Play posted:

and as a partiots fan that rubs off on you right? just a breed apart i suppose\

mcmagic posted:

BTW it's very possible to get Mono without kissing anyone...

Raku posted:

I feel like the Bills are in the worst position possible because their defense and Josh Allen's dumb brutish feats of athleticism are just good enough to keep them from ever getting a real QB

NutShellBill posted:

What's the traditional historical outcome for season ticket holders to sue teams for tanking?

I feel like you could make a case against the Dolphins, pulling a bait and switch this season; long term gains notwithstanding.

It's not fair to point at injury, or strength of schedule, or just dumb luck. However, the timing of these moves in comparison to tickets sales stinks of greed and incompetence.

At the very least, the whole tank looks like somebody high up said: "Nope, gently caress it. Tank." But only after season ticket sales were near their highest possible numbers.

The reality of last season was that the Dolphins were a bubble playoff team trending down, but we have 2 games against the Jets and Bills every year, so... who knows? I thought we were a 7-9 team who could easily have been a 3-13 team last season. (Miami Miracle + that one Bears game come to mind as games we had no business winning.)

I feel like to keep a fan base you have to operate in good faith. Even if you don't think you can win, you have an obligation to field your best possible team. If you don't meet that obligation, people should vote with their wallets. As an organization, the Dolphins are approaching the bottom 10, if not bottom 5 in terms of incompetence.

Highlights since Marino:

One playoff appearance in the last decade. (Lost in the wild card) On the same note, only one winning record in that time period.

Have not won a playoff game since 2000.

Promoted a cancerous locker room with Richie Incognito being his special brand of insane meth driven KKK fuckhead.

Escaping being the second ever 0-16 team thanks to one of the worst games ever played in London. IIRC, we won 3-0 in a game that resembled a mosh pit and had something like 200 yards of total offense.

That's it. That's what they've accomplished since wasting the career to a top 5 all time QB. Which is what they were previously known for. Keep in mind, they play the Patriots twice a year, but once again, they also play the Bills and Jets. And the last 20 years has NOT been kind to those franchises.





I would be on board with a tank if the organization was a bit more honest about things. Or at least it planned out in advance? Let me show you what I mean:

Big Pre-season moves of note:


Dolphins decide it's time to move on from Tannehill. He's 30, often injured... the move made sense. I hated that we signed Cutler to that big deal, outbidding precisely zero teams for his "services"; but whatever. At least it's not Osweiller. (It could have been Kaep, you fucks. I would forgive everything right now, if you signed him, tomorrow.)

The Dolphins trade a 2nd and 5th in 2020 for Josh Rosen. They also acquire Fitzpatrick. This made sense, but only if you have illusions of contention. Play Fitzpatrick until week 4-6, and THEN have the fire sale, if there's no hope. Rosen can get experience under a no pressure environment. Or say gently caress it, and let Rosen play with a real team on day one. Emphasis: REAL team.

The Rosen trade makes sense at the time it was made, in that Rosen was a first rounder, thrown in an awful situation. The Dolphins were a better team than last year's Cardinals at the time; and competing with Fitzpatrick would be way more likely to generate starts for Rosen than competing with Kyler Murray. A 2nd and 5th for a 1st sounds roughly correct, maybe even a win for the Dolphins. And Fitzpatrick is definitely the right choice for a #1B. He's pretty consistently been in the 25th to 35th best QB in the league area of talent, and would push Rosen. It all makes sense. But only if you intend to invest in Rosen.

The rest of the offseason is weird.

Dolphins made a medium big deal about replacing Adam Gase. He wasn't great... but hey, clean slate. They hire Brian Flores, who is obviously now just a placeholder, and has already lost the season and locker room. I'm pretty sure this team would stink if Shula, Ditka, or any other big name coach was there. The idea with Flores seemed to be that he was a young coach who might grow into the role, if I'm being optimistic. In truth, we just chased another Belichick disciple, and hoped for the best.

Ok, so we nailed the QB situation, and hosed up the coaching situation. Here's the way to tell if they were really going to tank from day 1: What's Flores' contract look like?

Five years, guaranteed money.

Oh. Well, you'll want to be competitive this year so that free agents don't think this guy is an idiot that can't---

gently caress.

Flores was the only head coach hired this off season (of eight) who got guaranteed money.

But hey. Staff money doesn't count against the salary cap, right?

Let's take a look at the rest of the moves, before we pass a verdict:

Season starts first week of September. We prepared for it by trading Laremy Tunsil and Kenny Stills for high end picks a week prior to the season. We also got a tackle named Davenport (who appears to be a career backup, and is on IR), and a special teams player named Bademosi, who is 29 and doesn't factor into anyone's long term plans.

Tunsil wasn't a leader (maybe?), but seems really well liked, to the point where there was a small mutiny when he was traded. He's 25, and right on the cusp of being a pro-bowl left tackle. If you presume the tank is on, and the goal is Tua; Tunsil is the one unmovable player on the roster. He will be in his prime at 28, presumably when Tua is making a push for the team to be competitive. The reason he is unmovable is simply because whether the guy of the future is Rosen, or Tua, you want to keep him upright! If Tua is eating David Carr level of abuse, nothing else will matter. A left tackle would have helped, and if you supposedly planned this tank out, some of the salary cap you freed, could have been used on Tunsil.

Side note: If we're tanking for Tua, why did we trade considerable draft stock for Rosen to die on a 0-16 team? One of the top rated passers of the modern era is available, if you had the balls. You could have had him last season instead, as well. (I miss Kaep. Maybe it's best he's not in Miami.)

Kenny Stills is a good receiver. He's 27, and probably won't ever light the league on fire, but he's a starter for some teams, and a nice piece for others. He probably IS a piece you cut during a fire sale, and this season was probably his maximum value.

Vince Biegel for Kiko Alonso is a wash. Biegel is a special teams player, Alonso is a moderately dirty 29 year old linebacker with a big contract. Trade happens four days before the league opener. It's a smart move in terms of dumping contract, and Alonso is at best, a replacement level player, so... meh.

Other moves:

Traded seventh-round pick to Minnesota Vikings for guard Danny Isidora.
Traded undisclosed conditional draft pick to Indianapolis Colts for center/guard Evan Boehm.

Seems weird to trade picks in a rebuilding process...

And this gem:

Acquired a 2020 first-round pick, a 2020 fifth-round pick and a 2021 sixth-round pick from Pittsburgh in exchange for safety Minkah Fitzpatrick, a 2020 fourth-round pick and a 2021 seventh-round pick.

This essentially amounts to Minkah for a 1st rounder... and a probable small decrease in the chance of finding a role player in this season's draft.

Minkah is 22 years old, and only needed to be traded because we took a knee for the season in week 0. All signs point to him being a near pro bowl level starter for nearly a decade, and we gave that up for a 1st rounder. Yeah, the Steelers are bad, and it will be a high pick, but you HAD the sure thing.

So, the tank is on. They're doing a middling, panicked job of it because every player worth a drat wants out.

Worse, the team stands to be awful for at least, 2020, maybe far longer. So, you have to pay premium dollars to lure free agents, because they're going to be playing for this... team. You also have to pay premium dollars, because every player who signs here is going to wonder if you're going to Rosen them. Or just decide to tank again.

I'm supposed to look at the bright side, and there is some excitement in that we bought 12 scratch lottery tickers, one of which is a "sure thing" at a position we spend two draft picks upgrading this offseason.

2020 first round: Dolphins (probably 1st), Steelers (Top 6-15), Texans (20-32)
2020 second round: Dolphins, Saints
2020 third round: Dolphins, (And a possible compensatory pick for Ju'waun James)
2020 fourth round: None (Pick sent to Steelers)
2020 fifth round: Steelers, (And a possible compensatory pick for Cameron Wake)
2020 sixth and seventh rounds: Cowboys, Chiefs, Colts

Assume 50% success in acquiring meaningful players, and that's 6 roster spots. Pulling that stat from a website that states that of 223 first round picks over the last seven years, there a 53% success rate in pulling a player who is average, or better. Those number tumble dramatically as you proceed in the draft, but with a team this bad, even D+ players will make the roster next year. (Stats and "average" player level are subjective, but the point stands)

Now, here's the current depth chart:

QB: Rosen, Fitzpatrick
RB: Drake, Ballage, Scrubs
WR: Parker, Williams, Grant, Scrubs
TE: Gesicki, Scrubs
OL: Just 5 starters away from a good o-line!

DE: No one of note.
DT: Godchaux, Scrubs
LB: Raekwon Macmillan and a bunch of guys of questionable ability.
CB: Xavien Howard, Eric Rowe and not a lot else.
Safety: 31 yr old Reshad Jones, scrubs

We're rushing for 2.6 YPC, the offense is averaging 3.1 YPP, and we're near last in every category. I watched us block with 7 guys all week against Dallas, who were sending 4 rushers, with great success. We are not going to contend next year, even if we nail the draft 100% AND crush free agency.

So, back to the opening question, has a team ever been successfully sued for breaching expectations to compete?

Let's just say that NFL competition committee is actually investigating the Dolphins for this egregious tank. Nothing will come of that, because NFL.

The only people who can really hold the NFL and Dolphins accountable are paying customers. Maybe 8 empty stadiums for home games and a few thousand angry season ticket holders cancelling next year's tickets will teach them something; but somehow, I have my doubts. The one hope we do have, is the NFL noticing the attendance for ROAD games being abysmal, and maybe instituting a rule against this.

Please keep in mind that barring divine intervention, this is the second time in 12 seasons that we have flirted with 0-16. That is a nadir between the 0-16 Lions and 1-31 Browns that should merit investigation/punishment.

Apologies for the but I really wanted to articulate my frustration that a franchise THIS bad, feels that they can get away with this because of promises of a better tomorrow. A fan should never be forced to hope for the abject humiliation of their team, every week. I'd rather see a strike in 2021 than watch season 3 of "The Dolphin Process".

I kinda hope they DO accidentally win a few.

mcmagic posted:

I'm so loving tired of Jet teams that are just completely unprepared to play this loving team every single game and the game is over before it starts. They never even had close to a chance in this game before it even loving started.

mcmagic posted:

Hey, you loving lied about me and posts I made. You gonna acknowledge that or just act like it didn't happen?

Symphoric posted:

My wife didn't "request" a divorce, but she did say she would welcome marrying another dude. Clearly everything is fine though

mcmagic posted:

He doesn't need to keep his opinions to himself. THIS SPECIFIC OPINION is a bad opinion and he shouldn't have shared it. BTW it's pretty hilarious for a Patriots fan to say this. If a Patriot had done what Adams did today on Twitter he would probably be cut.

mcmagic posted:

He’s more nativist than racist...

Dubious posted:

Catfish Noodlin posted:

I don't think you look at it in terms of Tunsil/Fitzpatrick(who are essentially white elephants IMO), it's the incredible amount of low-end roster churning they did and the huge amount of snaps they gave to guys they just found laying around right before the game. They broke the record for the most players to get snaps for a team a couple of weeks ago, and I'm sure they've also eclipsed the record for the amount of snaps those players have gotten.They had a linebacker starting for them who wasn't actually on any sort of printed or official roster, who I had to google and find out they signed off of the Patriots practice squad 4 days before. That's loving wild.

Ehud posted:

I’m confused. How is it that we know that’s a Gase burner account?

pasaluki posted:

I know he's terrible but I appreciate Manish.
Sports journalism could use more schlock.