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sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





post hole digger posted:

i like this way of looking at this, too. we are going through a lot of user/country login pattern auditing right now too and I never really thought about it explicitly in this context w/r/t password lifecycling and such before.

That kind of stuff falls under the "rate limiting" section as detailed here:

https://pages.nist.gov/800-63-3/sp800-63b.html

But continuous auditing and monitoring is a good starting path towards a network that adheres to the latest industry buzzword, zero trust security

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sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





don't go down the rabbit hole of zero trust security until you're ready

it's an insane mess

and that's before going into the discourse around it

there's a nist document if you wanna dip a toe in it or something

but I was serious when I called it a buzzword

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





my homie dhall posted:

I'm mostly an idiot, but traffic on your network should be encrypted and your traffic inspection magic means a compromised system results in having the plaintext for all services

ipsec tunnels are network-to-network and remove true source and destination addresses, making it impossible to know who is talking to who

(of course, ipsec transport mode is point-to-point but that's not the topic under discussion)

also, by removing port numbers and other information, you won't know if someone is talking over smb, https, smtps, postgres-over-ssl, etc. Because at least if you have that info, you have a much better idea of the kind of traffic that is going around, and who to look at to audit any access.

EDIT: to be clear, all of the above is encrypted. So there is confidentiality, but there is still visibility into traffic to look for very unusual behavior.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





it takes a certain amount of hubris, intelligence and wisdom to do that puerto rico vr tour

too much of one, and sorely lacking in the others

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





it should be noted that NFS security before v4 (I think) had no encryption, and security was largely centered on whitelisting machines instead of users.

Not like early days SMB was any better.

Modern systems have processor accelerated cryptography so it's not that much more expensive to encrypt data on the wire nowadays.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





so the mandiant leak is a wet fart?

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





I don't see the point if the endpoint just returns json and not scripts. The endpoint is probably hard coded to indicate json as the content type.

I mean, if you hijack the endpoint, you can make it do whatever you want including setting the content type to html or javascript. In that case, there's no need to muck with csp.

I would probably only set the csp in this case if I were contractually obligated to conform to a widely accepted set of reasonable standards that dictates this. But I get the feeling that this bullet point was written up by someone who saw a vulnerability on a web page that would have been mitigated by csp and then decided that all http endpoints needed csp.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





nudgenudgetilt posted:

but what benefit is there to pushing back on it?

it's heartache over at most a few more hardcoded bytes that sit next to the already apparently hardcoded content-type, and in the event someone finds some clever way to misuse the product, it's an extra layer of mitigation

even worse, if you're wrong and by some bizarre series of events you or your end users are hit in a manner that could have been mitigated via csp, you just burned massive amounts of political capital

i still liken it to a firewall -- you may be absolutely certain only hardened services are listening, but a default drop policy for inbound traffic isn't the most terrible of ideas

The problem with likening it to a firewall is that if you can RCE on a service, a telnet server with a shell is the quickest way to get into a server. Which a firewall mitigates. A firewall also does more than "drop default" - a well configured firewall will restrict access to sensitive services (like ssh) to only trusted clients. No one is arguing against adding a firewall.

Now, I'm normally against arguing for someone else because I may have their position wrong. But required web junk is annoying because:
  • these standards get added all the time
  • are not automated to just work
  • and adding them to unrelated services tends to lead to unnecessary cruft which is a source of bugs. And someone will look at it later and wonder why there's an XSS mitigation header in something that doesn't do scripting.

Personally, I wouldn't mind doing it if it were dictated by something like a NIST standard or something where real technical folks actually decided it was cool and good and required. And not just by the authors of the new thing that the standard wants. Otherwise, I'll just wait for the next new XSS mitigation tech that I need to implement in my jpeg flinger instead of constantly updating an already working piece of code because of the latest hot new standard.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





job qualifications are a suggestion

if you know what you need to get the job done, or are willing to learn the necessary skills, it doesn't matter what kind of certificates you have

And I doubt a goverment agency is dumb enough to just use AI to filter resumes. Instead, they want smart people with self-confidence and a drive to learn.

like that joke about 15 years of Java experience in a 90s job posting

I read that link and I get the feeling that these guys are pretty cool and open to whoever as long as they have potential

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Some places may absolutely require a 4 year degree or masters/phd (the diploma doesn't really need to be related to the position in many cases) for some positions for politics or optics but everything else that can be picked up in a quick wikipedia reading is optional

Just don't lie. And government jobs tend to be a position of trust so don't be surprised if there's a background check.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





"I think we can be up to 5 to 10% more secure but it will require a 50% increase in budget and everyone will hate us"

"Yes, but everyone already hates us"

"Good point, sir"

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





pki is a mess

openssl is a mess

at least the complexity helps pay the bills

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





I once had trouble getting a SIPS client to talk to my server and it turns out that I think the client actually checks to make sure something like the web tls server bit on the x509 extended attributes in the server certificate is turned on. And I think key encipherment on key usage. It was pretty maddening when I figured it out.

To top it all off, the code was open source. I dunno how fast I would have quit if the code was closed source.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Truga posted:

i use openssl once or twice a month, because dummies don't want letsencrypt and send certs in stupid formats instead of just requesting a CSR, so i've come to the conclusion that it's perfect as a CLI, because i now have a couple bash "scripts" that are just one openssl line that takes a file and spits out pem formatted certs i can throw into a web server or what have you

One of my CA systems is based on a makefile and, to be honest, it's very needs suiting

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





isn't tsx bad because it has a rare chance of unintended memory corruption?

even without malware, natch

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Beeftweeter posted:

get a medical card

It's still illegal in federal law regardless of medical cards

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





FlapYoJacks posted:

Or the government could pay better wages and legalize weed?

I agree that weed should be legalized but contractors (yes, I know, it's not 100% the same) can make bank

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





sometimes, you really need an embedded linux guy and are willing to pay anything because good engineers aren't a dime a dozen

but everything's gotta be cool at the federal level so weed is still not cool and it still might take another 4 years before it gets legalized.

I don't smoke but I see it as the same level as alcohol

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Beeftweeter posted:

lol, true enough, but who the hell is using theora video and vorbis audio in an ogv container?

not just because it's 2022, i mean that's true at basically any point in time

Video games and youtube? I think archive.org uses it too.

Keep in mind that mp4 is not a free codec and some people are using old rear end servers that don't support vp9 or whatever.

And ogv isn't really that popular in any case because it doesn't work on iphone. I think.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





nudgenudgetilt posted:

there are plenty of government jobs that don't test. i touched computers for the department of energy in a medical, then recreational state and never got tested. currently touch computers for the state govt in a different state, and again no tests.

That's a good point. I guess state agencies set their own rules and I guess some government agencies don't care as well.

I was more referring to software development, though. Some federal contractors have a lot of money but sometimes their hands are tied regarding who can work on the code.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





the only winning move is not to play

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





An important point in this discussion is that it's not the employer that's making the decision of whether or not you get or keep your clearance. It's DCSA.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_Counterintelligence_and_Security_Agency

So, I guess if DCSA has a policy of being lenient on weed smokers then that's nice, but they certainly aren't going to advertise it. It's all a judgement call on the whole person. The employer is likely not going to care about the occasional use if the employee can be honest about it and keep the clearance.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





FlapYoJacks posted:

I helped port asterisk to Buildroot, an embedded Linux SDK. :suicide:

Oh hey, maybe I'll make that my next project. I got an idea for something I wanted to do with asterisk, raspberry pi, and a couple of old grandstream VoIP phones

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





i thought the pandemic would give me time to finally read my arrl training book and pass the ham radio test but it turns out that computer touching work only increases when everyone works from home

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





FlapYoJacks posted:

It also has pjsip! It’s fairly easy to compile and get going!

I need to use a dial plan.

I might look at pjsip if I need to but ... for right now ... the devil you know and all that

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Achmed Jones posted:

read this: https://www.kb6nu.com/study-guides/. it is free and will take like an hour.

then do hamstudy.org practice tests a couple times. when you're regularly passing those, take the test. all the studying will probably take less than two hours. the technician exam is trivial, the general is easy, and i haven't taken extra because it was requiring Actual Studying and I stopped halfway through because I'm quite lazy.

sounds neat! I'll take a look.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





reading back an sms code is probably a weak nod to out of band authentication but probably the most friendly path for the geriatric crowd

banks and credit unions, ironically, seem to be the ones holding onto sms authentication for dear life while everyone else uses phone based totp or fido2

wouldn't banks be the first to promote fido2? It's the most secure 2fa method. Although good luck getting old people to figure out how it works

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





nudgenudgetilt posted:

honestly, it depends.

as tech asshats we assume the end user is always going to be interfacing with us via computery interfaces, but that simply isn't true.

what's the "right" way for a bank to authenticate an inbound call? a single use code isn't a terrible way to go. we can all agree sms is a terrible delivery mechanism. a voice call to the user isn't much better, especially since in this case we're trying to solve authentication for a user who is already on a voice call. oath, be it totp or hotp looks like a solid solution for this space except...

it violates the "we will never ask for your otp code" rule that's so popular. i feel like it's a disservice to deny a solid form of authentication to voice call users, and really wish everyone pushed "only give us a code over the phone if *you called us*" as a rule

"if you called us" requires users to remember a conditional, which causes the whole system to fail. If they know that there is a single condition where disclosing the OTP is valid, then there is a good chance that a savvy phisher will just tell them that policies change and they should check their e-mail from april last year when it was announced. And no one is going to go through that hassle if they're just opening a new line of credit in exchange for a free toaster or whatever banks give away now. Applebees gift card? A free cruise trip to Mexico?

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





nudgenudgetilt posted:

right, so while protecting one medium you're actively sacrificing another.

the required training should be "never trust inbound calls", not "protect this one type of credential geeks hold dear from a medium they despise"

Frankly, I think there should be context to all the OTPs and have users read them off every single time they want to do something that could be expensive.

The SMS should say "You are transferring $5000 to Kirk to purchase a ticket to the Razr afterparty. To confirm, repeat the following code to the service agent: 80085"

And just do it for every single thing they want to do that would reasonably require it. And if it takes too long then they need to either get a personal banker or walk into the branch office.

That way, a man-in-the-middle has a much harder time tricking them into doing something unintended.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Jabor posted:

The system sending the SMS knows that this one is going to be used to authenticate someone over the phone. (Or at least, it could know that it's being asked to send an SMS because someone in a call center pushed the "validate caller" button, rather than because a web server got a login request from the public internet). Instead of sending a number, it could send a pronounceable code phrase, that way you're not teaching people to recite web login OTP numbers to people on the phone.

"my rear end is my password"

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Plorkyeran posted:

i had a totp device for my wow account several years before it was an option for my bank account

I wish blizzard and square would allow people to use a standard totp generator instead of using their custom bespoke apps

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





flakeloaf posted:

i still have mine, which they obsoleted for a stupid app



I have one of those! I never used it.

But originally I was referring to the ability to use google authenticator or something. I want one app to generate TOTP codes, not 3 or 4.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Podima posted:

square lets you use a generic authenticator app as of last April


Subjunctive posted:

I use TOTP for my FFXIV account.

Thanks. I'll have to check it out!

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





go play outside Skyler posted:

lmao what do you need 2fa for on a gaming account? are you scared of losing your xp you loving nerds??

they give you bonuses if you attach an authenticator, you idiot. you absolute moron.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





business development via merge spam

it's ingenious

I wonder how many contract dev shops make use of it, although it may not be much since anyone getting tagged is gonna be a dev and not a program manager or anyone with pursestrings

On the other hand, it could be pretty ingenious to use for dating scams

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





I wish to push this 500k merge into your source tree but I require 10K lines from you as a good faith investment

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Beeftweeter posted:

yeah i just edited it because i realized the way i worded it made it sound dumb as hell lol. thanks, some turbonerd is trying to advocate for sftp and i'm trying to shut them down

I know sftp has been around as long as about ssh2 but I have never seen it used in any documentation or testing or production stuff. I think I've seen gui based file transfer clients for windows that might have used it, but that's about it.

I use rsync for everything, since it does both local and remote copy. But I'll use scp in edge cases or if I feel like it.

The only reason I could see a recommendation for sftp is maybe to reduce attack surface. But if everyone is using rsync anyway, it would just be easier to configure authorized_keys to restrict commands to rsync only or something

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





if it's secure enough and the systems administrators are familiar with it, I see little reason to change from rsync to sftp

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





nudgenudgetilt posted:

that page links to the twenty year old ietf standard implemented by pretty much every server

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-secsh-filexfer-02

except, apparently, dropbear

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sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016





Powerful Two-Hander posted:

chatting with our it sec guys today about something and said "I mean look, if you want to treat it like that just go and cut the cables so there's no internet access at all" and the response was "if I could cut every connection to this building, i would".

can't disagree with them tbh

:same:

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