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emgeejay
Dec 8, 2007

and if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you

all those black people who famously immigrated to america

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Orange Devil
Sep 30, 2010

CUNT


Xealot posted:

This was definitely true of Stewart circa GWB, but I feel like it's difficult to be genuinely "centrist" and also have human empathy in the current situation. Republican thought has shifted into such a racist and draconian place, I don't know what a "moderate" position between them and something human would even look like, or how someone argues for such a compromise in good faith. I guess Biden is attempting that, but I think he fell asleep in 2014 and hasn't absorbed new information since before Trump entered office.

"The police shouldn't murder people" and "immigrant children don't belong in cages" are characterized as Left positions now. Even something like Stewart advocating for fair compensation to 9/11 first responders was characterized by conservatives as some partisan Liberal ploy to exploit people's sympathies and squeeze socialism bucks out of them. He'd almost certainly be viewed as "a Leftist" today, and might even self-define as such.

Buddy, Bush had 14 year olds in Gitmo. So he was literally torturing children. You don't get to be "moderate" about that yet claim human empathy.

Republican thought has been racist and draconian for decades. Y'all just kept looking away.

Azhais
Feb 5, 2007


Cybernetic Crumb

Orange Devil posted:

Buddy, Bush had 14 year olds in Gitmo. So he was literally torturing children. You don't get to be "moderate" about that yet claim human empathy.

Republican thought has been racist and draconian for decades. Y'all just kept looking away.

It really started with Reagan. Ford was no saint but at least he tried to do some good social programs. Then the Gipper comes along with his piss on the poor economic system and jettisoning all of the nation's mentally ill onto the streets and it's been steadily downhill from them since

Orange Devil
Sep 30, 2010

CUNT


It started with Nixon, and it became inevitable with Ford's pardon of him.

Unless you are not white, then it started way earlier than that.

Xealot
Nov 25, 2002

Showdown in the Galaxy Era.



Orange Devil posted:

Buddy, Bush had 14 year olds in Gitmo. So he was literally torturing children. You don't get to be "moderate" about that yet claim human empathy.

Republican thought has been racist and draconian for decades. Y'all just kept looking away.

Hey, man, don't say "you." I'm not apologizing for GWB, or Reagan, or Nixon. I agree they were villains, as was Clinton on the topic of racial justice.

I'm saying the political discourse has shifted in the last 20 years, and that circa 2001 there existed a space for "reasonable moderates" that some demographic respected, and that's where John Stewart fit in. GWB was doing supervillain poo poo overseas, but it was possible for media figures to comment on those actions without being publicly called a Leftist cuck or Soros puppet or secret Antifa radical by the entire Republican establishment. The Torture Report this period instigated was a famously bi-partisan thing, even if Republicans were still lining their pockets with Halliburton contracts.

I'm saying that there was a category of centrism in political thought that was lauded as somehow virtuous at that time, but that now whatever illusion it was behind that is gone. Sure, Republicans were evil back then, too...but they knew to try and hide it, or at least pay lip service to some language of moderation. That's gone now.

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

STOP BEING EVIL.


Orange Devil posted:

It started with Nixon, and it became inevitable with Ford's pardon of him.

Unless you are not white, then it started way earlier than that.

Nixon was a scumbag, but he looked and sounded and acted like a scumbag, so everybody who voted for him had to recognize what they were doing.

Reagan's big innovation was putting on a whole song and dance around it so that everybody could become comfortable with all the absolute worst offenses of the party, and every successful Republican since basically relied on the same sort of entirely fictional public facade that Reagan maintained.

And on the other side of the aisle, Bill Clinton defined the values that the Democratic party leadership would rally around to the exclusion of dealing with things like income inequality, increasing corporate power, and a worsening penal system. The new deal died at his feet, and his main accomplishment was balancing the national budget only for that money to become fodder for Republicans to feed to the wealthy while totally burying the truth about which party was more fiscally responsible.

He basically wound up as the model for a non-progressive democrat that the party is desperately trying to cling to despite the country being destroyed by all the issues they ignore, and that's why there are so many people who get very aggressive about "centrists," because the democratic party has backstabbed progressive values constantly and refused to present a united front on extremely important issues while those issues destroy the country.

Toxic Fart Syndrome
Jul 2, 2006

*hits A-THREAD-5*

Only 3.6 Roentgoons per hour ... not great, not terrible.




...the meter only goes to 3.6...



Pork Pro

Has any other president besides Obama ordered the death of a US citizen and his son without a trial for posting YouTube videos while we are discussing sub-optimal presidents?

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007

Bote McBoteface. so what


I'm not defending everything Obama did, but I would take 8 more years of him over 8 seconds of Trumpski.

(Incidentally, "8 seconds of Trumpski" is what earned Stormy Daniels $130k! )

Orange Devil
Sep 30, 2010

CUNT


Xealot posted:

Hey, man, don't say "you." I'm not apologizing for GWB, or Reagan, or Nixon. I agree they were villains, as was Clinton on the topic of racial justice.

The "you" referred to Stewart in that context.

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?


Hormonal stalingrad implies he was victorious

Bro Dad
Mar 26, 2010


something tells me ton that is gonna be against facial recognition the second he becomes a victim of police racial violence

i give it three weeks

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011






Bro Dad posted:


i give it three weeks
That seems generous. The face eating leopards can find you way faster if you give them actual facial recognition tech.

Snowglobe of Doom
Mar 30, 2012

Because if I tell you, you'll tell your friends, your friends are callin' me on the horn all the time, I gotta show up at shopping centers for openings and sign autographs and shit like that and it makes my life a *hell*. Okay? A living hell.


Fan of Britches

I was watching some old clips from the BEFORE TIMES on youtube and hearing the live studio audiences reactions again felt weird

mobby_6kl
Aug 9, 2009

"You are the best poster... do not let anyone say otherwise."


Good episode of Rat Week Tonight. With the cases exploding everywhere (in America at least) the situation in prisons almost never comes up.

https://i.imgur.com/G6QjGUV.mp4

pwn
May 27, 2004

This Christmas get "Shoes"



This week’s episode coincides with this fantastic and thoroughly depressing article in this week’s unusually-good issue of the New Yorker

Punishment by Pandemic: In a penitentiary with one of the U.S.’s largest coronavirus outbreaks, prison terms become death sentences.

Seriously, go out and buy this.



(Closer look)

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

STOP BEING EVIL.


I was kinda hoping that some of the protesting against police brutality would segue into criticism of rest of the penal system. Even aside from the immediate health risk, prisons and jails across the nation are barbaric and need to be heavily reformed. Many should be closed. There's even plenty of justification to end many prisoners' sentences, between overactive judges and police and the sentences being served for offenses that may not still be crimes. There's also plenty reason to criticize the sub-citizen treatment of people after they were released from jail, but that's a bit of a further tangent.

John Oliver sounds pretty mad, and he really should be. The horror stories of people dying horribly and still being put further at risk can really grind you down.

whos that broooown
Dec 10, 2009


I normally appreciate the deep dives into subjects, but its really not cutting it right now. poo poo is happening too fast.

Phenotype
Jul 24, 2007

You must defeat Sheng Long to stand a chance.



I think he's done a deep dive on for-profit prisons before, hasn't he?

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010




Yes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pz3syET3DY

Stare-Out
Mar 11, 2010

not all who wander are lost


That "And now, this.." sure was something. Also, PS5 hype out of nowhere.

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011






Stare-Out posted:

That "And now, this.." sure was something.

Good news Butch, you'll get to die for the flag real soon.

Stare-Out
Mar 11, 2010

not all who wander are lost


Alhazred posted:

Good news Butch, you'll get to die for the flag real soon.

Yeah goddamn, I wonder if he'll feel the same hooked up to a loving respirator.

Kamrat
Nov 27, 2012

Thanks for playing Alone in the dark 2.

Now please fuck off


I don't have HBO, what was the "And now, this" segment all about?

Stare-Out
Mar 11, 2010

not all who wander are lost


Kamrat posted:

I don't have HBO, what was the "And now, this" segment all about?

A bunch of AMERICAN PATRIOTS one after another bitching to some council in Florida about the mandate to wear masks and how it's un-american to force people to do that. With bonus WHO/CDC conspiracy bullshit and how one guy would die for the flag. Typical dumb crap.

Kamrat
Nov 27, 2012

Thanks for playing Alone in the dark 2.

Now please fuck off


Stare-Out posted:

A bunch of AMERICAN PATRIOTS one after another bitching to some council in Florida about the mandate to wear masks and how it's un-american to force people to do that. With bonus WHO/CDC conspiracy bullshit and how one guy would die for the flag. Typical dumb crap.

Ah thanks! Yeah I figured it was something stupid like that.

Remora
Aug 15, 2010


The "clunk" that painting made gives me life.

muscles like this!
Jan 17, 2005



Yeah, John just casually tossing it off camera was pretty great.

Chris Knight
Jun 5, 2002

And I'm only saying this because I care.

There are a lot of decaffeinated brands on the market today that are just as tasty as the real thing.



Fun Shoe

Holy poo poo Papa John

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

STOP BEING EVIL.


It's no surprise that the Senate doesn't want to do anything about the eviction crisis. They straight-up don't believe in preventing the suffering of people. You can hear it right where they say that passing another relief bill should be considered in the context of how well the economy is doing. The non-bigoted portion of their platform is based upon promising that they will have some kind of effect on the random fluctuations of the economy, and they refuse to make the connection between an economy going badly and human suffering, from the big suffering like people being murdered and dying in the thousands to the smaller suffering like crippling debt and lack of income mobility.

I like how John Oliver made sure to clarify that the way rental housing works was already a crisis before the pandemic exacerbated it, because it's true. It needs massive reform, probably even central planning instead of relying on people who just want a safe return on their investment.

And then Papa John is also proving how he's still fantastically wealthy despite being ousted by his company. I don't know what he's trying to build up good will for, but he could probably afford to live the rest of his life without working.

Djarum
Apr 1, 2004

I promise, that one day, everything's going to be better for you.



Soiled Meat

SlothfulCobra posted:

And then Papa John is also proving how he's still fantastically wealthy despite being ousted by his company. I don't know what he's trying to build up good will for, but he could probably afford to live the rest of his life without working.

He wants to run for public office, potentially Governor of Kentucky next cycle. It was already in the plans before his meltdown. Which the stories that will come out if he tries to run for office will be nothing compared to what is already out. He is fairly universally loathed by anyone that has interacted with the guy. It is very well known that he would randomly pop into locations around the Louisville area unannounced and do incredibly inappropriate things. I have a close friend that worked at a location for a couple years after High School that he would stop in to on a regular basis. He would harass the female staff and it was basically told to them that they had to be quiet about it or else there would be ramifications to them personally.

I haven't had one of his pizzas in almost 20 years and I hope I never give a cent to that piece of garbage ever again.

whos that broooown
Dec 10, 2009


Papa John can't provide healthcare to his employees because he needs to buy a statue wrongly demonstrating how eagles gently caress.


This is the american dream.

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010




Papa Bless





or Papa Flex






Papa Bless







or Papa Flex

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011






SlothfulCobra posted:


I like how John Oliver made sure to clarify that the way rental housing works was already a crisis before the pandemic exacerbated it, because it's true. It needs massive reform, probably even central planning instead of relying on people who just want a safe return on their investment.


It's a crisis in every country, even mine. Rich people are buying up apartments and renting it out to insane prices because they know people are desperate. In my opinion a regulated market is the only solution.

Djarum
Apr 1, 2004

I promise, that one day, everything's going to be better for you.



Soiled Meat

Alhazred posted:

It's a crisis in every country, even mine. Rich people are buying up apartments and renting it out to insane prices because they know people are desperate. In my opinion a regulated market is the only solution.

Easiest way to combat this is by introducing a compounding real estate tax. If you own a single property you have the standard tax rate. Your second property raises this. Every property after compounds that tax rate to a point where it is uneconomical to own that much property. You can also charge a higher tax rate to those that live out of state as well to curb property speculation, etc.

You can also levy no-occupancy fines and taxes as well as the same on undeveloped land in residential or commercial areas.

Xealot
Nov 25, 2002

Showdown in the Galaxy Era.



Djarum posted:

Easiest way to combat this is by introducing a compounding real estate tax. If you own a single property you have the standard tax rate. Your second property raises this. Every property after compounds that tax rate to a point where it is uneconomical to own that much property. You can also charge a higher tax rate to those that live out of state as well to curb property speculation, etc.

You can also levy no-occupancy fines and taxes as well as the same on undeveloped land in residential or commercial areas.

This is a really interesting solution I haven't heard before, and it's pretty elegant. That is, punishing real estate hoarders without ruining single homeowners in the process.

I live in Los Angeles, which is pretty much one of the worst-case-scenarios for buying real estate in the US. Rich people speculating on property is a huge contributor to our collective misery; the other is a de facto property tax situation where those rates are locked in or near the assessed value of a property when it was purchased, ensuring that anyone who bought a home decades ago has little incentive to sell and every incentive to rent. The population is high, the available housing stock is low, the real estate values are inflated, and the only thing likely to change any of that is boomer homeowners dying en-masse (at which point those homes' values would be re-assessed for inheritance purposes.)

I'd love to own property at some point in my life, but out-competing the super wealthy for an ever-dwindling housing stock makes that impossible. And I'm solidly middle-class by any national definition; I can't even begin to imagine how bad it is for poor residents of South Central or East LA getting gentrified out of their own communities.

It sucks that most voting homeowners wouldn't understand this proposal if it became a ballot initiative. "TAXIFORNIA GONNA BIG TAX UR HOUSE / MAKE U HOMELESS / GOVERNMENT GREED BAD / VOTE NOpaid for by every pro-developer PAC in the region"

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009





What do you do about companies that legitimately own tons of properties to rent out? If you give them an exception, wealthy jerks will just incorporate that part of their lives into a company.

Djarum
Apr 1, 2004

I promise, that one day, everything's going to be better for you.



Soiled Meat

Josh Lyman posted:

What do you do about companies that legitimately own tons of properties to rent out? If you give them an exception, wealthy jerks will just incorporate that part of their lives into a company.

Well under a plan like this, such a business would not be able to exist or if it did it could not be profitable.

The idea would be to encourage ownership of property for all people by lowering the costs of property due to lack of scarcity. Those that are renting are in owner/operator situations so you have to actually interact with your renters and vice versa. Renting will still be in demand as you will have younger people just starting out in life, people moving to a new area for various reasons and not ready or wanting to settle down, etc.

On the commercial/industrial side you might need to have things slightly looser but you can have very strict rules in it what zoning the properties are, the amount and size of property and vacancy to curb both misuse in ways you are thinking and encourage small business owners. I would envision things on the commercial side being almost like the mall concept in some ways in which you have an anchor business that may rent out additional space to smaller businesses. You would also have an increase in smaller local businesses as well. A plus in this is that mega businesses like a Wal-Mart or McDonalds would have a much more limited reach. I would assume they would move towards a purely franchise model which would limit their profits and power ultimately.

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011






Djarum posted:

Easiest way to combat this is by introducing a compounding real estate tax. If you own a single property you have the standard tax rate. Your second property raises this. Every property after compounds that tax rate to a point where it is uneconomical to own that much property.

We've had this for three years in my country and it hasn't actually made that much of a difference.

Azhais
Feb 5, 2007


Cybernetic Crumb

Alhazred posted:

We've had this for three years in my country and it hasn't actually made that much of a difference.

Yeah, the rent just goes up. Just like a trade war, pass that extra cost on to the consumer.

The US charges like 4x property tax on rental stuff already

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Djarum
Apr 1, 2004

I promise, that one day, everything's going to be better for you.



Soiled Meat

Alhazred posted:

We've had this for three years in my country and it hasn't actually made that much of a difference.

What country and how is it laid out. In how I think about it, even if you are very wealthy once you hit let’s say 4 pieces of property the cost of taxes coupled with occupancy requirements would make the costs so high that you would effectively be paying the assessment values every year in taxes.

My first thought is that your country doesn’t have the penalties high enough to actively discourage property ownership after a certain point and is more looking to generate more tax revenue.

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