Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

spacemang_spliff posted:

doesn't Ukraine have a memorial to literal Nazis?
they have a literal nazi militia battalion

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

https://twitter.com/yashar/status/1365720721964457989

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy


https://denislavinski.substack.com/p/visions-of-a-new-political-nationalism

quote:

In June of 2008, four nationalist organizations held a conference at the Hotel Cosmos in Moscow. The conference was titled “A New Political Nationalism”. A banner with a a fair-skinned blonde Russian boy against a blue sky was strung up on stage. A slogan at the top reads “The Future Belongs to Us!”.

The design is as crude and rudimentary as the point the organizers are trying to get across. The image above is grainy and low-res, but I included it because it’s a small glimpse into Alexey Navalny’s past. A far cry from the glossy and well-produced persona he maintains today.

Navalny stands with his arms raised triumphantly alongside three figures from Russia’s Nationalist far-right. They are: Chairman of the political party Great Russia, Andrey Savelyev; Chairman of Russian Social Movement (ROD), Konstantin Krylov; and the leader of the Movement Against Illegal Immigration (DPNI), Alexander Potkin aka Belov.

...

Inceltown
Aug 6, 2019

What did Lavinski actually get banned for? Because if it was Navalny stuff (it wasn't) then that is strange. Seems like it might be worth mentioning what got them banned Yasha.

Some Guy TT
Aug 30, 2011

was he actually banned for a different reason or is this some kind of bit

Tiberius Christ
Mar 4, 2009

The people in charge of whos getting banned might not be rational, lib brain is all about petty grievances and finally getting enough power to crush your enemies

spacemang_spliff
Nov 29, 2014

wide pickle

awesome so glad we're funding that. that really owns

loving america lol

Atrocious Joe
Sep 2, 2011

I missed that a few weeks ago Chait wrote about this again
https://twitter.com/jonathanchait/status/1363149410763378688?s=20

spacemang_spliff
Nov 29, 2014

wide pickle
Still crack pinging over the explicitly nazi aligned, west backed battalion in ukraine

Atrocious Joe
Sep 2, 2011

The fascists won the Cold War
https://twitter.com/MSNBC/status/1359361959448219648?s=20

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth

it's so loving funny that Poland is going 100% holocaust denial and nobody's talking about it. Just straight up 'actually the nazis were fine, we should be like them even, what holocaust we didn't do poo poo' in europe and everyone's just all 'lol poles'.

Toplowtech
Aug 31, 2004

The case could do what the people pushing it want it to do? SHOCKING!!!! But thanks for explaining the obvious professor, i would never have guessed.

Virtual Russian
Sep 15, 2008

sexpig by night posted:

it's so loving funny that Poland is going 100% holocaust denial and nobody's talking about it. Just straight up 'actually the nazis were fine, we should be like them even, what holocaust we didn't do poo poo' in europe and everyone's just all 'lol poles'.

People often forget that the Polish state was hella reactionary. Hitler invading basically gave them a free pass.

Malleum
Aug 16, 2014

Am I the one at fault? What about me is wrong?
Buglord
before the nazis invaded poland they were so chummy that they both invaded czechoslovakia at the same time lol

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1367838319569215490
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1367838974870495234

is pepsi ok
Oct 23, 2002

Love all the replies going "but how do you explain him going to Russia on AMERICA'S SPECIAL DAY THE FOURTH OF JULY?!?!"

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
https://twitter.com/StevenBeynon/status/1369046293377613827?s=20

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth

is pepsi ok posted:

Love all the replies going "but how do you explain him going to Russia on AMERICA'S SPECIAL DAY THE FOURTH OF JULY?!?!"

America is that person who constantly says 'I can't believe I have to work ON MY BIRTHDAY' as if they genuinely don't understand why.

bedpan
Apr 23, 2008


this didn't do any favors for Augustus' successors

Some Guy TT
Aug 30, 2011

nice to know it is effectively impossible to protest the capitol the same way it was protested during the george floyd protests not that anyone would want to do such a thing now that the democrats are in charge of coursr

AceRimmer
Mar 18, 2009
I vaguely remember that the official investigation states that almighty Russian intelligence didn't actually know what a primary or caucus was until absurdly late into 2016, anyone got the exact fact and citation for this?

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010

AceRimmer posted:

I vaguely remember that the official investigation states that almighty Russian intelligence didn't actually know what a primary or caucus was until absurdly late into 2016, anyone got the exact fact and citation for this?

i don't, but i also recall that they didn't understand "red state" or "blue state"

and yet somehow, totally stole the election!

SpaceGoku
Jul 19, 2011

AceRimmer posted:

I vaguely remember that the official investigation states that almighty Russian intelligence didn't actually know what a primary or caucus was until absurdly late into 2016, anyone got the exact fact and citation for this?

wouldn't surprise me a foreign intelligence service didn't know how the 2016 primaries worked because the 2008 clinton campaign didn't understand how the caucuses worked either

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

WampaLord posted:

i don't, but i also recall that they didn't understand "red state" or "blue state"

and yet somehow, totally stole the election!

Unless you can explore the parallel reality where Russia did nothing and Hillary won, it is obviously logical to believe that they caused Trump to win.

commielingus
Jan 23, 2021

by Athanatos

SpaceGoku posted:

wouldn't surprise me a foreign intelligence service didn't know how the 2016 primaries worked because the 2008 clinton campaign didn't understand how the caucuses worked either

8 years later hillary thought rust belt meant her husband’s whip on epstein’s island

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
https://twitter.com/Billbrowder/status/1368702867134119943

Some context on Browder:

nut posted:

i don't think i can lower myself to reading this



if people aren't familiar, Bill Browder was one of the biggest profiteers to Yeltsin's (America's) 1990s shock capitalism in Russia. Browder had also gone through such valiant endeavors as renouncing his american citizenship to dodge taxes. In the same vein, he abandoned Russia following a civil tax judgement of 19 milly, leaving his accounting, Sergei Magnitsky behind to be arrested and answer for his crimes. Magnitsky died in jail (Russians say it was cardiac arrest, Browder and the US by extension say torture). Browder said Magnitsky was actually jailed not for Browder's own indiscretions but instead because Sergei had somehow exposed 230 milly in theft by the Russian govt.

Browder lobbied to get the Magnitsky act passed in America, which introduced sanctions on Putin and oligarchs close to him. Browder also fought tooth and nail to prevent release and screening of a documentary called "The Magnitsky Act: Behind the Scenes" by Andrei Nekrasov, a Russian dissident, because it suggested that Browder had made up most of his story.

Perhaps in the chaotic magic of this thread, I guess this can be woven back into the subjects here because the Magnitsky Act was famously combated by Putin barring the adoption of Russian orphans by Americans, which probably has implications here, sadly.

e: I don't even know where to begin to suggest to my dad that this is wild propaganda. Maybe ask him why he thinks the head of a capital firm that pillaged Russia in the 90s would write this book and not, say, an academic or journalist

nut posted:

I was reading a bit more and it sounds like Browder claimed that Magnitsky actually uncovered that Browder had been forced to overpay 230 mill in tax and def not fled the country after refusing to pay the 19 mill he still owed

the adoption ban was apparently justified by Putin pointing out a case of a Russian orphan dying when it was left alone in a hot car in Virginia.

also, I mentioned Browder relinquished US citizenships to dodge taxes, here’s the Wikipedia part with his justification for doing so

“In 1999, Browder received naturalization as a British citizen. Meanwhile, he relinquished his U.S. citizenship in 1998.[3][4][5] He cited that he did so because of "a legacy of bad feeling about the rule of law" as a result of his family having been "viciously persecuted" by U.S. authorities in the 1950s, citing especially his communist grandfather, Earl Browder who was imprisoned twice during the era of McCarthyism.”

Earl Browder was the leader of the US Communist Party for a while

nut posted:

I got it all from Max Blumental's Management of Savagery, but I agree that I was overzealous with how hard I believed it. I imagine both huge corruption in the russian government and browder, but he ultimately got slighted and took to the magnitsky act for retaliation. Regardless, here's some sourcing from his book

Bill Browder on this list of 5 citizens who left left the US to avoid paying tax
https://www.cbsnews.com/media/5-citizens-who-left-the-us-to-avoid-paying-tax/

https://www.jpost.com/opinion/architect-of-the-cold-war-374151
"On the one hand, he appears to be leading a crusade against corruption in Russia’s economy and regime. On the other, he is said to head a personal vendetta against Putin, while himself being responsible for corrupt – if not worse – behavior."

>Browder as one of the pillagers of Russia after shock capitalism by US-backed Boris Yeltsin
"Eastern Europe – especially Russia – opened to the West with the fall of the Berlin Wall, and Browder made full use of the chances provided. In 1996, after spending some years in Poland and studying privatization processes in formerly communist states, he founded Hermitage Capital Management for the purpose of enabling his activity in Russia"

>Browder's side of the story
"In June 2007, documents, computers and other sensitive materials were confiscated during a raid on his company’s Moscow offices. According to Browder, corrupt elements in the police and Russian tax authorities utilized the documents to establish straw companies and receive the largest tax return in Russian history – $230m.
In order to expose the affair, Browder employed Sergei Magnitsky, one of Hermitage’s lawyers in Russia."

>Russia's side of the story
"According to documents presented by the Russian authorities, Browder – with Magnitsky’s help – founded two companies in Russia’s Kalmykia region to evade $17m. in taxes in 2001. The prosecution claimed that Browder and Magnitsky exploited a law that allows 50% tax breaks for companies with a workforce of 50% handicapped employees, and claimed that one of the companies employed three people – Browder and two handicapped workers, whose labor cards were forged."

"Still, his motives are unclear. Is he really a knight in shining armor who wants to cleanse Russia of corruption and settle scores with Magnitsky’s killers, or is this a personal vendetta against the Russian authorities for halting his flourishing enterprise? There is no answer as of yet, but questions have been piling up over the last month, as Browder has continuously avoided the order to appear in a New York court in connection with a trial conducted by an American company against the Russian Parvazon Holdings. The suspicion is that assets purchased in the city actually constituted part of a scam to launder $230m., stolen from the Russian exchequer."

https://newrepublic.com/article/126760/fighting-putin-doesnt-make-saint
"Although Browder has been a willing interview in the press, getting him to make his case under oath has been a story in its own right. Browder gave up his U.S. citizenship in 1998 and has lived in the U.K. since leaving Russia. After a lengthy search, a process server finally managed to surprise him last summer in Aspen, Colorado,where he had given a speech. (A judge ruled the summons was not served properly due to lack of residence). Six months later, another server caught up with Browder in New York following an appearance on The Daily Show. When he charged forward to present subpoena papers, Browder slipped out of the side of his limousine and fled on foot. (The incident was captured on video). This time the judge ruled the subpoena was valid and the financier was deposed."

The video is linked in the article if u wanna see it

https://foreignpolicy.com/2016/06/1...y-bill-browder/
"But according to Nekrasov, that narrative is wrong. By his telling, Russian authorities were the victims of a massive theft, not the perpetrators. The film, he told Foreign Policy in a telephone interview, provides strong circumstantial evidence that Magnitsky’s boss, Bill Browder, was possibly involved in the multimillion dollar theft from Russian taxpayers."

"Here’s where the accounts diverge: Browder says the police then stole three of his holding companies and used them to claim a $230 million tax rebate; Nekrasov, who previously directed films critical of the Kremlin, argues that authorities were investigating Hermitage Capital over legitimate concerns about large-scale tax evasion.

“I can prove in court that Browder is not telling the truth,” Nekrasov told FP in an interview from Berlin.""

"Nekrasov’s film documents how he went from trusting Browder’s word to disbelieving it. The director says he began to doubt the hedge fund manager after reading the actual police reports in Russian. For example, Nekrasov argues that Magnitsky’s first contact with the police was not a voluntary act of whistleblowing, as Browder maintains, but a record of the police questioning him as a key witness in a tax evasion investigation."

"“The worst criticism comes from my Russian friends,” he said. “Most of my friends are completely pro-Browder, and Putin doesn’t have any influence over them. I became like a traitor.”

Browder has thwarted Nekrasov’s previous attempts to show the film with threats of legal action. The first time, he intervened at the last minute to stop Nekrasov, with Blu-ray disc in hand, from showing it to an audience of European Union parliamentarians at the their headquarters in Brussels."



And I never contended that Magnitsky wasn't killed, I just said what Russia and Browder both claim it was (and would, personally, totally believe he was killed in prison). Though I am a little sussed out that the site you linked uses Voice of America to source a pic for Magnitsky


Apoplexy
Mar 9, 2003

by Shine

Jesus Christ. I knew exactly Browder's side of the story and that Magnitsky died. Not that he was a Kirov-esque figure elevated after his death far beyond his reach in life and Browder bears significant responsibility for literally tens of millions of people suffering to the extent they have in Russia. Oof.

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

https://twitter.com/THR/status/1371194637856219136

Dr. Killjoy
Oct 9, 2012

:thunk::mason::brainworms::tinfoil::thunkher:
yeah real horseshit, Ronan Farrow’s performance of Catch and Kill should have won

Apoplexy
Mar 9, 2003

by Shine
Smokin' Turd Album

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

https://twitter.com/TheDailyEdge/status/1371897939958857729

Atrocious Joe
Sep 2, 2011

https://twitter.com/CNNSitRoom/status/1371960976669544451?s=20
https://twitter.com/Lawrence/status/1371896327051747330?s=20

Suspicious
Apr 30, 2005
You know he's the villain, because he's got shifty eyes.
:derp: Russians russians russians!!! :derp:

Some Guy TT
Aug 30, 2011


is that seriously the best example they can come up with

im not sure i can remember anyone actually making that argument at all last year even trump himself didnt really bother with it

galagazombie
Oct 31, 2011

A silly little mouse!
They are aware Biden won right? I swear they think Trump is still president with how they won't shut up about him being a pawn of the heathen east.

Winifred Madgers
Feb 12, 2002

got to make sure he can't rise from the grave in '24

Some Guy TT
Aug 30, 2011

https://mobile.twitter.com/JenniferJJacobs/status/1372151517545955329

digging how even in bidens tough guy fantasies he cant say with any confidence we can prove there was election interference

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

Some Guy TT posted:

https://mobile.twitter.com/JenniferJJacobs/status/1372151517545955329

digging how even in bidens tough guy fantasies he cant say with any confidence we can prove there was election interference

quote:

President Donald Trump said in an interview Sunday that he respects Vladimir Putin and, when challenged that the Russian president is "a killer," he pushed back that the United States is not "innocent."

Trump made the remarks to Fox News’ Bill O’Reilly before the Super Bowl on Sunday. Excerpts of the interview were released Saturday.

https://twitter.com/FoxNews/status/828019230100426752

When O’Reilly asked why Trump respects Putin, the president said, "Well, I respect a lot of people but that doesn't mean I'm going to get along with him."

When O’Reilly said, "Putin’s a killer," Trump responded: "There are a lot of killers. We’ve got a lot of killers. What, do you think our country’s so innocent?"

Doktor Avalanche
Dec 30, 2008

it's really tragic that the only american (possibly even western) president/prime minister of my lifetime with flashes of public genuine insight into the fabric of society is donald loving trump

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

the only correct american editorial line RE: calling putin a killer lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qkzc_P-ZGV8

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply