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megane
Jun 20, 2008





When trying to predict the future, “the rich people involved all pocket a ton of money and the poor idiots who trusted them are left holding the bill” is a pretty safe bet.

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Mirificus
Oct 29, 2004

Kings need not raise their voices to be heard


after spending $3000 backing SC the new question is.... posted:

age and intellect have many common traits or young and dumb are usually in the same boat. youthful players are often looking for more speed and thrill and the aged players are looking for accuracy and depth.
much older players like SIM more than the rest and as i see the game patch after patch the game walks away from SIM and more gamey.
1 other thing that is a common trait is the older you are commonly means more money.... so the biggest backers are in their 50+
for me the more the game ignores SIM the less time i play the game.
as a rocket scientist and prior service navy vet, realize there isnt as single factor in flight mechanics that is even remotely accurate and they are moving away from accuracy each patch. for example missiles.... they are insanely expensive not all countries can afford missiles and they are i win buttons we can drop a small missile and remove anything from existence. america is the richest country and spend more on our military than any 2 other countries put together is why america can use so many..... and our size 10 equivalent missile can travel faster than any aircraft higher and farther and vaporize anything within miles!!!! so to see that you need 12 size 9 torps to kill an 890 is a joke.....
i say rid of missiles or make them to expensive to use!!!! and beam lasers are the god of weapons in real life as the biggest bomb will never make it to its destination if you have beam weapons as our more modern aircraft are equipping lasers and getting rid of anti missile measures as a laser kills a missile or you need to well time a flair to hope missile misses.
this game is pretty but unless your playing human gameplay where it is very SIM the flight is nonsense i mean 1 entrance on a MSR lol thats a joke ships in the early patches ships had many entrance and the newer ships only 1 entrance the game is moving to fail if you ask me
lol probably the most accurate thing they can do in this game is give the prospector a duel purpose with its beam laser hunt down any and all missils and melt them to nothing hahaha

Bofast
Feb 21, 2011



Grimey Drawer


I always ever since I played the obscure Mac game Orb Mazez back in 1992 or thereabouts.

Sanya Juutilainen
Jun 19, 2019

Every slur offends someone and people will just rebrand other words to slurs / potentially offensive meanings (see also: gay, trap) which will then get banned, eventually at some point the language will run out of words.


at some point the language will run out of words.

Hog Jowls posted:

"I won't lie to you about your chances of getting a game... but you have my contempt"

So I see that Elite Dangerous is on sale on Steam. Is a sub 8 dollar game really the "competition" as envisioned by shitizens, or is that just a nominal cost and they make all their money from selling spacebucks? I'm not big on space pew pew games so I've never played it - I follow SC entirely for the shitshow.

Elite as base is seven years old game, so it has been out for tiny money and even free on Epic, no reason to sell it for more anymore - who wanted it has it, so the pool to fish in is new players with massive discount and cosmetics. And of course Odyssey, which will be a full price again and will probably cash in quite well, even if only a million people buy it, it's ~43M USD injection.

Sanya Juutilainen fucked around with this message at 19:46 on Feb 22, 2021

MedicineHut
Feb 25, 2016



Dwesa posted:

Divert Attitude Control System (DACS) kinetic warheads: hover test. - good example for why the movement of SC ships is perfectly fine.

https://v.redd.it/6v911rsoxqi61/DASH_480.mp4


Ah, I see we are back to the good old "flight model is so good that it looks bad". Full circle.

Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs



Grimey Drawer


There's a lot of dumb stuff in that post, but I really want to know why they capitalize SIM.

MedicineHut
Feb 25, 2016



Strangler 42 posted:

They are either A) dumb as poo poo, B) being defrauded by Chris with false claims about the viability of the company as a whole, or C) Have a super secret plan to use their minority investment to wrest control of the company from Chris to potentially make some money off this scam before selling all their shares back to Chris, effectively cashing out and leaving CIG bankrupt. I'm leaning towards C because if all parties play their cards right, Chris and co can keep their accumulated salaries, Calders gets their money back plus some interest, Chris gets somebody to blame who doesn't care about how nerds on the the internet feel about being scammed, and the only victims are the backers, which is funny.

Zazz Razzamatazz
Apr 19, 2016

No hunks allowed, ya dangus

Pixelate posted:

It’s mainly in chug & repeat mode. Biggest news this year was probably SQ42 totally missing its internal beta dates in Q2/Q3. Shockingly. And the endless roadmap to a new roadmap to explain all this. (The roadmap shows fundamental SQ42 dev as running into 2022 at least).

Agent’s agents say this is happening behind the scenes.

The investors have invested another 17.25 million...

My favorite part of that:

quote:

The last time we demoed the game, it was heavily scripted. [QA] had been playing it for hours and hours, getting the right route [and content]. The investors wanted it live, so nothing pre-recorded like we are used to sending. Everyone got really quiet when [they] asked if they could play it themselves and not follow the script at all. Almost immediately after the controller was handed over, they crashed. [Someone in the meeting] nervously laughed. I think that was the day we lost a lot of confidence with our investors and they started really looking at our progress.

Jonny Shiloh
Mar 7, 2019
You 'orrible little man


God you thought Daymar was boring:



PS use the arrows top left to spin round through 360 degrees.

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable


Hog Jowls posted:

"I won't lie to you about your chances of getting a game... but you have my contempt"

So I see that Elite Dangerous is on sale on Steam. Is a sub 8 dollar game really the "competition" as envisioned by shitizens, or is that just a nominal cost and they make all their money from selling spacebucks? I'm not big on space pew pew games so I've never played it - I follow SC entirely for the shitshow.

It was actually recently free on Epic like a month ago.

But yeah, the "huge competition" is a game that's pretty aged at this point, and if you've played it you've played it and are probably done with it (though people still do play it, and apparently it has fantastic VR support), and seemingly out of the kindness of their hearts Frontier continues to give it actual DLC upgrades that get people to come back to it.

It's basically like Star Citizen is competing against something like Starflight because you can never try to find something to put yourself against, no matter how corny.

Unfortunately for SC, they keep getting their teeth kicked in by Frontier because they keep making progress, albeit in a pretty boring game, but it is still progress.

Ultimately, space shooters tend to be boring animals anyhow.

ronmcd
Aug 27, 2017


The Titanic posted:

It was actually recently free on Epic like a month ago.

But yeah, the "huge competition" is a game that's pretty aged at this point, and if you've played it you've played it and are probably done with it (though people still do play it, and apparently it has fantastic VR support), and seemingly out of the kindness of their hearts Frontier continues to give it actual DLC upgrades that get people to come back to it.

As Sanya mentioned above, Frontier will surely sell more than a million copies of their (full price) dlc. I wonder how long it'll take Braben to casually mention they've sold more copies of the dlc than CIG have games

LostRook
Jun 7, 2013


Jonny Shiloh posted:

God you thought Daymar was boring:

PS use the arrows top left to spin round through 360 degrees.

I was about to ask if this was from the new Mars rover, but the pictures from over 130 million miles away have much more clarity and the terrain design of Mars is much more inspired.

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable



As a rocket scientist... whew.

If that guy was one of the early backers who was enticed by CR when he was very much in his "simulated everything", I feel sorry for the guy. But as smart as he is I feel he should also realize that SC is everything anybody wants because it's marketed not to make a game but to sell a game to everybody.

A lot of people were super excited for the simulation, being talked about to be DCS level with interactive cockpit buttons and the whole nine yard affair.

Before SC became some weird walking simulator with a hunger meter with this insane focus on the FPS side of the game, it was all about space and the cool stuff ships would do.

From thrusters rotating and spitting out real thrust that mattered to being damaged and reducing your mobility, to ship to ship docking and repairs with different materials to damage done to physicalized components and stuff getting damaged because of where it was hit... it was looking like DCS/Kerbal in an action game!

Of course that only lasted so long, and then Santaball came around and suddenly SC was an esport game that would rival Star Craft and CoD, with death being faster than a CoD game and more realistic... and suddenly it was ARMA but also not because it was also arcade with the space ball game.

Then it was also a space racing game, and things just got more confusing because it was pretty much everything to everybody.

Didn't like PvP? Turn up/down your PvP slider to prevent people from attacking you or only certain kinds of people in some unknown range!

LTI! It's... something!

Did you like PvP? You could hunt anybody and everybody was a target! What's that about a slider? Not in out grindark universe! It's for all the bad players to be evil!

Were you a pirate? We love pirates! Buy this pirate ship!

Did you actually act like a pirate? gently caress, go to space prison you loser cheater. We hate you.

Space farming!

Space science!

Own a store on a planet!

Hunt procedural wildlife!

Be eaten by a sandworm!

Go explore a sandworm tunnel!

Watch a battle from across the galaxy using your portable space telescope module!

Mix a drink for passengers!

Board and take over space ships with marines who are all players!

Dynamically repair your damaged ships with ships that connect together to form space netting in some kind of repair thing and a giant repair ship.

Literally buy land on a planet! Defend that land also with NPCs somehow!

Yes, of course you can drive a tank around! And it's like a 2 story large tank!

Have dune buggy races! Load your dune buggies into your space ships!




---
Sorry Rocket Science guy. You would be better off buying a DCS module if you want a simulator because SC is never going to simulate anything except stories about all the simulation things you "can totally do (someday very soon we promise)!"

But if you like stories and don't mind being lied to by a predatory marketing department who will tell you everything and anything you want to hear to get you to spend more money, then by all means enjoy further. Buy a Javelin or something.

The Titanic fucked around with this message at 22:50 on Feb 22, 2021

Jonny Shiloh
Mar 7, 2019
You 'orrible little man


LostRook posted:

I was about to ask if this was from the new Mars rover, but the pictures from over 130 million miles away have much more clarity and the terrain design of Mars is much more inspired.

Yeah, the tesselation's horrendous and anyway, never forget, you could fit the whole of Jezero Crater inside Microtech... I mean, two Skyrim Radiant quests could fit underneath Miles Eckhardt's jacket... errm, a Star Citizen hotdog has more polygons than the entirety of Microprose's Civilization 2...

Scruffpuff
Dec 23, 2015

Fidelity. Wait, was I'm working on again?

The Titanic posted:

But if you like stories and don't mind being lied to by a predatory marketing department who will tell you everything and anything you want to hear to get you to spend more money, then by all means enjoy further. Buy a Javelin or something.

The reason the predatory marketing department is so successful is because backers don't think they're prey. But they very much are - in fact, they're the perfect prey: their resources regenerate over time, so they can be farmed repeatedly, and they think they're the predators, so they're not even watching out for predation.

News flash to backers: you're not the wolves, you're the sheep. You're not the lions, you're the gazelles. You're not the foxes, you're the chickens. If you weren't, you'd have succeeded in real life and not been desperate to escape into a fake one, trying to prove how much of a failure you aren't by conspicuously consuming worthless JPEGs for large dollar amounts, while simultaneously demanding those expenses give you permanent status.

You know who's more successful than SC believers? Everyone.

Zazz Razzamatazz
Apr 19, 2016

No hunks allowed, ya dangus

Jonny Shiloh posted:

God you thought Daymar was boring:



PS use the arrows top left to spin round through 360 degrees.

Pure FUD!

Once the Mars pipelines get going there will be more content in that landing zone than all of Skyrim!

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable


Scruffpuff posted:

The reason the predatory marketing department is so successful is because backers don't think they're prey. But they very much are - in fact, they're the perfect prey: their resources regenerate over time, so they can be farmed repeatedly, and they think they're the predators, so they're not even watching out for predation.

News flash to backers: you're not the wolves, you're the sheep. You're not the lions, you're the gazelles. You're not the foxes, you're the chickens. If you weren't, you'd have succeeded in real life and not been desperate to escape into a fake one, trying to prove how much of a failure you aren't by conspicuously consuming worthless JPEGs for large dollar amounts, while simultaneously demanding those expenses give you permanent status.

You know who's more successful than SC believers? Everyone.

You forgot whales.

TheAgent
Feb 16, 2002

The call is coming from inside Dr. House

Grimey Drawer

SirTagz posted:

I am sure it has been discussed earlier and I probably just missed it but...

What is the general thinking of the outlook of the current CIG investors of getting their money back from this project? It seems clear that it would take a lot of more time and money to get anything usable out to the consumers even under competent managements.. more than any investor would be willing to provide. So.. Beyond milking the JPEG market, is there ANY value to the entire company and bits and bytes that have been created? Companies sometimes get broken up and sold piecemeal - is something like this even possible here? What realistic options are there to squeeze money out of this thing?

Please feel free to point out some older post if this has been discussed lately. Thanks!
chris roberts has mentioned he'll move 10 million units of SQ42 in the first year its released (lol)

that's what they are banking on 100%

Muscle Tracer
Feb 23, 2007

Medals only weigh
one down.


Mirificus posted:

age and intellect have many common traits or young and dumb are usually in the same boat. youthful players are often looking for more speed and thrill and the aged players are looking for accuracy and depth.

only one thing thrills me more than someone couching their own subjective personal tastes as inherently intelligent--someone doing so with absolutely abysmal syntax!

Scruffpuff
Dec 23, 2015

Fidelity. Wait, was I'm working on again?

TheAgent posted:

chris roberts has mentioned he'll move 10 million units of SQ42 in the first year its released (lol)

that's what they are banking on 100%

This absolutely amazes me. He's taken so long working toward this goal (he made no progress toward this goal, nor ever had any chance of reaching it) that the entire industry has changed substantially enough to make the point moot. I wonder if he's still picturing his game prominently featuring in windows and endcaps at Electronics Boutique in the mall.*

*E.B. may not exist. Mall may not exist. Game definitely will not exist.

Awesome!
Oct 17, 2008

Ready for adventure!




90% of the people who will ever own star citizen already own it

TheAgent
Feb 16, 2002

The call is coming from inside Dr. House

Grimey Drawer

Scruffpuff posted:

This absolutely amazes me. He's taken so long working toward this goal (he made no progress toward this goal, nor ever had any chance of reaching it) that the entire industry has changed substantially enough to make the point moot. I wonder if he's still picturing his game prominently featuring in windows and endcaps at Electronics Boutique in the mall.*

*E.B. may not exist. Mall may not exist. Game definitely will not exist.
whoa whoa whoa now, haven't you read all the updates to the mess hall scene?

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable


Scruffpuff posted:

This absolutely amazes me. He's taken so long working toward this goal (he made no progress toward this goal, nor ever had any chance of reaching it) that the entire industry has changed substantially enough to make the point moot. I wonder if he's still picturing his game prominently featuring in windows and endcaps at Electronics Boutique in the mall.*

*E.B. may not exist. Mall may not exist. Game definitely will not exist.



Ostentatious
Sep 29, 2010

Spliffs out to the truth




The thing about Star Citizen is games exist in moments. Call of Duty cultivated a moment into being a popular franchise for a decade, same thing with World of Warcraft and even Super Mario Bros. Star Citizen will never have a moment, there will never be a time where a 12 year old kid wakes up and wants a 2500 spaceship when you can spend money in Roblox instead.

There has never been upward momentum for star citizen and there never will be.

Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs



Grimey Drawer

Star Citizens moment was remaking a 90s classic that people fondly remembered and backed for. Instead it's stuck chasing after the current trends in gaming and failing to make progress towards any sort of complete state.

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable


Ostentatious posted:

The thing about Star Citizen is games exist in moments. Call of Duty cultivated a moment into being a popular franchise for a decade, same thing with World of Warcraft and even Super Mario Bros. Star Citizen will never have a moment, there will never be a time where a 12 year old kid wakes up and wants a 2500 spaceship when you can spend money in Roblox instead.

There has never been upward momentum for star citizen and there never will be.

The cost of entry to have an enjoyable time and not be destroyed by literally everything is far too much for kids and I'd suggest most adults too. Most adults with sense will not plunk down that kind of money at one time. You got to milk them slowly over time.

And I'm still eager to see how crushing it is to advance ahead in the game. If it takes months to get a new ship people will just not have fun.

Kosumo
Apr 9, 2016



Scruffpuff posted:

This absolutely amazes me. He's taken so long working toward this goal (he made no progress toward this goal, nor ever had any chance of reaching it) that the entire industry has changed substantially enough to make the point moot. I wonder if he's still picturing his game prominently featuring in windows and endcaps at Electronics Boutique in the mall.*

*E.B. may not exist. Mall may not exist. Game definitely will not exist.

But Gamestop stock is up!

no_recall
Aug 17, 2015



Lipstick Apathy

Jonny Shiloh posted:

God you thought Daymar was boring:



PS use the arrows top left to spin round through 360 degrees.

Looks like Elite Dangerous, boring as hell.

Thoatse
Feb 29, 2016

It's just a pledge bro!


https://i.imgur.com/7S9ikTu.mp4

bandaid.friend
Apr 25, 2017



Dwesa posted:

Divert Attitude Control System (DACS) kinetic warheads: hover test. - good example for why the movement of SC ships is perfectly fine.

https://v.redd.it/6v911rsoxqi61/DASH_480.mp4


drat imagine trying to use the jacuzzi in this thing

SMEGMA_MAIL
May 4, 2018




Dwesa posted:

Divert Attitude Control System (DACS) kinetic warheads: hover test. - good example for why the movement of SC ships is perfectly fine.

https://v.redd.it/6v911rsoxqi61/DASH_480.mp4


drat I can’t believe we finally invented no clip. This is revolutionary.

Blue On Blue
Nov 14, 2012



The Titanic posted:

As a rocket scientist... whew.

If that guy was one of the early backers who was enticed by CR when he was very much in his "simulated everything", I feel sorry for the guy. But as smart as he is I feel he should also realize that SC is everything anybody wants because it's marketed not to make a game but to sell a game to everybody.

A lot of people were super excited for the simulation, being talked about to be DCS level with interactive cockpit buttons and the whole nine yard affair.

Before SC became some weird walking simulator with a hunger meter with this insane focus on the FPS side of the game, it was all about space and the cool stuff ships would do.

From thrusters rotating and spitting out real thrust that mattered to being damaged and reducing your mobility, to ship to ship docking and repairs with different materials to damage done to physicalized components and stuff getting damaged because of where it was hit... it was looking like DCS/Kerbal in an action game!

Of course that only lasted so long, and then Santaball came around and suddenly SC was an esport game that would rival Star Craft and CoD, with death being faster than a CoD game and more realistic... and suddenly it was ARMA but also not because it was also arcade with the space ball game.

Then it was also a space racing game, and things just got more confusing because it was pretty much everything to everybody.

Didn't like PvP? Turn up/down your PvP slider to prevent people from attacking you or only certain kinds of people in some unknown range!

LTI! It's... something!

Did you like PvP? You could hunt anybody and everybody was a target! What's that about a slider? Not in out grindark universe! It's for all the bad players to be evil!

Were you a pirate? We love pirates! Buy this pirate ship!

Did you actually act like a pirate? gently caress, go to space prison you loser cheater. We hate you.

Space farming!

Space science!

Own a store on a planet!

Hunt procedural wildlife!

Be eaten by a sandworm!

Go explore a sandworm tunnel!

Watch a battle from across the galaxy using your portable space telescope module!

Mix a drink for passengers!

Board and take over space ships with marines who are all players!

Dynamically repair your damaged ships with ships that connect together to form space netting in some kind of repair thing and a giant repair ship.

Literally buy land on a planet! Defend that land also with NPCs somehow!

Yes, of course you can drive a tank around! And it's like a 2 story large tank!

Have dune buggy races! Load your dune buggies into your space ships!




---
Sorry Rocket Science guy. You would be better off buying a DCS module if you want a simulator because SC is never going to simulate anything except stories about all the simulation things you "can totally do (someday very soon we promise)!"

But if you like stories and don't mind being lied to by a predatory marketing department who will tell you everything and anything you want to hear to get you to spend more money, then by all means enjoy further. Buy a Javelin or something.

Time has shown us before that games which focus TOO much on being super specific and hardcore fidelitious don't last long once the honeymoon phase is over

I'm thinking of Hellion specifically, which was VERY unforgiving and modelled everything you could ever want re: space and vaccum and such

It never made it out of early access , as far as most people were concerned. Everyone that was going to bought it in the first 1-3 years after it launched in 2017, and then they called an end of development in 2019 stating there was no more income and couldn't afford to keep the servers up

March 2020 they officially disbanded the dev team and that's the end of that story.

What I'm trying to say is, the same is / will happen with SC , no matter how good a game it turns out to be.

Whoever said 90% of the people who want to play the game have already bought it is very true, even if the whales buy another 10 copies to try and keep it afloat on release day it won't matter. The game is dead already and hasn't even been released to the public

It's just a matter of time now until the money starts to run out and Chris can't keep spending 10k a month on server costs, I call the first sign will be them closing up a studio and playing it off as 'no longer needed because the development is so close to being finished'

It may be 1-2-3 more years but it's coming sure as taxes

SMEGMA_MAIL
May 4, 2018




I thought it would have folded two years ago and I was 100% wrong. It just keeps grifting along

Thoatse
Feb 29, 2016

It's just a pledge bro!


Awesome! posted:

90% of the people who will ever own star citizen already own it


100% of the people that have Star Citizen are already owned

Scruffpuff
Dec 23, 2015

Fidelity. Wait, was I'm working on again?

SpaceSDoorGunner posted:

I thought it would have folded two years ago and I was 100% wrong. It just keeps grifting along

Yeah it's odd. But they are not just floating on whale oil. They needed a bank loan some years back, then they got investors, and I'm not sure how many times you can pull that trick and still have nothing to show for it. I won't bother predicting when this collapses because history shows that it's impossible to tell. But the fact that they keep on trucking is not an indication of progress, or success, it's just an indication that really stupid people are still shoveling money into the furnace. I suspect, with the amount of money we're talking about, and the incredible burn rate due to ludicrous unnecessary expenses to make CIG look like a game development studio, that the end will be swift and sudden. Chris is never getting his 10 million copies sold, he's never getting millions of dollars in residual monthly income from subscribers. The money they're going to get is the money they've already gotten. If they needed bank loans and investors to stay afloat, then whales alone won't be enough to keep the lights on, even if they do a Tier-0 release.

"Release" date is going to be a cut and run, followed by CIG servers going dark, followed by petitions by the community to release the code so they can run their own servers, just like we've seen hundreds of times before. And the backers will be howling into the void as Chris wanders off to his next grift.

L. Ron Hoover
Nov 9, 2009


Blue On Blue posted:

even if the whales buy another 10 copies to try and keep it afloat on release day it won't matter.

How about 10 Idrises?

lobsterminator
Oct 16, 2012






The Titanic posted:

The cost of entry to have an enjoyable time and not be destroyed by literally everything is far too much for kids and I'd suggest most adults too. Most adults with sense will not plunk down that kind of money at one time. You got to milk them slowly over time.

And I'm still eager to see how crushing it is to advance ahead in the game. If it takes months to get a new ship people will just not have fun.

I'm sure they will introduce ship leasing, a.k.a. the Idris-as-a-service model.

MedicineHut
Feb 25, 2016



ronmcd posted:

As Sanya mentioned above, Frontier will surely sell more than a million copies of their (full price) dlc. I wonder how long it'll take Braben to casually mention they've sold more copies of the dlc than CIG have games

Ironically the same critiques SC fanatics have repeatedly thrown over ED about the lack of first person gameplay would have also probably helped built up a ton of hype for it and will probably contribute to those sales, if it does sale well. Thanks SC shitheads!

CeeJee
Dec 4, 2001


Oven Wrangler

lobsterminator posted:

I'm sure they will introduce ship leasing, a.k.a. the Idris-as-a-service model.

It's not as good or easy as the current dreams-as-a-service model.

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DigitalPenny
Sep 3, 2018



TheAgent posted:

chris roberts has mentioned he'll move 10 million units of SQ42 in the first year its released (lol)

that's what they are banking on 100%

His game will be so good he won't need the reach of epic or steam. Customers will be blowing up the RSI severs for a chance to get in on the action.

He could sell other games on his platform for 40% cut because of the tech they developed in it.

Sky is the limit when you are full of poo poo.

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