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PerniciousKnid
Sep 13, 2006


College Slice

DrSunshine posted:

There is! Just click play and select your Historic deck. It'll have the ! but ignore it and it'll let you play anyway.

Thanks, I guess I'm dumb I didn't even think to try that. Does it work with any other deck types e.g. brawl?

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Wezlar
May 13, 2005




DrSunshine posted:

A 1/1 UU with flash that has "When this enters the field, you may counter target spell or activated ability that targets you or a permanent you control."

What if it was a faerie, and it countered target spell with converted mana cost X or less where X is the number of faeries you control?

resistentialism
Aug 13, 2007



historic brawl is its own thing that they only put in on a rotation

DrSunshine
Mar 23, 2009

Did I just say that out loud~~?!!!


PerniciousKnid posted:

Thanks, I guess I'm dumb I didn't even think to try that. Does it work with any other deck types e.g. brawl?

Nah, you can hardly be faulted. It's really unintuitive. If they intended for people to be able to play unranked historic, why would they put a huge fat exclamation mark indicating it's not allowed??

PerniciousKnid
Sep 13, 2006


College Slice

Why isn't anyone playing unranked historic? Does it not look exciting enough? Maybe we should make the exclamation point bigger.

Wezlar
May 13, 2005




PerniciousKnid posted:

Why isn't anyone playing unranked historic? Does it not look exciting enough? Maybe we should make the exclamation point bigger.

Why does anyone play unranked to begin with?

Uranium Phoenix
Jun 20, 2007


RADIOACTIVE DUST SURGE DETECTED


Wezlar posted:

Why does anyone play unranked to begin with?

Because sometimes you want to try out weird jank and have fun rather than run into whatever deck just won the last big tournament 43 times in a row, alternating with RDWs that draw perfect and put an embercleave on their anax turn 4 for lethal.

Eej
Jun 17, 2007

HEAVYARMS


I mean I try out jank all the time in ranked queue because how else do you know if it even works

A Moose
Oct 22, 2009



I play historic ranked because there's no traditional unranked historic... bastards made me hit platinum for the first time in a while

PerniciousKnid
Sep 13, 2006


College Slice

I don't have a very big collection, so if I play anything but the one deck I poured wild cards into in ranked I tend to get rolled by power combos.

fadam
Apr 23, 2008



Eej posted:

I mean I try out jank all the time in ranked queue because how else do you know if it even works

What if you want to know if it works against Mazeís End or Shrines?

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005



Elephant Ambush posted:



I just googled a couple Gruul lists and I had enough WC to build one of them! Now to go get owned!
I was inspired by your posts to give up on my eternal quest to take vampires to Mythic (for this month) and to just slam Gruul in historic instead. Took about two hours to hit Mythic from high diamond with a 64% win rate.

Gruul is absurd. On the other hand, it was immensely satisfying to trash control over and over that easily.

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

Anyone have a deck list for that Mono U deck everyone was talking about?

thuly
Jun 19, 2005

Transcending history, and the world, a tale of MS Paint and animes, endlessly retold.


Ersatz posted:

I was inspired by your posts to give up on my eternal quest to take vampires to Mythic (for this month) and to just slam Gruul in historic instead. Took about two hours to hit Mythic from high diamond with a 64% win rate.

Gruul is absurd. On the other hand, it was immensely satisfying to trash control over and over that easily.

Are you running the combo mutate with emancipation or a straight aggro version?

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

Wow so something lovely I discovered:

Using Call of the Death Dweller on Archfiend's Vessel is a gigantic waste because the Menace / Deathtouch counters go on the Vile, then you sac that to create the 5/5. That doesn't make sense to me but whatever.

Ersatz
Sep 17, 2005



thuly posted:

Are you running the combo mutate with emancipation or a straight aggro version?
Straight aggro - it's too fast for most decks to reasonably be able to deal with, and I wouldn't want to water that down by trying to hit combinations. I usually build my own decks, but I took this list without modification from the 1st place finisher in the recent MTG Arena Zone tournament.

Ersatz fucked around with this message at 05:41 on Jun 30, 2020

Drewjitsu
Sep 2, 2007

Muay Thai is great but Buttscoot-Shin-to-Balls Style is undeniably better.



SalTheBard posted:

Wow so something lovely I discovered:

Using Call of the Death Dweller on Archfiend's Vessel is a gigantic waste because the Menace / Deathtouch counters go on the Vile, then you sac that to create the 5/5. That doesn't make sense to me but whatever.

RTFC. If archfiend's vessel comes out of the graveyard into play, then you exile it, then you create a demon.

Call targets the vessel and gives it the death touch and menace. Then it gets exiled to create the demon.

Makes sense to me.

Eej
Jun 17, 2007

HEAVYARMS


fadam posted:

What if you want to know if it works against Mazeís End or Shrines?

Trial by fire except the fire is the spot on your bed that your cat was sleeping on

Zero VGS
Aug 16, 2002
"It has gunfights and shit!"


Lipstick Apathy

Is this new Mastery Pass any better than the worthless last one? It seems like at a minimum it's not handing out piles of packs that are cycling out, and at least it has a lot of good dogges

flatluigi
Apr 22, 2008

here come the planes


the only reason the last one sucked was that it was two months instead of three months. if you care about the cosmetics and are fine with the rewards, go ahead

Jabor
Jul 16, 2010

#1 Loser at SpaceChem

The new pet is way too noisy and makes sad puppy dog whines whenever you take damage, so I'm leaving him in the kennel and sticking with a different pet.

The non-cosmetic rewards always depend on how much playing you're going to do, but if you finish out the pass are probably going to be worth it this time.

lemonadesweetheart
May 27, 2010



Jabor posted:

The new pet is way too noisy and makes sad puppy dog whines whenever you take damage, so I'm leaving him in the kennel and sticking with a different pet.

The non-cosmetic rewards always depend on how much playing you're going to do, but if you finish out the pass are probably going to be worth it this time.

It's just the wolf so far. The others don't seem as whiney.

Bugsy
Jul 15, 2004

I'm thumpin'. That's
why they call me
'Thumper'.



Slippery Tilde

Reminder:

quote:


Some codes are expiring soon on July 1 Ė make sure to redeem these codes below, if you have not already:

PlayRavnica: 3 Guilds of Ravnica Packs
PlayAllegiance: 3 Ravnica Allegiance Packs
PlayWarSpark: 3 War of the Spark Packs
PlayM20: 3 Core Set 2020 Packs

edit - Also I don't know which of these have been used or not so good luck if you get one. If you have already used one of these prerelease codes you cant use another one for that set. The non Eldraine ones also need to get used by 7-1-20.

ELD
fTm-QfPx-LSK
ELD
VAV-n8hb-SFF
M20
XWV-d6zJ-jGN
M20
XW2-yXAM-psc
M20
XW2-kEWc-Qbj
M20
Wy6-dzgb-ZJP
RNA
D3c-BFQS-Daq
RNA
BL5yiz4-iHf
GRN
8n5-z46s-nst
GRN
utz-sozf-g9y
WAR
Jwc-Ygmg-sbQ
WAR
yV1-cRYm-qsx

Bugsy fucked around with this message at 07:54 on Jun 30, 2020

Chadzok
Apr 25, 2002



This draft format is brick walling me, 41% winrate and nothing past 5 wins (platinum 3/4). The aggro speed makes it feel especially bad being on the draw or having to mulligan. Too much tilt happening for me, think i'ma mess around with constructed a bit and save my wizard bucks for Jumpstart.

Funso Banjo
Dec 22, 2003



Bugsy posted:

Reminder:


edit - Also I don't know which of these have been used or not so good luck if you get one. If you have already used one of these prerelease codes you cant use another one for that set. The non Eldraine ones also need to get used by 7-1-20.

ELD
fTm-QfPx-LSK
ELD
VAV-n8hb-SFF
M20
XWV-d6zJ-jGN
M20
XW2-yXAM-psc
M20
XW2-kEWc-Qbj
M20
Wy6-dzgb-ZJP
RNA
D3c-BFQS-Daq
RNA
BL5yiz4-iHf
GRN
8n5-z46s-nst
GRN
utz-sozf-g9y
WAR
Jwc-Ygmg-sbQ
WAR
yV1-cRYm-qsx

All used sadly. I was excited for a second, never had a prerelease or (non basic) promo code before

Funso Banjo fucked around with this message at 08:35 on Jun 30, 2020

Eej
Jun 17, 2007

HEAVYARMS


If I knew this Mono G deck was so good I woulda stopped farting around brewing jank earlier and gotten Mythic for the extra pack



https://twitter.com/CedricAPhillips...873142740824064

thespaceinvader
Mar 30, 2011

The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!


Sometimes I super resent being locked out of my favourite colours by quests I don't want to do.

Sometimes I work out that Izzet prowess is a blast.

Izzet Prowess is a blast.

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

Drewjitsu posted:

RTFC. If archfiend's vessel comes out of the graveyard into play, then you exile it, then you create a demon.

Call targets the vessel and gives it the death touch and menace. Then it gets exiled to create the demon.

Makes sense to me.

The way you explained it makes sense. I thought you excited it straight from the GY first. I just want my 5/5 flying death touch menace demon on turn 3!!

Bell_
Sep 3, 2006

Tiny Baltimore




thespaceinvader posted:

Sometimes I super resent being locked out of my favourite colours by quests I don't want to do.

Sometimes I work out that Izzet prowess is a blast.

Izzet Prowess is a blast.
I've been loving around with mono-red prowess and the new legend which makes weenies unblockable and refills your hand. I don't think it's quite there yet, but it is pretty fun.

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

TURDS BOD



SalTheBard posted:

The way you explained it makes sense. I thought you excited it straight from the GY first. I just want my 5/5 flying death touch menace demon on turn 3!!

I know you are relatively new, but in general, a 5/5 flyer doesnít need Menace (flying is better) and doesnít need Deathtouch (itís so big).

Spending 4 total mana and 2 cards to get a 5/5 flyer isnít even that bad, if you got any other creature with your reanimation spel you got your value!

The Klowner
Apr 20, 2019

I see past the sham that is society, and I'm into some incredibly fucked up shit.

Chadzok posted:

This draft format is brick walling me, 41% winrate and nothing past 5 wins (platinum 3/4). The aggro speed makes it feel especially bad being on the draw or having to mulligan. Too much tilt happening for me, think i'ma mess around with constructed a bit and save my wizard bucks for Jumpstart.

I'm in a similar boat except my winrate is 32% over 6 premier draft events, just absolutely loving abysmal. I started in plat 2 and now I'm in plat 4.

I feel like this format very much rewards good gameplay and good sideboarding due to how swingy it is and how thin the margins for victory are. This isn't like Ikoria where a well-built, synergistic deck can carry you, you really need to just play individually strong cards, read your opponent, make smart attacks and remove the right threats, just the nuts and bolts of limited gameplay. I've felt pretty good about my deck composition for each of the drafts I've done, I've just made too many misplays during actual gameplay.

I'll probably try a few more drafts after the season resets to see if I can at least get a draft event with more wins than losses. I'm not sure if I should be going for bo1 or bo3, on the one hand bo3 is the way this format should ideally be played but otoh I don't have the winrate to make it economically viable.

The Klowner fucked around with this message at 13:16 on Jun 30, 2020

Cabbages and Kings
Aug 25, 2004

shall we be trotting home again?



Well, I guess I'm finally gonna have to bite the bullet and learn to be not poo poo and limited if I'm really gonna farm wildcards as efficiently as possible, huh?

*sigh*

The Klowner posted:

I'll probably try a few more drafts after the season resets to see if I can at least get a draft event with more wins than losses. I'm not sure if I should be going for bo1 or bo3, on the one hand bo3 is the way this format should ideally be played but otoh I don't have the winrate to make it economically viable.

Going 3-0 in Bo3 pays out better than going 7-x in Bo1 (6packs plus 2200gems vs 6packs plus 3000). Additionally, Bo3 reduces variance. This might cause you to get less "free wins" up front from people bricking on their draws, but, over time, playing Bo3 is going to make you a better magic player.

I consider myself a slightly better than average constructed player (have made diamond pretty easily the 2 months I've been doing this, but never attempted to grind to mythic) but I'm a somewhat worse than average drafter and sealed player. This makes sense, as all my paper efforts in the last 5 years have been focused on constructed, but, Arena is changing my play patterns and basically I want to be able to keep on top of the pool enough to reasonably build any historic deck that might pop up, but I also don't want to put in more than $50 per set (the Mastery pre order, basically). This seems doable, but I need to get better at drafting because going 3-0 in one draft is better than spending all afternoon doing pretty well in Historic events.

A problem for me is that I always say I want to just get my dailies done fast and then I end up piloting miserably plodding poo poo like this.


This still has at least one too many win conditions, I might drop a 5Feri for a 4Feri.

0 friend count included, because Esper players don't need or find friends.

Cabbages and Kings fucked around with this message at 13:22 on Jun 30, 2020

thespaceinvader
Mar 30, 2011

The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!


Bust Rodd posted:

I know you are relatively new, but in general, a 5/5 flyer doesnít need Menace (flying is better) and doesnít need Deathtouch (itís so big).

Spending 4 total mana and 2 cards to get a 5/5 flyer isnít even that bad, if you got any other creature with your reanimation spel you got your value!

Ideal would be T1 Vessel, T2 Vessel/Village Rites, attack the other vessel into something and have it die or block with it, T3 Call.

10/10 of fliers attacking on T4 is the dream.

A Moose
Oct 22, 2009



thespaceinvader posted:

Ideal would be T1 Vessel, T2 Vessel/Village Rites, attack the other vessel into something and have it die or block with it, T3 Call.

10/10 of fliers attacking on T4 is the dream.

the Best Possible draw is T2 Seasoned Hallowblade, end of their turn pitch 3 Vessels, 15 power on turn 3

thespaceinvader
Mar 30, 2011

The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!


A Moose posted:

the Best Possible draw is T2 Seasoned Hallowblade, end of their turn pitch 3 Vessels, 15 power on turn 3

That is valid and acceptable.

Lone Goat
Apr 16, 2003

When life gives you lemons, suplex those lemons.






Cabbages and Kings posted:



Going 3-0 in Bo3 pays out better than going 7-x in Bo1 (6packs plus 2200gems vs 6packs plus 3000). Additionally, Bo3 reduces variance. This might cause you to get less "free wins" up front from people bricking on their draws, but, over time, playing Bo3 is going to make you a better magic player.


If someone's goal is to build a collection on a budget then they have to play based on their actual win rate, not whatever pays the most if you max wins.

Ryan Spain/Goingoptimal has an EV calculator that tells you where you're best spending your gold based on your expected win rate. Telling a novice drafter "you should play bo3" in a vacuum is not helpful if they bomb out and have nothing to show for it, it's only going to discourage them.

Cabbages and Kings
Aug 25, 2004

shall we be trotting home again?



Lone Goat posted:

If someone's goal is to build a collection on a budget then they have to play based on their actual win rate, not whatever pays the most if you max wins.

Ryan Spain/Goingoptimal has an EV calculator that tells you where you're best spending your gold based on your expected win rate. Telling a novice drafter "you should play bo3" in a vacuum is not helpful if they bomb out and have nothing to show for it, it's only going to discourage them.

your win rate will only improve if you play, though, and if you're trying to improve at drafting, I think calibrating towards what is ultimately the best return on time, is a good way to do it.

There's no need to be absolutist; if you farm ~12,000 gold in a normal week just from ladder dailies, you can alternate buying 12 packs one week, playing an event the other week. If you read draft strategy stuff to some extent but more importantly just put in the time you will get better. If you don't, then you're not going to improve. So, I'd maintain that if your goal is to build and maintain a collection over a long period of time with the minimum cash input, your time is best spent focusing on building the skillset which will eventually maintain that with the least time input.

People are generally terrible at knowing what their "expected win rate" is, unless they are keeping detailed spreadsheets of each format over a long period of time. Conversely, people who are invested enough to do that, generally hit a 50% winrate in draft in some reasonable amount of time. I am a very poor limited player but when I was drafting 1-2x a week and tracking results, I was able to get to ~51%+ after some period of time, before buying into legacy and forgetting about limited until this spring. I never came close to the maybe 60%+ winrate that the draft sharks had, so I mostly had more 2-1s than 1-2s with a very occasional 3-0 or 2-0-1.

Buying the mastery pass preorder gets you 3 draft entries and getting a pre-release code from someone (easy on various discords, just know someone who always does multiple prerelease events) gets you another one plus six packs. So, right there, that's 4 basically free entries per set, assuming you're buying the mastery passes anyway which I think is vastly the best RoI on anything they sell. If you can do okay in a couple of those drafts or well in 1, then cool, now you have another draft entry or two if you want. Before Arena, novice drafters had no choice but to play Bo3, and over the years I have watched a lot of novice drafters gradually turn into saturday draft regulars, gradually turn into the people you really would rather not play round 2 if you can avoid it. Arena gives you the option to focus on Bo1 which will certainly teach you fundamentals, but the variance is higher and even in limited sideboarding is such a fundamental part of the game, I don't think people do themselves favors by trying to duck that complexity for very long.

Cabbages and Kings fucked around with this message at 14:44 on Jun 30, 2020

thespaceinvader
Mar 30, 2011

The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!


Your win rate won't remotely improve if you go 0/3 with no wins because you're drafting a deck that needs more cards, then playing it in a higher-skill format against higher-skill opponents.

Which has largely been my experience of trying Bo3 draft. I just get stomped, it's not fun, and it's not productive, I'll take a slightly lower expectec value for an easier time.

If they had Bo3 ghost draft I'd probably be all over it.

InterrupterJones
Nov 10, 2012

It's obvious that this man and I share the same destiny. Therefore I must join forces with him! Besides, I'll save on gas money if I take him with me.

Have to say, I've played one game in a draft of M21 so far and I'm already a big fan of using Shipwreck Dowser to recur Sublime Epiphany, and set up a janky loop with that.

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Jabor
Jul 16, 2010

#1 Loser at SpaceChem


You should play because you have fun. I drafted my way to full set of Theros and Ikoria because those formats were fun, and the process of playing out those drafts was enjoyable. But it doesn't really matter how long it took, because the process of playing those games was fun enough on its own. Could I have done it slightly faster by doing bo3 drafts? Maybe, but that also means less time enjoying those games.

In contrast, I didn't draft my way to a full Eldraine set, because that draft format was utter shite until about halfway through when they refined the bots, and I just didn't feel like going back. I might skip M21 as well, after I've given it a fair shake.

In any case, this is a game where it's very realistic to maintain a complete rare collection with no money input whatsoever. If your stated goal is to "build and maintain a collection over a long period of time with the minimum cash input", why are you advocating spending real money on a mastery pass preorder in order to maybe potentially save a little time but only if you're already good at Limited?

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