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Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


He didn't use the minigun to shoot out knees he used a handgun.

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poonchasta
Feb 22, 2007

FFFFAAAFFFFF FFFFFAAAAAAAFFFFF FFFFFFFFAAAAAAFFFFF FFFFFFFAAAAAAAFFFFFF FFFFFFFAAAAAAAFFFFF

Groovelord Neato posted:

He didn't use the minigun to shoot out knees he used a handgun.

Yeah I think with the mini gun he was just lighting cars up to get the cops to run away.

Shrimp or Shrimps
Feb 14, 2012


Arny did fire a smoke grenade at short range into someone's lumbar spine. The cop even goes "my back my back!"

He's messed up for sure. Still alive though!

ruddiger
Jun 3, 2004

He murdered their insurance premiums.

Fried Watermelon
Dec 29, 2008


HUMAN
CASUALTIES: 0.0

DeimosRising
Oct 17, 2005

¡Hola SEA!


Fried Watermelon posted:

HUMAN
CASUALTIES: 0.0

Casualties include wounded unable to fight, they were all casualties. Stupid robot!

Azubah
Jun 5, 2007

Just like Batman doesn't kill, he maims the poo poo outta crime.

david_a
Apr 24, 2010




Megamarm
I don’t always buy Rob Ager’s film analysis but he at least comes up with interesting takes (amusingly he debunks himself in this one). Speaking of the T-1000 / police connection in T2, his video was the first time I noticed that the Hunter-Killers in T1 all have police lights. Combine that with the T-800 driving around in a cop car (“Protect and Serve” indeed) and it seems that the first movie also has a nice anti police slant.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQ9i9L6ka9g

Blood Boils
Dec 27, 2006

Its not an S, on my planet it means QUIPS

poonchasta posted:

Yeah I think with the mini gun he was just lighting cars up to get the cops to run away.

Rubber ricochets, honest

Megaman's Jockstrap
Jul 16, 2000

What a horrible thread to have a post.
Well I finally got around to watching Terminator: Dark Fate and it did a lot right but goddamn if blowing away a little kid in the first 5 minutes left a bad taste in my mouth and put a nasty oily film on everything that came after it. That's an Alien 3 level of making GBS threads on your own prior film and I'm amazed Cameron went for it - but famously the Terminator ends with "but we're still all dead in a nuke war, yeah?" so he's certainly capable of narrative downers. Killing a nice little boy who went through it to save the world is a big one though.

I think da real MVP of the film was MacKenzie Davis. My goodness was she good! Super intense without chewing the scenery and had a great physical presence. They shot her like she was 6'4" and that combined with her gangly frame gave her an almost serpentine power in the fight scenes. It was nice that she could be physically imposing in a new (for the franchise) way; honestly it was great to see T101 do the old "robo-brick that grabs and chucks you around" fighting style and Grace with her athleticism big loping swings as a contrast. Neat!

In fact all of the action scenes were of good quality and I was never bored by them. About the only issue I had was near the end of the movie, when a Terminator gets its hand around a human's throat and doesn't immediately tear it out. Oh well, we'll chalk it up to battle damage or some poo poo.

The new Rev9 was also a good new Terminator type and I liked him. Just a nice combination of being a total dumbass, extremely dangerous in close quarters, and totally implacable. In my stupid opinion Terminators work best when they're real fuckin' dorks whose technology tricks and near invincibility are the only thing they have going for them. I also like that it was the most "human" of all the Terminators in terms of mannerisms, cracking jokes and smiling charmingly and such...before becoming a Lobotomized Robo Reaper + Emo T1000.

Arnie was fine although the idea that a Terminator just sorta becomes human after finishing their mission is very compelling and had me asking a lot of questions, none of which the movie provided answers for. Even a dang "activating infiltration mode" after the kill would have helped me understand what happens here, as it stands I just don't understand why he would just kinda wander off and make friends? It's charming but not really earned or explained.

Lastly Linda Hamilton could have been good, but honestly the script let her down. I was very happy to see her, she looks great (hasn't plastic-surgery'd herself into oblivion, thank goodness) and did fine with what she had, but what they gave her wasn't particularly good. She kept getting de-emphasized or having to delivery truly butt-grade blockbuster dialogue. Ah well. She's cool and it's nice to have her back, even in a soggy role.

When the movie wrapped I felt pretty much done with Terminator, not because the film was bad or anything but because this just feels rehashed...again. The idea of another action blockbuster "future war" that's largely fought in the past and now just has detritus from broken timelines bouncing around in it is not particularly interesting to me anymore, and honestly I've had my fill watching near-indestructible cyborgs chasing and throwing each other around to prevent a war that happens anyway. Very much feels like wheel-spinning at this point. The next movie (or Netflix's upcoming Terminator Anime Series) should probably try something completely new or be a lot more intimate. This movie franchise did not go out on a bang but didn't go out on a whimper either and I suppose that will have to be good enough.

Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Sep 9, 2021

Snowman_McK
Jan 31, 2010

Sir Kodiak posted:


James Cameron talks about the choice of the T-1000 being a cop, not just in the practical sense of how the robot could make use of the disguise, but also how it characterizes him. As he says on the commentary track, "cops think of all non-cops as less than they are: stupid, weak, and evil." And that's the T-1000: condescending, brutal, and assured of its superiority. As such, he fits into the LA police department perfectly. The only police officer he kills, and even this is off-screen and we have to assume, is the one whose identity he steals at the very beginning.

You've just reminded me of another brilliant aspect of Robert Patrick's impressively subdued performance. That arrogance does come through. The complete confidence with which he says 'oh, I wouldn't worry about him' or the contempt he looks at the silver mannequin with, or the way he just disregards Arnie once he's got his arm trapped.

I also agree with your issue with it. I think there's a better version where the terminator is just her boss at the factory and crushes her spirit rather than try to kill her.


Megaman's Jockstrap posted:

Well I finally got around to watching Terminator: Dark Fate and it did a lot right but goddamn if blowing away a little kid in the first 5 minutes left a bad taste in my mouth and put a nasty oily film on everything that came after it. That's an Alien 3 level of making GBS threads on your own prior film and I'm amazed Cameron went for it - but famously the Terminator ends with "but we're still all dead in a nuke war, yeah?" so he's certainly capable of narrative downers. Killing a nice little boy who went through it to save the world is a big one though.

I like that they opened with trying to get away from what came before. It's something you need to do in a series that's been going on as long as the Terminator, but they immediately just did a riff on the usual formula. Dark Fate was basically very competent, but the formula has been run into the ground to such an extent it's hard to really give a poo poo about it.

DorianGravy
Sep 12, 2007

I liked Dark Fate pretty well, but I didn't like either use of "He'll be back"/"I won't be back". Stuff like that (or the Wilhelm scream in other movies) kind of breaks my immersion. It was especially annoying after the excellent opening action sequence. Still, the movie was pretty good.

DorianGravy fucked around with this message at 15:24 on Sep 10, 2021

Horizon Burning
Oct 23, 2019
:discourse:
killing john was just a very stupid move. it's way more interesting to see what the messiah whose destiny never came might've done when he was faced with being 'replaced' by someone else. it was especially stupid when it was just so they could have a latina messiah who has to fight skynet i mean legion.

Mat Cauthon
Jan 2, 2006

The more tragic things get,
the more I feel like laughing.



Horizon Burning posted:

killing john was just a very stupid move. it's way more interesting to see what the messiah whose destiny never came might've done when he was faced with being 'replaced' by someone else. it was especially stupid when it was just so they could have a latina messiah who has to fight skynet i mean legion.

Having John be in the role that Arnie played would've been immensely more interesting - his destiny has been supplanted by a new "messiah" but he can't really go back to being a normal person because OG Terminators kept showing up so he fakes his death and then goes into hiding, spending his free time tracking temporal anomalies so that his mom can hunt down the robots. Until one day the Terminator that shows up isn't the one he knows and doesn't care about him at all. How does he deal with that while also trying to help this new savior get comfortable with her destiny? What is his relationship with Sarah like?

IDK how you finagle the aircraft sequence in there, which was one of the cooler set pieces, without an extra terminator but it certainly raises the stakes for the big final showdown.

Chamale
Jul 11, 2010

I'm helping!



John Connor sucks. He was a fun kid but I don't think he can be a good character as an adult in a non-apocalypse world. The franchise is kind of stuck for new material, so making a movie that doesn't involve John was a good call.

Mulva
Sep 13, 2011
It's about time for my once per decade ban for being a consistently terrible poster.

Chamale posted:

John Connor sucks. He was a fun kid but I don't think he can be a good character as an adult in a non-apocalypse world. The franchise is kind of stuck for new material, so making a movie that doesn't involve John was a good call.

They replaced John Connor with John Connor. Why do I care about John Connor, after you just killed John Connor? Because you aren't explicitly calling them "John Connor" and having them fight "SkyNET"? That's not a narrative difference. It's going "This isn't your daddy's John Connor, fellow kids!" and expecting me to give a poo poo. And I didn't. It was an alright movie, better than the reboot, but I'd never bother to watch it again. A word replace on a story I've already seen isn't a new story. It's just new casting. And that can be good, but this wasn't.

Neo Rasa
Mar 8, 2007
Everyone should play DUKE games.

:dukedog:
I liked Dark Fate just because it was like 10,000x better than Salvation and Genisys in a lot of ways.

Awhile ago someone had posted that the director originally had more anti-ICE stuff in it but that Cameron had him reel it back, does anyone have a link to that?




DeimosRising posted:

Casualties include wounded unable to fight, they were all casualties. Stupid robot!

I don't think people at large in the US knew this while the movie was being made and I don't think did until the US was in Iraq for a bit.

Szmitten
Apr 26, 2008
Reminder that the bar scene was shot across the street the same night Rodney King was beaten by cops.

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


Dark Fate might be the best of the post 2 movies but it's still pretty bad. The new Terminator was pretty cool and reminded me of a post I think in this very thread about a T-1000 hiding as the skin of a T-800.

Spacebump
Dec 24, 2003

Dallas Mavericks: Generations
I hope every Terminator sequel from here on out is a new sequel to Terminator 2 that ignores the others. Next time this happens, I hope they don't write the 4th Terminator 3 with plans for a sequel that never gets made.

CelticPredator
Oct 11, 2013
🍀👽🆚🪖🏋

Dark fat

Gatts
Jan 2, 2001

Goodnight Moon

Nap Ghost
You know, you could have a Terminator movie like this where the heroes constantly have to rush to establishment places to hide and be protected and the Terminator is mowing down ICE and racist, fascist organizations and the twist is the heroes could have taken out the Terminator, which they do, but instead intentionally lead it down the path it went on because it is more single minded to make their future and world a better place and where they themselves couldn’t have the same impact so they used it.

Alchenar
Apr 9, 2008

Snowman_McK posted:



I also agree with your issue with it. I think there's a better version where the terminator is just her boss at the factory and crushes her spirit rather than try to kill her.


Yeah but they made that film it's called The Matrix.

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




Gatts posted:

You know, you could have a Terminator movie like this where the heroes constantly have to rush to establishment places to hide and be protected and the Terminator is mowing down ICE and racist, fascist organizations and the twist is the heroes could have taken out the Terminator, which they do, but instead intentionally lead it down the path it went on because it is more single minded to make their future and world a better place and where they themselves couldn’t have the same impact so they used it.

A more realistic take on it would be that the various racist and fascist organisations tries to work with the terminator because they basically have the same end goal. Of course, an even more realistic take on it would be that it won't be any more terminator movies because who even cares about the franchise at this point.

Xenomrph
Dec 9, 2005

AvP Nerd/Fanboy/Shill



I care. :colbert:

Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

Alhazred posted:

A more realistic take on it would be that the various racist and fascist organisations tries to work with the terminator because they basically have the same end goal. Of course, an even more realistic take on it would be that it won't be any more terminator movies because who even cares about the franchise at this point.

They made that movie it's called terminator 2

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




Stairmaster posted:

They made that movie it's called terminator 2

All the more reason to not bother with making another terminator movie.

Small Strange Bird
Sep 22, 2006

Merci, chaton!
Once James Cameron makes the second movie in a series, it should stop there.

Wait, he's making how many Avatar sequels?

AlternateAccount
Apr 25, 2005
FYGM

Payndz posted:

Once James Cameron makes the second movie in a series, it should stop there.

Wait, he's making how many Avatar sequels?

This. Don’t follow James Cameron. It never works.

Neo Rasa
Mar 8, 2007
Everyone should play DUKE games.

:dukedog:

AlternateAccount posted:

This. Don’t follow James Cameron. It never works.

Wasn't Piranha 3D supposed to be pretty good?

Snowman_McK
Jan 31, 2010

Alchenar posted:

Yeah but they made that film it's called The Matrix.

I rewatched the Matrix the other night and never noticed how much his software company boss reads as a program. I don't think he's supposed to be an agent, but he definitely mirrors a lot of Smith's mannerisms from later in the film. Either a human indistinguishable from a program, or a program itself. Works well as a critique of upward mobility either way.

Neo Rasa posted:

Wasn't Piranha 3D supposed to be pretty good?

fun fact: it has a cameo from Gianna Michaels, the porn star, that was supposed to go to Natasha Nice, another porn star. However, Nice had been arrested while doing a gonzo outdoor shoot and so couldn't make it.

Horizon Burning
Oct 23, 2019
:discourse:

Snowman_McK posted:

I rewatched the Matrix the other night and never noticed how much his software company boss reads as a program. I don't think he's supposed to be an agent, but he definitely mirrors a lot of Smith's mannerisms from later in the film. Either a human indistinguishable from a program, or a program itself. Works well as a critique of upward mobility either way.

track down the early draft of the reloaded script if you can, it's very interesting along those lines and neo's company and such factors directly into it

Alchenar
Apr 9, 2008

The whole point is that people who 'choose' to be part of the Matrix aren't just passive victims, they actively uphold the system (same as the police).

Szmitten
Apr 26, 2008

Snowman_McK posted:

I rewatched the Matrix the other night and never noticed how much his software company boss reads as a program. I don't think he's supposed to be an agent, but he definitely mirrors a lot of Smith's mannerisms from later in the film. Either a human indistinguishable from a program, or a program itself. Works well as a critique of upward mobility either way.

When I was a kid in my early watches I thought he literally was Smith.

AlternateAccount
Apr 25, 2005
FYGM

Neo Rasa posted:

Wasn't Piranha 3D supposed to be pretty good?

Naw, man. Hell naw.

Snowman_McK
Jan 31, 2010

Alchenar posted:

The whole point is that people who 'choose' to be part of the Matrix aren't just passive victims, they actively uphold the system (same as the police).

I remember the various readings getting mad at the rebels for killing people just doing their jobs or whatever. There were a lot of them around 2007 or so. Those seem loving hilarious now, like a wilful misreading of the text (of which there have been a fair few)

I think that's part of the reason I'm actually curious about a sequel. It's something that is simultaneously about a world that doesn't exist anymore but is also more relevant than ever.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

AlternateAccount posted:

Naw, man. Hell naw.
It's good bad.

It's really bad, but it's good bad.

AlternateAccount
Apr 25, 2005
FYGM

LividLiquid posted:

It's good bad.

It's really bad, but it's good bad.

I think I remember it somehow being mostly boring.

Darko
Dec 23, 2004

Neo Rasa posted:

Wasn't Piranha 3D supposed to be pretty good?

It's good for a genre piece that is self aware and knows what it is and takes it exactly where it needs to go. You make a killer piranha movie, you gorily kill 30 people and you have someone's dick get bitten off by a piranha and show it and still have the guy complain about his dick being eaten off.

It's Aja, too, so that's why it's higher quality than most. For instance, his Hills Have Eyes is better than Craven's (and especially the second one).

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LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

Everybody involved in Piranha 3D knew exactly what film they were making and somehow despite things never working out this way in that genre space, it was a better film for it.

Opening on Richard Dreyfus singing Show Me the Way to Go Home? Inspired.

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