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Vote to threadban Bioshuffle This poll is closed. |
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| Yes (Goku) |
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146 | 85.38% |
| No (also Goku) |
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25 | 14.62% |
| Total: | 171 votes | ||
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glad ryan is seemingly getting focused on this upcoming season
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Aug 2, 2022 12:58
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| # ? Apr 19, 2024 01:31 |
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ANOTHER SCORCHER posted:Black man loves both Obama and Huey P. Newton is as racist as Ennis' original take on MM. I wonder if anyone has ever held on to the vestiges of more radical politics from their youth while transforming into a moderate liberal later in life. Going to take a time machine to the 1960's to see. Agree with whoever said that a real in-universe Obama would have been constantly palling around with superheroes like he did with celebrities though.
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Aug 2, 2022 14:37
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MM isn't a moderate liberal, he's involved in an international vigilante conspiracy to assassinate white supremacist war criminals. (They currently have much less support from the US deep state than they did in the comic.) Whether he has random crank liberal opinions is neither here nor there.
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Aug 2, 2022 15:32
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Buncha people still just like Obama. I don’t think it’s hard to wrap one’s head around.
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Aug 2, 2022 17:54
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Dr Christmas posted:Buncha people still just like Obama. I don’t think it’s hard to wrap one’s head around. Obama is probably one of the top 5 best US Presidents, but i mean, that's more of condemnation of the entire rogues gallery than a endorsement of him. Though there is something to be said about the election of a Black Man as president in itself. Heliotrope posted:Why not? He's the head of pretty much the most powerful company on Earth. The fact that Homelander is still beholden to capitalism despite his powers fits the show. You're probably right, but I still think there is some ace in the hole he has. Mallory knows Victoria/Nadia is a supe right? There's no way the Boys didn't tell her that.
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Aug 2, 2022 19:13
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Regardless of how you evaluate the two figures, the ideals of Newton and Obama are completely incompatible, one encompassing violent revolution and the other incremental progress. However, people and movements don't necessarily follow logical conclusions. It would be very easy to idolize them both as attempts to better the lives of Black Americans without ever exploring the contradiction. Personally, I find inconsistencies like that to be very humanizing. Posters are complaining that it was irrational for MM to go after Soldier Boy when his gas grenade failed, but I found his lapse in logic to be revealing. His own sense of self preservation is trumped by the pure hatred for soldier boy, and that makes a lot of sense to me. There's no way you're going to dedicate your life to killing Homelander unless your priorities are completely scrambled from the norm.
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Aug 2, 2022 19:33
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PostNouveau posted:Stormfront was arguably a worse threat because she was a Nazi, whereas Homelander wants to build fascism to glorify himself instead of enact eugenics. I hear similar arguments pretty often, and don't see the relevant distinction. Homelander is a supremacist. He's not specifically, uniquely committed to the goals of the Nazi party, but I interpreted his fake apology tour this season (and his eventual break from it on live television) as a rejection of that difference. "But I *am* actually better!" The reason he was so compatible with Stormfront to begin with is that he mostly agreed with her. Like, divorced from the "Nazi" label, the fascistic and supremacist worldview she held sounded pretty good to him. He does think supes are rightfully top of the pile, should have all the societal power. And not even all supes: look at how he treats A-Train, or how he treated Blindspot, or his condescension towards Silver Kincaid. There's plainly an ethnic and gender component to his biases, with obvious out-groups that he resents and wishes he could kill without consequence. Which he eventually does. I'm only harping on this because of the obvious parallels to Trumpian Q politics, but just because the form of his racist fascism feels less organized doesn't make the agenda behind it all that different from literal Nazis. The belief that society is full of inferior mud people, and that true patriots should humiliate and reject them, is simply not different. The idea that policy should enshrine and realize that worldview is an inevitable outcome of enough powerful people thinking that way. So, distinguishing it from "actual" Nazism mostly serves the supremacist agenda by making it look more reasonable or moderate when it isn't.
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Aug 2, 2022 20:57
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Xealot posted:And not even all supes: look at how he treats A-Train, or how he treated Blindspot, or his condescension towards Silver Kincaid. There's plainly an ethnic and gender component to his biases Not really. The supe he seems to like the most is Black Noir, who he knew was black since he can see through the mask. Homelander is biased in favor of power. A-Train, Blindspot, and Silver Kincaid are all weak in some respect (A-Train was a V junkie who can't use his super power, Blindspot is still blind even if his other senses are heightened, and Silver Kincaid would be deeply unpopular with at least half the country).
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Aug 3, 2022 00:37
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I don't mean to be this flippant, but "Homelander has a Black friend" and "but the minorities he treats like poo poo actually are weak or deficient" isn't the refutation of my point you might assume it is.
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Aug 3, 2022 01:23
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Also Homelander liked Black Noir because Black Noir did what he and the company wanted, and when he found out that Black Noir kept a secret from him he killed him for it.
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Aug 3, 2022 01:24
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He's not racist he liked that one black dude that couldn't speak back to him and did what he was ordered.
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Aug 3, 2022 02:30
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I think the reason he likes Black Noir so much was he was the only hero on the 7 that would not be trying to steal the spotlight.
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Aug 3, 2022 03:13
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TyrantWD posted:Not really. The supe he seems to like the most is Black Noir, who he knew was black since he can see through the mask. He bought the Mexican-descended guy tacos for his intro lunch, talked to him in Spanish even though the guy didn't speak it, and then killed him. Definitely no racial animus there!!
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Aug 3, 2022 04:08
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socialsecurity posted:He's not racist he liked that one black dude that couldn't speak back to him and did what he was ordered. He kind of reminds me of Deadwood's george hearst in that respect. "I ought solely have to do with ****** and whites who obey me like dogs." He's a bigot with megalomania and an inability to connect with people. The racism is there on the surface, but on a deeper level it's anyone he perceives as weaker than him. It just so happens that that is almost everyone.
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Aug 3, 2022 05:48
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IIRC from the little spinoff series I think Noir was also the one who taught him to get away with poo poo using PR. Idk, I think Homelander just genuinely liked Noir.
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Aug 3, 2022 07:49
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Black Noir would literally just stand there while Homelander projected his views on him and got self validated. That's why he "liked" him.
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Aug 3, 2022 07:56
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christmas boots posted:IIRC from the little spinoff series I think Noir was also the one who taught him to get away with poo poo using PR. He did seem genuinely broken up when he thought Noir abandoned him. SirPablo posted:Black Noir would literally just stand there while Homelander projected his views on him and got self validated. That's why he "liked" him. Well Homelander mentioned he could and did peak under the mask, to see Noir's reactions. So yea he did like him.
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Aug 3, 2022 08:04
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Homelander is a living embodiment of American jingoism, so of course he's incredibly racist while dismissing race sciecne rhetoric as too weird. He agrees with Stormfront; he just doesn't like the word Nazi. That's all. I was a little puzzled by the way he randomly bullies his teammates, but this season made it clear. He was hoping he'd find a family in The Seven, but they're all hosed up like him.
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Aug 3, 2022 14:47
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What the show does get right is that Homelander isn't fascist and racist in a 1930s Racial Darwinian way - instead, he's a Supremacist Solipsist like every American. He believes that he is the only person who exists with any meaning at all, plus maybe his children. This is much more accurate to how Americans view themselves, and even calling it fascist is sort of historically inexpert. It is a new thing created by Protestantism and the experience of frontier individualism. The most obvious example of this is Trump, for whom everything and everyone: America, the Republican Party, and his own tribalistic followers are simply vehicles for his own self-aggrandizement. But you can see the same phenomenon at play with Obama, whose greatest ambition was to stop worker strikes while releasing a spotify playlist and book recommendations every year as the country burns. Neuman is a weird AOC-expy, as she doesn't really seem like her beyond being young and pretty. A better AOC stand-in would be performatively weepy for Instagram likes while exploding heads.
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Aug 3, 2022 16:13
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His reaction when Stormfront would go on about him being aryan perfection communicated it pretty succinctly. No, but also yes close enough.
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Aug 3, 2022 17:22
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“homelander isn’t racist! homelander isn’t racist!” i continue to insist as his literal 1930’s nazi girlfriend looks at the camera and says people love her ideas, they just don’t like the word nazi
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Aug 3, 2022 17:37
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Hey, leave him alone. He couldn't even get a decent handy from his girlfriend on his birthday, and then she died. He's had a rough time.
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Aug 3, 2022 22:56
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No Wave posted:His reaction when Stormfront would go on about him being aryan perfection communicated it pretty succinctly. No, but also yes close enough. He looked like a dude embarrassed about his girlfriend’s weird ideas, but not put off by them.
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Aug 3, 2022 23:54
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I think it might be more accurate to say that Stormfront is like Homelander more than the other way around. The core of what Stormfront and Homelander are the same, but Stormfront (and Nazism) does have some extra poo poo as part of the package that Homelander ends up being turned off/weirded out by. But it's still the same foundation, the same bigotry, the same fundamental worldview at the heart of both of them. Like idk if the example works perfectly but you could think of it as maybe your garden variety racist getting annoyed with a KKK member they otherwise agree with and telling him to knock it off with that dumb grand wizard poo poo
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Aug 4, 2022 00:16
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it’s not that the nazis were entirely wrong, it’s that they were losers and are thus cringe Homelander likes the countries that win world wars
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Aug 4, 2022 00:22
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Wheeee posted:it’s not that the nazis were entirely wrong, it’s that they were losers and are thus cringe 
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Aug 4, 2022 01:02
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Above all else, losing is the greatest sin to Homelander. Stormfronts delusion about an army of Ubermensch conquering the globe is offensive to him because: 1. Homelander runs the world already. 2. It ain't going to happen. It's loser talk. The fact that their visions are so similar and she failed suggests that his will fail too.
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Aug 4, 2022 01:07
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We just had this convo 10 pr 20 pages ago and came to a kind of agreement along with tons of references and diagrams.
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Aug 4, 2022 01:44
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Heliotrope posted:Why not? He's the head of pretty much the most powerful company on Earth. The fact that Homelander is still beholden to capitalism despite his powers fits the show. Edgars is kind of a stand-in for a lot of James Stillwell's character from the comics, and he pretty much literally said this in the comic: "I'm an expression of the corporation. I'm the voice that says--You're right, sue us. That never gets upset." Edgars IS capitalism and the corporation, that completely dispassionate entity that only looks to what benefits itself and its profits. Homelander is just another product to be recalled the second he stops making money for Vought. If Vought has a setback because of Homelander, why, they'll just figure out the next product release and smooth it over. The corporation plays the long game because they know that, most of the time, they'll ultimately survive and win, and why reveal your hand by losing your temper? Besides, as Edgars said, throwing an entitled tantrum "is a white man's luxury." RocketMermaid fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Aug 4, 2022 |
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Aug 4, 2022 02:33
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Wheeee posted:“homelander isn’t racist! homelander isn’t racist!” i continue to insist as his literal 1930’s nazi girlfriend looks at the camera and says people love her ideas, they just don’t like the word nazi Hmmmmmmmmm. Dumb as poo poo post. Missing the point it seems.
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Aug 4, 2022 06:02
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Homelander doesn't have a coherent worldview. He's a psychotic narcissist who can't spend 15 minutes alone without having a breakdown and talking to his reflection. Stormfront used to be human, had a normal childhood, and got superpowers around the same time she got indoctrinated with Nazi ideology. She's insightful enough to market fascism to the public by wrapping it in liberal feminism (which is totally in line with Vought's goals and a strategy munitions companies are using right now). She knows how to "act normal," which is utterly beyond Homelander, who has no concept of normal life beyond a set of props for photo ops.
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Aug 4, 2022 15:20
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https://twitter.com/PrimeVideoCA/status/1555191920011481091
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Aug 4, 2022 20:09
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I just got through binging the series. I like how Homelander watches Taxi Driver in season 2, foreshadowing how in season 3 the writers will also chicken out after the violent climax and spend the last few minutes undoing everything.
Nameless Pete fucked around with this message at 10:58 on Aug 5, 2022 |
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Aug 5, 2022 10:50
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https://twitter.com/VoughtIntl/status/1555599765466804226
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Aug 5, 2022 19:27
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Lotta scripted Vought stuff getting canceled.
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Aug 5, 2022 19:47
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Please tell me the host of Property Flippers has flippers
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Aug 5, 2022 19:57
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I would like to watch rising tide.
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Aug 5, 2022 20:00
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You love to see it https://twitter.com/HomelanderDride/status/1555601094377721857?s=20&t=xHHfCfIIfx_uh_7TgCKF8w
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Aug 5, 2022 20:06
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Nuts and Gum posted:I would like to watch rising tide.
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Aug 7, 2022 05:30
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| # ? Apr 19, 2024 01:31 |
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Nuts and Gum posted:I would like to watch rising tide. 
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Aug 7, 2022 06:28
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