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An insane mind
Aug 11, 2018



DnD are really horrible to their actors because they believe their vision and writing is what makes the show and not the actors.

They're privileged douches.

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Open Source Idiom
Jan 4, 2013


I'm so fascinated by their new show with Sandra Oh. Is it going to be bad? How bad will it be?

Let's find out.

Happy Thread
Jul 9, 2005


Plaster Town Cop

Ramsey Snow - Theon Greyjoy spinoff show exploring their adventures in the dungeon

Zeta Acosta
Dec 16, 2019

#essereFerrari


Zaphod42 posted:



Also interesting is in the original script Arya just jumps and stabs the Night's King. The thing with getting caught and dropping the dagger must have come about during filming & choreography.

lezard_valeth
Mar 14, 2016



It's impossible not to feel bad for Conleth Hill

lezard_valeth fucked around with this message at 01:09 on Apr 5, 2021

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


That gif of him slowly pushing the script away from himself in disdain is my favorite.

edit:
Found it!

Captain Splendid
Jan 7, 2009

Qu'en pense Caffarelli?

I did like how Lena held his hand when Varys' death got read out

nine-gear crow
Aug 10, 2013

low vis




Captain Splendid posted:

I did like how Lena held his hand when Varys' death got read out

And then him and Gwendoline Christie just hugged it out for dear life afterwards. God, she was really in a Catch-22 situation there when it came to roles, wasn't she? She missed out on the last Star Wars movie because of Game of Thrones, only said last Star Wars movie turned out to be The Rise of Skywalker, and the last season of Game of Thrones turned out to be... the last season of Game of Thrones.

An insane mind
Aug 11, 2018



Rise of Skywalker wasn't anything amazing either...but it wasn't the last season of GoT

Collapsing Farts
Jun 29, 2018

💀

Rise of skywalker was pure poo poo

Sanguinia
Jan 1, 2012

#RXT REVOLUTION~!
2000





Collapsing Farts posted:

Rise of skywalker was pure poo poo

Rise of the Skywalker was just a mostly-crappy movie that still had some redeeming qualities, GoT Season 8 was such a catastrophe it basically erased what had been a cultural juggernaut from the zeitgeist.

Strom Cuzewon
Jul 1, 2010



An insane mind posted:

DnD are really horrible to their actors because they believe their vision and writing is what makes the show and not the actors.

They're privileged douches.

Which is staggeringly dumb, because they've openly admitted to not knowing poo poo about TV shows, and GoT only works because they brought in some seriously good talent behind the scenes - getting Neil Marshall for Blackwater was a great move, all the costumes, locations, casting, absolutely top notch. Everyone's talked about the extra footage they had to cobble together for S1, which were universally loved, and the DVD commentary (I can't remmebr who it was, might even have been DnD) openly said "boy it's so good we got to hastily cobble these extra scenes together, they're probably the best stuff in the season!". The whole show is basically a demonstration of how important it is to have a good team behind you. And yet DnD just didn't learn any loving lessons.

Toplowtech
Aug 31, 2004



Zaphod42 posted:

The "Real" ending will involve Fagon taking over King's Landing from Cersei and being hailed as the new rightful good King, and everybody telling Daenerys to gently caress off right as she finally gets to her home, and she loses her poo poo.

But GRRM is never going to finish it anyways.
Oh, he will finish but in a true ASOIAF twist, we just all will be dead before he does.

kaworu
Jul 23, 2004



In a way, as an act of creative destruction Season 8 is almost impressively comprehensive, because it really did gently caress up and destroy a lot of what was or could have been great about the first 7 seasons, and there's something awe-inspiring about that.

I remember back when Lost ended and a lot of fans of that show were pretty disappointed by both the finale and the final season in general - myself included. Lots of people argued that the last few episodes somehow invalidated their enjoyment of the first five seasons, and I strongly disagreed with this at the time. I felt that there was no way a finale could be so bad that it could invalidate anything brilliant that a show had already accomplished, that the journey itself was sacred and not effected.

Now, all I can think is that I was pretty much wrong - an ending really can be so awful that it just obliterates any and all good that had been accomplished.

Macaluso
Sep 23, 2005

I HATE THAT HEDGEHOG, BROTHER!


The finale of Lost was great

kater
Nov 16, 2010



Oh yeah six years spent leading to a climax of jack getting into a fist fight with an old man, great show very gotesque.

Chris James 2
Aug 9, 2012
Probation
Can't post for 5 hours!


Collapsing Farts posted:

Rise of skywalker was pure poo poo

Completely and utterly. I feel bad for Christie, either way she was gonna be in something that was historically dreadful

An insane mind
Aug 11, 2018



Chris James 2 posted:

Completely and utterly. I feel bad for Christie, either way she was gonna be in something that was historically dreadful

Rise of Skywalker could have been better if they'd held unto a coherent vision instead of constantly trying to please a vocal group fans that complained about everything (like how they went rabid about how dare Rose look at Finn and how dare she be Asian)

I didn't like that they did Hamil dirty in the second movie (his ending, to me personally was atrocious) but if they'd actually ran with it to a satisfying ending it would have been fine. What do we get instead, loving Palp out of nowhere.

Also Finn should have ended up with Poe

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now.


Strom Cuzewon posted:

Which is staggeringly dumb, because they've openly admitted to not knowing poo poo about TV shows, and GoT only works because they brought in some seriously good talent behind the scenes - getting Neil Marshall for Blackwater was a great move, all the costumes, locations, casting, absolutely top notch. Everyone's talked about the extra footage they had to cobble together for S1, which were universally loved, and the DVD commentary (I can't remmebr who it was, might even have been DnD) openly said "boy it's so good we got to hastily cobble these extra scenes together, they're probably the best stuff in the season!". The whole show is basically a demonstration of how important it is to have a good team behind you. And yet DnD just didn't learn any loving lessons.

Also if you watch behind the scenes, there's DOZENS of times where D&D were like "Hey Maisie Williams here's your lines" and she was like "uh this is stupid, Arya wouldn't say that" and they had to come back like "oh oops yeah that was stupid here's your new lines"

Teenage actor better writer than D&D.

Also, I still maintain that seasons 1&2 were the best written by far, and GRRM himself was doing a lot of the screenplay writing and editing back then. D&D were competent producers, I'll give them that, but literally nothing more, and for them to produce a successful show and get it in their heads that means they're Emmy-worthy writers is loving absurd.

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now.


kaworu posted:

In a way, as an act of creative destruction Season 8 is almost impressively comprehensive, because it really did gently caress up and destroy a lot of what was or could have been great about the first 7 seasons, and there's something awe-inspiring about that.

I remember back when Lost ended and a lot of fans of that show were pretty disappointed by both the finale and the final season in general - myself included. Lots of people argued that the last few episodes somehow invalidated their enjoyment of the first five seasons, and I strongly disagreed with this at the time. I felt that there was no way a finale could be so bad that it could invalidate anything brilliant that a show had already accomplished, that the journey itself was sacred and not effected.

Now, all I can think is that I was pretty much wrong - an ending really can be so awful that it just obliterates any and all good that had been accomplished.

What I constantly think about is just how much GOT merch there was in the world at the time of S8. That poo poo was everywhere, all kinds of retailers were just choc full of GOT themed clothes and toys and poo poo.

And then literally overnight the value of all that back stock, all the warehouses full of GOT mugs and such, it all becomes just instantly worthless. Just vaporized.

I honestly would consider suing if I was HBO.

I wonder if their plan is to just stash all the merch and maybe one day sell it off after recovering the brand with whatever show they have in pre-production right now. But they honestly NEED to wait a few years for everybody to collectively forget about S8 and move on before they have any hope of possibly making a new show popular.

D&D didn't just tank an exceptionally popular show, they poisoned the well on what was going to be HBO's largest franchise by a mile.

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now.


Macaluso posted:

The finale of Lost was great

Nah sorry it sucked. "There's no magic everything has an explanation!" they said. And then it ends up the island has a magic pirate ship wheel which if you turn it like, breaks the universe? That's magic.

Also everything about Jacob and the Man in Black was total they never had an actual answer for.

I really really liked the Lost ARG and the plot it came up with, wish they had gone with something more like that.

An insane mind
Aug 11, 2018



Zaphod42 posted:

What I constantly think about is just how much GOT merch there was in the world at the time of S8. That poo poo was everywhere, all kinds of retailers were just choc full of GOT themed clothes and toys and poo poo.

And then literally overnight the value of all that back stock, all the warehouses full of GOT mugs and such, it all becomes just instantly worthless. Just vaporized.

I honestly would consider suing if I was HBO.

I wonder if their plan is to just stash all the merch and maybe one day sell it off after recovering the brand with whatever show they have in pre-production right now. But they honestly NEED to wait a few years for everybody to collectively forget about S8 and move on before they have any hope of possibly making a new show popular.

D&D didn't just tank an exceptionally popular show, they poisoned the well on what was going to be HBO's largest franchise by a mile.

Is the thing in pre-production at the moment the Duncann and Egg thing or are they just going for the Young Ned and Rob on the warpath thing? Cause personally I just want them to find a way to get Mark Addy back in, maybe as Rob's dad or something.

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.


Zaphod42 posted:

Also if you watch behind the scenes, there's DOZENS of times where D&D were like "Hey Maisie Williams here's your lines" and she was like "uh this is stupid, Arya wouldn't say that" and they had to come back like "oh oops yeah that was stupid here's your new lines"

Teenage actor better writer than D&D.

Also, I still maintain that seasons 1&2 were the best written by far, and GRRM himself was doing a lot of the screenplay writing and editing back then. D&D were competent producers, I'll give them that, but literally nothing more, and for them to produce a successful show and get it in their heads that means they're Emmy-worthy writers is loving absurd.

Wasn't there an interview where her and her boyfriend were talking about the script when she kills the Night King, and he said "that really should have been a moment for Jon" and she was like, "yeah, I don't know what the gently caress is going on."

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now.


An insane mind posted:

Is the thing in pre-production at the moment the Duncann and Egg thing or are they just going for the Young Ned and Rob on the warpath thing? Cause personally I just want them to find a way to get Mark Addy back in, maybe as Rob's dad or something.

Neither. They're doing a Young Targaryens thing which... we'll see where that goes.

Dunk and Egg is 80 years before GOT. This series is 300 years before GOT.

Solice Kirsk posted:

Wasn't there an interview where her and her boyfriend were talking about the script when she kills the Night King, and he said "that really should have been a moment for Jon" and she was like, "yeah, I don't know what the gently caress is going on."

Yeah

Zaphod42 posted:

I also love that, I think it was Maisie Williams told her boyfriend she kills the Night's King and he immediately responded, "Huh, should have been Jon though right?" Some random teenage boy understands these characters better than D&D does, even though its literally his girlfriend and he should be biased towards her character.

GABA ghoul
Oct 29, 2011

You're all I think, this thing set troublin


Zaphod42 posted:

Neither. They're doing a Young Targaryens thing which... we'll see where that goes.

Dunk and Egg is 80 years before GOT. This series is 300 years before GOT.

I seriously don't give a poo poo about more Targaryens. They had a great hook with the Long Night show about the origin of the Others. Great central mystery in a fresh, unspent setting and with lots of possibilities for callbacks and reference to GoT. No idea why they never went with it. If the pilot sucked so much they should have done reshoots.

e: there was also a lot of potential to expand on the lore about why the seasons happen, what's going on with Valyria, the lord of light, magic, etc. Not much you can do with an Aegon show cause nothing big happened in that time except for politics and war stuff

GABA ghoul fucked around with this message at 17:54 on Apr 5, 2021

banned from Starbucks
Jul 18, 2004






The origin of the Others was poo poo tho. An elf kid stabs a guy in the chest. Them you kill them all by doing that again.

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now.


That may be why they dropped that project and are focusing on the Targaryens plot. The White Walkers concept has been just wrecked now, they're no threat, we know they're all chumps, so who cares?

They're probably hoping everybody can forget about the white walkers and we can go back to sexy medieval times with families back-stabbing each other like the good old seasons, but it probably won't work like that.

Sanguinia
Jan 1, 2012

#RXT REVOLUTION~!
2000





If the Targaryen backstory show is about the Dance of Dragons I think that's pretty neat. Succession war even MORE directly ripped from the War of Roses, entrenched in gender politics and jilted lovers out for revenge. Fun stuff.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


I assume it will deal the causes of the apocalypse.

Xealot
Nov 25, 2002

Showdown in the Galaxy Era.



If you mean the Doom of Valyria, it probably won't. IIRC it's supposed to take place ~130 years after Aegon's arrival in Westeros, which itself happened over a century after the Doom.

I assumed the Doom was supposed to be a fantasy version of the fall of the Roman Empire, something that would've felt like ancient history to the late-medieval Europe of the War of the Roses.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Xealot posted:

If you mean the Doom of Valyria, it probably won't. IIRC it's supposed to take place ~130 years after Aegon's arrival in Westeros, which itself happened over a century after the Doom.

I assumed the Doom was supposed to be a fantasy version of the fall of the Roman Empire, something that would've felt like ancient history to the late-medieval Europe of the War of the Roses.

Oh well I guess I'm not terrifically interested then, because there's a reason all that is in the Ice and Fire Silmarillion material and not the actual story.

Pattonesque
Jul 14, 2004
johnny jesus and the infield fly rule

Strom Cuzewon posted:

He'd already read the books, got really excited at all the cool Selmy stuff (which imo was some of the best stuff in aDwD) and when his scripts for the season were so short he wrote Beinioff and Weiss an impassionaed letter arguing why they should keep him around.

Their response was to mock him (not by name, but its pretty clearly him) at the Oxford Union and say it made them want to kill him even more.


A Dance with Dragons posted:

Khrazz laughed. "Old man. I will eat your heart."

"Then come," said Barristan the Bold.

Khrazz came.

For the first time all day, Selmy felt certain. This is what I was made for, he thought. The dance, the sweet steel song, a sword in my hand and a foe before me.

Completely understand why D&D would want to replace this scene with him getting stabbed by mooks in an alley

edit: GRRM has his issues but one thing he's really, really good at is emphasizing the power of names and titles. We know Barristan's nickname comes from years and years of his bravery and feats and referring to him as such in that moment, when he's spent the entire book uncertain and nervous because he's not used to the politics of the situation, is extremely awesome.

Pattonesque fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Apr 6, 2021

bobjr
Oct 16, 2012

Roose is loose.



Barristan in the books is old enough to have to factor in his age in combat, but his chapters show he is a really good tactical thinker and putting himself in the right place to be and the right move to take.

Except when he gets kicked out of the Kingsguard, he just storms out and kicks everyone's rear end who challenges him along the way.

Vegetable
Oct 22, 2010



Id buy a scene where Selmy has the most unglamorous death and gets shanked in an alley by swarms of knife wielders. It fits with the ethos of the show. But the Sons of Harpy were so loving stupid it made the whole thing lame.

Vegetable fucked around with this message at 02:19 on Apr 6, 2021

Orange Devil
Sep 30, 2010

CUNT


Failsons of the Harpy.

Collapsing Farts
Jun 29, 2018

💀

He really wasn't much of a character in the TV show. He was an old guy who gave some advice and then he died

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014




I sometimes forget he was even in Essos and just remember he had one of the best scenes in the show.

Arbite
Nov 4, 2009







bobjr posted:

Barristan in the books is old enough to have to factor in his age in combat, but his chapters show he is a really good tactical thinker and putting himself in the right place to be and the right move to take.

Except when he gets kicked out of the Kingsguard, he just storms out and kicks everyone's rear end who challenges him along the way.

They only caught up with him because he had to enter his dismissal into the white book first.

Zeta Acosta
Dec 16, 2019

#essereFerrari


Tolkien really needed to write about how Frodo almost shitted himself after being bitten by Shelob imo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5K3H-FjEhkw

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Strom Cuzewon
Jul 1, 2010



Pattonesque posted:

edit: GRRM has his issues but one thing he's really, really good at is emphasizing the power of names and titles. We know Barristan's nickname comes from years and years of his bravery and feats and referring to him as such in that moment, when he's spent the entire book uncertain and nervous because he's not used to the politics of the situation, is extremely awesome.

I love how the meaning of titles shifts and warps constantly too. Like how Jon goes through Lord Snow (pejorative) to Lord Snow (respectful) and also Crow (pejorative) to Lord Crow (respectful). Or how Kingslayer absolutely deserves to be a badge of honour

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