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Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Pepperoneedy posted:

As long as we have free euthanasia centers with pretty pictures I'll be fine with the oceans and plankton and the world at large gradually dying

quote:

free
free doesn't make numbers go up, so if you fall under the good old American Trumpian Imperial Empire of North America's MAGAwesome... enjoy Eutho(TM) brand euthanasia drug, guaranteed a painless death(*), only 15,000,000,000,000 per dose

we expect generics to be available in about 500 years after never

gently caress you pay us

(*) in the event of pain only the taker has cause of action because of the binding EULA you signed by breaking the seal on the pills

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Complications
Jun 19, 2014

There's all these papers about how there'll be temperatures to let crocodiles inhabit the arctic ocean along with pine trees growing in the arctic circle, and it's just occurred to me that there's an entire continent at a pole. How long until the idea that we'll just move to the melted (and pristine, fossil fuel raw resource rich) Antarctic ends up being the mainstream reason to do nothing?

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

:tif:

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Cowpocalypse posted:

india is also in the midst of a water shortage which is getting worse

according to this report 40% of india's population, including 21 major cities, will have no drinking water by the year 2030

india will probably be one of the first dominos to fall
upside - we're going to find out about the practicalities of nuclear war just before it does

a nice trial run before the serious arsenals open up
:hmmyes:

who would've ever foreseen that we'd need to enshrine a right to make the government work to ensure a climate that's viable for human life exists

Complications has issued a correction as of 21:51 on Jun 6, 2019

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Rime posted:

I think you confused it for the other shade of grey. A good time to repeat a resounding :fuckoff: for graphs which use barely discernible color shades.

E: We got any dumbfucks in here who still believe that Voting democrat will do sweet jack poo poo against the collapse of our biosphere? Better click that link, if so.
Citizens United still paying dividends, I see.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Good news, that. Industry underreporting could account for a decent chunk of the methane that hasn't been accounted for previously. It probably means that the arctic feedback loop hasn't really taken off after all.

Yet.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Rime posted:

Nah, the isotopes of that mysterious methane indicate a biological rather than industrial origin.
Welp.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Maha posted:

We're going to 5°C, aren't we?
Your optimism warms my heart.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Economic Patriotism courtesy of Elizabeth Warren, considered by Americans to be a radical leftist.

quote:

The specific Warren proposal on this score has three parts, a Green Apollo Program, a Green Marshall Plan, and a Green Industrial Mobilization.

The Apollo Program is a ten-fold increase in clean energy R&D funding, the Marshall Plan is a $100 billion program to help foreign countries buy American-made clean technology, and the Industrial Mobilization (which it would perhaps be more natural to call a “Green New Deal,” were that name not already taken) proposes a massive $1.5 trillion federal procurement initiative over 10 years to buy “American-made clean, renewable, and emission free products for federal, state, and local use and for export.” That’s roughly the scale of federal spending on defense acquisition and would of course turn the federal government into a huge player in this market.
To bring some numbers into this:

Clean Energy R&D, between 6-20 billion dollars per year depending on if it takes the Trump budget cuts into consideration
Marshall Plan, $100 billion dollars total
Industrial Mobiliation, $150 billion dollars per year.

Basically, 265ish billion dollars per year in industry subsidies as her perfect ideal policy proposal to be inevitably watered down and/or destroyed by an inevitably Republican Congress within three years. Radical leftism in action, everybody.

Human civiliation will be carbon neutral by 2200 at this rate

because we'll all be dead

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Ramrod Hotshot posted:

one thing I've often wondered about - why, and more importantly how, does Phoenix exist
It was the home of some decent native american agriculturalists who got ruthlessly imperialized by the Spanish, became a stopoff point for US migrants headed west, became a railroad hub for the SW US in the 1880s thanks to becoming a cargo hub due to nearby rivers that east/west travelers patronized, grew for a bit off of that, and then became the Silicon Valley of the 1950s and 60s.

It was the last bit that really drove the whole thing over the cliff.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Cowpocalypse posted:

daily reminder:



remember when optimistic idiots thought we could keep it under 2°? lol that's all but an impossibility at this point
hmmm 4C hellpit by 2070

neat

statistically I'm gonna be dead around that point by various old age things if nothing else

is this what being a boomer feels like

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

water makes plants grow, lots of water means they'll grow bigger and faster and eat more CO2, this was all part of god's plan to let his chosen capitalists more more money

checkmate libs

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Ramrod Hotshot posted:

Yeah but how is there enough water for 4 million+ people and their golf courses?
:thejoke:

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Ah, green business. Let's see how that's working out.

quote:

In 2010, members of the Consumer Goods Forum, including some of the world’s biggest consumer brands, pledged to eliminate deforestation by 2020, through the sustainable sourcing of four commodities most linked to forest destruction: soya, palm oil, paper and pulp, and cattle.
[...]
Greenpeace says it wrote to more than 50 traders, retailers, producers and consumer companies early in 2019 asking them to demonstrate progress towards deforestation by disclosing their commodity suppliers.

Only a handful replied and all of those that did disclose the requested information source products from traders or producers involved in forest destruction, they said. None of the 50 demonstrated “meaningful” action to end deforestation, the campaigners said, based on assessing their policies and publicly available supply chain information.
[...]
In a statement, the CGF said: “Today, the CGF’s members have moved substantially closer to our goal of 100% sustainable sourcing of the four commodity groups. But over the last nine years we have also learned that the forces driving deforestation are more complex than almost any stakeholder realised in 2010.”

The CGF now believes that sourcing certified sustainable commodities is not sufficient to eliminate deforestation, and so has been working over the past 18 months with external stakeholders to develop a more effective strategy, it said. Details of the strategy, which will be discussed at this week’s global summit, will be shared during UN climate week in September, as planned, it said.
Don't worry, even if nothing got done for the last ten years they plan to get it right in the next decade. It's all gonna be okay 'cause the corporations said so.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

A quick lmao for everybody with regards to farm soil loss that I dug up on a whim - we all know it's estimated at about 75 billion tons per year for the United States alone. Courtesy of the Bureau of Transportation Statistics we know thanks to table 2-4 that the US transported a little over 28.5 billion tons of cargo in 2017. Total. As in railroads, trucks, river shipping, literally everything all together shipped about a third of the total that we'd need of end product alone to offset soil loss. Thanks to the explanation of table 2-2 we know that 50% of that by weight was shipped less than 100 miles. That, too, would be going way up since, well, the supplies for that effort wouldn't exactly be mined out of the rest of the farmland now would it?

...

I guess we'll just be building fucktons more trucks and laying fucktons more rail and building fucktons more highway and factories and mines and chemical refineries

numbers go up can get us out of this right?

:thejoke:

Complications has issued a correction as of 04:24 on Jun 12, 2019

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

net work error posted:

Folks, good news!
https://www.npr.org/2019/06/12/730258832/as-polar-ice-cap-recedes-the-u-s-navy-looks-north?utm_medium=RSS&utm_campaign=news
I like that half the article is dedicated to showing how cool and busy the navy is landing planes in this area no humans should really be in.
I'm glad to see that the infamous polar ice cap, universally reviled as an unyielding foe of freedom of navigation, is finally being subdued by the unlimited might and brilliantly innovative American industry.

:911:

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Eh, I'm still getting the occasional bout of hysterical laughter at the permafrost melting a literal order of magnitude faster than expected. I mean, the clathrate gun was 500-800 years or so away from firing according to the model of permafrost melt and if that follows like the surface stuff is, then it'll be 50-80 which is just... :discourse:

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Crazycryodude posted:

So if you expect to still be alive in a few decades what's the most useful life skill besides marksmanship to learn? Should we all be learning how to permaculture a few acres of remote wilderness or is expecting such a thing to exist too optimistic?
Find someone who's liable to end up a neo-feudal lord and discover what talent their current groupies lack. If you're aiming to be a farmer you're probably going to be drafted to feed someone else, so... try to make sure it's not Lord Farming Is Unholy or whatever if that's what you want to do.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Booourns posted:



very cool
Just looking at that makes my skin crawl, and the implication that there are cracks around to fall in...yikes. At least the dogs look like they're having fun.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Torpor posted:

yes but what if the climate changed?
Wait, unplanned obsolescence on a massive scale? As if we needed any more evidence that capitalists are God's chosen..

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Rime posted:

With 6000 activists on hand to run interference and blockade and a core few hundred armed with portable Oxy torches and a couple canisters each, you could easily do enough damage to put a bucket wheeled execavation system such as Bagger 293 permanently out of commission and make it uneconomical if not outright impossible to operate the mine at all.

But, uh, enjoy sitting around getting high for a couple of days while talking up how meaningful this is and then watching that mine continue to operate for years to come I guess?

Seriously, that level of mobilization is a small army. That's power. It's time for it to stop accomplishing sweet gently caress all and actively dismantle infrastructure instead.
Careful there, Icarus.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

vyelkin posted:

hands up if you're excited to get clathrate gunned 70 years ahead of schedule

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/jun/18/arctic-permafrost-canada-science-climate-crisis
Most of the clathrates are a fair bit deeper, where we expected them to take a few centuries to get to. Seems like the estimates are about to drop to decades, but there's always hope that it'll accelerate further! We're at the very start after all.

Stairmaster posted:

Hm, but what if I don't want to die?
We regret to inform you that the free market has spoken on the subject already.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

vyelkin posted:

well in that case then hands up if you're excited to get infected by frozen prehistoric diseases 70 years ahead of schedule
BOOYAH

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

quote:

things don't look that bad, yet

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Notorious R.I.M. posted:

If this monsoon season doesn't bring rain we're going to get to see how the first major mass human migrations play out.

Reminder that Delhi, Bengaluru, and Hyderabad are right behind Chennai in running out of water
One billion climate refugees by 2050 - worst case scenario or increasingly baseless optimism? Potentially 53.695 million about to go... :getin:

Complications has issued a correction as of 06:53 on Jun 19, 2019

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Conspiratiorist posted:

What the gently caress is eco-friendly about yet more plastic and hydrocarbon fuels?
Eco-what now? This is about making numbers go up with good propaganda, not doing anything hippy with the environment.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

India's short of water, Pakistan's short of water, Afghanistan's short of water, Iran's getting into short of water, Bangladesh is trying to help its coastal villages handle salt water influx, Thailand and Myanmar are running short on water... That entire region is poised to let go.

The response I've seen is "well, they shouldn't have let the government centralize water control instead of keeping the tradition of local ponds fed by monsoons they've got plenty of water really it's all government's fault free market lol"

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Yinlock posted:

don't worry i'm sure india is working on a solution and not just watching all the water disappear with a blank look on their face
given their near total reliance on ground water that their own analysts say is going to be dry come next year

well

next decade's gonna get an interesting start

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

StabbinHobo posted:

MOAR DOMES
edit2: ok this one finished me off


so the plan is to build suburbs with mcmansions that look different

and here I was worried that numbers would go down

phew

thank you domehouse, you've saved capitalism

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Cowpocalypse posted:

the monsoons are becoming less reliable, rainfall patterns are changing (for the worse) across the subcontinent

India is running out of water, fast

one of the world's most populous nations is running out of water and there's uh... there's no real plan to deal with the consequences :tif:
It's not getting better this year either.

:stonklol:

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Aw, you didn't quote the best part.

quote:

In other words, if ESAS springs a big fat leak, the Big Burp, which would only be <5% of the existing frozen methane deposit; it is possible that atmospheric CO2e would zoom up go as high as 1256 ppm.

What happens next?

A recent third-party study, also referenced in the aforementioned Arctic News article d/d June 10th, concluded that at 1200 ppm atmospheric CO2 global heating cranks up by 8°C, or 14.4°F, within a decade. (Source: Arctic News d/d June 10, 2019). Truth be known, that scenario is not problematic, it’s catastrophic and too far along to be classified as a problem. After all, problems can be fixed; catastrophes are fatal.
I bet we can get 8C by 2050! Who's with me?

never mind, everybody's in this with me

:tif:

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Telephones posted:

okI lol like kkpI is here to be SCARED to 😬😳😳😳6iikokI'M GONNA BE FINE, OKAY????
e rim and rime are only an e apart :schizohat:
I mean, it means global warming of 8C instead of 16C

sorta the difference between being shot square in the face by a .50cal vs being shot square in the face by an MBT

the end result is pile of body parts either way, only difference is how many

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Shima Honnou posted:

Look at this guy, not being an optimist. I say we can make 8C+ by 2030!
You're betting on an earth fart by 2020, eh? Bold man. :getin:

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Anyway, we've had a lot of doom and gloom recently so I wonder what technological wonders by our farsighted captain of industry billionaires have been made to save us all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHX9pmQ6m_s&t=294s

The main use being to make... oil extraction cheaper. And they hope that this technology will help ensure that we only end up 50% reliant on fossil fuels by 2040.










Good news, everyone. Oil prices are going to go down and oil company stock is still an excellent investment!

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Trainee PornStar posted:

I remember saying in one of the old threads that I'm half tempted to sell the house & cash in my pension to buy a boat & gently caress off into the horizon to see what happens.

I got told its a bad idea... I guess this is no longer the case?
Hold off until the arctic blue oceans, at least.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

JAY ZERO SUM GAME posted:

Maybe there just isn't an answer, and it's all hosed???
Hmm. Perhaps there is no ethical consumption?

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Xaris posted:

lmao if we can't even run nuclear reactors in the near future because its too hot. i cant wait to find out solar panels will actually melt and lose efficiency at 55c or something stupid

(also most Air Conditioners break when its too hot, which is actually cool n good)

it's ok tho, you know what still works? CLEAN COAL. beautiful, clean, gorgegous, stupid sexy, horny, coal
The problem isn't that we can't run the nuclear power plants, the problem is that they'd fry everything living in the river if they kept running. We're at the point of needing to do triage - is it important to offset making a bigger problem, or is it important to preserve and protect an environment that's unlikely to exist in 30 years? Naturally we're far more concerned about what would cause outrage immediately rather than what causes extinction later. Hooray for quarterly reports.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Turtlicious posted:

e: I'm not going to stop posting hopeful news, I refuse to just accept that I, and everyone I love will be dead and there's no way to walk back from that. I will volunteer, protest, march, and fight. I haven't given up on the world and neither should you.
You go right on ahead man. Just understand that we're going to need, bare minimum not-including-inputs, 4x more cargo transport capacity and probably more like 10x+ to be moving all this neat new soil stuff around. Just the soil. At the same time that we need to expand mineral production and processing of basically everything but especially rare earths 3-4x to replace all our infrastructure and ICE. And while we're doing that, we also need to be actively cutting emissions. Like, emitting less than are now with an order of magnitude or more less infrastructure and cargo moving around than we need to have to make all this happen.

While the third world continues to develop. Which will add more than I just discussed all on its own. While we're mitigating all the disasters. While we're losing small countries probably in the next few years. You know, like accounts-for-8% or more-of-global-GDP India. Did I say small countries? I meant huge ones. We're going to lose huge countries. I don't mean lose as in they take GDP hits I mean lose as in they run out of water.

Which means we have to dump resources into fighting numbers-go-down instead of infrastructure building because god forbid that happens when the world is built around numbers-go-up.

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Four posts from charging in with optimistic news and daring us all to gainsay it to preaching about how only action can save us all. 25 minutes, and nine different posters involved in total in replies. Good job, everybody. It's been nice watching someone's brain break over lunch.

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Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Zohar posted:

*fart noise*

Better out than in, I always say

*laugh track*

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