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Beasteh
Feb 12, 2012

I'M QUESTIONING MY EXISTENCE AND THIS IDIOT JUST WANTS TO PEE OFF A WALL



We see a few times throughout S1 that the whole 'the thread of fate has been severed, reload a save file or persist in this doomed world you have created' thing actually happens

Beasteh fucked around with this message at 00:42 on Mar 31, 2019

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XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.


Toalpaz posted:

Defeating the sky whale was very rewarding for Subaru but like... I've never really seen a character taken down so many notches before, and he literally admits that he wants to give up before Rem intervenes. They kinda have to give him something to feel kinda good about, though some of the respect is probably unearned considering how he'd been acting just a few 'days' earlier in their time.

I recently watched the edit where his failures are removed so it's all a single timeline, and this was one of the most interesting aspects. You basically are watching the events unfold as Emilia or Rem or Julius experienced them, and you get to experience exactly what Subaru looks like to everyone else.

And it makes way more sense than I thought it would. Like, you mentioned that Subaru was just recently acting totally unstable before the Sky Whale arc. That's true, but in context, it doesn't seem out of place, because he always acts like that. From his perspective, his mood shifts are gradual, and that's how it looks when we watch the show normally. But, to everyone else, it is a daily, sometimes even hourly event for Subaru to go from sunken, abject despair to cartoonishly manic confidence and back again. He barely even has a normal.

Like, he comes off winning the Sky Whale arc, full of resolve and guts. And in the middle of his big inspiring speech to fire up his troops, he suddenly switches from raring to go, to contemplative and muttering to himself and tells everyone to cancel all the plans because now he'd like to spend some time discussing ancient magical theory & myth for a while. And they roll with it.

In other words, to everyone else it seems like he's functionally bipolar.

AlternateNu
May 5, 2005


XboxPants posted:

I recently watched the edit where his failures are removed so it's all a single timeline, and this was one of the most interesting aspects. You basically are watching the events unfold as Emilia or Rem or Julius experienced them, and you get to experience exactly what Subaru looks like to everyone else.

And it makes way more sense than I thought it would. Like, you mentioned that Subaru was just recently acting totally unstable before the Sky Whale arc. That's true, but in context, it doesn't seem out of place, because he always acts like that. From his perspective, his mood shifts are gradual, and that's how it looks when we watch the show normally. But, to everyone else, it is a daily, sometimes even hourly event for Subaru to go from sunken, abject despair to cartoonishly manic confidence and back again. He barely even has a normal.

Like, he comes off winning the Sky Whale arc, full of resolve and guts. And in the middle of his big inspiring speech to fire up his troops, he suddenly switches from raring to go, to contemplative and muttering to himself and tells everyone to cancel all the plans because now he'd like to spend some time discussing ancient magical theory & myth for a while. And they roll with it.

In other words, to everyone else it seems like he's functionally bipolar.

Wait. Someone spliced all the "true timeline" scenes together? Where can I get this?

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012


Ytlaya posted:

At one point (I forget if it's in Arcs 1-3 or 4, but it's not a spoiler either way) someone (I think Ram?) comments on how Subaru is utterly unremarkable in every way, but seems to somehow always be at the right place at the right time. It's kind of interesting thinking about how the events of the series must look from the perspective of the other characters who only see an uninterrupted chain of Subaru's "successful" loops. To them, Subaru must just be this dude who goes through bizarre mood swings and is randomly going places and saying things in ways that somehow result in avoiding bad outcomes.

edit: One other thing that comes to mind about Subaru's particular time travel gimmick is that it's probably for the best that he can't tell other people, because it would be immensely disturbing to find out that if this guy dies your current existence would effectively be erased and everything you did for the past couple days (or whatever) rendered irrelevant. Is the "you" from when Subaru goes back in time the same "you" as the current one? Who knows!

I heard it does not work like that, the timelines continue on without Subaru.

XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.


AlternateNu posted:

Wait. Someone spliced all the "true timeline" scenes together? Where can I get this?

["Rewatching from a single timeline" link removed]

Don't get too excited, though, it cuts out less than I was expecting. Even with all the failures removed, it's still drat over 5 hours long. Cool idea, though.

XboxPants fucked around with this message at 20:39 on Mar 31, 2019

Conspiratiorist
Nov 12, 2015


Ytlaya posted:

My apparently controversial Re:Zero opinion is that Rem is not actually that interesting following the conclusion of her brief-ish character arc. Beyond the latter parts of Arc 3 there isn't really any place for her character to go and she basically just exists as "girl who loves Subaru really hard." I also generally strongly dislike the whole anime/manga trope of a love interest being totally cool with the protagonist being in love with someone else and having such a "pure" love that they're fine just sort of existing in their close social circle for eternity. The absolute worst and most inexcusable part was when Subaru mentioned taking on Rem as a second wife if Emilia is okay with it - like I mentioned before, romance is the only aspect of this series I actually dislike, and I'm hoping for the extremely unlikely possibility that Emilia at some point tells him to gently caress off with that.

edit: Even the stuff Conspiratiorist mentioned in his post above this one is almost all just tied into Subaru being an interesting character, with Rem just sort of existing as a reminder that he had a positive impact on someone.

Rem isn't like that, though. She's head over heels for Subaru because he's this mysterious, quirky stranger who came out of nowhere, and despite being a weakling, through heroic determination and saying the right words not only saved her life, but also managed to break through her shell and allowed her to finally start sorting out her traumatic life issues.

And she knows there's another girl he likes - he won't shut up about it - so what does she do? She mimics him and voices her affection for him just as he does for Emilia, doing her best to grab his attention. And Subaru notices this, but dismisses it by reasoning she's just going through a hero worship phase... until she clearly confesses her feelings for him when he needs to understand just how much he means to her.

He rejects her. Specifically, he rejects her because she told him to follow his heart rather than elope with her just because she was available. Because she'd love that, but that's not the point.

And this is heartbreaking for her, but she still loves him, and still wants to support him, so she doesn't act any different over it. Why would she? The only thing that's changed is they now know clearly and without pretenses where they each stand, deepening their bond. He's still her hero.

But most importantly is that even after being clearly rejected, she hasn't given up. Rem doesn't accept being out of the running. Despite the situation they're in, and the short time they have available, Rem insists on showing that she's interested in him in a more than platonic way (to Subaru's awkward surprise), and goes so far as to feign she's dying to force a confession out of him. The entire thing with the polygamy option? That was Rem grabbing him by the balls. There was nothing pure about that.

Rem gives her 100%, truly.

And later, after Emilia and Subaru formally become an item, she's a thorn on her side - Subaru is very clearly in love with Rem as well and there's no way for Emilia to compete with her.

AlternateNu
May 5, 2005


XboxPants posted:

Original reddit post
(I apologize if this is skirting too close to )

Don't get too excited, though, it cuts out less than I was expecting. Even with all the failures removed, it's still drat over 5 hours long. Cool idea, though.

Oh god, the audio leveling on that file is horrendous.

Wark Say
Feb 22, 2013


Zofia Today
Alm: Human Disaster


Lipstick Apathy

XboxPants posted:

Original reddit post
(I apologize if this is skirting too close to )

Don't get too excited, though, it cuts out less than I was expecting. Even with all the failures removed, it's still drat over 5 hours long. Cool idea, though.
It is indeed iffy, because while the series as a whole (I think even the shorts and ovas? I haven't checked in a while) is legally available in Crunchyroll, I really don't think that Kadokawa is looking forward to do something like this officially.

Also, please keep spoiler talk light or non-existent. A lot of folks haven't read/don't want to read neither the light novels nor the web version.

Wark Say fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Mar 31, 2019

madmac
Jun 22, 2010


The shorts are still available on Crunchyroll, last I checked, though the actual episodes may be region locked now that Funi is putting out the discs.

The OVAs are a bit of a sore spot, they're both theatrical releases (second one doesn't even come out until Oct this year) so they're effectively not available to English fans so far. From what I know, the first OVA is just fun side-story stuff set between Arc 2 and 3, but the second OVA looks like it has a bunch of critical character backstory for Emily, so that could be a problem if it leads straight into Season 2 and no one overseas has seen it.

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

I TRUST JOE BIDEN AND THE DEMS


Conspiratiorist posted:

Rem isn't like that, though. She's head over heels for Subaru because he's this mysterious, quirky stranger who came out of nowhere, and despite being a weakling, through heroic determination and saying the right words not only saved her life, but also managed to break through her shell and allowed her to finally start sorting out her traumatic life issues.

And she knows there's another girl he likes - he won't shut up about it - so what does she do? She mimics him and voices her affection for him just as he does for Emilia, doing her best to grab his attention. And Subaru notices this, but dismisses it by reasoning she's just going through a hero worship phase... until she clearly confesses her feelings for him when he needs to understand just how much he means to her.

He rejects her. Specifically, he rejects her because she told him to follow his heart rather than elope with her just because she was available. Because she'd love that, but that's not the point.

And this is heartbreaking for her, but she still loves him, and still wants to support him, so she doesn't act any different over it. Why would she? The only thing that's changed is they now know clearly and without pretenses where they each stand, deepening their bond. He's still her hero.

But most importantly is that even after being clearly rejected, she hasn't given up. Rem doesn't accept being out of the running. Despite the situation they're in, and the short time they have available, Rem insists on showing that she's interested in him in a more than platonic way (to Subaru's awkward surprise), and goes so far as to feign she's dying to force a confession out of him. The entire thing with the polygamy option? That was Rem grabbing him by the balls. There was nothing pure about that.

Rem gives her 100%, truly.

And later, after Emilia and Subaru formally become an item, she's a thorn on her side - Subaru is very clearly in love with Rem as well and there's no way for Emilia to compete with her.

By "pure" I mean the sort of thing where the character is basically willing to (as is made explicit in this case) literally be a second wife. And this is really as much of a problem with Subaru as it is a problem with Rem; it wouldn't really be an issue if Subaru just changed his mind and stop pursuing Emilia, but it is very obvious that Emilia is still the "main love interest."

I also just generally don't really like romances where the girl is unconditionally supportive (this doesn't mean that she doesn't ever disagree with Subaru, but rather that her #1 priority is always doing what she believes to be the best thing for him) and doesn't really seem to have any of their own independent goals unconnected to the protagonist (or have any interesting/dynamic relationships with characters other than the protagonist). While there's a plot reason for this being the case with Rem, it doesn't really stop it from not being that enjoyable. This dynamic is kinda reversed with Subaru/Emilia, where Subaru is fully committed to helping Emilia achieve her goals, and while Emilia certainly has her own issues as a love interest, she at least has her own fairly complex circumstances that she's navigating independent of Subaru's involvement.

Conspiratiorist
Nov 12, 2015


Ytlaya posted:

By "pure" I mean the sort of thing where the character is basically willing to (as is made explicit in this case) literally be a second wife. And this is really as much of a problem with Subaru as it is a problem with Rem; it wouldn't really be an issue if Subaru just changed his mind and stop pursuing Emilia, but it is very obvious that Emilia is still the "main love interest."

I believe you're really selling short the complexities of the relationships involved here by both wildly extrapolating from limited information, conflating the situation with one of the classic simplistic solutions for love triangles/harems in fiction, and your own notions regarding polyamory in real life.

And fact is, straight from the author's mouth is that he dislikes harems, so that's not what he was going for with this, either. Case in point is the sentence I spoiler tagged.

madmac
Jun 22, 2010


Conspiratiorist posted:

I believe you're really selling short the complexities of the relationships involved here by both wildly extrapolating from limited information, conflating the situation with one of the classic simplistic solutions for love triangles/harems in fiction, and your own notions regarding polyamory in real life.

And fact is, straight from the author's mouth is that he dislikes harems, so that's not what he was going for with this, either. Case in point is the sentence I spoiler tagged.

I agree.

Also in general Rezero really avoids becoming a big harem, outside of Emily and Rem everyone pretty much has their own weird relationships going on instead of fixating on Subaru.

ViggyNash
Oct 9, 2012


I ve started rewatching the first season to remind myself what even happened in this show.

The biggest thing I forgot is how well put together this show is. They really sell Subaru's moment to moment experiences down to some surprisingly granular detail. The audio cues, visuals, and editing do a lot of work to make that happen but make it seem easy.

Sefal
Nov 8, 2011


Fun Shoe

Man I completely forgot Rem feigning dying.

Meme Emulator
Oct 4, 2000



Conspiratiorist posted:

Why did you hate the second half?

I just watched the show last weekend and had the same thought. The third arc was way too long was mostly my problem. I understand what they were going for with Subaru breaking down and succumbing to despair but it really felt like the show was wallowing in it and entire episodes went by with nothing happening because he was too busy freaking out. Everything with the White Whale felt like nothing important is happening too, sure it was an important bargaining chip to get assistance to stop the Witches Cult but surely that could have been resolved without having to put in a 3 episode long mini arc where people just do the naruto run while dragging a sword behind them making whale sashimi.

Meme Emulator fucked around with this message at 14:33 on Apr 2, 2019

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005


Clever Betty

mmmmm, whale sashimi.

Phantasium
Dec 27, 2012



Hello, I watched season 1 almost entirely just because someone in the chat thread mentioned they were watching it one time and I expected it to be dumb and for babies because the only thing I knew about it was the maid twins but then invariably cried like a bitch during the talk episode because the show was so good and if anyone ever changes my avatar again I will murder them.

Knowing more is getting adapted is great news that I somehow passingly read and forgot about until just now.

Angry Grimace
Jul 29, 2010

ACTUALLY IT IS VERY GOOD THAT THE SHOW IS BAD AND ANYONE WHO DOESN'T REALIZE WHY THAT'S GOOD IS AN IDIOT. JUST ENJOY THE BAD SHOW INSTEAD OF THINKING.


Meme Emulator posted:

I just watched the show last weekend and had the same thought. The third arc was way too long was mostly my problem. I understand what they were going for with Subaru breaking down and succumbing to despair but it really felt like the show was wallowing in it and entire episodes went by with nothing happening because he was too busy freaking out. Everything with the White Whale felt like nothing important is happening too, sure it was an important bargaining chip to get assistance to stop the Witches Cult but surely that could have been resolved without having to put in a 3 episode long mini arc where people just do the naruto run while dragging a sword behind them making whale sashimi.

Yep. It got very close to feeling like misery porn.

Meme Emulator
Oct 4, 2000



I really liked the scene when Subaru gets to the mansion with Rem in his arms and monster-puck decapitates him from 500 meters away. One little scene nailed the hopelessness and despair of the situation with some very evocative imagery, but then the proceeded to spend the entire next episode showing me how bad it was again by having Subaru feigning a mental collapse. Yall already showed me once, and in a really good way!

Ill probably watch Season 2 because I would like to know whats going on with the various mysteries of the world but hearing that a single arc is enough to fill up an entire second season sorta gives me pause.

e: I might have my timeline messed up and the decapitation was after he was chained up and met Betelgeuse. In that case pretend I said "They showed me in one minute what they failed to show me in the preceding 19" instead.

Beasteh
Feb 12, 2012

I'M QUESTIONING MY EXISTENCE AND THIS IDIOT JUST WANTS TO PEE OFF A WALL



The ending of ep 15 is probably my fav ending of any anime episode, felt like a samurai western

a kitten
Aug 5, 2006



Fallen Rib

Meme Emulator posted:

I really liked the scene when Subaru gets to the mansion with Rem in his arms and monster-puck decapitates him from 500 meters away. One little scene nailed the hopelessness and despair of the situation with some very evocative imagery,

sleep


I don't know if I'd ever rank this show among my all time favorites, but that one short scene is top tier for sure.

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010





Angry Grimace posted:

Yep. It got very close to feeling like misery porn.

subaru was def hard to watch for a while

Sefal
Nov 8, 2011


Fun Shoe

Beasteh posted:

The ending of ep 15 is probably my fav ending of any anime episode, felt like a samurai western

It's so good.

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

I TRUST JOE BIDEN AND THE DEMS


I wonder if Subaru is ever going to have the sense to attach some sort of bomb to his head or something so he can just peace out whenever an inevitable painful death is in the works.

Meme Emulator
Oct 4, 2000



Ytlaya posted:

I wonder if Subaru is ever going to have the sense to attach some sort of bomb to his head or something so he can just peace out whenever an inevitable painful death is in the works.

Oh yea, Subaru steels himself and commits a triumphant suicide in like episode 6 or 7 but during the third arc hes back to fearing death. I think Subaru not wanting to die and struggling with every life is a good idea so leaping off of the cliff towards the sunset seemed weirdly out of place, especially since he never triumphantly dies and purposefully resets again.

I really did like the show despite all my posts being complaints, lol. Im just a bitter dude who focuses on the negative

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012



Him killing himself that one time was him saying "this reality is so hosed that I'm willing to go through death to get rid of it, because seriously this is just the worst" not "I'm totally cool with dying now"

Conspiratiorist
Nov 12, 2015


Yeah. He still doesn't know if there's some kind of limit, so suicide is something he'd contemplate in only the absolute worst possible situation, like Emilia dying.

LostRook
Jun 7, 2013


So is Satella the half-elf n-word?

Conspiratiorist
Nov 12, 2015


LostRook posted:

So is Satella the half-elf n-word?

Imagine if the devil was real and killed half the world a couple centuries ago.

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012



LostRook posted:

So is Satella the half-elf n-word?

It's satan. It's like someone being born half goat with a pentagram on their forehead.

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005


Clever Betty

It's satan except chocolatey and delicious.

Phantasium
Dec 27, 2012



If you look at things from her View, she's what brought us Radical Dreamers and radio broadcasts over weird timed sequels to Link to the Past.

ViggyNash
Oct 9, 2012


So I just finished rewatching season 1 and I'm not entirely sure why I hated the second half so much. It definitely felt drawn out (which is heightened on a weekly schedule) and the talking about running away episode was still too much talking, but overall I enjoyed it a whole lot more than my first viewing. I also feel like I understood what they were going for better and could empathize with it. Unfortunately what they were going for was breaking Subaru down to blood, flesh, and poop, then building him back up again. I can totally understand if that exhausted and disgusted some viewers and might have been what bothered me so much on the initial viewing.

Furnaceface
Oct 21, 2004




Beasteh posted:

The ending of ep 15 is probably my fav ending of any anime episode, felt like a samurai western

That episode literally turned the whole show around for me. The music at the end sells it so hard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vzlO4yvHVk

I was a mess by the end of it.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012


I would say more the Sauron then Satan equivalent.

The evil Dark Lord who meanced the whole world, but is currently largely dormant, though their servants are still causing trouble.

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012



a child born who happens to look precisely like hitler, whose toothbrush moustache is permanent and can not be shaved off

Wark Say
Feb 22, 2013


Zofia Today
Alm: Human Disaster


Lipstick Apathy

Episode 15 is "Crushing Despair and Horror" in a very neat, streamlined form. It's the sort of thing that you'd expect from the usual suspects/a seasoned veteran in the topic (Ito, Umezu, Tomino, early Nasu, Urobuchi, y'know the drill), but in this day and age, it's frankly mind-blowing just how completely desolating it makes you feel watching/listening/experiencing that bit.

I am kinda glad that I didn't decide to tackle the novels now that the 2nd season has been announced, because I absolutely want to know where does the story go next and, more specifically, I want to see it animated.

Conspiratiorist
Nov 12, 2015


The novels up to the end of the anime (Chapter 5 of Vol. 9) are still a good read to get a more fleshed out perspective on the world and the characters.

Eej
Jun 17, 2007

HEAVYARMS


One thing I really appreciated about Season 1 is the brutal takedown of Nice Guys. You spend so much time in Subaru's head that when he breaks down and tries to guilt Emilia about how much he's done and sacrificed for her you kinda go along with it until she stops him stone cold saying that he has created a mental image of an Emilia that doesn't exist because she never asked or wanted him to suffer just for her to be happy. It's such a simple thing but it rings so true for real life when so many people are so desperate to win the affections of someone or make them happy that they don't pause to consider that maybe they don't want you to go through all that trouble and if places them into an unwanted "debt" that demands some level of reciprocation.

The follow up Rem stuff is kinda tonally weird after that since it feels so departed from the reality of how people interact but hey that's anime!

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Conspiratiorist
Nov 12, 2015


Taken out of context the Subaru and Emilia scene can be read that way, but ultimately the point of it is they're both wrong.

Subaru hosed up, and he tells it straight he hosed up, but makes the mistake of overlooking just how important the promise was to her, then hoping Emilia would understand his feelings even though he can't explain them, and lastly snapping and in desperation demanding she accept his behavior as is because he owes her at least that much in light of all he's done for her.

Meanwhile, Emilia was hoping Subaru would be her friend, and doesn't understand he loves her. Can't understand it. That someone would truly be willing to push themselves like this - even against her own wishes - just because of personal affection towards her is simply something she can't internalize. And ultimately decides that what's best, for Subaru, is to push aside the matter of his reasons and cut contact with him.

The importance of promises is also something that's a quirk of hers that she's nevertheless pushing onto him, even though Subaru has little way of knowing.

It's a failure of communication on both sides. The scene with Rem, then, serves as the exact opposite: both parties patiently listen as they take turns pouring out their hearts to each other.

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