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Vote to threadban Bioshuffle
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How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

Boinks posted:

Neither of those things are extreme, try again.

What the gently caress is this supposed to mean?

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How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas
Haley Joel Osmont is really funny in the otherwise sort of forgettable The Spoils of Babylon.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

BIG HEADLINE posted:

Or intersexed because WHY NOT?

Being an intersex person isn't on par with being a nazi. This is a weird thing to say.

Edit: Revised terminology

How Wonderful! fucked around with this message at 04:47 on Sep 8, 2020

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

Zaphod42 posted:

FYI that's an outdated term and not medically or scientifically used or accurate, and potentially harmful. Say "intersex" next time (or don't say anything).

I'm surprised and embarrassed that I somehow didn't know this, I apologize for the terminology gently caress-up and thank you for mentioning it. I'm more used to seeing intersex these days anyway so I don't know what was going on in my head.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas
I think Aya Cash is really good and has a ton of screen presence so I'm ok watching her get a bunch of screentime as somebody odious. If you haven't seen it and want to see her not be a nazi, check out You're the Worst which is like a once in a lifetime incredible performance.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas
Maybe a silly question, but is there some kind of site that indexes peoples' outfits on shows? I loved the tech woman's bug shirt and I would wear it.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

ZZZorcerer posted:

"I love him squirm and throwing tantrums as Stormfront puts him in his place" is the cherry on top (of the turd)

Is doom patrol still running? I injoyed a few eps but stopped watching for no reason

The second season just wrapped up a few weeks ago, it was really good!

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

Elephant Ambush posted:

This happens sometimes. I remember my wife and I waiting desperately for Good Omens to go live and it ended up being available several hours early. Do they use midnight GMT or something?


OK so I read most of this thread but not all of it and here I am just finishing S2E4 and here are random thoughts. This will be long deal with it.

First of all I agree with everyone about all the amazing performances in this show. The casting and acting is just awesome. I also love the direction and cinematography. Most importantly, as others have said, this show is REALLY uncomfortable to watch most of the time. The gore doesn't bother me but there's always this dread that anyone can just suddenly die any second and they do it just often enough that it keeps me on edge whenever I'm watching. I've never watched a show that made me feel that way before. Mad props to the showrunners for pulling this off.

I also love all the little details they put in the background and in the costumes and sets. Some of this stuff I noticed myself and other bits I picked up itt. I really should go back and watch everything all over again to see what else I may have missed. The people making this show really give a poo poo about the quality of all the minutiae and I love it.

I was really hoping that Ryan wouldn't have the same super powers HL has. I know we saw glowing eyes at the end of S1 but it was really stupid for HL to assume that Ryan was literally a clone and had all the same powers. Maybe he has laser eyes but that's all? I was kind of hoping that they would somehow show the extent of Ryan's powers and he'd be way less powerful than HL thought and HL would get disappointed and disown Ryan or something.

I'm glad Becca called out Butcher for his blanket anti-supe bullshit and while it's sad, it's also showing how hosed up Butcher is that he wants his wife to give up her kid and share the same supe hate that he does. Now he has literally nothing left and he's either going to go in even harder on HL or he's going to find a way to try to kill Ryan and make it look like an accident so Becca will take him back. I also find it interesting that in the same episode where Butcher loses the only thing he clings to for comfort, so does HL. HL goes total narcissist and now everyone including Edgar should be scared shitless because now nobody holds and sway over him at all. If HL is being totally honest then there is nothing that anyone can give him that he can't give himself. He is absolutely going to start killing a ton of people including Vought executives and not care at all because he doesn't want the money and status and fame anymore.

I thought it was kinda lovely that the reason HL didn't kill Butcher is because of Becca threatening to kill herself in front of Ryan and tell him it was HL's fault. I really like the idea of HL being a sadist who wants to emotionally torture Butcher much better. I mean it's cool character building for Becca and I appreciate that but I prefer she didn't have to do that.

I still don't understand Starlight and Hughie. They have never sat down and explained anything to each other. Hughie lied to and used Starlight more than once, almost getting her killed, Butcher also shoots her in the chest with a .50cal and Hughie runs off with Butcher instead of staying with Starlight and trying to help her? And she still somehow forgives him? None of that makes any sense.

Speaking of bad communication, The Boys seem to never talk to each other. Ever. I can't count how many times I've yelled at my screen "Hey maybe you should have had a conversation about this already!" Then Butcher shows up out of nowhere and declares everyone follow whatever harebrained bullshit scheme he has and nobody ever refuses to go anywhere until Butcher explains himself. They've all been hosed over so many times that none of them should ever trust him until he comes clean with all the details first. They are all stupid as gently caress to continue to follow him. Their revenge isn't worth suffering through his abuse and guessing games.

I also don't understand anything between A-Train and Starlight. A-Train absolutely could have killed her at any point if he wanted to and I can't see what Starlight could have done about it. Her threats about "I'll bring you down with me" shouldn't have resonated with him at all and if anyone can explain it to me I'd love to be set straight.

I don't understand what was going on with Kimiko and Kenji either. Until she finds him, he's apparently all she thinks about and he's the only thing she has left and he means the world to her. Then after he declares that he wants to fight back against the 7 and America in general I have no idea why she would want to try to keep him from doing that or at least leaving The Boys to go with him and try to work on convincing him to change his mind. Frenchie was nice to her and all but she should be loyal to her brother first and foremost. It's not like him fighting imperialist fascists is something she should be against. Maybe she just wanted to stop fighting in general and just go home to hang out but at this point there really isn't any going back and it's weird that she chose to basically betray the person she cares about the most and turn him into the CIA where he will absolutely be tortured.

I'm with everyone who's already over The Deep being just a joke segment every episode. If he's going to get a redemption arc let's get it going. It doesn't have to be a fast one and I'm cool with it being 2 steps forward 1 step back all over the place but the Scientology angle is really lovely and I loathe the cult leader woman and I hate that the Deep isn't just telling them all to gently caress off. If he's not going to get a redemption arc then I'd prefer that he just go full-on eco-terrorist and have the 7 kill him than continue with what they're doing. I don't even find any of it funny. It's just sad and pathetic. The only time I laughed at any of his Ohio exile nonsense is when he was pushing the grocery cart and all it had in there were Doritos and kids cereals and soda and other junk food. That was hilarious.

This is going to be super nerdy but it really bothers me that we haven't seen more supes fighting each other and that we haven't really seen what anyone is truly capable of with their powers. I know the writers probably want to reveal this stuff slowly but I really want to know who can beat who or at least have a guess. Especially Maeve vs. Homelander. She's afraid of him but she's also one of the only people to stand up to him. I'm not sure she could take him down one on one but I want to know how much help she might need to do it. I really think HL can't truly be killed by conventional means so they'll have to find a way to subdue and imprison him somehow although I have no idea how you'd do that and it would probably involve a ton of trial and error and costs dozens of supe lives.

With Stormfront I really hope they explain what happened in the last 50 years because that's a huge history gap between being Liberty and being Stormfront and there is no way that Vought doesn't know about all that. I see why they hired her from a capitalistic perspective but not from the obviously hilariously racist angle.

It's weird to me that nobody on the show has mentioned a Homelander failsafe yet. Clearly the showrunners read the comics and even if the Black Noir angle isn't the way they want to go they have to have written down something because there is no way Vought didn't think of that. There's no way. I know you can't reveal something like that too soon because it takes away from the terror HL strikes in people but I really hope it's not something that Vought is only just now thinking of. From an ultra-greedy capitalist perspective there is no way they would leave that huge risk open.


My one stupid fan theory: Butcher will find out that he's a supe, but a low power one. His super power will be Silver Tongue or something like it. Not mind control but an amplified ability to persuade people by talking. Not only would that completely ruin him as a supe-hater but it would also explain how all of his awful speeches actually convince anyone to listen to him. I thought the Spice Girls speech was funny just like everyone else but if I were Frenchie or MM I would've just walked away because are you loving kidding me. I would love it if it turns out that people didn't follow him because they shared a common goal but because he can just convince people to do so by talking to them for long enough.


Nitpicky poo poo but gently caress it I hate stuff like this:

There is literally no way The Deep got from Ohio to NY in the span of like an hour or two, even if he found the fastest sea creatures to take him through the Great Lakes as fast as possible. I know there are things in this show where you're not supposed to ask questions but that was just dumb. They could've done better.

How the hell did HL hear Becca's conversation with the medical facility doctor? I tried to think of anything plausible given his super senses and whatever but there's just no way unless he somehow had everything everywhere bugged, including Becca herself. Dumb.

The 7 having tracking chips in them has been in my mind since they first mentioned it in S1 and they only ever talk about it or care about it in cherry picked situations. It's not consistent at all and there have been a bunch of times when Vought could have gone to get someone or called them or sent someone to check on them. If there's a way to jam the signal that's fine but nobody ever mentions it. That really annoying to me. It's also completely ridiculous that certain people are shown explicitly using burner phones to dodge tracking and yet apparently the 7 have personal phones that aren't tapped/bugged by Vought? There is no way in hell they would allow that.

The security in this compound where Becca and Ryan live really sucks. Butcher climbed over the wall, a security camera saw him, and yet he was able to go to Becca's house, break into her car (with another camera right nearby) and sit there and wait for her, and nothing happened. No guards came. Nobody did anything. I know they needed to have Butcher and Becca reunite briefly but they could have done that with a little more Solid Snake Butcher and less of him just being magical Butcher and doing whatever with nobody noticing.

There is no way Butcher managed to sneak a .50cal rifle into a public park to shoot Starlight, even under that big coat. Just lmfao at that stupid poo poo and there's no way they got away from that clean either but oh well.


All that said, this show is great and I love it flaws and all. I'll be watching it until the end or until it jumps the shark.

Oh and Take 5 is the best candy bar.

SIr, this is a Tony Cicero's

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

PostNouveau posted:

*scribbles 20 paragraphs of nitpicks on the back of a child's menu before I forget them*

No, please stick around for endless pasta!

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

Bust Rodd posted:

Homelander’s performance on the talk show where he throws Maeve under the bus while highlighting that her GF is Latino is one of the more legitimately funny moments in the show, because of Starr’s delivery, while also being completely disgusting and hosed up in a strictly social way. He doesn’t murder anyone or say anything... wrong but it just makes your skin crawl when you realize what he is doing.

That scene was excruciating, my wife was making horrified sounds that I only ever heard from her before during the DIY dentistry episode of The Americans. And that "Well, actually, Black Noir doesn't identify as any race" line. This show is so good at swinging from funny to gruesome.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas
It's oat milk, he's just really pleased with himself about his vegan choices and the vegan choices in other peoples' refrigerators.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas
Stormfront is still probably obfuscating or fabricating stuff when she talked about her Halloween costume because before the 50s there were just not that many Disney princesses for people to dress up as, and Pippi Longstocking would not have been a laughable or weird costume. I guess there's a lot of wiggle room right now for when her "real childhood" took place, though, so maybe I'm being too literal.

I will say I think the Pippi Longstocking stuff is interesting because I actually also really liked those books as a kid-- I'm a few years younger than Aya Cash IRL but close enough that I totally bought that she might have grown up with the cartoon adaptation (which iirc aired pretty regularly on the... Disney Channel I want to say?) and the books front and center in the kids' section of the library. I'm curious to see how the season plays out because the character does have a bunch of overlap with her hero-- super-strong, a "speak truth to power" persona, and perhaps revealingly Pippi Longstocking also has that Peter Pan "I refuse to ever grow up" thing going on.


Come on, don't be an rear end in a top hat. It's no fun to have everybody telling you you're wrong, I get that, but don't be a dick.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

Paracaidas posted:

The Pippa bit is a fantastic show of cultural literacy and something that gives me confidence writing the character with more depth than just Nordic Rune Barbie. Also I'm consistently impressed with Colby Minifie's ability to play someone barely suppressing the realization that her impostor syndrome is justified.

I have a lot of sympathy for Ashley because I used to have the same haircut as her and I know how hard a cross it is to bear.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas
I don't think those are plot holes necessarily when one of the major themes of this show is how incompetent and unstable the people in power are. It's no wonder they'd kind of botch the finer points of their missions and let people escape or get away or whatever. Everything you mentioned is an example of someone acting impulsively, carelessly, or from strong, overwhelming emotion. It's like saying my life had a plot hole because I had a panic attack or got bored and daydreamed in the middle of the work-day instead of calmly completing my tasks.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

text editor posted:

I'd imagine wealthy people of the world would be willing to pay at least $100 to avoid death. He could probably make thousands of dollars off that.

That seems like a very fair price to me!

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

Breakfast Burrito posted:

presuming he means trans women, being attracted to them is not evidence of him being bi, that would still make him straight.

it's a small thing but that joke really really annoyed me, i am thoroughly enjoying this show but it is extremely poo poo in TYOOL 2020 to still be used as a punchline for a joke

Yeah, it really took me out of it. Ennis is consistently grimy about trans characters and I was hoping that the show would do better.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

Breakfast Burrito posted:

well i am bi and trans, and i'm telling you that this is terribly handled, and completely took me out of the episode. it is exactly the type of transphobic bullshit that's been on tv and film for years and years and i expect better in the year 2020.

like, i'm stoked that you're happy about bi representation because i am too, it's so rare, but as i said previously, the fact he wants trans strippers is not evidence of him being bi, trans women are women and the men attracted to us in a lot of cases are boring old straight guys (just like cis women), only they feel ashamed of it because of poo poo-house jokes like this. i have dealt with the real life implications of this, and it is awful and dangerous.

if the beginning and end of your transgender representation is as a punchline to a joke about trans women sex workers that carries the implication that attraction to us is ~exotic~ or makes you in any way not straight, it's transphobic as gently caress, and it's not any different to the media representation that's been happening for years and years that we are a) 'really' men pretending or b) exoticised freaks.

side note: the 'with or without nuts' line sucks - tons of trans women including sex workers don't have 'nuts'

This is basically what I was putting my thoughts together to say. "<x> is bi because they're attracted to trans people" is a garbage stereotype, and believe it or not reducing a trans person their genitals is not at all flattering. It's sideshow poo poo and by now writers should know better.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

Stupid_Sexy_Flander posted:

maybe look at it in the perspective that it was supposed to be 8 years ago, and people weren't as woke back then?

The scene wasn't written eight years ago, it was written, I guess, several months ago, by professional writers who, again, should know better. Do I believe that guys like the Boys would make that joke in real life? Sure, I know they would, because I've heard them all. That doesn't mean I want to hear them in a show I'm enjoying, especially from the mouths of characters that the show has gone to great lengths to successfully paint as likeable and relatively more "good" than many of the other characters, and who I genuinely want to like. Particularly when the exchange and the episode and the series in general seems to have no interest in trans lives outside of that goofy lazy punchline and casting a non-binary performer, Ess Hödlmoser, in what will hopefully be a recurring role (unless I'm forgetting other things).

Like, I don't want to attribute malice or anything to anyone who enjoyed the joke because I really truly don't think that's the case. I just think that it's one of those things that unless you're keeping an eye out for it you might not notice. I have the utmost respect for sex workers, but I'm tired of the vast majority of references to trans characters in TV and pop culture being about sexual novelties. Of course this has changed for the better tremendously in the past few years but rewatching, say, Arrested Development or The Venture Bros, two shows I like immensely, sucks because it reminds me of how small an allotment the popular imagination had for trans people and how small, for so many people, that allotment remains. Anyway, I'm explicitly whining and ranting at this point so I'll back off, I just wanted to articulate a bit about how what is, honestly, a not especially egregious scene fits within the context of a much larger and more pernicious pattern in the media.

To segue onto something more positive, I do remember that in the Highland Laddie mini-series in the comics, Ennis introduces Hughie's childhood best friend, a trans woman.. As you might imagine, Ennis does not handle this especially gracefully, but I've been curious to see what the show might be able to do with her. This one dumb little five second blip of dialogue aside I've enjoyed and been impressed by so many elements of this adaptation.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas
I agree, I think, and in my opinion one of the few really strong throughlines of the comic was that the real force behind all the monstrosity and carnage was just corporate incompetence, greediness, and selfishness. Comics Stilwell was a great character, and for all the shortcomings of the final arc and the series in general, I loved his final scene, in which he finally confronts the futility and error of what he's built his life into-- "bad product."

Nazis have an immense cultural gravity, and they succeeded in rooting their stupid tacky aesthetics and garish imagery into the popular consciousness as something bigger than it really was. Ennis' version of Vought, on the other hand, is never anything more than venality and corner-cutting. Every attempt it makes to dress itself or its products up in anything more is almost instantly deflated. It felt very honest and as crummy as I think the series is in many many ways I admire that element of it.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

scary ghost dog posted:

the show was better

Yeah it's really good.

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

radmonger posted:

Trace the history where that word and concept came from, and it will be the 1930s. And that’s not a good time period to be sourcing your ideas from.

I'm sorry, are you claiming that the concept of race was invented in the 1930s? What on earth?

Edit: I think I read your post ungenerously, if you're talking about "race" in the context of different kinds of fantasy people I apologize for jumping the gun.

How Wonderful! fucked around with this message at 04:36 on Oct 8, 2020

How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas
I'd argue that the concept of fantasy "races" draws heavily on 19th century pseudoscientific and esoteric sources like Theosophy, some of the cruder taxonomizing of American and British Spiritualists, things lifted from novels like The Coming Race, etc.. Especially the Theosophy. I liked Helen Young's Race and Popular Fantasy Literature: Habits of Whiteness for a broad overview.

As a matter of fact in a lot of scientific communities the 1930s saw a sharp if in some ways superficial reaction against "race science" compared to the first few decades of the century (see Julian Sorell Huxley's shockingly racist lecture tour of the US in 1924) if on a somewhat superficial level. This is certainly not to say that the 1930s were a period of astonishingly violent racism, just that academic anthropology and ethnology pumped the brakes a bit. Even then however you had texts like We Europeans which I would describe as an early example of "liberal" race science and Carelton Coon's The Races of Europe, very very dated books which, especially in light of the ways in which Coon expanded his arguments later in his career, look very starkly problematic. But still-- they were simply picking up the ball handed to them by their predecessors and running with it, just as the nazis scrounged up several decades of cast off junk science to cobble together.

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How Wonderful!
Jul 18, 2006


I only have excellent ideas

cosmin posted:

don't want to derail this thread but I'm cautious about going into the Comics subforum (is there one?)

Now that I kind of finished The Boys and I found a good source for comics, is there anything else I should check out to clean my eyes and my taste buds after all this ennis-ness? Adult oriented, stand-alone arcs, no golden age superheroes, already read Transmetropolitan, The Losers, 99 Bullets, Preacher(didn't finish it), TWD but I think I missed Miller's Batman, never read any Daredevil (there was a good arc I think?), Punisher (should I start Ennis' Punisher?) etc

BSS is very good and friendly and has a pretty active recommendations thread!

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