If you've ever read and hated Ultimatum from Ultimate Marvel, you will hate Justice League Dark 2. It's like Ultimatum but 10x worse in terms of...pretty much everything. The ONLY reason this is true is because it's the last animated DC movie in that universe so they decided to "go all out".

While I wasn't that hot on Apokolips War and pretty much just took it as dumb fun, I also really don't like the Ultimatum comparison because it fails to take into account why Ultimatum was actually bad beyond "had gore in it." Which was not the loving problem with Ultimatum.

The problem with Ultimatum was that it was fundamentally an incredibly cynical project on every level. I don't mean "cynical" as in "dark," I mean cynical from a business perspective- Ultimate Marvel's sales were flagging, so time to start the massacre to prune a bunch of books and maybe get some last-second attention. In the process, it basically destroyed every character it touched, turning a lot of characters that were either well-liked specifically in their Ultimate forms or just generally well-liked regardless into either psychopathic murderers or slabs of meat for the former. It was also staggeringly poorly written, with almost no throughline whatsoever to make it more than "everyone dies horribly." A grand total of one loving book, Ultimate Spider-Man, managed to survive Ultimatum unscathed and I'm pretty sure it did so by just flat-out ignoring the event and pretending it never happened.

Apokolips War just isn't really coming from that same place or having the same effect. It's violent as gently caress, sure, but it's a natural-feeling endcap to a series that got a shitload of time and has inarguably run its course, and the ending makes it clear that it's not even really killing the series outright so much as just giving it a reset. It's not taking something that a bunch of people really liked, and stomping it into dust simply because not enough people liked it, a la Ultimatum.

Robot Style
Jul 5, 2009



John Wick of Dogs posted:

GL will be in the history lesson scene I'm pretty sure, not part of the team. Joining the team was part of an unrealized draft from when it was a two parter. Lanterns are already in the history lesson scene but I expect that sequence will be extended a bit and feature them a little more.

Yeah and what you said about the epilogue scene

A couple of weeks before we were supposed to finish the Whedon version, I heard that one of the other VFX studios had gotten a last-minute request for a shot with a Green Lantern in it, which required an extreme rush to build a CG Green Lantern model. It might have been something that ended up being cut, but it's also possible that this was the Lantern shown briefly in the History Lesson.

McSpanky
Jan 16, 2005






ThermoPhysical posted:

https://screenrant.com/justice-leag...er-cut-release/

Supposedly, the re-release isn't the original? Who knows. It at least won't be all Whedon'd up.

The "Snyder Cut" everyone is referring to is the four-hour workprint version of the film production, screened for studio execs and which the initial, blue-hued trailer was edited from. All of the black-and-white stills Synder has been posting for the last two years have been from this version, and storyboard scans have generally been about this version unless indicated otherwise.

This article is bullshit obfuscation by people who can't stand that #ReleaseTheSnyderCut worked. Ever since the announcement there's been a glut of articles and twitter posts like this basically claiming "the REAL Snyder Cut never existed so you still lose Snydailiures ", but don't be fooled. I mean, the fact that the Snyder Cut is actually getting properly finished and not being released as-was with missing material and without completely VFX and editing is far more than what fans were expecting, a pipe dream even by all previous expectations. So sure, by the most asinine pedantic definition we're not getting "the real Snyder Cut". We're getting better.

ruddiger
Jun 3, 2004

Crook County

Theyíre just bitter because this came out before the 77 Star Wars cut (which doesnít exit anymore, btw).

Space Fish
Oct 14, 2008

The original Big Tuna.

McSpanky posted:

The "Snyder Cut" everyone is referring to is the four-hour workprint version of the film production, screened for studio execs and which the initial, blue-hued trailer was edited from. All of the black-and-white stills Synder has been posting for the last two years have been from this version, and storyboard scans have generally been about this version unless indicated otherwise.

Someone brought up the workprint runtime before and Snyder directly said that was 4-5 hours (I forget which) while his actual cut was 214 minutes - less than 100% complete and in need of some VFX work, but definitely 214 minutes.

HBO wants weekly headlines, so the miniseries strategy is on the table, and all that unused footage with it.

Mr. Apollo
Nov 8, 2000



If they go the miniseries route I hope the make it available as a movie too.

McSpanky
Jan 16, 2005






Space Fish posted:

Someone brought up the workprint runtime before and Snyder directly said that was 4-5 hours (I forget which) while his actual cut was 214 minutes - less than 100% complete and in need of some VFX work, but definitely 214 minutes.

HBO wants weekly headlines, so the miniseries strategy is on the table, and all that unused footage with it.

I hadn't heard that, thanks for the info.

teagone
Jun 10, 2003

That was pretty intense, huh?

Space Fish posted:

Someone brought up the workprint runtime before and Snyder directly said that was 4-5 hours (I forget which) while his actual cut was 214 minutes - less than 100% complete and in need of some VFX work, but definitely 214 minutes.

HBO wants weekly headlines, so the miniseries strategy is on the table, and all that unused footage with it.

Snyder himself said the assembly cut was ~5 hours when he called out the Forbes film guy, lol.

https://twitter.com/ZackSnyder/stat...649210954244096

Snowman_McK
Jan 31, 2010
ASK ME ABOUT MY SELF-PUBLISHED WARHAMMER FANFICTION AND MY KNIFE COLLECTION


Gatts posted:

Supposedly Apokolips War cribs from what Snyder had wanted to do with his JL trilogy. Superman leads a charge against Darksied, fails and we get the future vision. Then Flash goes back in time to warn Bruce to save Lois or something.

The other possibility is fans hate Snyder because for once a Superhero movie showed how terrifying, disastrous and damaging it would be to have superheroes in the real world and were shook at not being given a pat on head hope,

Itís also funny because as we see with Star Wars that when they listen to the fans it turns out to poo poo. They donít like a new direction like with TLJ, hated Rise of Skywalker, and the only thing they were okay was a complete rehash of the original bullshit in The Force Awakens. They only want superficial touches of all their favorites that does nothing to examine or go anywhere. Itís like they want the Jeph Loeb of their properties (all your favorites in a bland paper thin story smashing each other) than a Morrison or Hickman or anything good

And even TFA, i think, got a lot of good will thanks to setting up several interesting threads. It's a perfectly acceptable set up for the new series. Part of the very angry reaction to TROS is realising all that stuff ended up going nowhere. It's why flawed early chapters of things like Game of Thrones and Sherlock were forgiven because, hey, maybe they're going somewhere interesting.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017



People are really mad about Snyder for reasons they seem to have mostly invented in their heads and come to fully believe.

Oasx
Oct 11, 2006

Greetings from Asbury Park

Snyder is just a one hit wonder for me, I havenít really been impressed by any of his movies since 300, and itís especially gone downhill since Man of Steel.

Spacebump
Dec 23, 2003

Dallas Mavericks: Generations


Tonight a friend reminded me Justice League was using the line "Unite the Seven" in early advertising. Was the seventh going to be Martian Manhunter?

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The Fuzzy Hulk
Nov 22, 2007

ASK ME ABOUT CROSSING THE STREAMS



Spacebump posted:

Tonight a friend reminded me Justice League was using the line "Unite the Seven" in early advertising. Was the seventh going to be Martian Manhunter?

Robin. Going to be played by the Young Sheldon kid.

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