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As someone who played this a lot as a young child with low standards, I find the differences between Dinosaur Planet and Star Fox Adventures fascinating. Almost everything I could say was either covered in the video or would be spoilers, so here's what I have left: Originally, you would use the key on the ship to open the cage on the deck. After removing the part where you open the cage, they left in you collecting the key so now you find the key to some random door instead? This is but the first of many things that made more sense in the original draft and end up being weird in the final product. Soundtrack's good though. David Wise did a great job with this game.
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Aug 12, 2019 01:59
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| # ¿ Apr 16, 2024 09:14 |
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A recap of what the dino-speak plot point has brought us: - The intro's voice acting was incomprehensible for no real benefit - Fox presumably didn't understand anything Krystal said about the staff - Fox getting mad at the queen and Slippy (in fairness, this scene's alright) - The shopkeeper and the WarpStone speak English instead of dino-speak for some reason - Fox gets mad at Tricky over "hot spring or you'd be frozen by now" Originally in Dinosaur Plant, dino-speak wasn't a thing. It was introduced at some point after the switch to Star Fox, and I have no idea why they did it because it adds very little while making certain scenes make less sense. Moving on to the combat: It's bad. I believe there's different combos you can do depending on what direction you hold the stick while attacking, but it doesn't make any difference which you use. The health bars are weird. They only display in quarter increments for some reason, leading to a lot of people believing that only the final hit of a combo deals damage (as you saw from the hitstun combo in the video, this isn't true). The blaster aiming is very awkward. The reticle is constantly trying to return to the default position instead of staying where you put it like in a better game (i.e. Zelda) I like the aesthetics of the bomb spore plants, they're dope volcano ferns. The gameplay is, well, it's also bad. Ignoring the inconvenience of getting spores with the whole scattering mechanic, you can only plant spores in predefined spots, unlike in a better game, where you could use them when you want and use them in combat. (On the other hand, I wouldn't trust the level designers not to add arbitrary unmarked destructible walls if you could use bombs anywhere) An "interesting" detail is that Tricky's model changes depending on how much he's been fed. You can see this around 26:30 in the video when he goes from 1 food to 5 food. Now you'll never not notice it whenever it happens. Let's end on a positive note: One thing this game does have over Zelda is the ability to move blocks sideways as well as forward and back, so you can move them diagonally without needing to reposition yourself constantly.
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Aug 17, 2019 03:10
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Doc M posted:Not being allowed to talk to NPCs at night and having to wait it out is... certainly a design decision. What in the gently caress were they thinking? Aside from "oh god we have to ship this poo poo in two weeks," I mean. This exact same problem appeared in Twilight Princess somehow, which is weird considering previous Zelda games figured out that having NPCs sensitive to time of day without giving the player the ability to change the time freely was a bad idea. In hindsight, the smarter solution probably would have been to not have a time-of-day mechanic at all. No sleeping mammoths and possibly more dev time to work on other aspects of the game.
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Aug 17, 2019 22:01
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If you had turned around on the high platform in the Dinosewer, there was a small switch to shoot that unlocks two fuel cells. The whole "planet splitting apart" plot point didn't exist in Dinosaur Planet, it was introduced entirely to justify Arwing sections, I'd imagine. The SpellStones just enabled Scales to drain energy from the planet or something. The guardians always existed, but instead of allowing passage to the planet chunks (which you couldn't reach before because ???) they were required to activate the SpellStones, which seems less convoluted. What is even the timeline in Adventures? For the planet chunks to leave the planet, Scales needs to have removed the SpellStones, but if he removed the SpellStones, why are they on the planet chunks and oh look I've gone cross-eyed Actually, I've just realized, what is even Scales' plan here? What does he gain from causing the planet he's trying to conquer to blow up? The plot changes between Dinosaur Planet and Adventures have made his entire plan completely nonsensical
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Aug 23, 2019 22:22
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EponymousMrYar posted:It's Megatron-style tyrannical rule. In a vacuum, I'd be mostly fine with his plan not making sense, it's the fact that an earlier revision of the plot had it make sense that gets me. The beta plot outline doesn't go into it too much but I imagine the idea originally would be "the planet is drained of magic energy and that's bad, but Scales won't live long enough to suffer the consequences of this". Standard Shinra/oil executive stuff. I just find the transition from Dinosaur Planet to Adventures fascinating. The gameplay was never going to be good, things like the sleeping mammoth and the decision to have currency run away from you would always have been there, but the plot would have been far more coherent (and the original lategame plot sounds far better and more interesting than what we actually got, though that'll have to wait until later).
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Aug 24, 2019 03:44
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Wait what this game is rated T in America? It was 3+ in Europe. "Animated Blood, Mild Violence" Weird, I don't remember any blood in this game.
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Aug 30, 2019 21:14
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C-Euro posted:God I forgot how often that "Item Get!" animation plays in this game. I knew it was a lot, but it's a loooooot. How/why the hell did I play through this game twice? It's actually the bat he killed earlier respawning because the animation and sound is very similar for some reason. Also because respawning bats was something that needed to be added.
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Sep 2, 2019 15:57
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Since you're not buying maps, you could switch the map display with the d-pad to display the names of nearby enemies. Now you can learn about the... Kalda Chom? The gargoyle things are called Bloops? What the hell are these names? You glossed over it because you were dunking on Tricky (always a good time), but the WarpStone on DINOSAUR Planet cannot warp dinosaurs. What does he even do when space foxes aren't around. This is why no one brings you gifts! "But how do I get mine in there?" - Fox McCloud, 2002
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Sep 13, 2019 23:44
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FlamingLiberal posted:The worldbuilding stuff is very inconsistent which I'm sure has a lot to do with the fact that this was not going to be a Star Fox game until the last minute Yeah, in this case the WarpStone was originally two SwapStones you used to switch characters between Krystal and Saber. Fun fact about the switch to Star Fox: There's unused text in the game for the cutscene where Fox first rescues Tricky on Ice Mountain where Fox calls himself a "Royal Knight of the Lylat System", presumably because of find/replacing "from the planet Animus" with "of the Lylat System". There's footage of the N64 version of this cutscene that backs up this theory. I don't think Dinosaur Planet was going to be a masterpiece of storytelling or anything, but it does make me sad to see it became this weird inconsistent mess. Imagine the timeline where it was released and had Beyond Good And Evil cult classic status (insert joke about BGAE 2 here). The gameplay was always going to be of this quality though, even in early videos the "find switch hidden on the ceiling" non-puzzle is used all over the place.
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Sep 14, 2019 07:31
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All the convoluted area transitions are there to mask loading times. Of course, they end up taking far longer to cross than a loading screen would take. The wall plants are called "Venus Foxtrap" because names are hard. With CloudRunner Fortress, there's finally Dinosaur Planet facts to share again. As said in the video, originally Krystal went through this area with Kyte, a young CloudRunner who served as her equivalent of Tricky (but less annoying). Scales killed the queen instead of putting her in a cage. The pachycephalosaurus in the prison was a SpellStone Guardian (most of these were converted to Gatekeepers in the transition to Adventures, they were dinosaurs with the ability to control SpellStone energy or something). Speaking of the pachycephalosaurus, his name is Gradabug and he is the only member of the BoneHead tribe in the game. No, seriously, that's the name they chose.
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Sep 20, 2019 21:20
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Dinosaur Planet Facts: Originally, the Ocean Force Point Temple was the Desert Force Point Temple. It was in a desert area that required help from a PointBack, probably a stegosaurus-like dinosaur. The LightFoot segment was originally a Krystal segment, so the CloudRunner was likely originally Kyte. The LightFoot segment also happened earlier in the game, before CloudRunner Fortress. I feel like the LightFoot segment marks the point where the game goes completely downhill. It wasn't great before, but from now on the game feels far more rushed to me.
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Sep 28, 2019 02:37
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Oh poo poo, I've been called out in a video. For what it's worth, while I know more about this game than anyone really should for a mediocre zelda clone, I looked up the enemy names on the wiki  There's actually 10 gold rings in all the arwing sections. Compare and contrast the wallet gates in this game and Wind Waker: Wind Waker lets you get the wallets early and doesn't require them until some ways in (though people who don't explore still get screwed and they changed it for the HD version). This game gives you the wallet and then immediately says "no progress until you grind out 30 more scarabs than your old cap". Technically 20 if you haggle, I guess. Has any game actually made haggling fun? Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland had haggling as a core mechanic, and even there it wasn't fun. Originally, the Walled City had not just the RedEyes, but also HookClaws, described as similar to SharpClaws, but more intelligent. The Queen Earthwalker won't let Tricky go to the Walled City, so Meanwhile, Krystal is busy doing an area completely cut from the final game. The original draft had 6 SpellStones and 8 Krazoa Spirits (still only two force point temples though). She visits the sacred dinosaur burial grounds of BlackWater Canyon. Kyte isn't allowed, so she takes a LightFoot guide. That's right, Rare planned to have four sidekicks originally. I imagine the other three all got cut after it turned out Tricky was difficult enough to program on his own. BlackWater Canyon contains the Tree of Souls (it's your standard video game cycle of souls tree) and is protected by the ShadowHunter tribe. These actually show up in Star Fox Adventures, as the raptors in the Test of Fear cutscene. The leader is cool and agrees to just give Krystal the SpellStone, but his lovely son disagrees and steals it and flees into the canyon. Krystal catches up to the ShadowHunter, but their disturbance angers the spirits and a giant skeleton monster traps the ShadowHunter in its cagelike ribs. Krystal defeats it, the ShadowHunter learns a valuable lesson, yadda yadda. Procrastine fucked around with this message at 02:54 on Nov 16, 2019 |
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Nov 16, 2019 02:48
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Dinosaur Planet facts! Dragon Rock and Drakor were far more plot-important originally, but before we get to that, more cut content! This is a long one, there's a LOT of cut plot stuff here. Dragon Rock is the resting place of the dinosaurs' god, the Kameria Dragon. Sabre visits Willow Grove, a sacred land near Dragon Rock that has been tainted by Scales. The plants and dinosaurs in the area have become mutants. They're not evil, just angry about being turned into mutants. (The dinosaurs at least. I don't think the plants are angry.) Before Sabre can enter Dragon Rock itself, he has to do a Krazoa test and deliver it to the usual place. I forget if I've covered this earlier, so I'm going to do it now: A) The spirits are delivered to Warlock Mountain, not Krazoa Palace, though prerelease footage shows that DP's Warlock Mountain is basically just SFA's Krazoa Palace outside of the name. B) The Krazoa spirits are the spirits of the Quan Ata Lachu, eight beings worshipped by the Krazoa themselves. After delivering the sixth spirit, the location of Krazoa Palace is revealed (no relation to SFA's Krazoa Palace outside of the name). Sabre is levitated by a strange force and the Quan Ata Lachu begin speaking to him. They reveal that there is a greater evil behind General Scales that must be stopped and also explain the concept of the Majestic Eight planets. These are the first eight planets created at the start of the universe, and Dinosaur Planet is one of them. To save the planet, Sabre/Krystal must go to the Krazoa themselves. The Krazoa fought a great war aeons ago that almost killed them all, but some still live. Krystal enters the giant head at Cape Claw (the ocean temple doesn't exist in this draft, remember) and finds a Translator Object, letting her and Sabre read ancient texts throughout the world containing hints on how to open the gates of Krazoa Palace. This part seems like it could be cool if done well, but I have my doubts it would be. Krystal enters the palace and finds a lone Krazoa. The rest of his race are in suspended animation and he was woken by the emergency system. He reveals the person behind Scales is a Dragon of Kameria, the archenemy of the Krazoa. The great war mentioned earlier was fought between the Krazoa and the Dragons, as the Krazoa worshipped the Quan Ata Lachu as the creators of the universe, while the Dragons considered themselves above the Quan Ata Lachu. The final battle of the war took place above a newly-born Dinosaur Planet. The Kamerian Dragon the dinosaurs worship is actually the last dragon warrior slain in the battle, whose body fell down to the planet below. An ancestor of this dragon, called Drakor (see, there he is!) is extracting the energy from the planet to kill the Krazoa. There was once a SpellStone in the palace, but it disappeared at some point. The large amounts of magic energy flowing through the palace have caused two tears in space-time to appear. Looks like Krystal has to go on a time-travel adventure! She first visits the future, where the palace is almost completely destroyed. All the time fuckery has placed it in a precarious limbo, poised on the edge of a black hole. The Krazoa from earlier is still here, though close to death. Drakor won and all the others have been killed. Drakor stole the SpellStone from the past, preventing our heroes from assembling the full set. Sabre fought Drakor on Warlock Mountain and died. Krystal asks what happened to her, but the Krazoa dies before he can answer. Krystal heads to the past next, just before the start of the great war. The Krazoa here are antagonistic to Krystal, so she must sneak through and steal the SpellStone before Drakor's spies. While there, Krystal discovers that the backstory the Krazoa told her was the sanitized version. The Krazoa were actually the ones who started the war, as they wanted the Dragons dead so the Quan Ata Lachu would only allow them to rule the universe. Krystal returns to the present with a dilemma. Should she help the Krazoa knowing the truth behind the war? If she doesn't, she risks keeping the future she saw earlier, where Sabre dies. The lone Krazoa in the palace says they were wrong in the past and that they have changed, but of course he would say that wouldn't he. Krystal chooses to believe him, and heads to the Desert Force Point Temple to shut it down with the last desert SpellStone. As she places the SpellStone, Scales shows up. He's too late to stop the temple shutting down, but he won't stop until Krystal is dead. The King EarthWalker and his soldiers try to enter the temple to help, but they're too late and Krystal must face Scales alone. (Aren't the EarthWalkers with Sabre? Probably should be the CloudRunners helping Krystal.) Krystal kills Scales as the King finally breaks through. He tells Krystal to take Scales' belt, but it turns to stone for some reason? The King tells her to send it to Sabre so he can show it to the mutant leader in Willow Grove, as he's an alchemist and can help somehow. Sure, why not. Sabre does so, and the belt is restored. It allows Sabre to enter Dragon Rock without becoming mutated. With Scales dead, the SharpClaw have become morose and they just stand by and watch Sabre enter without doing anything to stop him. I like this as a plot element. Dragon Rock is big and empty like in SFA, but more as a calm-before-the-storm thing rather than the obvious time crunch of SFA. Under the towering rock in the center lies the body of the Ancient Dragon that Drakor wants to revive. The Dragons used to have far more magic power than the current generation has, and by reviving it with magic energy taken with the SpellStones, Drakor will be able to destroy the Krazoa and rule the universe. Dragon Rock's gameplay is the same as in SFA, except the CloudRunner and HighTop switch places, and instead of hitting a switch, the HighTop carries rocks to open the entrance to the rock. Inside the rock itself, Sabre discovers that all that's left of the Kameria Dragon is its heart, connected to huge tubes pumping it full of magic energy. The final SpellStone is embedded in the heart. Sabre destroys the heart and takes the stone, but Drakor tries to trap him inside the rock. Sabre escapes and return to the mutant leader, who is a SpellStone Guardian. He places the stone in the Volcano Force Point Temple and puts an end to Drakor's plan to revive the dragon. But for some reason, if all the spirits aren't placed, the bad future Krystal saw might still come true!!! Eh, it's an early draft, they're allowed some plot weirdness.
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Nov 23, 2019 04:26
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| # ¿ Apr 16, 2024 09:14 |
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So that was a wet fart of an endgame. How does the Dinosaur Planet outline fare in comparison? With all the SpellStones placed, the seventh shrine rises from the desert. Krystal gets the spirit, then Kyte leaves to become the next queen. When Krystal arrives at Warlock Mountain, she learns Randorn is dying. I've covered Randorn, right? It's been a while. He's Sabre's father who adopted Krystal. He's been hanging out in Warlock Mountain the whole game. Anyway, to save him, MoonSeeds must be planted in special locations. Why does this help him? Who the gently caress knows. This is optional, you can just let him die if you want. Placing the seventh spirit causes statues of the Krazoa to come to life and begin the alignment of the Majestic 8 planets. This will bring peace to the universe and bring the Krazoa out of their sleep. At this point, Sabre is under a time limit to collect and return the final spirit, or the alignment will fail and bad things will happen. The final shrine is the Test of Sacrifice, where Sabre must show he is willing to sacrifice himself to save the life of a dinosaur. Imagine this with SFA's rear end in a top hat Fox for a laugh. After collecting the Spirit, Tricky leaves to be with his family. Depending on whether the MoonSeeds were planted, at this point either Randorn dies, or he gives a special reward. It's not specified, so I choose to believe it's the Fierce Deity Mask. Sabre is about to place the final spirit, but Drakor swoops in out of nowhere and absorbs it with his magic dragon powers! The Krazoa start shooting lasers at Drakor and Sabre but accomplish about as much as Krystal did at the end of SFA. The two of them are knocked through Warlock Mountain and into *Boss Nass voice* the planet corrrrre. Oh no, this is where Krystal saw Sabre being killed! Dinosaur Planet Plot Outline posted:Will Sabre do it? Well, guess we'll never know now. If you want to read the less abridged version, you can find it here. There's also early footage, screenshots and concept art there.
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Nov 29, 2019 23:21
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