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rjmccall
Sep 7, 2007

no worries friend
Fun Shoe
Dota 1 has a lot of single-dimensional heroes that do one thing really well, like Lina dumping out an endless stream of single-target magic burst damage. Those heroes now exist, and there aren’t a ton of different single-dimensional roles possible, and Valve isn’t going to add a second Lina with blue hair and a pet parrot. So newer heroes are necessarily going to be more complex than the bare minimum.

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RazzleDazzleHour
Mar 31, 2016

I asked one of my friends (has three accounts in top 300 NA) what he thought about Willow and he said: solid 4 position even in this patch where the most important thing a hero can do is instantly stun and delete an enemy. Only reason she doesn't see more pub play is because she has a non-zero learning curve. Saying her Q is unreliable is pretty misleading because its always the same pattern and pretty easy to hit the enemy with the middle one.

rjmccall posted:

So newer heroes are necessarily going to be more complex than the bare minimum.

I think this makes sense, but at the same time, there's a lot of older heroes that have been totally left by the wayside and are now basically obsolete. Before the forums went down I typed about Lich, and how none of his abilities have any synergy and none of them combo together to help you land them more effectively. The change to Devour that made him super strong was obviously predicated upon the current patch at the time, and now that denying the ranged creep isnt nearly as big a deal he's so bad he went totally unpicked. I think it would go a long way to try and take another look at heroes with the current design philosophy, instead of looking at the bottom of the barrel heroes and trying to band-aid their relevancy by changing one spell or their talents or something. Lifestealer is another good example of a carry who just looks kind of sad in comparison to the new carries with insane kits like MK

rjmccall
Sep 7, 2007

no worries friend
Fun Shoe
Yeah, there are several heroes that just don’t seem to have a niche at all and need a serious rework. Skywrath Mage stands out as a hero that just seems permanently out of the meta because his kit just kindof sucks.

RazzleDazzleHour
Mar 31, 2016

rjmccall posted:

Yeah, there are several heroes that just don’t seem to have a niche at all and need a serious rework. Skywrath Mage stands out as a hero that just seems permanently out of the meta because his kit just kindof sucks.

I think it's also massively an issue that now every single hero buys BKB like second item. Skywrath's whole gimmick also used to be that "this is the hero you can pick to guarantee that someone dies" but as power creep has happened, having three abilities that all just do magic damage doesn't cut it anymore because every meta hero does a bazillion damage

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

https://twitter.com/DOTA2/status/1380596153259991040

Omniknight got a girlfriend

e: lmao her ult is INCREDIBLE

IcePhoenix fucked around with this message at 20:09 on Apr 9, 2021

IncendiaC
Sep 25, 2011
technically it's Kotl's grandkid/phoenix's niece

quote:

Necronomicon
Removed Item

what the gently caress

JollyBoyJohn
Feb 13, 2019

For Real!
lol the new hero is like someone from the avengers and its awesome

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

IncendiaC posted:

technically it's Kotl's grandkid/phoenix's niece

they can both be true

Honestly I'm sure she's very good but I want to play the new hero because she just looks fun as hell to play

TOOT BOOT
May 25, 2010

No more griefing by blocking camps with wards.

RealityWarCriminal
Aug 10, 2016

:o:

DNK posted:

I actually think AM might be pickable if he could take stats over ability points. All he needs is 1/1/1 and then mass stats until he has manta finished (at which point he'll be like level 17 and able to skill poo poo).

Added +2 Attributes leveling for up to 7 times (for the 7 empty levels from 1-26), and can be leveled in any order (via clicking on the talent tree circle). They will automatically be leveled if there are no other options available.


:chanpop:

RealityWarCriminal
Aug 10, 2016

:o:
Hoodwink added to Captains Mode

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

Reality Protester posted:

Added +2 Attributes leveling for up to 7 times (for the 7 empty levels from 1-26), and can be leveled in any order (via clicking on the talent tree circle). They will automatically be leveled if there are no other options available.


:chanpop:

lol I literally just saw that line and was looking for that quote for the exact same reason

Also instead of getting all talents at 30 you pick the last four from 27-30

IncendiaC
Sep 25, 2011
Broodmother got a big rework: spiderlings is now her ult, old passive removed, and her shard ability is a regular spell

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

Couriers no longer have vision when inside Roshan's pit
Wards can now be denied from full health by any allied player if the ward is placed in a spawn camp box

TheFlyingLlama
Jan 2, 2013

You really think someone would do that? Just go on the internet and be a llama?



quote:

FIREBALL
Shard can now be used in melee form. Has 600 cast range when used that way (compared to 1400 in dragon form)

well, now dragon knight can farm like crazy at minute 20

RealityWarCriminal
Aug 10, 2016

:o:

IncendiaC posted:

Broodmother got a big rework: spiderlings is now her ult, old passive removed, and her shard ability is a regular spell

to the dumpster with ye

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

Scepter gives enchant totem a 40% cleave now

Faceless Void got the biggest buff of the patch:

quote:

Base armor increased by 1

he also got a pretty sizeable buff overall, time dilation especially

TOOT BOOT
May 25, 2010

This seems like a really good patch. This is kinda WTF though: "Tango pooling has been removed from the Strategy Phase UI."

Sab669
Sep 24, 2009

7.29 posted:

Shared tangos now expire after 40 seconds. Tango pooling has been removed from the Strategy Phase UI.

Mid pickers on suicide watch

RealityWarCriminal
Aug 10, 2016

:o:
DOOM
Base armor increased from 0 to 3

Zurreco
Dec 27, 2004

Cutty approves.
Heroes now gain 1 TP scroll on death

What? Why?

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

I threw Draskyl on in the background and he says the new hero is probably going to be played mid a lot because of the way the ult works to allow you to gank sidelanes.

rjmccall
Sep 7, 2007

no worries friend
Fun Shoe
Ooh, the Bane scepter is interesting; it makes it significantly harder to cancel Fiend's Grip:

quote:

Reworked Scepter upgrade. Reduces Fiend's Grip cooldown by 45 seconds and causes Fiend's Grip to create two uncontrollable illusions that channel Fiend's Grip on the target. Illusions take 700% damage.

mikeraskol
May 3, 2006

Oh yeah. I was killing you.
I think Dawnbreaker is a carry? Regardless, just tried her in a bot game and she's fun as gently caress.

Sab669
Sep 24, 2009

This new CM Shard where you can walk and it follows you is actually gonna be obscenely good, me thinks.

mikeraskol
May 3, 2006

Oh yeah. I was killing you.
You move at 25% speed. That seems useless, being able to cast is the bigger deal but not its sure worth 1400 gold.

Sab669
Sep 24, 2009

It's no longer channeled so you can't be interrupted. And you can Force Staff yourself into fights :haw:

IcePhoenix
Sep 18, 2005

Take me to your Shida

mikeraskol posted:

You move at 25% speed.

How can you tell?

mikeraskol
May 3, 2006

Oh yeah. I was killing you.

Sab669 posted:

It's no longer channeled so you can't be interrupted. And you can Force Staff yourself into fights :haw:

Are you reading what I'm reading?

Reworked Shard. Now allows you to move, cast, and attack during Freezing Field. Your movement speed is reduced by 75% during this and the Freezing Field follows your movement. Interruptions and Silences will still interrupt the spell.

RealityWarCriminal
Aug 10, 2016

:o:
Meepo Shard lets you Poof to allies within 2000 range. that's a cool change that wont matter because not enough pros train meepo.

mistermojo
Jul 3, 2004

lions shard seems very good, spell immune when mana draining

TOOT BOOT
May 25, 2010

mistermojo posted:

lions shard seems very good, spell immune when mana draining

It's interesting at least, unlike the last one that just seemed like it painted a target over your head.

sugar free jazz
Mar 5, 2008

this is a fuckin PATCH right here


dazzle gettin a hex on poison touch lmao is it aoe

lol LC shard


LS is back baby

rip morph

sugar free jazz fucked around with this message at 21:45 on Apr 9, 2021

Tom Clancy is Dead
Jul 13, 2011

Necronomicon removed from the game

Sab669
Sep 24, 2009

Sab669 posted:

It's no longer channeled so you can't be interrupted. And you can Force Staff yourself into fights :haw:

OK it actually can be interrupted by Stuns? In a demo game Axe taunt didn't interrupt it :thunk:

DNK
Sep 18, 2004

DNK posted:

I actually think AM might be pickable if he could take stats over ability points. All he needs is 1/1/1 and then mass stats until he has manta finished (at which point he'll be like level 17 and able to skill poo poo).

Added +2 Attributes leveling for up to 7 times (for the 7 empty levels from 1-26), and can be leveled in any order (via clicking on the talent tree circle). They will automatically be leveled if there are no other options available.

lol

e:

Reality Protester posted:

Added +2 Attributes leveling for up to 7 times (for the 7 empty levels from 1-26), and can be leveled in any order (via clicking on the talent tree circle). They will automatically be leveled if there are no other options available.


:chanpop:

yea

MadHat
Mar 31, 2011

Sab669 posted:

OK it actually can be interrupted by Stuns? In a demo game Axe taunt didn't interrupt it :thunk:

May be intended since Taunt just forces Auto Attacks to target Axe?

Zurreco
Dec 27, 2004

Cutty approves.
CM shard is actually ridiculous if you have a Dark Seer on your team.

e: Is Invoker shard trash? You're never gonna hit anyone with the other two meteors.

Zurreco fucked around with this message at 22:14 on Apr 9, 2021

BabelFish
Jul 20, 2013

Fallen Rib

Tom Clancy is Dead posted:

Necronomicon removed from the game

Necronomicon? More like NecronomiGONE!

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Sab669
Sep 24, 2009

Zurreco posted:

CM shard is actually ridiculous if you have a Dark Seer on your team.

👀 I need to try this. I just played a game and gave it a whirl thinking it was un-interuptable but they had a fair few stuns and made me sad lol.

Also this Beast Master throwing axe spam is wild. Makes me wanna play Silencer

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