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Jackard
Oct 28, 2007

We Have A Bow And We Wish To Use It

amigolupus posted:

Just read this as well! It's fun and the faces are hilarious, but one thing about it bothers me a little. I think it's how the story feels like it doesn't really allow the villainess to flex her agency. I get that the point is that she's forced to deal with lovely men in her life, but I feel like it might get annoying how every time she tries to clear misunderstandings or tell them to gently caress off, they just completely ignore her wishes.
From the recent chapters it looks like this might change..?

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Fellis
Feb 14, 2012

Kid, don't threaten me. There are worse things than death, and uh, I can do all of them.


Ham Wrangler

Yeah the first 10 chapters of that were kinda spinning its wheels, but the last 3 really opened up the story and it seems way more interesting to follow now.

Compendium posted:

It kind of bothered me at first too, but I'm getting into its rhythm. I don't think it's necessary in these kinds of stories to have immediate wins as it were and I'd argue that part of the conflict, externally is gaining back agency (I mean I hope it is) as a maligned fictional female character who was designed to get screwed over by the narrative which blames her downfall entirely on herself and not the male love interests who don't really get punished by the way they treat her.

Bakarina and a lot of villainness reincarnation stories sometimes start off being reborn in childhood so they have an advantage of being able to change perceptions about themselves early on in order to change their bad ending. Melissa doesn't have that luxury and is working more at the starting point of the story she's in. So, in that way, I can believe why there's a slow pace; the other characters have known her for years as a bratty, pitiful and spiteful girl with a major temper issues. Of course they'd hang onto the idea that she's just being the same and not take her seriously even though she's actively pushing against them to show that they're not innocent in how they've treated her back.

As much as I love Bakarina, there are times where the adoration she gets doesn't feel earned even though she does do things that cause everyone to fall in love with her. That might be with just a few certain characters, not necessarily all of them. It's supposed to be a fluffy romcom at heart after all.

I feel the same about Bakarina new game plus, it feels like she didnt struggle to win people over despite the shorter timelime and more difficulty she should have had. The first one was great, but the second just feels like a retread

Compendium
Jun 18, 2013

M-E-J-E-D


Fellis posted:

I feel the same about Bakarina new game plus, it feels like she didnt struggle to win people over despite the shorter timelime and more difficulty she should have had. The first one was great, but the second just feels like a retread

New game plus Bakarina is hardly struggling and it's way more dull as a result. Hell, it makes me feel lesser towards the main story even though I love the light novel and think the manga adaption is decent enough.

It also makes me realize that I'm starting to have a lot of nitpicky feelings about Bakarina and its relationship dynamics but I'll just leave them at the door because at the end of the day it really is just light fluff.

Rocko Bonaparte
Mar 12, 2002

Every day is Friday!


Bakarina's story might as be over because the climax of the condemnation event has come and passed. If it hadn't taken off so much, that would have been the perfect place to end it.

Sindai
Jan 24, 2007
i want to achieve immortality through not dying

Nap Ghost

Beware the Villainess is rapidly becoming my second favorite otome isekai.

Nemo2342
Nov 25, 2007

Have A Day



Nap Ghost

amigolupus posted:

Just read this as well! It's fun and the faces are hilarious, but one thing about it bothers me a little. I think it's how the story feels like it doesn't really allow the villainess to flex her agency. I get that the point is that she's forced to deal with lovely men in her life, but I feel like it might get annoying how every time she tries to clear misunderstandings or tell them to gently caress off, they just completely ignore her wishes.

The pacing is a little slow, too. In other stories where a lady tries to improve and get even with the terrible people in her life, it takes about the second or third chapter for them to score some kind of win against her tormentors. Here, it took about 13 chapters before she was able to humiliate the prince during the ball by bringing someone else as her date. And even then, her plan still failed because Nine ditched her at the party.

I was definitely feeling the same way; while there is a lot of comedy from everyone in this story being kind of lovely and not listening to each other, it was feeling a little empty since the villainess wasn't really scoring even little victories. The updates today (chapters 22 and 23) have changed that a bit, so I am hoping this is going to be the start of things finally picking up for her.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.


Fellis posted:

I feel the same about Bakarina new game plus, it feels like she didnt struggle to win people over despite the shorter timelime and more difficulty she should have had. The first one was great, but the second just feels like a retread
It is but the addition of new cast members from the school helps it feel more like an expansion rather than just a simple retread. So props for the effort there.

Compendium posted:

It kind of bothered me at first too, but I'm getting into its rhythm. I don't think it's necessary in these kinds of stories to have immediate wins as it were and I'd argue that part of the conflict, externally is gaining back agency (I mean I hope it is) as a maligned fictional female character who was designed to get screwed over by the narrative which blames her downfall entirely on herself and not the male love interests who don't really get punished by the way they treat her.

Part of that from what I noticed was that the main character fell into the trap of excessive inner monologing. Like she'd get the attention of people, then reminisce/complain about them in her mindspace for a bit. So naturally they'd lose interest and she'd be like 'hey i've got something to say here!'
Meanwhile I'm sitting here going 'it looks like you should have tried saying something instead of talking to yourself then.'

And then she did. And it worked.
Ahh catharsis.

Compendium
Jun 18, 2013

M-E-J-E-D


I'd also add on and say the issue is that she's working out of (perfectly understood) self-interest in order to get back at the jerks in her life, but Melissa's only been really successful once she has actual concern for other people other than herself.

Herbotron
Feb 24, 2013



It just keeps getting better? I was not expecting this when she asked for an introduction to a swordmaster but it's the best direction it could have gone, imo.

Nemo2342
Nov 25, 2007

Have A Day



Nap Ghost

Herbotron posted:

It just keeps getting better? I was not expecting this when she asked for an introduction to a swordmaster but it's the best direction it could have gone, imo.

She took quite a few levels in badass (and I love her shades).

khy
Aug 14, 2005




Glad you are enjoying it. Honestly these days finding a new Isekai that is wholesome and doesn't fit in with a billion other tropes where the MC is in a black trenchcoat being overpowered and showing off his cheat skills is difficult. I mean, having a cheat skill in your isekai escape fantasy is well and good but really I like variety of finding stuff that doesn't fit in that mold. So I like to bring any I find to the thread, hopefully some people get a kick out of 'em.

It's one reason why I love Karate Baka Isekai so much, the Protag is offered a cheat skill and just nopes out of there down to fight stuff with Karate. And then he punches the poo poo out of a wyvern. It's like Ride-On King but without all the weird putin propoganda!

That said, I noticed in the latest update of Sentouin, Hakenshimasu! that there's an ANIME COMING! This one totally deserves it, being Konosuba 2.0 and all.

khy fucked around with this message at 03:31 on May 5, 2020

Vincent Van Goatse
Nov 8, 2006

Don't be so gloomy. After all it's not that awful. Like the fella says, in Italy for thirty years under the Borgias they had warfare, terror, murder, and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, and the Renaissance.




Smellrose

khy posted:

Glad you are enjoying it. Honestly these days finding a new Isekai that is wholesome and doesn't fit in with a billion other tropes where the MC is in a black trenchcoat being overpowered and showing off his cheat skills is difficult. I mean, having a cheat skill in your isekai escape fantasy is well and good but really I like variety of finding stuff that doesn't fit in that mold.

It's one reason why I love Karate Baka Isekai so much, the Protag is offered a cheat skill and just nopes out of there down to fight stuff with Karate.

That said, I noticed in the latest update of Sentouin, Hakenshimasu! that there's an ANIME COMING! This one totally deserves it, being Konosuba 2.0 and all.

Why can't there be more Konosuba anime though?

khy
Aug 14, 2005



Vincent Van Goatse posted:

Why can't there be more Konosuba anime though?

Because as fun as Kazuma and Explosion Spell and the rest of the cast are, evil henchman is as good or better.

kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012





It was too.. Mean spirited for me to get into as opposed to Konosuba or Kemono Michi.

Giving that guy a topknot was funny though

Vincent Van Goatse
Nov 8, 2006

Don't be so gloomy. After all it's not that awful. Like the fella says, in Italy for thirty years under the Borgias they had warfare, terror, murder, and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, and the Renaissance.




Smellrose

khy posted:

Because as fun as Kazuma and Explosion Spell and the rest of the cast are, evil henchman is as good or better.

I'm asking why can't we have both.

Sindai
Jan 24, 2007
i want to achieve immortality through not dying

Nap Ghost

Herbotron posted:

It just keeps getting better? I was not expecting this when she asked for an introduction to a swordmaster but it's the best direction it could have gone, imo.
Nice arm and leg definition on the last page.

khy
Aug 14, 2005



kirbysuperstar posted:

It was too.. Mean spirited for me to get into as opposed to Konosuba or Kemono Michi.

Giving that guy a topknot was funny though

Strangely that's what I liked the most about it, but I love stories about the bad guys being bad guys. I adored Ratman, always look for 'be the bad guy' games, and unless they're just pure poo poo I often find myself rooting for bad guys in movies and stories. So this story is pretty much perfect for me.

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005


Clever Betty

yeah I can totally understand not wanting to watch the characters be COMPLETE assholes to each other, and at times in Combatants it totally does get a bit much, but other times it's just so goddamn hilarious that I can forgive its missteps.

the topknot though, holy poo poo, and now it's gonna get animated

edit: number six is totally right, I couldn't eat a sapient, talking creature either.

Captain Invictus fucked around with this message at 04:27 on May 5, 2020

Onean
Feb 11, 2010


New Endo and Kobayashi, and we're so close to finally getting to meet Finne's mother.

gimme the GOD DAMN candy
Jul 1, 2007

Ask me about the hate crime perpetrated against a gay black man, and how it was a real hate crime and totally not fabricated. I am well acquainted with the facts of this actual hate crime which actually took place in actuality.

combatants leans a bit too hard on violence against women as jokes. if it was less frequent, sure, it is supposed to be in bad taste.

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005


Clever Betty

yeah, I totally get that, it's pretty offputting at times.

on an unrelated note, Egg Dragon updated, I wish it updated more frequently since it's one of my favorites of the "stat-based" isekai, I like it more than the spider isekai at least.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.


I like Combatant's because while it's about a jerk in a party of women (hence why it seems to lean so hard on that schtick) there's plenty of mixing it up with the comedy and the villainy.

kirbysuperstar posted:

It was too.. Mean spirited for me to get into as opposed to Konosuba or Kemono Michi.

Giving that guy a topknot was funny though

I can't get into Kemono Michi. It repeats it's central joke too much and it's a bit to saccharine without some sort of variety to it.

khy
Aug 14, 2005



I want to like Eminence in the Shadows. It has all kinds of things I usually like, but the Protagonist's sheer obliviousness puts me off for some reason.

He's a top notch mage? Understandable given his goals. He's a great fighter? Makes perfect sense with his background. He stumbles across a conspiracy and dark cult? Actually not a bad idea, and I liked it. But somehow the combination of stupid luck (IE : Random knife thrown at a map miraculously lands on the location of a kidnap victim) and obliviousness to the fact that the cult he stumbled across is real and not just his own invention pushes it too far and feels dumb to me as a result. I don't know why it rubs me the wrong way. Usually I like most of the elements in play in this story.

Jackard
Oct 28, 2007

We Have A Bow And We Wish To Use It

khy posted:

Strangely that's what I liked the most about it, but I love stories about the bad guys being bad guys. I adored Ratman, always look for 'be the bad guy' games,
Ratman is not a bad guy!

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005


Clever Betty

khy posted:

He's a top notch mage? Understandable given his goals. He's a great fighter? Makes perfect sense with his background. He stumbles across a conspiracy and dark cult? Actually not a bad idea, and I liked it. But somehow the combination of stupid luck (IE : Random knife thrown at a map miraculously lands on the location of a kidnap victim) and obliviousness to the fact that the cult he stumbled across is real and not just his own invention pushes it too far and feels dumb to me as a result. I don't know why it rubs me the wrong way. Usually I like most of the elements in play in this story.
I love that everything he does in the name of "being cool" comes true/is the perfect shot/works out somehow and he's got literal millionaire followers but he considers pulling a fast one to get an "okay" hotel room the height of skill. It's great.

khy
Aug 14, 2005



Here's another new one. MC is reincarnated as a werewolf and a vice-commander in the Demon Lord's army, so he takes over a town with the most adorable army ever. Now he has to manage the city and keep bloodthirsty werewolves and annoying humans from murdering each other. Also his army is adorable.

https://mangadex.org/title/38337/ji...ajimari-no-shou

Only 5 chapters, nothing unwholesome yet, art style's a bit rough but I like it.

khy fucked around with this message at 08:47 on May 5, 2020

Nalin
Sep 28, 2007



Hair Elf

Herbotron posted:

It just keeps getting better? I was not expecting this when she asked for an introduction to a swordmaster but it's the best direction it could have gone, imo.

I'm really loving these series where the MC is just a massive rage-ball. This one takes the cake, though. God drat is she so angry. And rightfully so! She needs to team up with the Mad Dog Princess and go on a cathartic smashing spree.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


khy posted:

I want to like Eminence in the Shadows. It has all kinds of things I usually like, but the Protagonist's sheer obliviousness puts me off for some reason.

He's a top notch mage? Understandable given his goals. He's a great fighter? Makes perfect sense with his background. He stumbles across a conspiracy and dark cult? Actually not a bad idea, and I liked it. But somehow the combination of stupid luck (IE : Random knife thrown at a map miraculously lands on the location of a kidnap victim) and obliviousness to the fact that the cult he stumbled across is real and not just his own invention pushes it too far and feels dumb to me as a result. I don't know why it rubs me the wrong way. Usually I like most of the elements in play in this story.

It's great when he thinks they're just all playing along with him, and when something that ought to be a massive challenge comes incredibly easily to him he thinks its all staged, but when he makes dumbass assumptions about what his closest entourage actually thinks and gets petty and jealous about poo poo it's just far, far worse. It strides the line, but falls off it quite often. A Will Eternal has a similar main character that's just far, far better.

Phobophilia
Apr 26, 2008
This space intentionally left blank.


Onean posted:

New Endo and Kobayashi, and we're so close to finally getting to meet Finne's mother.

Okay I just started this series, and chapter 3 has a phenomenal gag where the heroine obliviously munches on a bird leg like some kind of barbarian in the background. The fact that she is a complete blank slate and barely has a personality has to be a deliberate decision.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


Phobophilia posted:

Okay I just started this series, and chapter 3 has a phenomenal gag where the heroine obliviously munches on a bird leg like some kind of barbarian in the background. The fact that she is a complete blank slate and barely has a personality has to be a deliberate decision.

Oh no, she has a personality, she's just set to minmax mode. Bird leg gives best stat gains.

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005


Clever Betty

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

It's great when he thinks they're just all playing along with him, and when something that ought to be a massive challenge comes incredibly easily to him he thinks its all staged, but when he makes dumbass assumptions about what his closest entourage actually thinks and gets petty and jealous about poo poo it's just far, far worse. It strides the line, but falls off it quite often. A Will Eternal has a similar main character that's just far, far better.
it's at its best when he's using his insanely overpowered abilities to try and force appearing normal but completely fucks it up, like when he pretended to lose that colosseum fight while doing ballerina poo poo and ninja flips in the air as overreactions to getting hit, setting off ridiculously over the top blood squibs and such. that's probably my favorite part of it so far, but it certainly can drop the ball at a moment's notice, very all-or-nothing with its humor

Phobophilia posted:

Okay I just started this series, and chapter 3 has a phenomenal gag where the heroine obliviously munches on a bird leg like some kind of barbarian in the background. The fact that she is a complete blank slate and barely has a personality has to be a deliberate decision.



finne is great

Captain Invictus fucked around with this message at 11:13 on May 5, 2020

Shyrka
Feb 10, 2005

Small Boss likes to spin!

khy posted:

I want to like Eminence in the Shadows. It has all kinds of things I usually like, but the Protagonist's sheer obliviousness puts me off for some reason.

He's a top notch mage? Understandable given his goals. He's a great fighter? Makes perfect sense with his background. He stumbles across a conspiracy and dark cult? Actually not a bad idea, and I liked it. But somehow the combination of stupid luck (IE : Random knife thrown at a map miraculously lands on the location of a kidnap victim) and obliviousness to the fact that the cult he stumbled across is real and not just his own invention pushes it too far and feels dumb to me as a result. I don't know why it rubs me the wrong way. Usually I like most of the elements in play in this story.

The way I interpret it is that he's basically Haruhi and is subconsciously reality-warping everything to go the way it does rather than 'just' being absurdly lucky. I enjoy it pretty well on those terms.

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005


Clever Betty

khy posted:

Here's another new one. MC is reincarnated as a werewolf and a vice-commander in the Demon Lord's army, so he takes over a town with the most adorable army ever. Now he has to manage the city and keep bloodthirsty werewolves and annoying humans from murdering each other. Also his army is adorable.

https://mangadex.org/title/38337/ji...ajimari-no-shou

Only 5 chapters, nothing unwholesome yet, art style's a bit rough but I like it.

a bit rough is understating it I think. like I understand a minimalist style and they certainly have good chops when it comes to character design and expressions, but the description of "every page is like if someone set off a flashbang" is apt. the lack of hard lines can accentuate an artstyle, but in this case a lot of the time it just looks...off.



the lack of lines on their heads at times is particularly jarring sometimes, like there's a few shots of him looking off to the side and there's zero lines indicating where his face ends and the background, which is also solid white, begins, so it's just a floating face and hair in the panel with no lines showing where his head ends. it's an odd choice.

that said, a promising first five chapters, I like it, and the dogmen are suuuuuuper cute.

NinjaDebugger
Apr 22, 2008


Phobophilia posted:

Okay I just started this series, and chapter 3 has a phenomenal gag where the heroine obliviously munches on a bird leg like some kind of barbarian in the background. The fact that she is a complete blank slate and barely has a personality has to be a deliberate decision.

Finne absolutely has a personality, it's just that... okay, so it points out at some point, I forget when, that the original game has a potential path where you ignore the romance entirely in favor of getting swole as gently caress, and get so powerful that you solo the final boss. This Finne is on that route.

Phobophilia
Apr 26, 2008
This space intentionally left blank.


Well I've caught up since. Finne's personality is still much more bare-bones than Endo or Kobayashi or Seig or Liselotte or Baldur. So the writer can be good at characters, it's just that they chose to make her a pure force of nature.

gimme the GOD DAMN candy
Jul 1, 2007

Ask me about the hate crime perpetrated against a gay black man, and how it was a real hate crime and totally not fabricated. I am well acquainted with the facts of this actual hate crime which actually took place in actuality.

this is the second manga adaptation of that werewolf commander thing. the first one got cancelled for some reason and then someone else was tasked with making another.

Argas
Jan 13, 2008
SRW Fanatic




The werewolf LN (Der Werwolf: The Annals of Veight) is up to 7 volumes now anyway. It's kind of a decent read. A slightly toned down isekai power fantasy because the MC is somewhat humble and doesn't particularly care about flexing his isekai advantages the way a more typical protagonist would.

Agronox
Feb 4, 2005


Herbotron posted:

It just keeps getting better? I was not expecting this when she asked for an introduction to a swordmaster but it's the best direction it could have gone, imo.

Yeah, this had a shaky start but it's getting pretty fun now. The motivations of pretty much everyone other than Melissa are murky as heck, though, and the new maid has a real rear end of a name.

AtomikKrab
Jul 17, 2010

Keep on GOP rolling rolling rolling rolling.


Onean posted:

New Endo and Kobayashi, and we're so close to finally getting to meet Finne's mother.

I like this one.



Theres so much good stuff out right now.

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Rocko Bonaparte
Mar 12, 2002

Every day is Friday!


khy posted:

I want to like Eminence in the Shadows. It has all kinds of things I usually like, but the Protagonist's sheer obliviousness puts me off for some reason.

He's a top notch mage? Understandable given his goals. He's a great fighter? Makes perfect sense with his background. He stumbles across a conspiracy and dark cult? Actually not a bad idea, and I liked it. But somehow the combination of stupid luck (IE : Random knife thrown at a map miraculously lands on the location of a kidnap victim) and obliviousness to the fact that the cult he stumbled across is real and not just his own invention pushes it too far and feels dumb to me as a result. I don't know why it rubs me the wrong way. Usually I like most of the elements in play in this story.

I read some translations of the LN up to the latest they had and they never explained that luck. I think the only solace there is that arbitrariness doesn't happen any more. The setting has so much stuff happening everywhere that the protagonist can't swing a cat with its claws digging into the cult in some way.

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