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Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Echidna is great, and I hope to finally get back to live watching anime with fellow goons after dropping off for a while!

paragon1 posted:

Pretty cold of Subaru to just start hanging out with another witch without properly responding to Satella's confession.

When was this

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Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Furnaceface posted:

No. I require a 14+ paragraph effort post to explain it.




Conspiratiorist posted:

She whispers "I love you" when he attempts the "I can Return By Death!" trick to lure the White Whale.

Now that I remember it I think you're right but wasn't it a "wordless" whisper? Or does the LN/WebNovel make it explicit?

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Subaru was kind of a dick at first but as Re;Zero starts progressing more as a isekai reconstruction after departing the deconstruction train station the more I start to root for him as a relatable expy.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

So I've been wondering, does Echidna "know" Subaru isn't from this world? Are the Witches exempt from Satella's meddling in that regard? Or is it okay since Satella ate the other Witches a long time ago so they are probably already her?

Grouchio posted:

Episode 5:

Guess who's baaaaaaaaaack

It will be interesting finding out where the (this episode spoilers) reset point is. Depending on where it ends up it will ask a lot of questions and perhaps prompt some answers.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Rudoku posted:

If she didn't know before, she does now. I mean, she chose to wear that uniform.

I wonder how much of this though is her not "knowing" and is just how the illusion works, i.e she is not truly conscious and is just responding automatically given the inputs like a really advanced robot; or she is in fact conscious and self-aware and aware of her surroundings and if the latter it's interesting that Satella doesn't react to Echidna knowing but did whenever Subaru tried to spill the beans to anyone else including Emilia.

Rewatching the Director's cut in preparation for the new season, I notice some people in this thread and reddit talk about Satella, are we as anime only watchers supposed to "know" that it's Satella squeezing Subaru's heart? I feel like it's been very strongly hinted at and is pretty obvious but I don't think they explicitly did so; I know Subaru taunted Betelgeuse a bit about it but not in a super explicit way.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

He also still has a bit of a thing where he treats people like NPC's in a video game.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Roswaal's actions for an IRL comparison is the famous example of Churchill infamously deciding to let Coventry be bombed by the Germans instead of risking informing them that they had cracked the enigma.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

Not really? That comparison would only make sense if he knew due to having spies in the Witch Cult and he didn't want to blow their cover.

More about the idea of letting bad things happen, very bad things, in order for a win later.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Vincent Van Goatse posted:

You mean a specific thing that didn't actually happen? Interesting analogy considering return by death and all.

Anime isn't real either? I don't get your point here. Whether the event happened or not doesn't really have bearing as an analogy for Roswaal's motivations.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Wicked Them Beats posted:

You literally called it an "IRL comparison." Very weird to double down on it when someone proves it isn't. Also the analogy was bad regardless. If you wanted to make a dumb WW2 analogy using debunked conspiracy theories you could have at least gone with the classic "FDR knew about Pearl Harbor in advance." That one is way more directly applicable to the situation we're discussing.

There's a pretty big difference between a literal conspiracy theory which had no evidence and something that's so commonly believed in popular culture it even made it into an episode of Star Trek; but again it doesn't really change the point of the post so it's equally strange to me in an anime thread to focus more on whether it happened or not over the value of the analogy; because if I had just slightly reworded my post's substance wouldn't have changed.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Vincent Van Goatse posted:

If you're drawing an IRL comparison you should make sure the event you're using actually happened. Like if I said that Roswaal blowing up the mabeasts at the end of the mansion arc was like how Perseus and the Athenian triremes rode to the rescue of the Spartans at Thermopylae I'd expect to be endlessly dunked on, or at least corrected on my inaccurate knowledge of history.

You posted something historically false and I, being a historian, corrected you while trying to keep the post relevant to discussing this wonderful show. It's not rocket surgery.

But this continues to sorta not make sense, who here would actually know about those ancient greek conflicts to result in you being "endlessly" dunked on? Like that's a terrible example and would actually support the idea that it's a reasonable mistake to make. Why is being dunked on something that would be expected instead of making productive use of the conversation that happened? We should be all friends here focusing on good faith constructive discussion, not aiming for openings to "own" people or await hazing rituals. Yes, 'twas wrong about an event I heard in my highschool history class two decades that got reinforced by popular culture oh well! Sadly never came across that wikipedia article before and now I know better.

Regardless, I don't see why that should in the end negate the observation made in that post in its entirety is what I'm saying, because if there had been a mythological event that was approximately similar that had came to mind instead I would've used that instead, because my usage of "an irl comparison" was because I thought it was true; not as an assertion in the validity of the analogy.

Raenir Salazar fucked around with this message at 20:25 on Aug 7, 2020

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Wark Say posted:

Uh, I was busy?

Also Raenir and Vinny knock this off or I'm giving you both a timeout.

No problem!

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

LostRook posted:

In fairness, this isn't the busiest anime season.

I'm hype for when I'm a Spider so what finally comes out!

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

AlternateNu posted:

I'm trying to remember how far back (e.g.; which timeline iteration) was the scene where Rem dies in the mansion and everyone thinks Subaru was responsible. Then, due to Beako initiating a pact with Subaru to protect him, all the mansion's big guns (Ram/Roswaal/Beatrice) turn on each other.

Roswaal's whole "keikaku doori!" moment doesn't make sense if it was devised prior to the point that loop is initiated.

Maybe I wasn't reading the scene properly, but that whole interaction back in season 1 never made much sense to me.

There's a few possibilities here, one is that Roswaal momentarily lost his cool seeing one of his Servants dead in front of him; another is he was pretending to get upset enough to force the issue in order to motivate Subaru to reset the loop. Or something else.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Is it really the case that Beatrice doesn't like Subaru? I get the feeling Subaru wouldn't have such a knack for finding her if she didn't on some level like the attention? Lots of people like it when you check in on them and say hi but quickly have their "social energy" expended and shoo you out.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Makes you think then when Subaru couldn't find her anymore after upsetting her; which either implies she was letting him find her or Subaru is subconsciously refusing to let himself face her again until he made good to her.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Being Subaru is suffering.

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

Yep, this is definitely Re Zero. gently caress being Subaru.

Things were going too well!

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Not Keyser Soze posted:

The fact that "this time" gets by without a heart grab possibly means we could have characters piece together the whole Return by Death system without violating whatever arbitrary rules Satella has in place over what Subaru can disclose.

RBD seems to be whenever he's trying to tell someone deliberately, it's interesting that Echidna reading his mind or similar seems to get a pass, or Subaru's random non-sequitors also get a pass. Feels like Satella's rules about this might be either be a bit under autopilot according to very specific criteria, or her like ghost or something maybe either is cool with it as long as he isn't trying to jeopardize her plans. It'll be cool to see what the explanation in the end is.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

I think Subaru's resets are mostly in regards to him reseting until he achieves some personal or overall goal that helps in advancing Satella's still currently unknown Xanatos level of consoluted plan. I don't really see what not being able to reset the death of Patriche and Petra would accomplish other than traumatizing him more. Maybe it could be argued he has yet to truly accept loss but I'm not really feeling it that's super pressing right now.

Sometimes the reset point is made right after some major change i.e his fight with Emilia, either because the Doylist explanation that its necessasary for his personal growth in how he sees and interacts with others or because the Watsonian explanation being that fight was necessary to advance the Plan.

One thing that I felt like I noticed this season was he might've been a little too reliant on the ability to reset to avoid a bad outcome, instead of facing it head on and learning the most from it; i.e acquire as much information as possible. Like when he first encountered Rem this season he learned nothing from that reset other than that it couldn't be reset. He didn't try to investigate it because of how distraught he was.

I feel like I can intuitively sense some sort of parallel being drawn here where Emilia is having difficulty facing her past, but isn't really concerned with the future; where Subaru is the reverse, in the end he faced his past head on, its the future he's afraid of where he's afraid of losing those he loves and would prefer to reset everything rather than face it again.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

That's a good point as well that I'm not sure we've ever had a reset save update at any time before the latest point he dies at or along those lines.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

A big flaming stink posted:

while thats true, haven't the reset points been like, 4 or 5 points total?

There haven't been that that many save points but there's been a lot of resets such that going by the current pattern Subaru generally has at least until he gets past his latest death by reset before his save moves. And generally his save never moves if he hasn't accomplished something, I feel like there's nothing to indicate a reset at the moment.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

And it bears repeating, the fact that Subaru is still mostly a weak, normal person in a world full back to back with badasses and insanely powerful characters and makes his way through by muddling it learning from mistake after mistake.

A lot of isekais I glance at where the protagonist is a showy invincible protagonist just seems so bland and samey.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

So no wonder why Gar was acting different each reset. Subaru's witch's scent was something Garfield acted on depending on the severity of it, and also seems to go away with time?

The bit with Beako was hard to watch. Subaru has a habit of lashing out when he's stressed and emotionally hurting people.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

To be fair I think this:

Grouchio posted:

Grouchio posted:

I TOLD Y'ALL THIS IS GOOD poo poo

Was more than fine.


Grouchio posted:

I really, really, really want to answer all of your questions but that would delve into big arc spoilers. If any of you are antsy and need to know now, please PM me.

But this is flying too close to the sun because it influences our understanding of the work and the information as to whether something is "important" or not.

So Grouchio please do more of the former, and cut down on the latter, because the more genre savy or trope poisoned someone is, the more they can infer information you didn't intend from non-spoiler talk by someone who knows spoilers.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Grouchio posted:

Alrighty. If I can't talk about episodes, then I'll post fanart and memes!



When I initially first saw this, I immediately thought today was tuesday and thought you were posting a screencap from a new episode, so I immediately nope'd out and checked to see if it was out, then I got very confused, realized it was Saturday and tentatively came back and realized it was a fanart gif. This is all wonderfully ironic.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

I cried this episode. I could viscerally feel Subaru's loneliness and the weight of the burden he'd been carrying the whole time, and the sense of sheer joy and relief that he finally found a friend he could talk to about his experiences.

Echidna being all dere was cute too.


Grouchio posted:

Re Zero Episode 8, in Summary:



BUT FOLLOW ONLY IF YE BE MEN OF VALOR

FOR THE ENTRANCE TO THIS CAVE IS GUARDED BY A CREATURE SO FOUL SO CRUEL THAT NO MAN YET HAS FOUGHT WITH IT AND LIVED

BONES OF FOUR FIFTY MEN LIE STREWN ABOUT ITS LAIR

SO BRAVE KNIGHTS IF YOU DO DOUBT YOUR COURAGE OR YOUR STRENGTH COME NO FURTHER

FOR DEATH AWAITS YOU ALL WITH NASTY BIG POINTY TEETH


You magnificent bastard.


When I saw the bunny I was like, "Nah no way it could be that evil bunny from Monty Pythoooooooooooooo-HOLY poo poo.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

This is some Game of Thrones thread title poo poo.

Additional thoughts about this episode: I wonder how much time has passed. The villagers are presumably all dead. Likely because of the Evil Bunnies. But the land being Winter makes me think Emilia died and so Puck is running rampant. I have a feeling Subaru might have been teleported a couple of days into the future instead of a few hours. I'm surprised there was no flash back to the earlier Ice Death by Puck. The villagers' stuff is all there still without dust or webs covering them, so it makes me think this wasn't like a year into the future. It's surprising to me if its been a few hours only, maybe he was in like a coma for a few days but it seems strange he wouldn't have been eaten before then unless the Elves were protecting him until then.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

I feel like you could see the gears in Roswaal's head turning when talking to Subaru; like Subaru to his perspective just ALL OF A SUDDEN asks about the Not!Fake grimoire (an interesting detail Subaru missed is the connection between a 'Tome of Wisdom' and a Grimoire of the Cult) and whether Beatrice is a cultist, whatever Roswaal happens to know you gotta think that's making him think about things.

It's a good thing maybe from Subaru's POV that this was a dead end timeline because I feel like that had to have consequences down the road otherwise.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

thechosenone posted:

When is this stated, and why? I was aware of this only vaguely (and I really don't know why they had to make this the case).

Yeah there's a lot of posts that feel like information that didn't come from the anime, can people be more careful?

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

I think it's probably too soon for Emilia to get that information just yet, even in context of a nightmare. I think she was only crying out for Subaru after already failing and in the process of waking up.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Conspiratiorist posted:

Ongoing threads:

- Also, according to Echidna, Subaru is compatible with and ended up absorbing Betelgeuse's "Witch Factor" upon slaying him, which would ordinarily run the risk of unraveling his soul but she's helped stabilize him.

IIRC it's actually the Sloth factor that's stabilizing him isn't it? Echidna is maybe pressing buttons to make it more effective.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

AnoHito posted:

Yeah, I can't believe this is a cursed world without pizza, and Subaru focused on making mayo instead LIKE A SCRUB.

I like the idea of how just like how that Flugel in No Game No Life was obsessed with learning things from the world they came from, Echidna is likewise super interested/addicted to learning about conveniences from Subaru's world.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

What the heck is going on and why is everything suddenly different again.

e:

AAAAAAAGH THAT POST CREDITS SCENE AAAAAAAAHJ!!

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

My guess about what happened with Emilia is: Her seeing Subaru unconscious (and injured) set her off, which maybe because of some other circumstance we don't know about allowed her to become an imperfect vessel for Satella

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

A big flaming stink posted:

judging from that one shot of the black tendrils reaching into the tea party but dissipating, i think it's quite likely satella got really, really, really, really, REALLY loving mad about subaru casually blabbing about return by death.

When was this again?

But yeah that's an interesting note on Garfield.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

A big flaming stink posted:

on the 2:25 mark

Hrm, I had figured that was more Subaru remembering what it felt like.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

The witch's miasma thing feels almost like a developer's hotfix

"Fixed issue where players could respawn infinite times. Now whenever they respawn a Giant Angry Cat chases them."

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Raxivace posted:

Yeah these kinds of stories naturally draw comparison to video game logic (Iíve even seen non-anime examples like Run Lola Run being described this way), but if anything Re:Zero is about why trying to game your way through loops without a care (That is, through life) isnít actually viable.

Like most of Subaruís problems/deaths donít even seem to come from Bad Isekai RNG, but rather his own inability to pay enough attention to both the world and the feelings of the people around him.

It's in a way a deconstruction of trying to treat the isekai you find youself in as a video game (cough NGNL which I adore but...) because if Subaru is lovely to the "NPCs" he gets the door to a successful outcome slammed shut in his face. This arc in particular feels like is trying to be more explicit about that.

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Conspiratiorist posted:

Subaru has done his best to get along with everyone and have their goals and feelings in consideration when taking action during this, so it's not that.

He really took Anastasia's advice to heart.

I disagree, I think Subaru especially this arc like when he goes up to Beatrice to ask about the grimoire is a pretty stark example of him, being in the swing of things not being considerate of others as freely thinking independent beings.

The previous arc had its moments, like assuming everyone should drop everything to help him and so on, but this arc is taking pains to break Subaru out of bad habbits.

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Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Conspiratiorist posted:

He had absolutely no way of knowing she'd have a strong emotional response as a result of having a connection to the deceased Sin Archbishop.

And part of the problem is he's very surface level in how he interacts with people, cutesy nicknames for Emilia, Beatrice and so on. But how often has he ever just sat down and had tea with them and listened?

Like he just shoved the grimoire in her face, he didn't preface it or give her mental time to prepare in case of a negative response, he just gave it to her like he was turning in a quest!

It's just one example, I feel like there's others, like when he suggested he should take the challenge in Emilia's quest because he went about what seemed like naturally the most effacious solution in the moment but didn't stop to think about how Emilia may thought of it, he just used information he didn't have the complete picture of from his previous attempt to try to speed up the process.

The very fact that they had that scene with Otto was meant to reinforce this point, its pretty obvious that it's the text speaking to us about what Subaru's arc is this season.

It's a subconscious thing, he's getting better, but he still needs to make improvements.

Ironically, him not being fully keyed into the feelings of others might hilariously continue to bite him, but in the reverse way, like seemingly making Echidna fall for him if that's what we're supposed to take from his interactions with her. Because I can see her maybe wanting him to herself if the opportunity presents itself if the story takes that sort of route.

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