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 Welcome to the Island of Misfit This is the Misc. Racing Thread, home for discussion of all kinds of racing that aren't Formula 1, IndyCar, or NASCAR. Feel free to post about sports car racing, touring cars, rallying, off-road racing, motocross, and anything else you can think of. So much good racing is available to watch (especially online officially) that we can share and discuss while enjoying speedy race cars.  So what kind of racing are you talking about here, then? We talk a lot about sports-car racing. It’s the racing, primarily on road and street courses, of cars which come closest in design and spirit to street cars. After the big And at the top of sports cars are what’s called prototypes -- single-seat racers with closed tops and fenders. The Grand Prix cars of long-distance racing. Why should I care about sports car racing? There’s a wide variety -- of cars, drivers, locations, and of race distances. It’s where your favorites from Formula 1, IndyCar and NASCAR past will wind up. Races are often long (6-, 12- and 24-hour races are not uncommon), and feature multiple classes of car racing on the same track but in individual class battles alongside the overall win. The world of sports car racing tends to be friendlier and more approachable than other parts, while still attracting many colorful characters. Okay. So tell me about the cars! Within sports car racing, there are two major groups: Prototypes and GT cars.   One of the current LMP-1 prototypes | Current GT Porsche 911 and Aston Martin Vantage Let’s start with the easier one: Prototypes are often the fastest cars on track, and as mentioned, they’re similar to Formula 1 cars or Indy cars, but build to go fast and for a long time. Within prototypes, there are often various classes -- currently LMP1, LMP2 and LMP3 -- and they refer to generally how fast the cars are. GT-class cars are generally racing versions of supercars or sports cars from brands like Porsche, Aston Martin, Ferrari, BMW, and others. As long as there has been sports car racing, people have made modifications to street cars to take them racing; now, that work is just more professional and expensive. For example: Porsche uses the 911 as its base for GT racing, and the racing Porsche 911 RSR looks like a Porsche 911 but ready for battle. These cars are raced both by the manufacturers that make them (eg Porsche Racing having “factory” teams) and by customers who buy the cars and enter them. Also, compared with Formula 1 or IndyCar, the big difference is the cars are teams unto themselves: Even the shorter races generally require two drivers to share time in a car, and endurance races will see teams of three, four, or five drivers sharing duty. So, what are the series I should know?  The FIA World Endurance Championship is the highest level of sports-car racing. It’s an FIA World Championship, same as Formula 1 and the World Rally Championship, which means a lot. The WEC schedule includes the 24 Hours of Le Mans, which means almost as much, if not more, as Le Mans remains a hugely popular event and a major marketing point for all these big manufacturers. The WEC features LMP1 cars, LMP2 cars, and two GT classes, and is pretty fun to watch.  Under the WEC are various regional series, the highest profile of which is IMSA in the United States. Its a US and Canadian-based series, but many teams and drivers will also compete at Le Mans on an annual basis. IMSA also has a number of high-profile races: endurance epics include the 24 Hours of Daytona in January, the Sebring 12 Hours in March, and Petit Le Mans at Road Atlanta in October, plus marquee shorter races at Long Beach, Road America, and more. Other regional series under the WEC include the European Le Mans Series, and Asian Le Mans Series, which both act as feeders to the World Endurance Championship and 24 Hours of Le Mans.  But there are other series in this sports car world! Many of them fall under a sports car rulebook called GT3. These are cars made by big companies (Porsche, Ferrari, BMW, Mercedes, Nissan, Audi) which are sold to customers. GT3 cars are expected to be balanced to achieve a similar level of performance -- in theory, a driver could take each of those cars around a track and get roughly the same lap time. This has led to a boom in series aimed to customers, as the cars are relatively affordable, well-built, fairly easy to drive (especially compared to customer cars from the 1970s and ‘80s) and eligible to race in a lot of exciting events. The 24 Hours races at Spa-Francorchamps in Belgium and the Nurburgring in Germany are highlights for GT3-type racing worldwide. Great! So how/when do I watch? Because the sports-car world is so diverse, there’s a lot to watch. Happily, much of it is readily available online or even via YouTube.
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Other questions? Reach out and ask! Recommendations? Please suggest and we'll try to add them in. Come join us on Discord! https://discord.gg/kg3d2Uu Misc Threads of the Past Misc Auto Racing 2018: Mazda gonna Mazda Misc Auto Racing 2017: gently caress off Whincup Misc Auto Racing 2016 : Downgraded From Silver Posters to Bronze Misc Auto Racing 2015: At least our criminals are non-violent Misc Auto Racing 2014: So long and thanks for all the McNish Misc Auto Racing 2013: Beware: Ferrari Ahead Misc. Auto Racing 2012: No War But Class War Sportscars 2011: Racing with Class (ILMC/ALMS/GrandAm) 2011 Daytona 24 Hours 2010 Daytona 24 Hours harperdc fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Jan 12, 2019 |
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Jan 12, 2019 02:51
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| # ¿ Apr 26, 2024 13:07 |
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Other Wonderful Misfit Series of Note Formula E YouTube Channel Link  Now in its fifth season, the FIA Formula E championship is a heavily-pushed series that attempts to re-think multiple aspects of the traditional racing series and weekend. Beyond eschewing internal combustion engines for a fully electric drivetrain, the series also stands out thanks to having one-day events (qualifying and the race on the same day), and holding those events not at existing race circuits but in city centers worldwide. This year is actually a decent time to get into Formula E: the season has just started (the first round was in December 2018 in Saudi Arabia), the races are easy to watch and don't run 2+ hours each, and most importantly, there's a new chassis for this year. This means the most common joke leveled at Formula E -- that its cars couldn't last a race distance, so drivers had to pit stop not to refuel but to change cars -- is now gone, replaced by something that also happens to look a good bit more Tron. The other aspect with Formula E is that, compared with other top-level parts of motor racing, it's relatively inexpensive and is attracting a ton of manufacturers: Audi, BMW, DS, Jaguar, Mahindra and Nissan all have teams in the series, while Mercedes-Benz and Porsche are both set to join in coming years. It's relevant to their World Rally Championship (WRC) Rally is in a better position than its been for years. Rules have been liberalized giving the cars about 380hp and growing more crazy aero appendages every event. There are currently four major teams, Hyundai, Toyota, Citroen and M-Sport (privateers using Fords), and they have all won several events the past few years making it one of the most even fields ever in Rally. Teams Hyundai  Hyundai has steadily grown over the last 20 years to become one of the most resourceful and best teams, but it has never really come together for them to take a title. They never seem to have quite the fastest or most robust car, or the fastest drivers, but it has been achingly close for years. Toyota  Toyota returned to rally in 2017. Originally the team was planned to be run by the same outfit that runs the LMP programme in Germany. Rally legend Tommi Makinen was given the job instead, and the team has been based out of his barn in Finland since. The confidence put in him paid off quickly with them winning in only their second event in Sweden. They have quickly become one of the most competitive teams, crowned by winning the manufacturers title in 2018. An eclectic stable of drivers and a fast but somewhat frail car makes this an exiting team to follow. It also seems to enjoy strong personal support by Toyota CEO and heir Akio Toyoda. M-Sport  M-Sport is the chronically underfunded privateer running Fords. They used to be the Ford factory team until 2012, and languished in the following years. When VW pulled out of rally following the 2016 season, team boss Malcom Wilson reportedly mortgaged his house to secure their champion Sebastian Ogier. It immediately paid off and M-Sport secured the drivers title twice and the manufactures title once in the past two seasons. With their in-house prodigy Ott Tanak leaving for Toyota last year, and Ogier going to Citroen this year, I fear they will return to mediocracy, but I’d love to be proven wrong Citroen  Citroen went from being one of the most dominant teams ever, to pretty poo poo since Loeb left. They put all their faith in Kris Meeke as their lead driver even when they had the chance to grab any of the VW drivers two years back, only to fire him mid-season last year. They were the only team not to win a rally last year. Now they have lured Ogier back, and will probably be a force to be reconed with from that alone Select Drivers Sebasitian Ogier Co driver: Julien Ingrassia Team: Citroen Has won the past six drivers world championships. First with the dominant VW team, then with the underdog M-Sport team. He will move to the underdog Citroen team this year to try to further his legacy. Unquestionably the best driver of the current generation, but his driving style is quite lairy and fun to watch. Thierry Neuville Co driver: Nicolas Gilsoul Team: Hyundai The perennial runner up. He has finished second 5 times in the championship but never won. Although he is fast and seemingly much tidier than Ogier, he makes a few too many mistakes across a season to truly challenge him. Maybe this year will be it? Ott Tanak Co driver: Martin Järveoja Team: Toyota The M-Sport wonderchild moved to Toyota before the 2018 season, and immediately positioned himself as their #1 driver. His Toyota had one too many reliability issues in the early season last year for him to be in serious contention for the championship, but he was extremely fast after the summer break to drag himself back into contention. With the Toyota getting ever better, and Ogier having to adapt to a new team, this might just be his year. Kris Meeke Co driver Sebastian Marshall Team: Toyota Collin McRae’s spiritual successor. His win or crash altitude didn’t endear him to his previous employers Citroen, but he is hugely fun to watch. Toyota has taken him on for this season Jari Matti Latvalla Co driver: Miikka Anttila Team: Toyota The other perennial runner up. As Ogiers team mate at VW, he was always that little bit behind, and by his own admission it took a toll on him mentally. Now his new teammate Ott Tanak is upstaging him as well. He is the most experienced driver in the field, and still has the speed to win rallies though. Andreas Mikkelsen Co driver: Anders Jaeger Team: Hyundai Was without a job when VW folded two years ago but was taken in by Hyundai as a full-time driver. He had an awful last season with freak accidents and poor reliability. Nonetheless, he will have to improve to keep his drive. Sebastien Loeb Co Driver: Daniel Elena Team: Hyundai The other dominant Sebastian having a record 9 driver titles under his belt. He retired from full time rally in 2012 and has only attended select events since. Now that his rallycross team has folded, he might be a more frequent fixture. Still has the speed to win events. How to watch All stages are now streamed live on the WRC+ paid streaming service. Its pretty good if fairly low bitrate and quality, but the events take place in the middle of nowhere, so nut sure how much one can expect. https://plus.wrc.com/en/?utm_source=wrc-com&utm_medium=banner&utm_content=livestages There are live text updates and timing on the WRC webpage. https://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/livetiming/page/4175----.html The youtube channel has short summaries and highlights. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WERua1duBTU Super GT  Ah yes. This one's more for the hardcore. Almost 25 years old, the Super GT series (previously the Japanese GT Championship or JGTC) is Japan's premier national sports car series, and a paradise for diehard racing fans. The series is divided in two classes: GT500 and GT300. The top class, GT500, is the home of factory-backed teams racing Nissan, Honda and Lexus/Toyota machines, though there is often strong family rivalries inside each of the brand's teams. As well, these teams are backed by the manufacturer's engineering departments -- this is purely an exercise in the designers and boffins trying to make faster race cars, not to market them to the masses. It's also an engineering exercise for the tire brands, who can develop the tires throughout the year -- a major difference compared with other series around the world. And there are a number of teams which have been running with their brands since the early days 20-plus years ago. This is where I mention the "blue shinkansen" Impul Nissan, the Denso Sard and TOMS Toyotas, the orange ARTA Honda and blue Real Racing Honda. If you played Gran Turismo 2, you'd be shocked to see familiar cars on the grid in 2019. The GT300 class is made of privateers, with a few smaller factory efforts rolled in. Most teams have moved to GT3 machinery, but a few oddballs still exist. Subaru has built a BRZ using the old WRC engine, for example. And then there's the Toyota Priuses, which use off-the-shelf hybrid systems, but had put a Prototype-grade V8 racing engine into the middle of the car until this season. Madness. It goes without saying that this is mad, wonderful racing. Nissan has helped make this series more accessible to those outside Japan in recent years, hosting English commentary streams on their NISMO YouTube channel. Hopefully they'll continue for 2019. Series Schedules 2018-19 WEC "Super Season"
2019 IMSA WeatherTech Sports Car Series
2018-19 Formula E Series
2019 World Rally Championship
2019 European Le Mans Series
2018-19 Asian Le Mans Series
2019 Super GT
harperdc fucked around with this message at 14:42 on Jan 24, 2019 |
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Jan 12, 2019 02:52
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[reserved]
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Jan 12, 2019 02:52
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Asian Le Mans Series round at Buriram is live in an hour and a half: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzCLPYsazK8
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Jan 12, 2019 03:51
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MazeOfTzeentch posted:Formula E threads were kinda dead so I figured we'd talk about it here. I normally made those but idk if it's enough for it's own. They're running at Marrakesh this weekend, 10am Eastern That makes sense, changed the wording. I’ll add the schedule to the OP, if you want a Formula E sub-section too feel free. Think I might add links in the schedules to YouTube videos for any of the races that have happened already (like WEC, Formula E and AsLMS). Might be worth it through the year too.
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Jan 12, 2019 04:54
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Peanut President posted:I think there were 3 NHRA posts last year (and only 1 was me) so I'm not even gonna bother a drag racing post that pass was so fast I think it has T/F written on the screen
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Jan 12, 2019 14:13
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MazeOfTzeentch posted:https://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/core-unveils-historic-nissan-dpi-livery/ Niiiiiice
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Jan 17, 2019 00:50
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Mazda will either win or go kaboom, and I’m here for it.
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Jan 17, 2019 04:08
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IMSA Radio remains an option always for live events, and if you're outside of the US, IMSA's live stream of the race uses the Radio commentary team. Which means Radio Le Mans, which should be a good thing. Interested in what NBC is throwing at the 24, though, and it should at least be a drat sight better than FOX has been.
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Jan 17, 2019 23:24
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CBJSprague24 posted:Here's a preview of what NBC's IMSA coverage might look like: 99% sure the Radio Le Mans crew will still be doing their IMSA Radio coverage this year.
so that's what I'll be watching this coming weekend! Meanwhile, a preview of Daytona: https://twitter.com/jordan10taylor/status/1086016200105213952
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Jan 21, 2019 23:10
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Sounds like Hot Wheels paid money for Bigfoot to come on in and made dollar store knockoffs of Monster Jam trucks, AND part of the show is being run by ex-Monster Jam people. They might have a case but I’m sure it gets settled. But their wording and what they “expected” as worded in the suit is absolutely hilarious.
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Jan 23, 2019 15:27
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Humbug posted:With Rally Monte Carlo starting today, I thought I’d make a bit of an effort post. I will go drop this into the OP, if that's okay!
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Jan 24, 2019 14:33
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Wirth1000 posted:There’s 3 great racing movies that already exist in the form of Grand Prix, Steve McQueens Le Mans and Days of Thunder. one of these things is not like the other one (one of these things is Top Gun with Dr. Jerry Punch inspiring the whole thing)
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Jan 24, 2019 14:58
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DoctorGonzo posted:Good job from the boys of Scuderia Corsa. Didnt Alonso would race at Daytona? WTF? He’ll probably be in sometime during practice. Plus unlike in the WEC, only one driver sets the time in qualifying in IMSA - and by rules for this year, that driver has to start the car. Makes sense that the full-time guy is in there for qualifying.
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Jan 25, 2019 02:11
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freeranger posted:Apologies if it's been posted already but what time does the 24hr race start? Need to figure out the time difference for Australia 14:35 pm EST on Saturday US time is the green flag per IMSA’s website, which is I think 06:35 am Sunday morning Melbourne time. So for us in Asia, early Sunday morning; for those in Europe, Saturday night.
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Jan 25, 2019 10:31
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God dammit, apparently J SPORTS has IMSA this season. That's why the broadcast on IMSA.tv wouldn't load at all. ah well, guess I'll find another way which may or may not be on the last page rough for the BMW that Zanardi's steering wheel wound up messing up the steering column 
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Jan 27, 2019 01:38
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...and I'm disappointed that when the #18 spun it wasn't Maldonado on board.
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Jan 27, 2019 03:27
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orange juche posted:77 ate a turbo, and it will not be coming back out. It probably ingested vanes on the intake side into the cylinders if they're not even going to attempt to repair it.  yeah I don't remember the specific IMSA rules, but I know that for both them and WEC (Le Mans) there are parts of the engine you just can't change during the race. A lot of those would be badly damaged by swallowing a turbo.
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Jan 27, 2019 03:51
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GelatinSkeleton posted:Where is the number 57 Acura? The all lady team at the Rolex 24 14th in its GTD class, 1 lap behind the class leading #86 teammate.
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Jan 27, 2019 04:50
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MazeOfTzeentch posted:55 Mazda is dangerously close to getting on the lead lap with a well-timed caution Even now there's only three cars retired, and in GTLM there's only really two cars completely out of it too (the #24 BMW had more issues, and the #3 Corvette stopped dead on the track just about the 12-hour mark after pushing their fuel mileage too far).
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Jan 27, 2019 09:14
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Oh lord, the #4 Corvette sent it a bit too hard it's really really wet out there
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Jan 27, 2019 12:05
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Space Butler posted:What happened to the 55 this time? sounds like he spun and/or got hit going into the horseshoe, then they lost a bunch of time on repairs in the pits.
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Jan 27, 2019 12:40
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drgitlin posted:Yet again I did not get to interview Rodney. Ffs. He’s fast become your great neon and Velcro whale. And hey, if you didn’t get enough from last weekend at Daytona, guess what’s coming up this coming weekend? The Bathurst 12 Hour!
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Jan 28, 2019 15:21
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Basticle posted:what time does the race start in EST? Am I gonna have to get up at 3am to watch PT crash into a mountain? 5:45 Aussie Eastern time on Sunday is the green flag, which should be about 1:45 pm PT on Saturday afternoon. So, manageable for the US!
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Jan 28, 2019 23:07
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orange juche posted:Analysis: For Mazda's IMSA program, it's 51 and, unfortunately, counting. oh man, this passage quote:Behind the car, John Doonan, head of the Mazda Motorsports programs in the U.S. -- and perhaps the most loved and respected constant presence in the paddock -- stood there with a look on his face you’d expect to see when a man is watching his house burn. is such a picture but so, so, so heartbreaking.
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Jan 30, 2019 12:36
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GTLM wouldn’t be any cheaper. Besides Corvette (which is adding a car for the WEC Sebring 1000), all of the GTLM teams are running development both for IMSA and the WEC, and possibly supplying cars for the Am class in ELMS. It’s a different animal than DPi. As well, even if they had a car for GT3, the SRO is on the record as not wanting any further “bespoke” GT3 cars. There’s a minimum build number (I think 25?) and requirement that the OEMs build them for customers and support them around the world. They’d be eligible for a lot of different series, but again, that’s different and a higher level of investment than doing DPi. I hope Mazda succeeds this year. They need to.
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Jan 31, 2019 01:13
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orange juche posted:Audi is a lot bigger and can afford that kind of support, I don't think Mazda could though. It’s not that Audi is bigger, it’s that they have built up the machine to support it. Ginetta probably has equally good customer support and they’re tiny by comparison.
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Jan 31, 2019 04:23
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And even if Mazda went with a rotary it’s not like those haven’t been banned or limited in ways to reduce the advantages to the package. Shame. Love hearing the angry kegs of bees.
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Jan 31, 2019 07:16
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drgitlin posted:The 919 Hybrid actually influenced the current 911 and 718 way more than the 918 Spyder. The design of the cylinder and head on the 919 V4 shares a LOT with the the flat-4 and flat-6. Meanwhile the 918 Spyder actually owes a lot more to the RS Spyder of the mid-2000s. the 918 Spyder uses a V8 too, which I wouldn't be shocked to learn is closer to the RS Spyder. the 918 Spyder also came out a year before the 919 racer debuted. For those that don't know: the road car is going to be on the drawing board a whole lot earlier than that (the 919 had concept cars in 2010 and 2011 for reference).
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Jan 31, 2019 13:52
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Schlesische posted:Bolting in a V8 because "you need one for racing" makes no sense if you can't link it to something you have in brand. Yeah, I agree, but it's striking me as funny that of the WEC teams from the recent past, the only two to connect the engine configuration to the road product were the Nissan GT-R LM and the Audi to an extent, though with Audi it was more focusing on the diesel aspect than it being a V6 or straight four or whatever. Toyota used first the V8 and then the turbo V6 because it made sense for the rules, and Porsche went with the V4 because Porsche. Schlesische posted:The Acura NSX was irrelevant because Acura completely forgot everything that made the original NSX legendary and went in on tech (and price!) when they really didn't need to. ...what made the original NSX legendary was the aluminum chassis technology, the high-revving VTEC engine, the audacity of the company what makes the Civic making a really good sports car, and also the first exotic supercar that was actually reliable. so, that's not tech?  Mazda is awesome and I'm seriously considering the new Mazda
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Feb 1, 2019 13:36
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drgitlin posted:Have a couple of pieces up about Daytona, including this interview with Zanardi that people might enjoy: https://arstechnica.com/cars/2019/02/paralympic-gold-medalist-alex-zanardi-on-how-hes-able-to-race-at-daytona/ okay so this The Legend Alex Zanardi posted:But then I explain that I'm not any more vulnerable, because if I break one of my legs it only takes a 4mm screw to fix it, you know? ...how did you not crack up at that (also the Dinner With Racers episode with Dr. Terry Trammal has an excellent but not-work-friendly story about Zanardi having his sense of humor in the aftermath of his wreck in Germany)
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Feb 1, 2019 15:33
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WindyMan posted:
It’s such a shame the “enormous car” meme was wasted on the BMW M8 GTE.
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Feb 2, 2019 03:33
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drgitlin posted:It’s an M6 GT3, isn’t it? I think the only M8 racecars are the M8 GTEs but maybe I’m wrong. You’re right, it’s the M6 GT3. Which looks small compared to the Bentley.
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Feb 3, 2019 05:28
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Great news, sounds like at least one team is committed to the WEC next yearToyota Gazoo Racing via their Website posted:TOYOTA GAZOO Racing will compete in the 2019-2020 FIA World Endurance Championship (WEC) season, it was confirmed today. there's also news from Toyota in Japan today about their Super GT driver lineups, Nissan is expected to follow with their's tomorrow. I'll wait until both are out there to put together a consolidated list.
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Feb 7, 2019 11:25
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Cygni posted:youve got way more faith in them giving a solitary gently caress about privateers than i do The 19/20 season was always going to be a real lame duck season between rule announcements and implementation, and while it might be processional to confirm Toyota’s back, it’s still a good result and confirmation. And yes, it’s more likely the privateer teams will get a boost next year. They need the privateers. They always do.
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Feb 8, 2019 05:03
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net work error posted:The Patron Nissan DPi won Sebring last year too which is extra lol. they're not the same engine -- the DPi team uses a GT-R GT3 engine, while I believe the Nissan in the ByKolles is the Cosworth engine developed for the front-wheel-drive GT-R LM, which is a purpose-built and designed engine. So it might be a problem (since I doubt Cosworth would be doing much development out of their own pocket and when I think "ByKolles" the word that doesn't come to mind is "budget,") but it's more likely that they just have a really bad cooling design.
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Feb 10, 2019 02:33
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Dudley posted:And to be fair it's not like top speed was that car's problem. top speed would've been fine but I don't think they ever got the hybrid system working, so it was ~500hp versus double that for the other LMP1 cars of the time. That, plus the whole thing being a bit undercooked as a whole, they never got the development chance they needed.
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Feb 11, 2019 14:45
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FuzzySkinner posted:They've apparently re-released the "Snake" and "Moongoose" cars to boot apparently, but I've yet to stumble upon them. I saw 1/64s of each plus a tow vehicle as part of a bigger collection, hopefully still available and what you’d be looking for. In January I went to Tokyo Auto Salon and picked up a few different ones, a group of three of the recent 1/64 LMP1s (including that Nissan GT-R LM in throwback livery) and also the Le Mans-winning McLaren F1. I was pointing out the different die cast shops there to my wife and said “I like to look around but will only buy something I really want,” and walk immediately up to find it 
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Feb 14, 2019 06:12
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MazeOfTzeentch posted:http://www.dailysportscar.com/2019/02/15/bykolles-switch-to-gibson-power-for-lmp1-programme.html they've clearly got a multi-season goal to blow up one of each kind, like a bad stamp card or the world's most expensive bingo game. Part of discussion on Pruett and Goodwin's podcast this week was which engine they might switch to, and it seemed like AER would be the smart choice since they've had experience bolting those engines in before. ah well good luck have spares, see you at Spa you crazy secretive Austrian outfit. Lord knows what crimes the racing team covers up.
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Feb 16, 2019 01:51
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| # ¿ Apr 26, 2024 13:07 |
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Dudley posted:And we don't have pics why? Needed to get the camera out!  still on the lookout for the Audi R18 to go along with the other three LMP1s, may have to go looking some weekend soon.
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Feb 18, 2019 12:28
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