NBA Offseason N/V: We're All Betas Here

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > NBA Offseason N/V: We're All Betas Here

Does Kawhi stay? This poll is closed.
He stay	95	32.20%
He leave	99	33.56%
ask Uncle Dennis	57	19.32%
burn down Toronto if he doesn't	44	14.92%
Total:	295 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Dejan Bimble posted:

https://imgur.com/0qkjcUW Do you guys think this would be a good new basketball for the NBA?

I've always wondered if the ball is complicit in the game, this would make me sure that it was.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2019 01:41

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# ¿ Apr 27, 2024 09:18

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

morestuff posted:

I just like to think people in this thread are smarter than my racist uncle's Facebook feed

It's a nice fantasy, but,

# ¿ Jun 18, 2019 18:09

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

RJ probably does in fact need to change his shot.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2019 19:11

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Drunk Canuck posted:

Knicks no longer look smart.

RJ in no way is the type of prospect that you shouldn't be at least looking at other players.

WhyteRyce posted:

I'd avoid anyone associated with Markelle Fultz on principal alone

I guess but he is one of the few people who's a shooting coach that you can name people whose shots he improved. Most of these guys are pure snake oil.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2019 19:22

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Space Camp fuckup posted:

He's been wrong about the Suns a lot lately, I'd like to think he's being fed BS. On the other hand the Suns turning their nose up at an All-Star who is Devin Booker's best friend who plays a position of dire need also sounds really on-brand so it's hard to say.

Just make sure someone let's Robert Sarver know that it's a chance to Own the Lakes(ers) because at least a portion of fans will be mad about that.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2019 21:48

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Tae posted:

Is this including rick

You have the reading comprehension of a slug.

Jota posted:

https://twitter.com/esidery/status/1141143662371323904

The last part honestly doesn't mean anything, because of the summer league and G league everyone basically has to meet second round guys even if they don't have picks because this is the only time to work those dudes out.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2019 04:16

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Tae posted:

Is this including rick

You have the reading comprehension of a slug.

Jota posted:

https://twitter.com/esidery/status/1141143662371323904

# ¿ Jun 19, 2019 04:27

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Boston can still make a nice turn of this season because if Al leaves it does make a max contact possible. Kemba would take a lot of pressure off of Tatum.

It does force them to punt all their draft picks if they can�t trade them. Again. Which is pretty lovely for dudes who are first round talent that get pushed down so the Celtics can take 2nd round draft-stash guys in the lottery.

�-

Y�all should be nicer to the nice Celtics fans here, they do not deserve the meanness, they are not to blame for the All Celtic Player or Fan studio show.

Bobby Digital posted:

I didn�t know this beautiful moment made it to SA emoji.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2019 07:21

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Buying them some time to find another player who is younger to help stop Mitchell from having to be the whole offense seems like a good idea.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2019 17:23

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

NickRoweFillea posted:

https://twitter.com/yoggimane/status/1141387970986926080?s=21

Look at the size of that trade exception!

If Lebron goes down early and AD starts sulking the Lakers should unironically trade him to Utah for the TPE and uhhh . . Tony Bradley. To at least get something out of it.

E: Oops I had the Utah roster open I mean, uhh . . . . Ivan Rabb.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2019 20:12

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Diva Cupcake posted:

https://twitter.com/TheNBACentral/status/1141411932689313794

Like honestly this is as clear of a sign that it's time for Chris to retire as anything.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2019 20:17

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

IcePhoenix posted:

Andrew Wiggins for literally nothing who says no

Honestly if you just added Wiggins to Memphis for free he'd probably be okay, like a poor man's 38 year old Vince Carter.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2019 20:19

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Le Saboteur posted:

It is funny that Lakers fans are holding out hope when every major commentator has said he's not going to the Lakers and they don't have nearly enough cap space to give him a competitive offer with other teams any ways.

They can make the cap space if they need it. Not saying they will but the money isn't the problem here.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2019 22:12

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

There is this thing popping up on various Lakers boards that even most of the nuttier places aren't taking very serious but it's basically 3,000 words of a guy claiming to work for AEG and explaining the vast conspiracy happening behind the scenes of the NBA. Like according to this the league forced the AD trade, and they were the ones who dictated the terms, because they want the Lakers to be in the second round for ratings reasons, but they don't actually want them to win a title, but the machinations of the masterful stadium owners may exceed the NBA's wishes as apparently aeg has an ownership stake in New Balance (I have no idea if this is true or not) and have specifically structured the New Balance deal to basically force Uncle Dennis and his agent to have no financial choice but try and push Kawhi to abandon his teammates who he loves [rick note: obviously written this way to make Kawhi seem like a good person even if he leaves Toronto] and go to LA, and probably the Lakers since they already have secured endorsements in other AEG subsidiaries and also Kawhi does not want to be considered a Microsoft guy which would happen if he was with the Clippers.

I didn't have the energy to read the whole thing but every part I skimmed into was like the wildest poo poo, whoever wrote it should be writing for a Japanese sports anime.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2019 22:20

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

DeimosRising posted:

How does this work without NO pushing the trade and AD waving his bonus?

It's complicated but basically by dumping their non-Kuzma guaranteed guys (ESPN at least has reported this part), filling out some minimum roster slots with cheaper-than-the-hold slots (so like 2nd round picks, camp deals) and manipulating some cap holds will allow them to basically do the same thing as just waiting until the 30th. It's a lot more moving parts and maybe beyond the savvy of Pelinka but if dudes on twitter and reddit can figure it out hopefully someone in the office can.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2019 22:57

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

Does this mean the AD trade is 100% going down on July 6

Probably. Well more like 90%.

There is a powerplay here, the Lakers could delay the signing of the #4 to force this to go down on the 30th, now that NO also really can't back out of this deal very easily either, but this would probably be the last nail for Pelinka's rep, along with pissing off the draft pick's agent (well unless it is in fact Garland, since Klutch doesn't necessarily love their dudes playing summer league anyway).

# ¿ Jun 20, 2019 23:10

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

If the Celtics would've just been the third team in the Lakers deal they could've had the 4 and the Pelicans could've had more picks but that probably would've been bad for optics.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2019 23:35

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Josh Hart said he was coming at Kuzma. Kuzma replied.

https://twitter.com/kylekuzma/status/1141901429575045125

# ¿ Jun 21, 2019 03:57

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

I get angry when people try to redraft anywhere farther back than the 2012 draft so I understand.

Tae posted:

I feel like sometimes Dokmo was literally birthed into a scouting office and locked in the vault

Microsoft please dial up this AI's self-awareness.

# ¿ Jun 21, 2019 23:50

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

I can't believe after nailing Monte Morris I didn't get hired to draft for the Suns.

# ¿ Jun 21, 2019 23:51

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Dejan Bimble posted:

If you takes were quantized in a spreadsheet, you'd absolutely be hired by now.
Because of this autoimmune thing I have, I spend a lot of time with so much muscle tension that it's painful to stare at a screen, so for that my amateur scouting has suffered. It's a great shame to me

That sucks big time )= I always think you have really thoughtful takes.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2019 00:14

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

This is not my analysis but I can�t remember where I saw it to credit it, but a scout basically said Tacko is fun to turn your brain off and watch but he is slower than Boban is, without the same touch, defensive instinct or development over the period of scouting, that Boban was scouted before he was brought over, and Boban can barely stay on the floor some nights, so the idea of Tacko being developable just isn�t one that many NBA dudes have.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2019 02:53

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

dokmo posted:

I don't disagree with anything you said. I'm simply pointing out that a bunch of opinions are more likely to converge on the truth than any single opinion. Not always, but most of the time. The average of a bunch of guesses is going to be more right than any single person's guess. I certainly did not mean to impugn the basketball knowledge of any of the writers who write these things, just wondering about their motives for doing so.

Which is why the bottom half of the second round going away from "consensus" (at least the recruitment/draft coverage media's - which at least for some of these sites is done via guys who have scouting connections) the past couple of years has been interesting to me. Some of it is probably huge swings on roster spots teams probably want to keep open or don't have anyway, and part of that is Euroleague players don't necessarily want to be stashed anymore. But it seems we've gotten more "guy ranked 140 on nbadraft getting drafted in the 40s that teams seem to actually expect have a shot to make their team." Too small a sample size to know if it's a trend or not though.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2019 04:47

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

straight up brolic posted:

Cam Reddish went #10 in this draft and . I think you guys are being SUPER overcritical of Bol Bol on offense. He showed more translatable offensive ability in 10 games than any one outside of the top 3, Goga, and like...Coby White did all season

He does have a nice touch around the rim for sure, decent sense of what to do in transition, has a decent post game (albeit against some small competition) and was one of the better shooters in the draft. But do you really think he's going to be able to do those drives, or really anything he does that involves putting the ball on the floor in the NBA?

I would've taken him in the first probably, maybe even would've rolled the dice in the lottery based on the things I have access to, butif I was an NBA team and he had a bad interview or I knew more about his health I totally see pushing that off into the second round or maybe not even drafted.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2019 21:35

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

We're talking about the dude with the girl leaning over in his avatar who has posted kind of yikesy stuff other places unless that avatar is common. I also assume he returned to the hockey thread.

# ¿ Jun 23, 2019 02:38

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Lockback posted:

Any team with a bunch of picks in the 30s and 40s will look bad. The picks they had in the lottery have been:

1. John Wall
6. Jan Vesely
3. Bradley Beal
3. Otto Porter

So Vesely is a big giant bust but the other guys ended up pretty good, even if Washington maybe didn't manage the team very well around those guys.

You're arguing something that isn't really even considered controversial. Washington decided they were bad at drafting and decided to trade picks for players that were being dumped as a strategy.

And there are a lot of the same type of player picked in the second round over and over, maybe get the pattern isn't working and change it.

# ¿ Jun 23, 2019 22:27

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Lockback posted:

I know you were high on JJJ but there was a feeling he was a bit more of a high-upside guy vs a safe pick. I'm not defending Bagley over him, I thought Bagley was a better prospect than most and I think drafting him #2 was pretty dumb.

If picking players in the 2nd round was just a matter of being smart than, like 75% of them wouldn't peter out before 100 games. If you took a list of any team's 2nd round picks they'd be a bunch of garbage with a few rare solid players mixed in.

Oh yeah you're right. For some reason I thought he played a year in Sac before being traded.

The Lakers, Spurs and Nuggets routinely pick players who are able to play a role and get a second contract, even though they rarely have the luxury of drafting in the 30s. Hell even with Earvin interfering the Lakers are still doing that their players just end up playing meaningful minutes for other teams. I'm not going to say it doesn't require a lot of luck to draft in the second round but it's clearly a skill to get players and it's something that teams punt on. The Wizards drafted Arenas once and then tried to do that again and again and again and again.

# ¿ Jun 23, 2019 23:59

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Lockback posted:

Who was the last Spurs 2nd round pick that signed a 2nd contract? Dragic but he was a Suns draft night trade. Who has Denver gotten other than Jokic? LA has legit been pretty good at 2nd rounders but over the last 7-8 years they are definitely an outlier. While I think they are good at it, I think they've also had a pretty lucky run too.

I mean if you want to be pedantic Jaron Blossomgame but Jordan McRae is a borderline NBA player. They pull someone out roughly every 3 years, that's better than luck.

# ¿ Jun 24, 2019 05:00

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

New-Scenery Bazemore is always good for a year.

# ¿ Jun 24, 2019 21:04

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Bazemore started the season pretty decent and then got hurt and by the time he was healthy Atlanta had decided to go youth movement (probably the right plan) and he never really got consistent run again.

Pre/Post all star splits usually aren't this dramatic:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bazemke01/splits/2019

# ¿ Jun 25, 2019 00:14

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

WhyteRyce posted:

Do we have a Fultz update?

So he's not dead and in great shape

There's not a ton of reason for him to do SL, if he does poorly it's more nails in the coffin of his career and if he does well people will have unrealistic expectations.

# ¿ Jun 25, 2019 23:58

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Spacebump posted:

What are reasonable expectations for Porzingis next season?

50-75% of his last healthy form Year 1 from injury, pretty close to what he was pre injury after that.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2019 17:06

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

big boi posted:

https://twitter.com/EricPincus/status/1143967225079988224

What are the chances that this is actually possible and the Lakers can actually pull it off? Not to mention that Kawhi or Kemba actually will have to want to be a Laker first

The Pelicans don't have to be the team that takes those players on and it doesn't need to be Alex Carusso. It's possible, it also can't be done before July 6th so the Lakers at that point will probably have their answer from Kawhi/Kemba.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2019 22:56

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Lockback posted:

If the lakers have help from another team they can get to 32mil on July 6th, the question has always been "What do they need to give up to get that help from another team", cuz they don't have much left.

Wagner and Jonothan were okay enough that it probably wouldn't take a ton to trade them. If the Lakers weren't in the position they were in they could actually maybe even get something for Wagner.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2019 23:15

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

DeimosRising posted:

They problem is you might not need much in a vacuum, but everyone knows you�re over a barrel and HAVE to make the trades to get a max guy. So your leverage is pretty shot

Eh, the Heat and Cavs managed. And owners were really pissed off about the Heat. Not to mention . . . y'all posted the same things back then.

It's cheaper to get a second round pick for Jonothan William's contract than it is to buy one for cash, especially since the league would end up subsidizing most of that cost. And if you make that two seconds. Lakers have 7 second round picks they can spend on this.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2019 23:55

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

chunkles posted:

if anyone remembers my quest to get the lowest score, fuckin nailed it boy. i'd like to thank all the teams that thought they were going to make the playoffs even when they obviously weren't 👌

I think I picked the Lakers to win almost everything and was only 6 points off from first so honestly your achievement is big.

# ¿ Jun 27, 2019 00:07

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

The Maestro posted:

In that scenario is AD also waiving his trade kicker, or is it factored in?

It's not relevant in this scenario because in this scenario the Lakers technically create the cap space first prior to the trade.

# ¿ Jun 27, 2019 00:14

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

DeimosRising posted:

Heat had to give up quite a few seconds. It�s not a game breaker, but it contributes to that situation super teams usually hit 3 years in where there are no decent role players left. I�m just saying that stash of seconds is likely to empty out quickly.

It's definitely huge to part with that, especially since the Lakers usually draft well in the second. which is why I don't think the Lakers should actually do this unless it's Kawhi or Kemba.

# ¿ Jun 27, 2019 00:17

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

DeimosRising posted:

How much of the scouting staff is intact? Since they�ve been through a few front offices and ownership palace intrigues I assume that�s where they�re getting all these good reads on fringe prospects

Because one of the people in charge of the department is another Buss family, probably, it's pretty much been left alone. My assumption is Jerry will poach his son at some point though, and he's one of the key elements. Also Bill Bertka theoretically will retire or depart from this mortal plane at some point and he finds a good player every 5 years or so.

# ¿ Jun 27, 2019 07:27

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# ¿ Apr 27, 2024 09:18

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

BWV posted:

I had nothing against the Clippers before but now I hope they strike out and just end up with Woj's twitter as their biggest acquisition�although to be fair they've basically owned that for the past year anyway.

I doubt anyone actually has Jeorge Sedano in strategy meetings or whatever, but he, an ESPN employee said--as if this is a positive thing that he was stating--that ESPN is trying to steer the narrative to push Kawhi to the Clippers because two LA teams is better for basketball than Kawhi being on a team that isn't cooperative with ESPN like the Lakers or Toronto, a team apparently in another country!!

# ¿ Jun 27, 2019 19:54

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