Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!
Solid chunk of evidence for the Mangetsu is an artificial human theory this episode.

Also she's gaaay


also, a big promotion for the butler lady

Fangz fucked around with this message at 20:39 on Aug 23, 2019

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

nielsm
Jun 1, 2009



I really like how this show is playing out.
Nenenee for MVP.

Lurking Haro
Oct 27, 2009

Fangz posted:

also, a big promotion for the butler lady

Butler lady still is butler lady.
It's the girl that got beaten right at the beginning of the show.

SatoshiMiwa
May 6, 2007


Was wondering Anna's fate was coma or death but nope show has to go and be even more mean by erasing her from existence

Some real good direction this episode too and some actual great quiet moments before it drops some plot bombs on us.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

This show's gotten extremely good and I hope it ends well. The storyboards have just been dynamite throughout.

Also I'm only having a harder and harder time deciding whether I think Suisho is/ever was human or not.

Spiritus Nox fucked around with this message at 00:27 on Aug 24, 2019

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled
viewers: how on earth is suishou going to measure up to anna?

aoi yuuki: strap in, fools, i got this

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012
So I think this episode pretty heavily indicated what the show's title is about.

The 'two princeps' aren't Shingetsu and Mangetsu. They're Mangetsu and Suishou. They're split halves of the same person, the reigning princeps of Granbelm. Apart from poking massive holes in Mangetsu's backstory, which Suishou seemed suspiciously familiar with - and pulling little visual tricks like having Suishou make out with Kuon and then having Kuon and Mangetsu wake up naked in bed together - this episode also highlighted their physical similarities, like their bright green eyes and the pale tips on the ends of their hair. Then it had that little bit at the end where Mangetsu's hair becomes white - the midpoint between pink and blue - when she looks at the moon, which Suishou is heavily associated with.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

Darth Walrus posted:

So I think this episode pretty heavily indicated what the show's title is about.

The 'two princeps' aren't Shingetsu and Mangetsu. They're Mangetsu and Suishou. They're split halves of the same person, the reigning princeps of Granbelm. Apart from poking massive holes in Mangetsu's backstory, which Suishou seemed suspiciously familiar with - and pulling little visual tricks like having Suishou make out with Kuon and then having Kuon and Mangetsu wake up naked in bed together - this episode also highlighted their physical similarities, like their bright green eyes and the pale tips on the ends of their hair. Then it had that little bit at the end where Mangetsu's hair becomes white - the midpoint between pink and blue - when she looks at the moon, which Suishou is heavily associated with.

....poo poo.

...Where's Kibou and her apparent powers fit into this theory, tho?

Spiritus Nox fucked around with this message at 03:34 on Aug 24, 2019

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012

Spiritus Nox posted:

....poo poo.

...Where's Kibou and her apparent powers fit into this theory, tho?

I don't think she's magical. I do, however, think that a shitload of magic was poured into her house to make Mangetsu her sister.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

Darth Walrus posted:

I don't think she's magical. I do, however, think that a shitload of magic was poured into her house to make Mangetsu her sister.

Hmmm....We have established that it's not all that hard to use magic to rewrite memories and insert/delete people into and out of families...

Tamba
Apr 5, 2010

Darth Walrus posted:

So I think this episode pretty heavily indicated what the show's title is about.

The 'two princeps' aren't Shingetsu and Mangetsu. They're Mangetsu and Suishou. They're split halves of the same person, the reigning princeps of Granbelm.

Yeah, I've wondered what was up with the japanese subtitle: "Princeps no futari". Rather than "the two Princeps" (i.e. there are two Princeps-es) it's more "the two, who are [the] Princeps".

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

That episode's overall delivery felt kind of limp and weird to me, and I hope we stop doing that "cut away from our viewpoint character to arbitrarily hide something they've just learned from the audience" thing pretty soon because it wore out its welcome pretty hard here, but that last reveal is pretty good.

So Mangetsu's clearly some kind of Homunculus or some such. Presumably Suisho's creation? But to what end...?

Also I hope there's still something to Kuon's sister's plan that we haven't grasped yet, because "let the villain devour my soul so I can make them flinch a little at a key moment down the line" feels decidedly off to me.

Elephant Parade
Jan 20, 2018



Next time on Granbelm: Homura battles Walpurgisnacht

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

Oh yeah, lol. I had been thinking some of the Madoka comps were slightly overdone, but that particular shot is, uh, not subtle lmfao

Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!
Don't miss the post-credits.

Okay strong implication that uh... Mangetsu is an armanox isn't she? I'm assuming she's Magiaconatus's.

Elephant Parade
Jan 20, 2018

Fangz posted:

Don't miss the post-credits.

Okay strong implication that uh... Mangetsu is an armanox isn't she?
I don't think she's an Armanox specifically, but she's definitely some kind of artificial being.

Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!

Elephant Parade posted:

I don't think she's an Armanox specifically, but she's definitely some kind of artificial being.

I do think she's an armanox specifically because the 'threads' apparently controlling her exactly mirror the threads the other contenders use to control their armanoxes

also welp they are getting rid of Suishou early huh

Fangz fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Aug 30, 2019

SatoshiMiwa
May 6, 2007


Most people probably won't notice it cause of the other big cliff hanger but boy Shingetsu hosed up here again the same way she did with Anna huh

Elephant Parade
Jan 20, 2018

Fangz posted:

I do think she's an armanox specifically because the 'threads' apparently controlling her exactly mirror the threads the other contenders use to control their armanoxes

also welp they are getting rid of Suishou early huh
An "Armanox" is specifically a giant robot, though, or so we've been told. Also, strings are used to control puppets in general, both in media and in real life. It's not impossible, but it doesn't seem particularly likely, especially since (again, as far as we know) mage descendants only have one Armanox each.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

I do hope the show still has something interesting left to reveal about Suisho. Right now her character's kind of just "I Do Bad Things Because I'm Just Bad Like That" to me, which is a little dull when you get right down to it, would like there to be something that gives her at least a little bit more depth like Anna had.

Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!

Elephant Parade posted:

An "Armanox" is specifically a giant robot, though, or so we've been told. Also, strings are used to control puppets in general, both in media and in real life. It's not impossible, but it doesn't seem particularly likely, especially since (again, as far as we know) mage descendants only have one Armanox each.

Well, I definitely don't agree that she's made by Suishou. I think it makes more sense for her to be an armanox than some other newly defined type of magical doll, since we haven't see the string motif used anywhere else. If she's an armanox herself that definitely explains why she appeared in Granbelm without an armanox, also. I don't think armanoxes have to be giant robots, they only have to represent the creator.

I expect Suishou to be defeated next episode.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

Oh something I forgot until I took another look - the gently caress is with those burns on Onee-chan's arms???

SatoshiMiwa
May 6, 2007


Read this elsewhere but Kibou (Mangetsu sister) has been featured too prominently to just be Nene's girlfriend. Something has to be up there as well

Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!
Kibou needs to knock some sense into her gf for making her sister cry

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012

SatoshiMiwa posted:

Read this elsewhere but Kibou (Mangetsu sister) has been featured too prominently to just be Nene's girlfriend. Something has to be up there as well

I think the main thing that's up is that she's the 'sister' of the protagonist, an artificial being who was magically inserted into her life. Mangetsu has a really weak sense of identity, and she's a key part of it, for better or worse. I reckon that her familial connection with Kibou will be just as important as her romance with Shingetsu (c'mon, we're not going to try pretending it's just a friendship, are we?) in helping her decide that she's a person after all.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

Darth Walrus posted:

I think the main thing that's up is that she's the 'sister' of the protagonist, an artificial being who was magically inserted into her life. Mangetsu has a really weak sense of identity, and she's a key part of it, for better or worse. I reckon that her familial connection with Kibou will be just as important as her romance with Shingetsu (c'mon, we're not going to try pretending it's just a friendship, are we?) in helping her decide that she's a person after all.

There's a part of me that wonders if Kibou *made* Mangetsu somehow. I don't think it makes much sense for it to be any of the other Granbelm participants, and her being some agent of the Magiaconatus itself feels a little too easy.

Darth Walrus
Feb 13, 2012

Spiritus Nox posted:

There's a part of me that wonders if Kibou *made* Mangetsu somehow. I don't think it makes much sense for it to be any of the other Granbelm participants, and her being some agent of the Magiaconatus itself feels a little too easy.

I would assume that she and Suishou are creations (or broken-off aspects) of the white-haired girl in the moon, who is presumably the previous princeps. The interference she was getting when she summoned a spirit was because she kept feeling like she was doing it from the wrong end.

Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!
https://manga.tokyo/interview/interview-with-granbelm-producer-takayuki-nagatani/

Interview with the producer


quote:

Could you please tell us how the idea for the anime came about?

I approached anime studio Nexus with the idea of creating a new anime together. They said that they were interested in chibi-style robots and wanted to create anime featuring them. I love those kinds of anime too, so I suggested they start the creative process right away and I would organize it as soon as possible. That’s how we got started.

Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!
RIP Kuon

Misc thoughts

the person who said that Suishou is representative of a different aspect of Magiaconatus seems to be correct. Or maybe Suishou is like Suishi's Mangetsu? Mangetsu 1.0?

I liked that they didn't go the route of Misunderstandings and having Mangetsu hate Shingetsu for drama

It is certainly quite unclear why some participants get erased when defeated and some do not

Magiaconatus seems to have some kind of conscious will, I reckon, as to how things are 'fixed' when a participant is removed. I don't think it necessarily had to revive Kuon's sister, but it did

Fangz fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Sep 6, 2019

nielsm
Jun 1, 2009



Fangz posted:

It is certainly quite unclear why some participants get erased when defeated and some do not

If the Armanox is defeated/magic crystal broken, but the candidate driving it is safe, the candidate is removed from the game but lives. If the candidate is killed/self-detonates they are erased. I think that's the pattern.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

I'm really curious about what, if anything Shisui will be able to tell us about Suisho. In particular - was Suisho always Like This?

SatoshiMiwa
May 6, 2007


Oh hey I have some theories about things will *watches episode* welp time throw theories into the trash

Elephant Parade
Jan 20, 2018

imo it's kind of lame that Mangetsu's life problems are because she's a magic robot and not just because she's had a crappy life. like, it doesn't totally destroy her character or the series or anything, but it sort of retroactively makes her less interesting.

Spiritus Nox
Sep 2, 2011

....poo poo I keep forgetting there's only two eps left.

Sindai
Jan 24, 2007
i want to achieve immortality through not dying
I dunno, I don't trust anything Suisho says and the magic castle appears to have almost limitless control over reality, so I'm not going to take her word on what's going on with Mangetsu. If nothing else, it being impossible for her to win Granbelm is almost certainly wrong. Especially if Suisho, who certainly doesn't seem to be human any more (if she ever was) can win.

Sindai fucked around with this message at 03:19 on Sep 7, 2019

Elephant Parade
Jan 20, 2018

Sindai posted:

I dunno, I don't trust anything Suisho says and the magic castle appears to have almost limitless control over reality, so I'm not going to take her word on what's going on with Mangetsu. If nothing else, it being impossible for her to win Granbelm is almost certainly wrong. Especially if Suisho, who certainly doesn't seem to be human any more (if she ever was) can win.
Suisho appears to be able to "win" in the sense that she can be the last combatant standing (assuming that, at the very least, the present Granbelm is separate from the one Kuon's sister participated in), but she can't become the Princeps even if/when she does win. Because of that, she assumes that Mangetsu, another doll created by Magiconatus, can't win either. But she's not

Also, any portion of this could be bullshit. Given that Suishou intends to win "to prove that no so-called human being can become Princeps," she, at least, thinks that Granbelm's setup is legit. But she might be being lied to as well! Who knows!

Elephant Parade
Jan 20, 2018

And yeah, Mangetsu might not be a doll. Unlike Suishou, she can feel pain.

SatoshiMiwa
May 6, 2007


Suisho really has that Emet Selch FFXIV energy going this episode yes

Diabetes Forecast
Aug 13, 2008

Droopy Only
everytime I go into a new episode I get anxiety and honestly this was no exception. I'm scared for basically everyone and I'm sad Kuon got killed in such a really horrible way, and everyone else is getting their faces kicked in by the reality of this situation.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Fangz
Jul 5, 2007

Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!

Spiritus Nox posted:

....poo poo I keep forgetting there's only two eps left.

It's a 13 episode series, so three episodes left.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply