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silvergoose
Mar 18, 2006

IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS



Yeah. I mean it's in the intro thingie in every book.

I really like the scene with Moridin where he's contemplating the not-chess board and how the fisher king might just be another age's representation of Rand...

silvergoose fucked around with this message at 10:48 on Mar 25, 2021

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latinotwink1997
Jan 2, 2008

Taste my Ball of Hope, foul dragon!




Reading through the thread after hearing the series was being made on Amazon (very cool!). Saw this post and first impression was “clearly the yellow and brown ajah outfits.”

Vavrek
Mar 2, 2013

I like your style hombre, but this is no laughing matter. Assault on a police officer. Theft of police property. Illegal possession of a firearm. FIVE counts of attempted murder. That comes to... 29 dollars and 40 cents. Cash, cheque, or credit card?

I just had a galaxy brain moment I've got to share with you all.

So, our introduction as readers to the office of the Amyrlin Seat is Siuan Sanche. The closest real world comparison to the Amyrlin is likely the Pope. The Pope wears the Ring of the Fisherman because the first Pope, Peter, was a fisherman before he was a bishop. Siuan Sanche talks in nothing but fishing metaphors.

Though superficial, this is going in my list of references that WoT makes.

JOHN SKELETON
Dec 12, 2005



Well, I done did it. 16 months or something to reread the whole goddamn thing. Just finished.

The things that bothered me the first time through AMoL - Padan Fain, sorta clunky argument / fight with the Dark One - didn't really feel like big deals this time. The latter I actually even really enjoyed, and of course overall AMoL and the series as a whole is just wonderful. Demandred is such a great end boss, like holy poo poo. Pimped out in coin armor, holding a magic sceptre, followed by a full circle of worshippers and raving his paranoid lunacy about Lews Therin.. Too bad it's pretty much impossible the show would ever get there.

Instead I think the biggest flaw in the last three books is small dialogue issues. Sanderson's characters can sometimes just be a bit too quippy, especially in the middle of battle, and every time it happens it's like a little discordant tone.

Also of course I wouldn't have minded 100 more pages of epilogue, or a few books. The world is left in such an interesting state where it's clearly saved, but there's so much tension in all directions.

Skyl3lazer
Aug 27, 2007

[Dooting Stealthily]





I've never read these before but I'm 6 books in now and I realize it's taken months to get to this point, and I read very quickly. I clicked this thread after chatting with a friend and haven't yet finished laughing at the gif in the second post. Thank you.

silvergoose
Mar 18, 2006

IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS



That gif is an absolute gem, especially to fans of the books.

DarkHorse
Dec 13, 2006

Vroom Vroom, BEEP BEEP!

Nap Ghost

The Golden Crane flies to Tarmon Gai'don!



quote:

“A message to each merchant you correspond with. Tarmon Gai’don is coming soon.” He shrugged uneasily. “That is nothing to do with me, Aes Sedai. I’m a merchant.” She was asking for a good many pigeons. He corresponded with merchants as far away as Shienar. “But I will send your message.” He would, too, however many birds it required. Only stone-blind idiots failed to keep promises to Aes Sedai. Besides which, he wanted rid of her and her talk of the Last Battle. “Do you recognize this?” she said, fishing a leather cord from the neck of her dress. His breath caught, and he stretched out a hand, brushed a finger across the heavy gold signet ring on the cord. Across the crane in flight. How had she come by this? Under the Light, how? “I recognize it,” he told her, his voice suddenly hoarse. “My name is Nynaeve ti al’Meara Mandragoran. The message I want sent is this. My husband rides from World’s End toward Tarwin’s Gap, toward Tarmon Gai’don. Will he ride alone?” He trembled. He did not know whether he was laughing or crying. Perhaps both. She was his wife? “I will send your message, my Lady, but it has nothing to do with me. I am a merchant. Malkier is dead. Dead, I tell you.” The heat in her eyes seemed to intensify, and she gripped her long, thick braid with one hand. “Lan told me once that Malkier lives so long as one man wears the hadori in pledge that he will fight the Shadow, so long as one woman wears the ki’sain in pledge that she will send her sons to fight the Shadow. I wear the ki’sain, Master Aldragoran. My husband wears the hadori. So do you. Will Lan Mandragoran ride to the Last Battle alone?”

buffalo all day
Mar 13, 2019



DarkHorse posted:

The Golden Crane flies to Tarmon Gai'don!




absolutely the loving best

silvergoose
Mar 18, 2006

IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS



buffalo all day posted:

absolutely the loving best

Joey Steel
Jul 24, 2019

Big Dictatorship-of-the-proletariat Energy


DarkHorse posted:

The Golden Crane flies to Tarmon Gai'don!




When it's good, it's good.

aparmenideanmonad
Jan 28, 2004
Balls to you and your way of mortal opinions - you don't exist anyway!

Fun Shoe

Knife of Dreams is top 3 book in the series, really such a tragedy that RJ died right after he got his groove back. The dragging setup of the middle books is over, he's finally getting to the payoff, and he's doing it so well when...

rafikki
Mar 8, 2008

I see what you did there. (It's pretty easy, since ducks have a field of vision spanning 340 degrees.)

~SMcD

I haven't read the books in years at this point, why does that give me chills to read?

DarkHorse
Dec 13, 2006

Vroom Vroom, BEEP BEEP!

Nap Ghost

A long-dead nation rising from the ashes in a desperate last stand at the Last Battle; a forgotten hope showing a flickering of life; a man determined to die and too honorable to bring others with him; a stubborn woman's love for her husband driving her to trick him and rally an entire army along his way, and save the world in the bargain; all in just a paragraph that closes with a rhetorical call to action, "Will he ride alone?"

It helps that there's a ton of background build up for the characters and world, but honestly I think it would work even if you knew nothing about them

ONE YEAR LATER
Apr 13, 2004

Fry old buddy, it's me, Bender!


Oven Wrangler

When I read the last three books, especially the part where some random guy is making a flint spear head and all of the metal around them starts to melt I imagined the sky was like world 6-1 in Super Mario for the NES. It's full daylight but the sky itself is jet black, things are just wrong in a fundamental way.

eke out
Feb 24, 2013



ONE YEAR LATER posted:

When I read the last three books, especially the part where some random guy is making a flint spear head and all of the metal around them starts to melt I imagined the sky was like world 6-1 in Super Mario for the NES. It's full daylight but the sky itself is jet black, things are just wrong in a fundamental way.

the kinda montage where the farmers are forging their pitchforks into polearms and leaving everything behind is so good

Invalid Validation
Jan 13, 2008

DON'T DOUBLE DOWN ON YOUR STUPID SHIT JUST CAUSE YOU THINK IT'S FUNNY. YOU MAKE STUPID FUCKING DECISIONS ALL THE TIME THEN DOUBLE DOWN LIKE A PETULANT CHILD. GOD I FUCKING HATE YOU SO MUCH SOMETIMES.

Everyone starting to follow Lan and looking a different direction whistling when he turns around is so good. Him and his merry band of killers have some of the best battle scenes in the books.

JOHN SKELETON
Dec 12, 2005



eke out posted:

the kinda montage where the farmers are forging their pitchforks into polearms and leaving everything behind is so good
All three prologue scenes from the last three books with random new characters are great, they set the tone amazingly well. It's really surprising how well Sanderson can do dark, foreboding tone like that when you compare to some of the non-WoT books of his I've read.

Here's a dumb thing that's been bugging me about AMoL now that I think about it: Throughout the Last Battle, Egwene and all the Aes Sedai are just blasting the gently caress out of the Sharan army. I don't think there's a single mention of the three vows in the entire book. At some point Egwene even has to collateral damage some civilians with lightning for whatever reason. Is this a plot hole or are we to assume the Aes Sedai were constantly considering their life in danger?

Submarine Sandpaper
May 27, 2007



They can blast dark friends iirc

Comrade Blyatlov
Aug 4, 2007


should have picked four fingers


I'm pretty sure The Last Battle means yes, you are in terrible danger of your life.

JOHN SKELETON
Dec 12, 2005



Submarine Sandpaper posted:

They can blast dark friends iirc
But I don't think Sharan's are Darkfriends? None of them explicitly say they serve The Great Lord, they are just following the Wyld who says he's the savior. So they're more misguided pawns than actual followers. I suppose you could make a case that the Aes Sedai think they are Darkfriends, but it's never brought up in text as far as I noticed.

edit:

Comrade Blyatlov posted:

I'm pretty sure The Last Battle means yes, you are in terrible danger of your life.
Yeah, though it seems a bit of a grey area for the vows. My understanding of the vows in the earlier books was that Aes Sedai can channel aggressively only when they are directly threatened, and can then directly stop / respond to that immediate danger. If you are throwing fireballs at some pikemen across the river, those pikemen are not directly threatening your life even though there might be some channelers around who could.

JOHN SKELETON fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Apr 6, 2021

Submarine Sandpaper
May 27, 2007



JOHN SKELETON posted:

But I suppose you could make a case that the Aes Sedai think they are Darkfriends, but it's never brought up in text as far as I noticed.

there was a forsaken shouting for LTT leading all their channelers. I think it's a pretty good case.

/e I think the 3 oaths not really mattering, really, would be egg win blasting the raken out of the sky when they were on retreat. I forget if she had already oathed herself though

Invalid Validation
Jan 13, 2008

DON'T DOUBLE DOWN ON YOUR STUPID SHIT JUST CAUSE YOU THINK IT'S FUNNY. YOU MAKE STUPID FUCKING DECISIONS ALL THE TIME THEN DOUBLE DOWN LIKE A PETULANT CHILD. GOD I FUCKING HATE YOU SO MUCH SOMETIMES.

I’m sure Aes Sedai can twist whatever internal logic they want to make them able to kill innocent people. Vows are very subjective. I always did think it was funny they couldn’t lie but everyone in the world just believed they did anyways.

JOHN SKELETON
Dec 12, 2005



Submarine Sandpaper posted:

/e I think the 3 oaths not really mattering, really, would be egg win blasting the raken out of the sky when they were on retreat. I forget if she had already oathed herself though
She had not, at that point, because she was still a Novice to the White Tower.

Comrade Blyatlov
Aug 4, 2007


should have picked four fingers


Oh man you are gonna get spanked so hard for calling the Amyrlin a novice

Apparatchik Magnet
Sep 25, 2019

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Submarine Sandpaper posted:

They can blast dark friends iirc

The issue is “what’s a Darkfriend.” A white Ajah Aes Sedai subject to this oath can’t hurt random Whitecloaks, the average Whitecloak bound by this oath could slash up every Aes Sedai he meets with no problem, just like your average SA poster subject to a “only kill Nazis” oath would be able to chop up any Republican and be confused why others with functioning brains subject to the same oath can’t.

Mat Cauthon
Jan 2, 2006

The more tragic things get, the more I feel like laughing.



It was the Last Battle, if they don't go all out the Shadow wins. Some skirting of the rules is probably in order. Even if Sharans aren't straight up darkfriends they were fighting for the Shadow, albeit as a result of being manipulated.

One of those situations where you do you have to do and cry about it, make amends for it, debate the morality, etc later.

Inspector 34
Mar 9, 2009
DOES NOT RESPECT THE RUN

BUT THEY WILL



Good of the oaths to recognize the desperate situation the world was in.

JOHN SKELETON
Dec 12, 2005



Apparatchik Magnet posted:

just like your average SA poster subject to a “only kill Nazis” oath would be able to chop up any Republican and be confused why others with functioning brains subject to the same oath can’t.
Thanks for bringing this energy to our lighthearted discussion about wizards and other fantasy crap

Actually, if AMoL was a few hundred pages longer - oh man if only - it would have been cool to have some White Ajah Aes Sedai that was mentioned once in book 7 have an internal debate about who she can target while she's blasting Sharan channelers and carefully avoiding everyone else.

Apparatchik Magnet
Sep 25, 2019

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Inspector 34 posted:

Good of the oaths to recognize the desperate situation the world was in.

Lord, bind me to this oath, but not if inconvenient.

Anias
Jun 3, 2010

It really is a lovely hat


Apparatchik Magnet posted:

Lord, bind me to this oath, but not if inconvenient.

Sure. Whatever. Stop Calling Me. Destroy Creation.

Cavelcade
Dec 9, 2015

I'm actually a boy!




A friend of mine took to lying like an Aes Sedai, ie, stating truths in such a way he knew they'd be misinterpreted. Good times.

Anias posted:

Sure. Whatever. Stop Calling Me. Destroy Creation.

Wait what was that last one?

silvergoose
Mar 18, 2006

IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS



There's this theory that the creator and the dark one are the same, and all the talking to them at the bore and poo poo is just calling some extra reality being on the phone and they just want you to hang up and stop bothering them.

Mat Cauthon
Jan 2, 2006

The more tragic things get, the more I feel like laughing.



Inspector 34 posted:

Good of the oaths to recognize the desperate situation the world was in.

"Never to use the One Power as a weapon except against Darkfriends or Shadowspawn, or in the last extreme defense of her life, the life of her Warder, or another Aes Sedai."

That's an extremely broad writ, especially in the context of a battle where everyone that isn't on your side is trying to kill you and/or every other Aes Sedai on the field.

Gnoman
Feb 11, 2014

"What we therefore hath joined together, let Gnoman put asunder..."


Honestly, I think most people would have little issue calling the people who are literally marching behind Satan's banner to be his allies.

Ghislaine of YOSPOS
Apr 19, 2020



the guys on the other side at the last battle are by definition dark friends

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!



Morbid Hound

Ghislaine of YOSPOS posted:

the guys on the other side at the last battle are by definition dark friends

More coworkers really

DarkHorse
Dec 13, 2006

Vroom Vroom, BEEP BEEP!

Nap Ghost

Distant Acquaintances of the Dark

Comrade Blyatlov
Aug 4, 2007


should have picked four fingers


And this dude.

Libluini
May 18, 2012

Did I predict the future?


Grimey Drawer

The way the oaths work, if you guys showed up at the last battle and managed to convince some Aes Sedai Sharans are not dark friends and no direct threat, they would be helpless until they convinced themselves you're full of poo poo.

Which is hilarious, really

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Vavrek
Mar 2, 2013

I like your style hombre, but this is no laughing matter. Assault on a police officer. Theft of police property. Illegal possession of a firearm. FIVE counts of attempted murder. That comes to... 29 dollars and 40 cents. Cash, cheque, or credit card?

I learned the other day that The Wheel of Time has a soundtrack album, by Robert Berry. It's an expanded version of the video game's soundtrack. While trying to find a place I could listen to it (which I eventually did, on YouTube), I learned about this other album, made by fans, reproducing several of the songs mentioned within the books: Threads from the Pattern. It's really good!
(They also have a good rendition of Jak o' the Shadows: https://reflectionsofsound.bandcamp.com/track/jak-o-the-shadows-a-memory-of-light-version)

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