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Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







I'll play the game if you have slots open

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Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







oh poo poo I forgot to pick a creature, I guess I default to a basilisk which is actually super cool

just call me... EL BASILISCO

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







it is I, EL BASILISCO, here to do a mafia

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







kaschei posted:

Iím a 0 year old fairy baby here to play adventurously

(Caution 18+ For Mature Audiences Only)

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Man this role madness should be fun.

how do you know it's a RM?

also good morning, EL BASILISCO had a nice night, how are you thread

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







GulagDolls posted:

im going to propose we kill all the girl monsters. ##vote icephoenix

die sexist fucksmeller ##vote gulag

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







Anomalous Amalgam posted:



##vote Ghoulash

this is the worst nickname I've ever seen ##vote aa

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







Mr. Humalong posted:

They get two nightkills already so if I get hammered we lose 3 town pretty much at once lol

what?

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







to clarify: I get the two nightkills part, is this just you saying "no really I'm town" or

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







just checking in to say that I'm very busy today but hope to check in tonight to do some reads

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







I was hoping that in the time I was gone this game would have been more... productive

The Ninth Layer posted:

This whole game has been joke phase. And I didn't know deadline was in three hours.

hey lets backtrack a second here:

The Ninth Layer posted:

Are we still in jokephase?

Also can someone provide me with a list of what everyone is so that I can more efficiently joke during the jokephase, provided one is still occurring?

you're leaning real hard on Hey Is This Jokephase? Are We Playing Mafia Yet? No Okay I Will Come Back Later posts

out of all the posters so far I think you're one of the least engaged and one of the most defensive and I declare jokephase to be OVER with the following statement:

##vote TNL

Jokephase is over, guys! From here on out we play Mafia, for keeps, and you know I'm serious because this sentence has punctuation and poo poo in it. Game on, dweeblords!

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







George Kansas posted:

these posts mostly

tbh I think that's just AA's posting

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







to clarify since I think that sounds kinda lovely in retrospect: in the last few games I've played with AA, their posting is really punchy and maybe even a little overbearingly goofy; AA's posting in this game doesn't give me a scummy feel

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







GulagDolls posted:

what do you think scum AA would look like

I feel like he'd have scumbros that would reel him in and-or direct him a little more constructively

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

Thinking day 1 was mostly joke phase is not an alignment tell.

day 1 in the gross majority of games is jokephase, outside of something like N0 actions or a D1 vig giving the town some info. this is nothing new to most people. why is this such a sticking point?

The Ninth Layer posted:

Instead of engaging with the case being made on me you're just piling on me for uhh defending myself I guess. This vote has nothing to do with alignment.

I'm not engaging with the case being made on you because I don't really consider AA's vote on you being a case. I'm making my own case based on your behavior and the assumptions I can make from it - namely that I'm assuming you're scum based on your tone and engagement with the game so far, and then voting you because of it. You're whining about jokephase and complaining about my rationale for voting you instead of going out and building a case.

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

Ask the people voting me, including yourself.

I'm going to assume you're being obtuse: why are you the one to keep bring up Jokephase, Guys, It's All Jokephase

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







Anomalous Amalgam posted:

I think GK has the worst vote.

##vote gk

and it just so happens to be on you

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







hal I still need to what your av text is from

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

Great posting here beek.

this is a good catch, although they don't necessarily contradict depending on how you read this post:

The Ninth Layer posted:

My vote was as serious as his scum claim is.

I am still not for sure how serious you are about voting based entirely on a D1 scum claim, and I feel like the rest of the thread isn't 100% on how to read you atm either

regardless it's a good enough read to potentially swing my vote; tbh I still think you're scum but am willing to accept I am wrong and vote BK before deadline ends - gonna meditate on it a bit

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

It was a joke vote, in the sense that I did not believe Hal was earnestly scum claiming, as well as a serious vote, in the sense that I was voting for someone who scum claimed which is bad. It was serious in proportion to how serious Hal meant his claim (not very).

this does not do a whole lot to clarify your intent but I'll vote GK so we can be sure to go out for lunch today

##vote GK

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







Vanilla? surprised, based ln the flips so far I thought it would be a role madness game

also we're in LYLO right? I'm about to drive home so I can't do much posting for a few hours, maybe a brief moratorium on votes?

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







Anomalous Amalgam posted:

welp, my reads were poo poo this game. Sorry town.

what are your reads now?

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







how the hell is there a SK? unless the SK managed to target one of the mafia kills every night, which is... possible in such a small game but still unlikely

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







I think it's you TNL, you were the focus of a lot of non-productive discussion D2 and brought up a weird SK discussion today:

The Ninth Layer posted:

I'm vanilla but yeah that's what I think, EP/IP scum and maybe Hal SK.

you post this after AA admits that SK discussion is implausible and don't backtrack at all from it. I'd say that it's a scum miscommunication leading to bad posts between you and AA but I'm not totally sold on AA being scum - I've misread AA in the last couple of games we were in.

Hal I'm pretty sure is town; IP could be scum - they've been kinda distant and quiet all game. it's hard to say with either of them though because we're at LYLO with only six pages of posts, a good chunk of which is recruit/jokephase, and we've had no night action reports to use for information gathering. I'd ask for a fullclaim but scum can easily claim vanilla at this point - really wanted this to be a RM game to avoid this.

Anyway the end result is that TNL is who I'm the most sure about but I'm willing to entertain counterarguments.

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

You can probably come up with a better reason for me being scum than "I was the focus of discussion."

The post you quoted came literally one post after AA was herself speculating about a serial killer. Literally the post above mine. So what are you even talking about?

a few posts above that AA discounts the idea of a SK and mentions a ninja edit before talking about a potential SK; I wasn't there to see the original post so I assumed the first post was talking about an SK then got ninja'd

I don't think you're scum because you're a topic of discussion, I think you're scum because you kept bringing it up D1 instead of dropping it. D2 you start talking about SKs and even after it's said that the OP states there are two scum kills per night you keep speculating about who could be the SK? it doesn't feel productive to actual discussion, it feels like a distraction. again, if AA ninja'd her post I wasn't around to see it, so my specifics may be off-base, but the core of my argument is firm - I think you're hoping to end the game today, but are willing to set yourself up for a bus if you can't cinch it today to make tomorrow more confusing

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







okay I made a mistake, that was supposed to be D2/D3

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







here let me fix the pertinent parts

Epsilon Plus posted:

I don't think you're scum because you're a topic of discussion, I think you're scum because you kept bringing it up D2 instead of dropping it. D3 you start talking about SKs and even after it's said that the OP states there are two scum kills per night you keep speculating about who could be the SK?

if you want to claim you didn't bring up SKs today, here's a post

The Ninth Layer posted:

I'm vanilla but yeah that's what I think, EP/IP scum and maybe Hal SK.

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







also this is the dumbest gotcha anyone's ever tried to pull on me. I'm heading into work, I can post in a few hours if anyone wants to start up some other form of discussion to change my mind on TNL

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

What is the "it" I kept bringing up.

is anyone else confused about what I meant with this statement (with the D1/D2 mistake fixed, sorry, sorry):

Epsilon Plus posted:

I don't think you're scum because you're a topic of discussion, I think you're scum because you kept bringing it up D2 instead of dropping it.

like I think my thesis here is pretty clearly "TNL kept bringing up jokephase and the results of it, leading to a majority of discussion being about TNL, meaning nothing else was discussed as in-depth" and I can't decide if TNL is being obtuse in an effort to paint me as some wackjob or if I'm actually communicating poorly

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

Hal has been really quiet this game and he's basically a wild card for me.

also I just looked at the post count and you're right; hal has all of 15 posts and even after recruit and jokephase none of them are longer than two lines

hal do you have any solid reads or casing you want to present?

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

And as far as your revision goes, you're basically accusing me of defending myself instead of shutting up and letting bad votes sit on me.

I think it's a valid tactic to stop discussion you think is unproductive by no longer replying to it instead of constantly drawing it out, so that other discussions can be had instead, yes. No defense can be a valid defense - either the discussion moves on, or you get lunched and the remaining players have data from that based on the voting pattern that emerged. Especially if you're just a vanilla townie - you win regardless of if you're dead or alive, right?

The Ninth Layer posted:

Yeah I'm obtuse for not reading a sentence into a two letter word

yeah sorry for not retyping an argument that we were all deeply familiar with from D2? I'm going to chalk it up to us having a radically different idea of how to communicate, or how to play mafia in general, and move on.

is there anything else to discuss today, or are TNL and I just going to slapfight until someone impulse-votes and scum jump on it?

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

By the way I completely disagree with this, it's never good tactics to let the town vote someone you know 100% for a fact is town (yourself). But anyway you're not even talking about alignment anymore, you just don't like that I defended myself for so long.

Maybe concede that you don't really have a case here, and I'll concede that while I think you are scummy for going after me for reasons unrelated to alignment at least you're putting in work to go after -somebody.-

I am absolutely talking about alignment, why would I bother debating tactics with you unless it's to convince someone else that you're scum? I'm not going to slapfight about it here anymore, you can ping me in #mafiachat later if you want to have a spirited discussion about it.

Relatedly, I absolutely think I have a case based on your aggression and resistance to let it go even after I said I wanted to move on so we could hopefully have some actual discussion. Just because you don't like my methods doesn't mean that I'm not following some kind of consistent internal logic.

I can agree that IP doesn't look great, but I have counterarguments:

The Ninth Layer posted:

IcePhoenix's only post today so far. If you squint at it you can almost see an opinion expressed here.

It's true that this is IP's only post today, but I disagree with your read of it: there's absolutely an opinion. The opinion is that SK discussion is pointless and distracting; IP is stating that they believe that the SK discussion is one (or maybe both) scum trying to distract the town. You should consider things more in-depth. It is very possible that IP is lurking scum; it's also possible that IP has been busy, like Hal. It's also also possible that Hal is a lying scumlord. Lots of things are possible in a low-postcount game like this.

The Ninth Layer posted:

Gulag voted IP yesterday. Where is he now? Dead.

This again comes down to style of play: many scum will leave town who voted for them or argued with them alive because they feel it would be suspicious if that person died. This is Gulag's vote on IP:

GulagDolls posted:

##vote ip PREDATORY

There's not a whole lot of context to this vote, or to any of Gulag's posts really. If IP is scum, how likely are they to feel threatened by Gulag's vote? There's an odor of scumminess to IP, but I think you smell worse. I would vote IP if I could not get enough traction from other players to vote you today. I believe that voting IP is the wrong play given the other options, but think IP is more likely to be scum than AA, who is more likely to be scum than Hal. This is starting to read like a weird low-power bus attempt from you, though.

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







Hal, AA, IP: thoughts?

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006








god I hope this a prelude to some content

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







The Ninth Layer posted:

EP gives this whole mealy mouthed argument about how really IP doesn't look that bad but also he's the second scummiest player but also he'd be a bad vote today but also that I'm probably busing him. EP is simultaneously trying to defend EP from suspicion, redirect suspicion onto me, and still get some kind of proxy credit for if EP is voted and flips scum.

this is a hilariously roundabout way of saying that I think you're an order of magnitude scummier than IP. I think IP is likely scum, and I will vote him to make sure we don't no-lynch, but I think voting IP is much more likely to lead to a town loss than voting for you.

also lol "EP is simultaneously trying to defend EP from suspicion" wow are you some kind of crazy person?!?! that statement makes no sense!!!!!!!!!!

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







Hal Incandenza posted:

Hmmm I don’t like the use of “town loss” over “us losing” generally

But I also just feel like this is your scum game TNL

I feel like if I had said "us losing" that TNL would have jumped on it and claimed it was another scum tell, and I'm sick of going back and forth with him. Anyways,

I have a work event that I have to go help run for the next two hours, so I'm gonna do this now:

All game TNL has consistently misrepresented my points. TNL has also repeatedly stated how scum should act, according to TNL, without accepting any of the nuance that can happen from game to game. According to Votefinder TNL has participated in 100+ games and is still saying stuff like this:

The Ninth Layer posted:

You kill people who are likely to vote for you. This is a basic strategy.

without allowing for any wiggle room or interpretation. A lot of the game IMO has been TNL saying How Things Are and not actually discussing anything. I am aware that this is flavored by interactions I've had with TNL this game, but I still think that it's sound. I made a pair of typos and TNL jumped on that. I post a correction and TNL completely ignores it. TNL is attempting to enforce his viewpoint on other players and ignoring plenty of material that doesn't fit in with "IP scum, Epsilon or Hal scumbuddy, hurry up and hammer". It all feels very smug, and I read that as scum preparing for a victory. This game hasn't provided a significant body of posts for casing, so this read is the best I've got.

##vote TNL I'll be back before deadline if we have to switch to IP but this is, as far as I am concerned, the proper vote.

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







el basilisco rides again!

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006







also I meant every single word I wrote about mafia strategy, that wasn't some bizarro smokescreen

Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006








sometimes the best plan is the stupidest one, because nobody believes you'd do it

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Epsilon Plus
Dec 30, 2006








wait was that sarcasm I'm too stupid to tell

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