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Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Smith's guide to picking stuff up on the street:

SANDWICH - yes! (don't eat it and you can get a bunch of money or make a friend)
DAGGER - HESH NO (cornered by 3 50-health spree revvers. On day 2. what the hesh)

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Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry

ZepiaEltnamOberon posted:

Man, Negotiations are so fun.

Made a Powder Keg deck, drafted as few cards as possible, and then just repeatedly created and duplicated and destroyed Powder Kegs. Also had the Graft that heals you for your starting hand's cost (though it nearly killed me since it damages you for your starting hand's cost prior to its upgrade), so the blowback from destroying my Renown didn't hurt. Wanna try something similar but with Hot Air Balloons instead.

One of these days I'm going to have to stop playing with Mutators so I can unlock Prestige 2 but that's not today.

Just had a run like this. Powder Kegs with Turnabout are just kind of unfair. Yeah, I'll do 12 damage and put a 6 shield on everything. No, that's not a flourish, it's a 0-cost regular card. (Okay, Pale Turnabout is an upgraded regular card, but even so.)

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry

ilitarist posted:

Won Prestige 3 with Sal.

Usually when you think a deckbuilder game relies on luck too much it's a sign of you not getting the game. But I'm starting to think that in the case of Griftlands it's true, at least with Sal. It quickly becomes apparent that with Sal you don't have many ways to build your decks. Negotiations are either about diplomacy or hostility, and this choice is closely connected to your quest choices and specific negotiations. So I think the choice is good, but it's just 2 ways to go. And in case of combat, you have Combo and Bleed. Bleed just doesn't work on some types of enemies. It's a bigger problem in Brawl where the final boss can be immune to bleed, but in normal mode, you meet plenty of robots too, and the final boss can summon them. So really Combo is the way. There are many cards that suit both strategies or spice up them in some way (e.g. you can have some cards giving bonuses on Expend in Negotiations or Improvise in combat). But it still feels you're building the same deck. I've failed Prestige 3 several times, and it's not that harder than Prestige 2, but something just didn't work for me.

Another thing is Normal mode relies on you knowing the quests and characters. The game only tells you that this specific NPC will ruin your deck (e.g. you can rely heavily on items and some characters make it so that using items hurts you) if you made them hate you already. I think the game would have benefited from some transparency here. Attitude change is also strange sometimes, e.g. you attack someone and the game tells you they will dislike you, but after you win they start to hate you, like they get another dislike after you spare their lives.

I'll probably switch to other characters. Rook looks like a much more interesting character with a lot of variety and tactics. Sal's Combo and Bleed focus enforce specialization, but after 1 game as Rook I feel like he needs more diverse approach in combat, e.g. there's a place for Empty, Spend Charge, and Fully Charged effects in any deck.

The game does persist knowledge of boons and banes from run to run. The characters are a static cast and they'll always have the same rewards, and if you take it to the face once, you'll always know (by clicking on their portrait). You can also guess from the shape, though that's not as reliable. Buying combat items from Fssh is a good way to give Sal a leg up in her early combats, so if you get into a fight after talking all day she can get XP on her cards and get some battle draws.

It's a bit unconventional, but Sal's definitely also got discard as a combat mechanic, in addition to bleed and combo. Especially as compared to Rook and Smith, she gets a lot of cards that discard and have effects on discard. Her basic stabs upgrade to have a discard effect, that's how you can tell.

I definitely feel like I got some luck to break my way in the last run to clear prestige 2, but I put a lot out into the world. Was it lucky that two people who liked me were negotiation opponents on day 5? Yeah, but I had 15 people who liked me because I shared a lot of drinks in the evening. Was it lucky that I pulled the flex trick on Kashio by getting some temporary power boons and drawing a debuff remover in the opening hand, leaving me 4 power up permanently? Yeah, but I wasn't relying on it and I put some debuff shed on my defenses for that and other purposes.

I imagine Sal's prestige 3 isn't going to be a big bump from 2 since most days you can just heal up with Fssh for cheap.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Rook P2 down.

Pretty fun build, with a snails/discard negotiation deck - man, that thing really needs the Tyrant Coin to come online - and a mostly empty battle deck, with 2 extra chambers, some Lucky Shot and Cheap Shot, a +2 damage on empty cells graft, and a 2 random Wound on last charge graft. The end boss was up to 20 Wound by the time it finally went down.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry

ilitarist posted:

Agree. I admire the desire to make a mini-RPG that is also a hardcore every-click-counts deck builder, but the internal contradiction is clear. The game treats story mode as the main attraction and if you switch to Brawl you crawl a different ladder. Story mode has some interesting mechanics from time to time, I still get new events I haven't seen. In general it feels like you play a more complex game manipulating the outcomes of various quests and encounters. It also means that there are some clearly inferior paths and a lot depends on available encounters. Like in a final day if you go with Two-face you have to beat Admiralty guards before going to auction. I think they're random and sometimes they can be a deadly combo. Plus you not being able to take mercenaries on the last day makes party-focused abilities less attractive. Also you get access to additional vendors in a seemingly random manner: you can only visit many merchants if someone wants to give you a quest in their shop. Merchants are always there, you just can't visit them. Brawl seems to be less arbitrary in that regard, mercenaries are more available and you can often choose your fights.

Brawl also lacks some features - I understand you have no access to Mettle shop in Brawl and, say, can't upgrade Rook's guns. I've just said that Brawl is less arbitrary, but it has more possibilities and sometimes it means a wilder balance: I've talked about how Sal's bleed feels inferior to me because robotic/armored enemies just ignore it. At least in the story mode no major boss is robotic and you can make sure Kashio won't summon a robot. In Brawl you can get a robot final boss.

You can't rechamber Rook's pistols in Brawl, but the Mettle shop does show up nearer to the end of each day, for everybody. Brawl is a pretty different game, mostly because you can hire people to help you with the end bosses. It really changes Smith's end boss.

Pretty sure all the end bosses are constant in Brawl. Smith's end boss is built at least in part to screw Smith over, it'd be weird if they showed up in a different Brawl, but I've only played one apiece so far; maybe I just got lucky.

I do agree there's not a lot in Sal's story if you try and betray people, but Sal isn't much for skullduggery like Rook and she isn't as impulsive as Smith, so it kind of makes sense?

But I had kind of a different experience with Sal and Nadan on the final day. I went out to confront the Admiralty and it was a drinking buddy of mine, so I was able to talk her away by convincing her I was on the trail of the butcher of Murder Bay (somebody actually called him that!) and things were about to get messy.

Haven't played enough to say whether that always happens or if I just got lucky with making friends at the Grog 'n Dog.

Glazius fucked around with this message at 06:10 on Jul 15, 2021

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry

ilitarist posted:

Oh yeah, the final boss is the same, randomized daily bosses are the problem. And I don't think you can influence Kashio abilities the same way?..

As far as robosses go, it's just Bossbit and 999, right? There's a bunch more cybered up people but I don't think they count as metallic. I guess Jeol gets robo-help, but in his case even if you could bleed out the drones you'd be more likely to destabilize them.

You don't get to shut down two of Kashio's abilities of your choice in Brawl, but she does still show up with two of them shut down.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry

Captain Foo posted:

I haven't really played a Sal discard deck yet, any tips?

Just get cards that do discard, or trigger on discard? It's not really more complicated than that. Trigger on discard is a bit rarer, so grab those for preference.

Build a little bleed or combo to go alongside them, since your daggers will be leaning you that way.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Had some fun with Sal's daily today. Got the cosmic that gets you a new card when you expend. The mutators didn't discard hand at end of turn, and the cosmic really liked giving me that card that discards your whole hand for defense and counter per discard. Real hilarious when you're getting multi-attacked.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry

Tom Tucker posted:

This game is lowkey awesome. I'm just leveling up everyone and unlocking cards in the main missions. It honestly took me a while to balance the game since it's not immediately obvious at first that negotiation is a means towards better fights, not a mutually complementary system. Once I learned that and threw shills at removing starting cards (and passing on cards that didn't directly enhance my chosen theme) I found a groove and I can generally have a good shot on each run at the 2-4 "prestige" or whatever the ascendancy mode is called on this.

Starter cards can get a build going if they upgrade the right way. Or they can upgrade to Lucid (power + expend) or Clarity (more power + destroy) and get themselves out of the way. But yeah, if you can't get anything good out of them, might as well be rid of them.

But yeah, you can't just negotiate or just fight; I mean, perhaps theoretically you could just fight if you lucked into an extremely solid fight deck, but the damage would stack up pretty quick. It's always good to build a strong negotiation deck so you can pick and set up your fights, but you need a strong fight setup to actually win them. That can be buying grafts or combat cards (seriously, shell out for some combat cards from your bartender, they're good stuff) or choosing to fight you can win with minimal social consequences to get XP on your existing deck.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Honestly, the prerelease cinematics made it seem like the three grifters would meet up more than they do. I wonder if there's like an epilogue day or something in the works.

Smith brawl P2 down. The huge number of bosses in brawl makes some things unusually viable, like getting three boss combat grafts to have enough action overhead to run all three chain cards.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Negotiation is there to help you pick your fights and get advantages in them. Usually you can prop yourself up some in battles by buying advanced cards and grafts, but a little experience now and then can help enormously.

Also bartenders. Bartenders are good for propping you up in general, but the items you can buy from them like Brain Gills, Slurry, Tincture, and adrenaline are a help. Though Sal has a nice advantage there with Fssh, as compared to Rook's more professional relationship with the static bartender.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry

Captain Foo posted:

I haven’t played with mutators at all! That sounds kinda fun

Oh yeah, the daily challenges trot out mutators if you just want a taste of them. Some of them can be pretty fun, and there are cosmic relics for more spice. And if you don't like them, it's only about 15 minutes of gameplay.

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Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Eh, Sweet Moreef's got an iron core. He's your ticket to the party store and the people who set up Theroux. He's not prepared for the full extent of Smith, but neither are like 99% of the Pearlies and they're not gutless rubes.

The Admiralty is far from home and while the Pearl is getting a lot of Cult attention right now their real power base is up in Supplicant City. Smith's just a guy trying to pull the stalks of his better-off family members, for all that he's bought into this line about the world transforming from some reclusive bile-brokers.

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