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Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

"I find my life is a lot easier the lower I keep my expectations."
-Bill Watterson


GoGoGadgetChris posted:

this show is so good it makes HBO's the Watchmen look like Alan Moore's the Watchmen

Amazon Boys is to Moore's Watchmen as HBO's Watchmen is to Ennis' Boys

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GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010


Bad Dog

Bust Rodd posted:

Watchmen pretty clearly had a message that ended up, uh, becoming completely hyper relevant only a few months after it was being criticized as “heavy handed”.

More black female cops now

Utgardaloki
Mar 2, 2009


Bust Rodd posted:

Nah, The Boys is extremely entertaining but I really don’t get the sense that it’s trying to “say something”, just trying to tell this awesome story.

ahahaha what

the show is so filled with social critique it's amazing there's screentime for anything else.

Arglebargle III
Feb 21, 2006


MY GIMMICK IS POSTING GIBBERISH




Man I forgot how bad HBO Watchmen's ending was. Classic Lindelof.

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

TURDS BOD



Utgardaloki posted:

ahahaha what

the show is so filled with social critique it's amazing there's screentime for anything else.

Yeah I think that’s incidental to the narrative as opposed to deliberately interwoven into the narrative the way it is in Watchmen.

I think both shows are poking the bear, but The Boys is doing it as a backdrop to their story, whereas I think Watchmen was using its story as more of a backdrop for social commentary.

I think both shows are approaching a lot of the same ideas from the exact opposite ends of the entertainment spectrum and I love both shows for their strengths, not their weaknesses.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010


Bad Dog

Arglebargle III posted:

Man I forgot how bad HBO Watchmen's ending was. Classic Lindelof.

His better half is crushing it with Lovecraft, though!

As Nero Danced
Sep 3, 2009

Alright, let's do this


DogsInSpace! posted:

Or he brings out an 80s boombox and plays some Peter Gabriel. Sadly he chooses "Sledgehammer" so the message gets muddied.



Yeah.... HR responds by sending her to Sandusky. I don't blame Ashley at all. I know she's a PR Drone a lot of people would mock but she really was neck deep in the chum before she knew what hit her. She has obviously been terrified since like the second episode of this show when she was newer. Annika I think might be able to quietly slip away but I am fairly sure Ashley is toast. I bet the character knows this but is too terrified to do anything but watch the truck come slowly at her.

Watching the first ep of Season 2 again. "Sympathy for the Devil" is a cool song but I just feel a bit overdone with TV and movies. At least the Rolling Stones version. Janes Addiction did a version on their 80s album XXX. Use that or some custom cover.

The Ozzy cover was great. Honestly that whole Under Cover album was perfect.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Brz9N0O_DD8

Phenotype
Jul 24, 2007

You must defeat Sheng Long to stand a chance.



Bust Rodd posted:

Ok I thought you were saying "People cannot consent to supes due to power imbalance" which is completely different from "Homelander isn't emotionally stable enough to have real relationships"

It's kind of an interesting question, at least in Homelander's case. No one's going to say you can't consent to sex with The Rock because he's bigger and stronger than you, but then we live in a society and there are systems that can theoretically protect you if The Rock tries to threaten you into consent. With Homelander, there is basically no possible way to stop him if he feels like doing something awful. It's like the boat episode of Always Sunny -- sure these girls could say no, but y'know, we're out here at sea, no one's around to help them, things could turn really ugly all of a sudden, so they're not gonna say no because of The Implication.

Homelander basically spends his entire life on a boat, in that sense.

Pixelante
Mar 15, 2006

You people will by God act like a team, or at least like people who know each other, or I'll incinerate the bunch of you here and now.


Phenotype posted:

It's like the boat episode of Always Sunny -- sure these girls could say no, but y'know, we're out here at sea, no one's around to help them, things could turn really ugly all of a sudden, so they're not gonna say no because of The Implication.

I have never watched Always Sunny but I thought it was a comedy? What the christ.

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

"I find my life is a lot easier the lower I keep my expectations."
-Bill Watterson


Pixelante posted:

I have never watched Always Sunny but I thought it was a comedy? What the christ.

Its a black comedy. The whole point is the main characters are terrible people. Its like Seinfeld taken to its extreme conclusion.

Asgerd
May 6, 2012






Grimey Drawer

Pixelante posted:

I have never watched Always Sunny but I thought it was a comedy? What the christ.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yUafzOXHPE

Gonz
Dec 22, 2009

"Jesus, did I say that? Or just think it? Was I talking? Did they hear me?"


Just waiting for Homelander to bust out the most perfect CCH Pounder impression of all time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snOJTzrBies

Also, that’s the best analogy. Homelander is 100% a superpowered Dennis Reynolds.

thrawn527
Mar 27, 2004

Thrawn/Pellaeon
Studying the art of terrorists
To keep you safe

Pixelante posted:

I have never watched Always Sunny but I thought it was a comedy? What the christ.


The two important things to keep in mind with It's Always Sunny are A) as stated, they are all terrible people doing terrible things and B) their schemes and terrible deeds basically always blow up horribly in their faces. Which is where the comedy comes from. It's been forever since I saw this episode, but I can say with almost 100% certainty that they do not get laid on a boat at the end of the episode.

Chef Boyardeez Nuts
Sep 9, 2011

[size=xx-large"]
You're not getting another fucking dime from us, Lowtax
[/size]

Pixelante posted:

I have never watched Always Sunny but I thought it was a comedy? What the christ.

Dennis Reynold's job is to be the abyss gazing back at the other characters.

Beef Stew
Dec 27, 2009


Phenotype posted:

It's kind of an interesting question, at least in Homelander's case. No one's going to say you can't consent to sex with The Rock because he's bigger and stronger than you, but then we live in a society and there are systems that can theoretically protect you if The Rock tries to threaten you into consent. With Homelander, there is basically no possible way to stop him if he feels like doing something awful. It's like the boat episode of Always Sunny -- sure these girls could say no, but y'know, we're out here at sea, no one's around to help them, things could turn really ugly all of a sudden, so they're not gonna say no because of The Implication.

Homelander basically spends his entire life on a boat, in that sense.


With Homelander specifically there are some insanely hosed up power dynamics. He is a sadistic sociopath that maims and murders on a whim and is utterly broken emotionally when it comes to intimacy. He murdered a guy just for talking to Maeve. I feel like it's totally different with your "average" supe. Who yeah, could theoretically kill their partner about as easily, but because they don't impulsively commit gratuitous acts of violence over the smallest emotional slights, their partners never feel threatened and they have no issues with consent or coercion. Like Annie and Hughie or Maeve and her girlfriend.

Phenotype
Jul 24, 2007

You must defeat Sheng Long to stand a chance.



Beef Stew posted:

With Homelander specifically there are some insanely hosed up power dynamics. He is a sadistic sociopath that maims and murders on a whim and is utterly broken emotionally when it comes to intimacy. He murdered a guy just for talking to Maeve. I feel like it's totally different with your "average" supe. Who yeah, could theoretically kill their partner about as easily, but because they don't impulsively commit gratuitous acts of violence over the smallest emotional slights, their partners never feel threatened and they have no issues with consent or coercion. Like Annie and Hughie or Maeve and her girlfriend.

I don't disagree, but the power dynamics I'm talking about don't have anything to do with the personalities involved. Sure, Starlight or Maeve could murder their partners, but they'd send other supes after them and throw them in No Lunch Supermax or something -- there would be consequences for their actions, so it's not much different than any normal human having to obey the law. But there are no real consequences for pretty much anything Homelander does, because they don't have any way to enforce them. Even if he actually was the friendly All-American hero he's impersonating, there'd still be The Implication, because he can do anything he wants and no one can stop him.

Beef Stew
Dec 27, 2009


Phenotype posted:

I don't disagree, but the power dynamics I'm talking about don't have anything to do with the personalities involved. Sure, Starlight or Maeve could murder their partners, but they'd send other supes after them and throw them in No Lunch Supermax or something -- there would be consequences for their actions, so it's not much different than any normal human having to obey the law. But there are no real consequences for pretty much anything Homelander does, because they don't have any way to enforce them. Even if he actually was the friendly All-American hero he's impersonating, there'd still be The Implication, because he can do anything he wants and no one can stop him.

Ahh ok I see what you are saying. That's definitely true as well, there's literally no way he could even be theoretically held accountable for anything he does and everyone knows that.

To change the subject slightly, I wonder if Homelander really does think he's totally untouchable though. Like virtually indestructible, sure, but he seems like a pretty intelligent guy. Definitely moreso then his comics counterpart. I wonder if the thought hasn't crossed his mind that it would be pretty uncharacteristic of Vought, who seem to be very good at covering their asses and seem to have a contingency plan for every disaster, not to have some kind of emergency option in case their most dangerous and valuable investment goes rogue.

I know he's been kept partially in line up until this point because he enjoys the status quo and being a rock star loved by millions, but I wonder if the idea that Vought might have a way to deal with him if he goes too far might not also be somewhere in the back of his mind.

Then again he is a total narcissist that's probably never even experienced physical pain, and he seemed to have no issue attempting to physically intimidate the literal CEO. So probably not.

seaborgium
Aug 1, 2002

"Nothing a shitload of bleach won't fix"


Zazz Razzamatazz posted:

I haven't seen this mentioned yet but I just don't get Ashley.

After she saw what HL did to that blind supe, I don't get why she didn't bail right there.

The prestige and pay of that job can't possibly be worth having to be around a psychopath like HL all the time.

He did straight up say to her that she's back after being fired to do whatever the gently caress he told her too. She's there because she doesn't want to die, that's pretty much it.

She's kind of a lovely corporate PR person, but after HL brought her back she's pretty much stuck with doing what he says or he brutally murders her.

unlimited shrimp
Aug 30, 2008



ONE YEAR LATER posted:

Becca says "when I found out I was pregnant I went to Vought, not you" should be the end of the conversation in regards to Butcher's disposition, but then again half of the people watching TV and movies seem media illiterate.

ugh I hate her she's worse than Skyler

Accretionist
Nov 7, 2012



Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:

Dennis Homelander is cannon








Ha, nice!

Supreme Allah
Oct 6, 2004

working from home


Nap Ghost

i am untethered & my rage knows no bounds

Democratic Pirate
Feb 17, 2010



My favorite Homelander line is “that baby is an accessory” from Season 1. The utter contempt Starr puts into the word “baby” is great.

spacetoaster
Feb 10, 2014








Has anyone gone through the math and determined how many calories supes burn to do things? I mean, I understand it's all magic, or whatever, but I'm curious what the caloric cost would be to eye laser a person in half.

That's probably a lot of milk HL would have to drink.

Baudolino
Apr 1, 2010

THUNDERDOME LOSER

If there is one thing i have trouble beleiving it`s that there would be any serious resistance to letting supes work for the military in the first place.
I don`t see the twin towers in this version of New York so i assume 9/11 happened. Don`t tell me Bush jr and Cheney of all people would be against letting all-american patriot Homelander and the Vougth corporation participate in Iraq or Afghanistan? The only thing that could have kept them out until the super-terrorists show up would be the fear that they would be too effective and reduce profits of the defense industry. But that`s easily solved by letting Homelander obliterate allegded terrorists every now and again to lift moral, but otherwise running the wars as normal.

thunderspanks
Nov 5, 2003

crucify this

All this talk of supe relationships and no one brought up the dude who had his dick broken off while bangin icicle girl.

unlimited shrimp
Aug 30, 2008



It's conceivable to me that the military would not tolerate a weapon it couldn't control, especially when it's already the most powerful military on Earth.

Baudolino
Apr 1, 2010

THUNDERDOME LOSER

Sure, but in the hysteria following 9/11 hardly anyone in the US goverment was thinking rationally. Relastically it would be the White house begging Vougth to get involved regardless of that the military leaders said, not Vougth having to wage a long pr-campaign over several years to be allowed to kill abroad under the US flag.

Rando
Mar 11, 2004



The 9/11 analog in the comics is that the plane Homelander abandons goes on to destroy the brooklyn bridge.

Elephant Ambush
Nov 13, 2012

...We shoulde spenden more time together. What sayest thou?



Nap Ghost

Bust Rodd posted:

Nah, The Boys is extremely entertaining but I really don’t get the sense that it’s trying to “say something”, just trying to tell this awesome story. Watchmen pretty clearly had a message that ended up, uh, becoming completely hyper relevant only a few months after it was being criticized as “heavy handed”.

Uhhh what? This show has tons to say on multiple socioeconomic issues.

Panfilo
Aug 27, 2011

EXISTENCE IS PAIN

Baudolino posted:

If there is one thing i have trouble beleiving it`s that there would be any serious resistance to letting supes work for the military in the first place.
I don`t see the twin towers in this version of New York so i assume 9/11 happened. Don`t tell me Bush jr and Cheney of all people would be against letting all-american patriot Homelander and the Vougth corporation participate in Iraq or Afghanistan? The only thing that could have kept them out until the super-terrorists show up would be the fear that they would be too effective and reduce profits of the defense industry. But that`s easily solved by letting Homelander obliterate allegded terrorists every now and again to lift moral, but otherwise running the wars as normal.
I mean they address this in the Watchmen universe, where Dr Manhattan wins the Vietnam War in a few weeks by vaporizing all the North Vietnamese soldiers one by one. And all it really did was accelerate nuclear escalation with the Soviets, since it kind of puts their back into a wall when a rival world power has a godlike being at their disposal.

In the Boys universe, I think the pushback is that it makes them look less competent. But this probably applies to police as well, what good are cops when you have supes? Think about how much police unions would have to twist themselves in knots to justify their existence?

Tip
Mar 21, 2006

Your move, creep.



spacetoaster posted:

Has anyone gone through the math and determined how many calories supes burn to do things? I mean, I understand it's all magic, or whatever, but I'm curious what the caloric cost would be to eye laser a person in half.

That's probably a lot of milk HL would have to drink.

They talk about this in the first season, A-Train's trainer makes him stop and drink some packet and says that if he doesn't get 3000 calories an hour he'll pass out.

Avasculous
Aug 30, 2008


spacetoaster posted:

Has anyone gone through the math and determined how many calories supes burn to do things? I mean, I understand it's all magic, or whatever, but I'm curious what the caloric cost would be to eye laser a person in half.

That's probably a lot of milk HL would have to drink.


Wikipedia says industrial cutting lasers run on kilowatts of power to cut steel at point blank range for <1 cm depth and <1 cm diameter.

5000 kW *1 second = 1200 dietary calories.

I couldn't find an equation for this, but multiply that by however many orders of magnitude it would take to overcome heat dispersion from across a room at the diameter of his eyes and you have an idea of how much breast milk he would need to drink.

Also I've read that a major limitation holding back military lasers is that scattering and heat dispersion get way worse in even mild weather conditions- so him shooting down a plane in the middle of a storm is extra absurd.

Hopefully now I've annoyed an actual physicist into giving us the real answer.

AlternateAccount
Apr 25, 2005
FYGM

He could be getting an IV of pure butter and it wouldn’t be enough.

It’s like when Tony Stark claimed whatever number of gigajoules out of his arc reactor, which is impossible even with perfect conversion of matter to energy, and that was his cave/box of scraps reactor.

El Padrino
Dec 24, 2005

No es nada personal, solo negocios.

Phenotype posted:

Even if he actually was the friendly All-American hero he's impersonating, there'd still be The Implication, because he can do anything he wants and no one can stop him.

If I recall correctly in the comics Homelander at the beginning was the friendly All-American Hero and probably would've stayed that way cause he recognized that Vought was a gravy train and had no reason to stirr poo poo cause he had it good. This all changed due to Black Noir playing mind games with HL just so he could get the kill order he'd been told all his life was his entire reason for existing. I wonder if they switched out Homelander and Black Noir's personalities and that's why he's like he is in the Amazon series

Tip
Mar 21, 2006

Your move, creep.



AlternateAccount posted:

He could be getting an IV of pure butter and it wouldn’t be enough.

It’s like when Tony Stark claimed whatever number of gigajoules out of his arc reactor, which is impossible even with perfect conversion of matter to energy, and that was his cave/box of scraps reactor.

The arc reactor opens a portal to an alternate dimension of pure energy.

I don't know anything about comic books.

Gynovore
Jun 17, 2009

Forget your RoboCoX or your StickyCoX or your EvilCoX, MY CoX has Blinking Bewbs!

WHY IS THIS GAME DEAD?!

Tip posted:

The arc reactor opens a portal to an alternate dimension of pure energy.

I don't know anything about comic books.

Generally Marvel doesn't even try to align with real science. I still remember during Iron Man II, when Stark triumphantly announced he had invented a new element. Uhhhh yeah.

Stupid_Sexy_Flander
Mar 14, 2007

Is a man not entitled to the haw of his maw?


Grimey Drawer

It's right next to the dimensions of red punch laser force, and replacement blood and meat.

Grizzled Patriarch
Mar 27, 2014

These dentures won't stop me from tearing out jugulars in Thunderdome.




Rando posted:

The 9/11 analog in the comics is that the plane Homelander abandons goes on to destroy the brooklyn bridge.

Which is bizarre because Ennis mostly uses this as an excuse to make really unsubtle comparisons to the twin towers - complete with panels that zoom in on them - while being Islamophobic.

Sarcastro
Dec 28, 2000
Elite member of the Grammar Nazi Squad that

Avasculous posted:

Also I've read that a major limitation holding back military lasers is that scattering and heat dispersion get way worse in even mild weather conditions- so him shooting down a plane in the middle of a storm is extra absurd.

Hopefully now I've annoyed an actual physicist into giving us the real answer.

I'm not an actual physicist, but from what I've read on the subject that problem is more of an issue over significant distances, and Homelander was pretty close to the plane, so that's easily hand-wavable. The energy generation thing is way more relevant.

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Zazz Razzamatazz
Apr 19, 2016

No hunks allowed, ya dangus

boo_radley posted:

"Why does Ashley simply not report Homelander to Human Resources? Surely Vought has a process for this!"

Well I was thinking something more along the lines of "I need to quit to pursue my love of bluegrass banjo music" (or something else I don't care what) and then running like gently caress. "My grandma on the other side of the country needs me to take care of her" Something.

I would run like gently caress, personally.

I also love the Homelander- Dennis Reynolds mashups.

Edit-

seaborgium posted:

He did straight up say to her that she's back after being fired to do whatever the gently caress he told her too. She's there because she doesn't want to die, that's pretty much it.

She's kind of a lovely corporate PR person, but after HL brought her back she's pretty much stuck with doing what he says or he brutally murders her.

Yeah, ok I can buy that.

Zazz Razzamatazz fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Sep 17, 2020

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