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Hello Goons! My partner and myself are currently planning a two week road trip through California & the Western USA this October. We're from France and Germany, and this will only be our second time in the US, so of course we want to visit a lot of the must-see sites: San Francisco, Grand Canyon, Yosemite, Vegas, etc. Currently, our plan is to fly in and out of LAX (already booked) and rent a car for the entirety of the trip. We would bring a tent for camping in the national parks. Of course, the US being huge and all, we want to avoid overdoing it as we're prone to do  Our preliminary schedule would be as follows:code: Of course, any comment or advice on things to do is very welcome! For info, we're both in our early thirties, and usually we like to do a bit of everything: city strolling, light hiking, having a beer or an interesting meal here or there, etc. Thanks a lot in advance!
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May 12, 2019 13:02
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| # ? Apr 25, 2024 13:53 |
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Looking at the distances, it's a lot of driving but it's still doable. It looks like you've taken that properly into account (you don't have any days where you're both driving a long distance and then trying to do something) so I would rate this as "doable, but possibly unpleasant." Rent a good car that won't suck to drive for long distances.
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May 12, 2019 13:26
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PT6A's summary seems concise and accurate. The most skippable parts of your trip are either the two days you're spending in LA, or the trip up to Yosemite and Big Sur. Yosemite is gorgeous but at least for me in Switzerland, it's a lot harder to get excited about Yosemite given that the Alps are like, right here. Big Sur, same deal, but it's totally interchangeable with the Mediterranean between Genoa and Marseille. Alternatively there's nothing even remotely vaguely in the same universe as Death Valley or the Grand Canyon anywhere close to Europe (sorry, Verdon Gorge). To be honest I'd suggest something more like LA -> Vegas -> Grand Canyon -> [pick two of: Antelope Canyon -> Bryce Canyon -> Zion NP] -> Death Valley -> Sequoia NP -> LA This is way less driving, giving you way more time to enjoy the southwest reasonably well instead of trying to mix the southwest and the west coast into a single two-week trip. It's close enough to be feasible, but it's not great. Keep Big Sur and Yosemite for another trip; it's a serious driving detour and the drive 5 hour drive between Yosemite and Big Sur is like 4 hours of incredibly boring central valley scenery. But...there's really better scenery along the same lines of Big Sur and Yosemite in Europe, IME. Just go to the calanques and the dolomites or Grindelwald or something later on as a Eurogoon. I've been through and hiked around Big Sur quite a bit, and I've spent a lot of time on the Mediterranean coast, and while both are beautiful, they're 99% interchangeable, and I like that type of scenery a lot. Saladman fucked around with this message at 18:12 on May 12, 2019 |
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May 12, 2019 18:07
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Would agree with the above. It's doable, but a ton of driving... too much I would argue. You're planning to spend almost half of your entire time in the US inside a car. I've been to all the places you're going more than once, and I've never done northern California and the southwest in the same trip. Antelope Canyon, Bryce Canyon, and Zion are all great suggestions that I also covered on my last trip to the Grand Canyon, and all are much more convenient to reach. Zion in particular has a lot of great hikes, and I like it just as much as Yosemite (Antelope Canyon takes just an hour or two to see once you get to Page, while you'd probably be satisfied spending a day in Bryce Canyon). October is a great time to go, just be prepared for a wide range of temperatures.
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May 12, 2019 20:59
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Also OP I guess you (or your partner) speak French? I love the Gallimard guides, they're fantastic for the type of thing you're looking to do. I'd recommend getting this: http://www.gallimard.fr/Catalogue/GALLIMARD-LOISIRS/Bibliotheque-du-voyageur/Parcs-de-l-Ouest-americain4 I've found the Gallimard guides to be much better for preliminary trip planning than Lonely Planet / Guide du Routard, as they don't try to give you a suggested itinerary or hotels or restaurants or whatever stuff you can easily search on the spot, but they give good maps with interesting points highlighted and with really good photos of those areas that, at least for me, provide a lot of inspiration for "holy poo poo I want to go there". Then later on I can just use google to find out hotels nearby and tripadvisor or google for restaurants once I'm on the spot. Gallimard guides are kind of like the DK travel guides, if you've ever used those, but better streamlined and with better photography. E: OTOH because this covers the whole west and will have tons of awesome things, it might make you want to do something totally insane like try to include Yellowstone in the same trip. You'd probably need like 2 months to do a reasonably-rushed-but-not-insane trip of parks of the American West, not counting Alaska/Hawaii. Anyway I really like those guides, check them out if you're a travel research type of person who wants travel ideas, but not necessarily mundane practical details like Lonely Planet provides. Saladman fucked around with this message at 21:39 on May 12, 2019 |
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May 12, 2019 21:35
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Wow thanks for all the recommendations so far! I'll admit that I was surprised that Yosemite and Big Sur are deemed as skippable, since they are always among the nr. 1 attractions in the guide books... But yeah if you're going by "exoticism" as compared to Europe I get that the other NPs are more interesting, even if we love that kind of scenery as well. However one of the reasons we also included those two destinations in our itinerary is that we were really keen on seeing San Francisco and driving down the coast (even though I guess October is too cold for swimming). No idea if that's overrated, and on the other hand if we can cut back on the driving it would be a plus as well... Decisions decisions  Oh and another thing: my SO saw that you can do some whale watching in Monterey in October; anybody tried that and could weigh in? Saladman posted:Also OP I guess you (or your partner) speak French? I love the Gallimard guides, they're fantastic for the type of thing you're looking to do. I'd recommend getting this: We do both speak french! Haven't looked into the Gallimard guides to be honest, I was using the Lonely Planet out of habit and the Routard for some french snobbiness, but maybe that combo works better in classic backpacking countries in SEA or South America than in the US. But going by your description it sounds really good, gonna check it out at our local Fnac!
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May 13, 2019 16:12
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Chikimiki posted:Wow thanks for all the recommendations so far! Yeah I'm going purely based on exoticism relative to where you're from, and your time limitations. Yosemite and Big Sur are both pretty incredible places in absolute terms but they're just not as unique for a European as the southwest. Your other itinerary doesn't have San Francisco in it, but if it had, that would have been way too packed -- not that it's so much of a detour (traffic depending) from Yosemite to Big Sur via SF, but then you'd also need like a day or two in SF itself. I guess you could take those two days out of LA and stick them in SF, but... I dunno, I'd really recommend not trying to do coastal California on this trip. Coastal California is relatively easy to get to sometime else in your life; there are cheap direct flights from most major European cities--like $500 cheap if you go in winter--and you'll likely never go to Zion or Bryce or wherever again after this trip since you'll have "done" the Grand Canyon and Vegas. I also wouldn't recommend LA "over" SF either even if it was a direct 1:1 tradeoff. They're very different from each other, and both easily have two days worth of very distinct things to do and see. E: Also it is always too cold for comfortable swimming in San Francisco. You'll essentially never see any pleasure bathers there, only people surfing, occasionally people swimming, and a few people dipping in the water briefly. October's not really any worse than August if the air temperature is high enough and depending on what you're used to it might be fine. I was in Laguna Beach in late October last year and thought it was fine to swim; the water temperature was about what I'm used to here in the rivers in Switzerland. SF is quite a bit colder though. Saladman fucked around with this message at 17:22 on May 13, 2019 |
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May 13, 2019 17:11
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Alright, thanks for the input! Just a slight remark, my original itinerary does indeed include SF. So basically we'll have to choose between doing more of the great National Parks or more of Coastal California... I'll have to check that with my SO
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May 14, 2019 08:29
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Haha, I was gonna say, even the middle of July is too cold for swimming there. Anyway, Saladman pretty much covered everything. I would never label Yosemite or other places in northern California as "skippable", just hard to combine in the same trip as southern California, Vegas, and the southwest parks without a lot more time. edit: On the other hand, I would normally consider LA to be pretty skippable, especially compared to the rest of your trip, but if you're gonna fly in and out of there you might as well look around for a bit. runawayturtles fucked around with this message at 09:05 on May 14, 2019 |
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May 14, 2019 08:54
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Chikimiki posted:Alright, thanks for the input! Just a slight remark, my original itinerary does indeed include SF. So basically we'll have to choose between doing more of the great National Parks or more of Coastal California... I'll have to check that with my SO Oh, yep, sure enough. I should have scrolled up before writing that, for some reason I remembered Yosemite -> Big Sur -> LAX
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May 14, 2019 09:22
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On a related note, I figured that for lodging our best options would be an Airbnb in the cities, and camping in the NP. Does this seem right? Any recommended camping sites ? Thanks
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May 18, 2019 09:39
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By camping do you mean rent a tent or lodges? I haven't been to Death Valley yet but Grand Canyon is the second most popular NP and their reservations book up real quick. I've only camped at GC in Dec/Jan when it's slow and first-come-first-served for sites. Check out recreation.gov for bookings.
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May 18, 2019 21:58
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Chikimiki posted:On a related note, I figured that for lodging our best options would be an Airbnb in the cities, and camping in the NP. Does this seem right? Any recommended camping sites ? Thanks Not sure what you mean by "best" option. If you want to camp, you can, as long as you reserve and have the gear you need. It'll certainly be the cheapest option. I'm personally not much of a camper, so I always stay at hotels/b&bs either inside or outside the parks. You can find the ones inside the parks on their respective government websites; they're typically more convenient and expensive than the ones in nearby towns. There should still be availability either way, but the hotels inside the parks do fill up, so if you're interested in them I would book as soon as you finish planning.
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May 19, 2019 07:11
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Sorry, should have been more precise: we would bring a tent with us to camp in the National Parks, as we're used to camping and it also seems to be the cheapest option. And I was wondering if there were any specific camping areas to be recommended, maybe by somebody who's already done the same (a bit of narrow question, I'll admit). Secondly, as hotels seemed rather expensive in LA and/or SF, I was looking into Airbnb which looks to be a more economical option, is that right? Also, what are the best neighborhoods to stay in both cities? Thanks again for all the help
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May 19, 2019 16:35
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For GC, Mather is reservations only and Desert View is fcfs, so I'd just do Mather. If you can't get that then Kaibob National Forest has campsites and is next to GC. Your pass for GC is good for 7 days so you wouldn't have to worry about paying each time you go back. As for LA, what do you want to see/do? That will help determine where you'd want to stay. I do agree with seeing Zion or one of the other Utah NPs. The Aardvark fucked around with this message at 17:34 on May 19, 2019 |
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May 19, 2019 17:30
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The Aardvark posted:For GC, Mather is reservations only and Desert View is fcfs, so I'd just do Mather. If you can't get that then Kaibob National Forest has campsites and is next to GC. Your pass for GC is good for 7 days so you wouldn't have to worry about paying each time you go back. Thanks a lot! In LA, of course there are the big attractions like Santa Monica, Venice Beach, Mulholland Drive, Griffith Park, etc. and maybe one or two museums, however we are not that interested in the movie studios or the whole ~houses of the rich & famous~ shtick. We'd rather explore lively areas with either a cool food scene, or good nightlife, or some cultural scene - not necessarily hipster areas but inching towards that. I know that's rather vague but I hope you see what I mean
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May 20, 2019 13:30
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Stay in Westwood or Santa Monica then. Also check out the Getty on the hill. Getty Villa is nice too, iirc it requires tickets in advance (maybe only for parking or something weird? Maybe you can uber in). Northwest LA is great, easily two days of stuff there
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May 20, 2019 16:18
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Don't forget about Central LA tho! LACMA to the Broad, K-town, go hike up to Griffith Observatory for sunset. Cultural scene, get a tall can and drink it at Echo Park lake! Eat all the food! Thats real LA.
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May 21, 2019 05:25
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Like it's been mentioned by other posters previously in the thread, if you want to camp in national parks, you have to do it in approved camping spaces. And for some of the popular parks like you want to see, you will need reservations. Recreation.gov is the place to do it. I think they release availability six months or so in advance. The BLM (bureau of land management) also manages quite a bit of land in the western US, and while there is often developed camp sites on BLM land, you are also allowed to camp anywhere on BLM land for free for up to 14 days per place. Be aware of any fire restrictions in place. In all likeliness, considering the droughts and wildfires that have been plaguing the western US for a number of years now, you won't be allowed any fires. Bring a camp stove.
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May 21, 2019 19:02
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Saladman posted:PT6A's summary seems concise and accurate. When I go on road trips, I tend to pick high-mileage itineraries that would raise the hackles of most people here. Last September, for example, I drove from Kalispell, Montana to Denver, CO in 9 days with 2 days each at Glacier, Yellowstone, Grand Teton, and Rocky Mountain NPs. I see no problem with hiking from 6am-12pm, eating lunch, then driving until 9pm. I'm still inclined to agree with Saladman, though; Yosemite and the California coast would be better-suited to another trip entirely (and would warrant one). If I were you, I would do: LA -> Vegas -> Zion/Bryce Canyon -> Capitol Reef -> Grand Canyon -> Joshua Tree -> LA. I think you can do all of those in two weeks. This would probably look crazy to most people here, but it's entirely doable. It's only 9.5 hours from LA to Capitol Reef. If you really want to see Death Valley, tack that on at the beginning before Vegas. The American Southwest is really cool for outdoors-oriented people, and you won't really see anything like it anywhere else. You should reserve camp sites ASAP if you want to camp in any of the national parks. But as many people have pointed out, you can camp on National Forest land, and if you are okay with wild camping it will be a more enjoyable. US national parks are insanely crowded, although October is a pretty good time to go.
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May 21, 2019 21:46
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when you go hiking in the desert, bring twice as much water as you will think you need, and don't rely on gps to navigate. have a plan and check a map. it is extremely dry and the temperature averages 33*c even in october. death is a small possibility but a real one, the place is called 'death valley' for a reason also as mentioned, be aware of local fire conditions that may get you yelled at if you try to light a campfire
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May 24, 2019 19:15
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Zion in October is gorgeous and I would do that and Bryce. Also less traveled but still very awesome are the slot canyons outside of Kanab, UT. You can show up at the ranger station and try to get a day pass for the wave, and if you don’t succeed no worries because the ancient pictographs in these slot canyons, which are free and basically unregulated, are something else. Source: did a thousand mile road trip through the national parks in Utah a few years back. Highly recommend.
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Sep 24, 2021 07:01
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In a similar vain to the person above me I much rather recommend south Utah - Zion and Bryce NP, maybe Arches NP - rather than driving East/West so much Also recommend Sedona over GC, though it's gotten pretty expensive As a german myself Big Sur was really not that interesting
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Sep 26, 2021 02:46
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Quite a thread resurrection 2 1/2 years later  However this reminds me that I never gave a feedback after having done it in October 2019... feels like a lifetime ago !In the end we managed to follow our initial schedule, as we weren't willing to compromise between the California Coast and the Southwest It was a lot of driving indeed, but we did manage it; also most of our destinations would have deserved more of our time, but nevertheless we enjoyed our trip quite a lot and would love to follow up on our experience.A few thoughts on our trip: - LA is cool, but it strikes me as a city that is nicer to visit if you know a bunch of good adresses. For a newcomer it's quite tricky to navigate. Also, everything was expensive and the traffic horrendous. The beachfront was really cool though, the tacos delicious, and I would lie if I didn't admit that I loved the feeling of being in a movie scene (same as in Paris or NY for example). - Vegas I enjoyed more than I thought I would, in a very weird way. Though being there with a bunch of friends sure helped. - Grand Canyon was amazing, but indeed very remote. Would love to go back though for one of the big hikes. - Death Valley was also a highlight for us! It was more car-centric than I expected so we didn't hike much, but it was really beautiful in an otherworldy way. - On the way to Yosemite we stopped in a small city called Lone Pine that had quite a "Western Movie" atmosphere that I really liked! - Yosemite was indeed similar to the Alps but still different enough to feel unique. I think the "American outdoors" vibe there helped aswell - SF was really a cool city to visit, but unfortunately it turned out our hostel was in the Tenderloin district... I knew that unfortunately there was a lot of poverty in LA and SF, but I wasn't really prepared to be surrounded by so much misery in the center of one of the richest cities in the US. I don't mean to sound condescending, but it was quite a harrowing experience. - The drive along highway 1 on Big Sur was really lovely, the scenery felt like a mix between Britanny and the Mediterranean coast. We stopped at Monterey for the aquarium and for some whale watching, definitely worth the time! - For the National Parks, it is indeed hard to find a camp site, we were really lucky that some slots were still open! Definitely need to book in advance next time. I'll also carry better camping equipment, as it did get really cold at night! Also, no one told me there would be no cell service at all there All in all, for us it was a really nice first experience of the Western US, and we'd love to get back for some more
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Oct 6, 2021 10:19
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Thank you for this. And all of it during the tail end of the pandemic, too! If you ever wish to return to Los Angeles, I suggest asking around in the LAN thread for recommendations. We're very frendly! And yes, there is a reason we measure distances in minutes rather than miles Also, Lone Pine has a restaurant that serves both chinese food and italian food. And as the gateway to Mt. Whitney, it's definitely a place you're likely to visit on a return trip. I'm glad that you didn't suffer any smash-and-grabs in SF or suffer any pandemic related delays in your trip. I hope you return soon, although there are plenty of other nice places in the US to visit.
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Nov 22, 2021 06:43
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