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i am tim!
Jan 5, 2005

God damn it, where are my ant keys?! I'm gonna miss my flight!

Honest Hearts is very much Sawyer showing us his favourite vacation destination and I appreciate that.

Iím looking forward to seeing the characters speaking in full sentences in those games Avellone was kicked off of.

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Ariong
Jun 25, 2012





Zongerian posted:

I do like rainbows, puppies, and ice cream. So it wouldn't bother me at all if somebody said something like that to me.

If I was being mocked and belittled by my superiors in the workplace, I would simply choose not to be bothered by it. RIP to Sean Allen but Iím different.

StrixNebulosa
Feb 14, 2012

You cheated not only the game, but yourself.
But most of all, you cheated BABA


Sleeveless posted:

Man it's going to be weird seeing the usual chorus of "well I never liked his stuff anyways " posturing people do when a predator gets outed after 20 years of Planescape being hailed as one of the best game narratives of all time and a decade of New Vegas as the gold standard of open world storytelling.

You act like it doesn't hurt that Plaenscape Torment was written by a predator.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


StrixNebulosa posted:

You act like it doesn't hurt that Plaenscape Torment was written by a predator.

For some people it doesn't. To me, it sucks that somebody is a predator, but that's divorced from their work. Might make me read into things differently, which then might hurt my opinion of the game, but the fact that he worked on it won't affect it for me on its own.

But then again, I never really liked most of his stuff. Thought KOTOR 2 was well written but that's about it, and if he did the DLC of New Vegas, I really liked that too except for Dead Money.

StrixNebulosa
Feb 14, 2012

You cheated not only the game, but yourself.
But most of all, you cheated BABA


HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

For some people it doesn't. To me, it sucks that somebody is a predator, but that's divorced from their work. Might make me read into things differently, which then might hurt my opinion of the game, but the fact that he worked on it won't affect it for me on its own.

But then again, I never really liked most of his stuff. Thought KOTOR 2 was well written but that's about it, and if he did the DLC of New Vegas, I really liked that too except for Dead Money.

That's fair.

I still have to work through it though, and it sucks. Why couldn't Avellone have kept it in his pants and been a decent person

Famethrowa
Oct 5, 2012


Ariong posted:

If I was being mocked and belittled by my superiors in the workplace, I would simply choose not to be bothered by it. RIP to Sean Allen but Iím different.

I know this is obvious sarcasm, but how sheltered do you have to be to think that workplace harassment from a superior is something that can just be shrugged off?? if your superior is targeting you in front of higher-ups to make you look bad, there is a good chance you would be blocked from any promotion or department move. it's not just rude, it's demonstrably harmful to one's livelihood.

I hope for that dude's sake they still work retail or something because if they ever move to any other career they have a rude awakening coming.

Captain Oblivious
Oct 12, 2007

BRING CORPRO



Does it matter if he wasn't a predator when he wrote X but was later? My personal view is that it's more important to focus on what I can materially do to keep him from being in a position of power to predator again. Buying or not buying games he isn't getting royalties from anyway, from a decade ago, is literally meaningless.

Telling people who emblazon his name on their prodcuts going forward to gently caress off seems more likely to have an impact.

StrixNebulosa
Feb 14, 2012

You cheated not only the game, but yourself.
But most of all, you cheated BABA


Captain Oblivious posted:

Does it matter if he wasn't a predator when he wrote X but was later? My personal view is that it's more important to focus on what I can materially do to keep him from being in a position of power to predator again. Buying or not buying games he isn't getting royalties from anyway, from a decade ago, is literally meaningless.

Telling people who emblazon his name on their prodcuts going forward to gently caress off seems more likely to have an impact.

This is true. I mean, I'm not going to stop loving Planescape Torment, nor am I going to not buy it again if it gets another remaster. And I said this in the steam thread - I was going to get Dying Light 2 regardless of the news because Techland is more than one guy, and it's even better now that he's been booted.

I'm not trying to say "we shouldn't expose predators", more... "it sucks man". also keep exposing predators and run them out of the industry because it needs to be diverse and welcoming to everyone, not some horror show

Fair Bear Maiden
Jun 17, 2013


I understand that it's unlikely that victims of Avellone or other prominent industry figures are reading *this* specific threads, but I personally feel like in the immediate aftermath of people like that being exposed, we take the time to maybe realize that our feelings of betrayal towards someone that made some art we enjoy, or even our impulse to reanalyze that art, is fundamentally not that important right now.

Support for the victims and strong, vigorous condemnation of those actions come first. And I agree with Captain Oblivious: instead of stressing about games you've already played, think about the material ways in which you can affect the world positive going forward, finding ways (small as they are) to bar these creators from hurting more people.

Happy Hedonist
Jan 18, 2009



Fun Shoe

As someone who grew up in an abusive household, I'm trying to imagine escaping that by going to college only to find yourself in an abusive workplace after graduating. gently caress that poo poo. I don't know that'd I'd have had the spine for it.

achillesforever6
Apr 23, 2012

BROTHER I WANT YOU TO JOIN THE DSA AND SUBSCRIBE TO THE AWARD WINNING WWE NETWORK FOR ONLY $9.99 A MONTH


CW sex abuse
https://twitter.com/wuffles/status/...4200092672?s=21
This industry is such garbage

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Shitposting 24/7 without regrets. my parents would be proud.


bunch of heads of ubisoft are getting outed too

https://twitter.com/BelgianBoolean/...053524609667072
https://twitter.com/betterthemask/s...496191720148994
https://twitter.com/betterthemask/s...496377787842566
https://twitter.com/betterthemask/s...497246151397377

bunch of others too.

DelilahFlowers
Jan 10, 2020



Ubisoft leadership getting hit with accusations of sexual assault.

https://twitter.com/DennyVonDoom/st...469546623729666

https://twitter.com/betterthemask/s...489645019762689

https://twitter.com/KateNV_/status/1275137315208343558

Hub Cat
Aug 3, 2011

Trunk Lover



Meghna Jayanth is compiling a thread for anybody else that's having trouble keeping up with everything happening today
https://twitter.com/betterthemask/s...7244026881?s=20

And I want to boost this post too

Fair Bear Maiden posted:

I understand that it's unlikely that victims of Avellone or other prominent industry figures are reading *this* specific threads, but I personally feel like in the immediate aftermath of people like that being exposed, we take the time to maybe realize that our feelings of betrayal towards someone that made some art we enjoy, or even our impulse to reanalyze that art, is fundamentally not that important right now.

Support for the victims and strong, vigorous condemnation of those actions come first. And I agree with Captain Oblivious: instead of stressing about games you've already played, think about the material ways in which you can affect the world positive going forward, finding ways (small as they are) to bar these creators from hurting more people.

Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Jun 23, 2020

PunkBoy
Aug 22, 2008

You wanna get through this?


Vice has an article out summarizing some of the stuff that's been going on (I don't think it covers everything).
https://twitter.com/xoxogossipgita/...523584946065410

Viewtiful Jew
Apr 21, 2007
Mench'n-a-go-go-baby!

Dude that's been the creative director for the Halo series for the last decade is up next:

https://twitter.com/EmpressCortana/...891013174235143

She's referring to this dude: https://www.halopedia.org/Frank_O%27Connor

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Shitposting 24/7 without regrets. my parents would be proud.


Viewtiful Jew posted:

Dude that's been the creative director for the Halo series for the last decade is up next:

https://twitter.com/EmpressCortana/...891013174235143

She's referring to this dude: https://www.halopedia.org/Frank_O%27Connor

https://twitter.com/EmpressCortana/...387087895695360

frank seems like a real sack of poo poo.

Hub Cat
Aug 3, 2011

Trunk Lover



Oof this one really hits home but a little homegrown MeToo. The game is Brigador, the posts[CW:Racism Transphobia anti-semitism, Homophobia] for anyone that wants to see them.

gauss posted:

The posts are real, I made them on YCS. I'm sorry to everyone for this.


For years, I've posted to a private forum where I've made many transphobic, racist, and anti-semitic remarks. I'm deeply sorry for that, but know that apologizing will not change what I have done.

Over the last decade, I fooled myself into thinking that my words had no consequence, but over the past few days, I've discovered the opposite to be true. It matters what you say, even in private. I've hurt many people.

Effective immediately I am suspending my involvement with Stellar Jockeys & Brigador Killers. I love the game, I love how excited our fans and community have been, but I have jeopardized the trust we've worked so hard to build with everyone. I made this happen, and that means I need to step away.

I can't undo what I did, but I can work forward from here. I have deleted my account for the forum in question. I've been talking to people whose values and perspectives I've been critical of. I now need to spend time listening, learning and growing as a person. I am truly sorry for what I have done.
https://twitter.com/StellarJockeys/...559933606424576

Edit:Rehosting the pic so it doesn't disappear in the future

Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 23:04 on Jun 23, 2020

PunkBoy
Aug 22, 2008

You wanna get through this?


Oof, I remember Frank when he was just an editor at OXM. Did not expect him to pop up. What a scumbag.

StrixNebulosa
Feb 14, 2012

You cheated not only the game, but yourself.
But most of all, you cheated BABA


Hub Cat posted:

Oof this one really hits home but a little homegrown MeToo. The game is Brigador, the posts for anyone that wants to see them.[CW:Racism Transphobia anti-semitism]

https://twitter.com/StellarJockeys/...559933606424576

StrixNebulosa
Feb 14, 2012

You cheated not only the game, but yourself.
But most of all, you cheated BABA


I'm glad he's saying the right things and getting away from Brigador, but that sucks. A lot!

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



Hub Cat posted:

Oof this one really hits home but a little homegrown MeToo. The game is Brigador, the posts[CW:Racism Transphobia anti-semitism] for anyone that wants to see them.

https://twitter.com/StellarJockeys/...559933606424576

Ah gently caress. I liked Brigador a lot.

I was about to say "Oh, maybe that was a long while ago" before I noticed he was making those exact posts a week or so ago, which also makes the apology feel incredibly false considering the context.

StrixNebulosa posted:

I'm glad he's saying the right things and getting away from Brigador, but that sucks. A lot!

I don't think they're saying the right thing at all. The text of their apology is "Oh, I didn't realize the things I said in private would have consequences." Not any apology for the insanely offensive things they were saying on a regular basis as recently as a week ago where they were even watching SA to mock people for being "Simps/Cucks/F-Slur."

ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Jun 23, 2020

GrandpaPants
Feb 13, 2006


Free to roam the heavens in man's noble quest to investigate the weirdness of the universe!



Hub Cat posted:

Oof this one really hits home but a little homegrown MeToo. The game is Brigador, the posts[CW:Racism Transphobia anti-semitism] for anyone that wants to see them.

https://twitter.com/StellarJockeys/...559933606424576

I read the tweet and thought that it was about posts he made like, a decade ago, but no, literally last week. Is YCS just not moderated or what?

Osmosisch
Sep 9, 2007

I shall make everyone look like me! Then when they trick each other, they will say "oh that Coyote, he is the smartest one, he can even trick the great Coyote."

Grimey Drawer

Oh poo poo, that sucks. I love brigador and the dev thread was really cool.

Hub Cat
Aug 3, 2011

Trunk Lover



GrandpaPants posted:

I read the tweet and thought that it was about posts he made like, a decade ago, but no, literally last week. Is YCS just not moderated or what?

It's an offsite of YCS probably split off when original YCS got shutdown ages ago for being shitheads.

ImpAtom posted:

Ah gently caress. I liked Brigador a lot.
I was about to say "Oh, maybe that was a long while ago" before I noticed he was making those exact posts a week or so ago, which also makes the apology feel incredibly false considering the context.
I don't think they're saying the right thing at all. The text of their apology is "Oh, I didn't realize the things I said in private would have consequences." Not any apology for the insanely offensive things they were saying on a regular basis as recently as a week ago where they were even watching SA to mock people for being "Simps/Cucks/F-Slur."
Yeah this is the problem I'm having, and those posts are way too recent and this only happened because it came up in the Brig thread after an anonymous person linked that pic as someones title text.

Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Jun 23, 2020

credburn
Jun 22, 2016


Does deleting one's account also remove all the posts? Because that just seems like a convenient way to minimize the bullshit while trying to look like you're doing the right thing.

Happy Hedonist
Jan 18, 2009



Fun Shoe

Whatís YCS?

Unlucky7
Jul 11, 2006

Don't worry my friends. I will be your shield.


Fallen Rib

GrandpaPants posted:

I read the tweet and thought that it was about posts he made like, a decade ago, but no, literally last week. Is YCS just not moderated or what?

Apparently it is an offsite.

But yeah, oof. I heard some twitter chatter about it in the PoE2 thread when the Avellone stuff hit but wanted to think it was just hearsay. gently caress.

EDIT: Anyway, hopefully he makes good on his apology but...we will see.

Unlucky7 fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Jun 23, 2020

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010




The Great Twist


Your Console Sucks. Video Games FYAD from the past.

e: Also apparently an offsite.

Orcs and Ostriches fucked around with this message at 23:11 on Jun 23, 2020

Wicked Them Beats
Apr 1, 2007




"I have realized the things I said in secret and went to great lengths to hide my saying of were actually wrong, a thing I could not have realized until being exposed" is, uh, well it's not remotely a believable apology and this dude can gently caress off forever.

He definitely still believes the things he was saying but hey if reading from this script is what he needs to do to satisfy the simps then so be it.

Happy Hedonist
Jan 18, 2009



Fun Shoe

Yea, gently caress that guy. There is absolutely no way that apology is genuine. It takes time to deprogram and heís claiming to have done it in days?

WeedlordGoku69
Feb 11, 2015

A DAILY DOSE
OF OLD SHOOTERS


PLAY NOW MY LORD



Wicked Them Beats posted:

"I have realized the things I said in secret and went to great lengths to hide my saying of were actually wrong, a thing I could not have realized until being exposed" is, uh, well it's not remotely a believable apology and this dude can gently caress off forever.

He definitely still believes the things he was saying but hey if reading from this script is what he needs to do to satisfy the simps then so be it.

Happy Hedonist posted:

Yea, gently caress that guy. There is absolutely no way that apology is genuine. It takes time to deprogram and he’s claiming to have done it in days?

it's probably worth keeping in mind that this was almost entirely localized to SA, and that this is only known about by non-goons because he is apologizing for it publicly. the shithead way to handle this would have been to just autoban his SA account and pretend nothing happened.

Hub Cat
Aug 3, 2011

Trunk Lover



It was probably feeding back onto twitter he deleted his account there too so it's gonna be hard to tell. Regardless even if it was localized here it was going to start shifting to Discord and Twitter etc. eventually it would be impossible to dodge forever.

Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 23:36 on Jun 23, 2020

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



WeedlordGoku69 posted:

it's probably worth keeping in mind that this was almost entirely localized to SA, and that this is only known about by non-goons because he is apologizing for it publicly. the shithead way to handle this would have been to just autoban his SA account and pretend nothing happened.

I mean once the cat is out of the bag on stuff like this it remains out. SA isn't a closed community from which nothing leaks out from.

Also it's worth pointing out that in the main Brigand thread there are a loving staggering amount of people coming in to defend him while also mysteriously talking about cancel culture and talking about how it wasn't serious. Considering some of them haven't posted since as long ago as 2012 I don't think it's a coincidence.

Reene
Aug 26, 2005





Orcs and Ostriches posted:

Your Console Sucks. Video Games FYAD from the past.

e: Also apparently an offsite.

Worth noting that one of the reasons YCS was deleted is because it was host to torrents of exactly that kind of odious poo poo. Just distilled Edgy Gamer Culture.

Ibram Gaunt
Jul 22, 2009


Really weird how in that compilation of bad posts he made, they include ones where they say wolf2 is bad, on the same level as the transphobia and racism. Reminds me of when Resetera compiled all the awful poo poo the iron fury devs said and they included tons of stuff about them just saying resetera sucks as top billing and the transphobia on like post 2 of the thread lol.

StrixNebulosa
Feb 14, 2012

You cheated not only the game, but yourself.
But most of all, you cheated BABA


Do not go into the Brigador thread it's a twitter thread in there with how many people are coming out of the woodwork to say that racism is good actually

WeedlordGoku69
Feb 11, 2015

A DAILY DOSE
OF OLD SHOOTERS


PLAY NOW MY LORD



ImpAtom posted:

I mean once the cat is out of the bag on stuff like this it remains out. SA isn't a closed community from which nothing leaks out from.

Also it's worth pointing out that in the main Brigand thread there are a loving staggering amount of people coming in to defend him while also mysteriously talking about cancel culture and talking about how it wasn't serious. Considering some of them haven't posted since as long ago as 2012 I don't think it's a coincidence.

it's not a closed community from which nothing leaks, but it is a fairly small community and one that very few others overlap with heavily, and it seems pretty rare that stuff does leak. like, there's multiple semi-famous people who have made complete asses of themselves on SA, and... nobody's aware of it outside goons. dude could have legit just waited this out and said nothing, and it would have most likely just blown over as Goon Drama.

and... yeah? that tends to happen whenever an offsite gets called out in a way they find out about (and gauss deleted his account over there, so, they did). you end up with a flood of assholes piling into wherever it happened and making GBS threads everywhere.

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007

HONKING IS VIOLENCE


i have a probe from YCS days that really bothers me, not the probe but what i said to get it. don't have any excuse or context for it even, that's not a word that can be excused and it's really embarrassing and lovely that I said and that it was a common thing to say there. i don't know who to apologize to or who I hurt but acknowledging it was lovely, recognizing why, never saying it again, become better and not defending it seem like the bare minimum. plenty of folks made it their whole lives without going through a phase of posting on edgelord bbs so i can't fault anyone for faulting me in that regard

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Cardiovorax
Jun 5, 2011
I got chased out of the Monster Hunter thread for garbage posting, now I shit up other Games threads with useless low-effort uninformed aggro noise. I somehow think "VN nerds" are beneath me and I belong on your ignore list.

Fair Bear Maiden posted:

I understand that it's unlikely that victims of Avellone or other prominent industry figures are reading *this* specific threads, but I personally feel like in the immediate aftermath of people like that being exposed, we take the time to maybe realize that our feelings of betrayal towards someone that made some art we enjoy, or even our impulse to reanalyze that art, is fundamentally not that important right now.
I don't think there would be half as many people upset about it every this kind of reveal happens if it wasn't for that sense of betrayal giving people a feeling of being personally affected by it themselves, instead of it being just yet another headline about bad things happening to other people. It shouldn't be a priority when discussing it, but it's hard to claim that it's not important when it's such a large part of what makes so many people take notice of it in the first place.

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