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SG Bamboo
Aug 21, 2013

I will never shake your hand.

Ever.


Bushmeister posted:

After some Discord talk about Jericho's impending retirement and how he's obviously going to go out as a babyface in the end, made me think: what big names, if any, have retired from in-ring competition as heels to the end? Career heels like Abdullah The Butcher seem, if they make it that far, to become kind of beloved figures in the end so you can't really count on that. Did anyone ever walk away from the ring for good while doing the full MJF shtick?

Takashi Iizuka. It looked like Tenzan was finally going to bring him back to the light, but he ran off screaming into the night never to be seen again, his Iron Fingers all that remains

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Hirez
Feb 3, 2003

Weber scored 49 points?



Davros1 posted:

Heenan called the move a "Stupid-Plex".


lo loving l

jesus WEP
Oct 17, 2004



Fun Shoe

TheKingslayer posted:

This really is accurate for JBL as a person

man where was this meme when he wrote that big thing attacking statesí continued use of the confederate flag

Vagabundo
Mar 20, 2007

Ya like Little Wayne?


JBL is a land of contrasts.

He also came down firmly on the side of BLM.

britishbornandbread
Jul 8, 2000

You'll stumble in my footsteps


Iíve gone down a ring boy scandal worm hole today, watching the Larry King and the Donahue appearances by Vince McMahon. My question is more general - what was, and/or is, the relationship both professionally and personally between Vince and Dave Meltzer? I donít follow the dirt sheets in any way, though I find Meltzer interesting, so i donít really know how he gets his scoops about the WWF then WWE. Does Vince use him in any way? Do they talk about the business? I find it interesting Dave is consistently denigrated by wrestlers and fans alike yet seemingly wields such influence.

Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.

I seem to recall reading somewhere that before one of the shows they did together, maybe Donahue, Vince turned to Meltzer and made a "This is gonna suck" sort of remark.

There was also a story that when Lance Cade died, Meltzer got a message that Vince needed to get in touch with him urgently, only for it to turn out that it was a mistake because Vince thought Lance Storm had died??

collocation
Jun 17, 2018



britishbornandbread posted:

Iíve gone down a ring boy scandal worm hole today, watching the Larry King and the Donahue appearances by Vince McMahon. My question is more general - what was, and/or is, the relationship both professionally and personally between Vince and Dave Meltzer? I donít follow the dirt sheets in any way, though I find Meltzer interesting, so i donít really know how he gets his scoops about the WWF then WWE. Does Vince use him in any way? Do they talk about the business? I find it interesting Dave is consistently denigrated by wrestlers and fans alike yet seemingly wields such influence.

Dave was very briefly employed by WWE during their early expansion to keep them up to date on what was going on in Japan. During certain portions of time in later years, Vince would call Dave to discuss things. I believe this mostly ended after the Invasion. None of this stopped Dave from being very critical of WWE, and iirc, WWE tried to somehow mess with his real life newspaper employment when he was covering the Sgt Slaughter WM7 angle. I believe that there is an Observer that details that whole thing.

dracula vladdy AF
May 6, 2011


I don't know a whole lot about wrestling history. Back in the 2000s there were a bunch of SmackDown branded games, before they started doing Smackdown vs Raw and eventually just having more general WWE games. Why was it SmackDown specifically that got games to begin with, instead of Raw? Was it a popularity thing, or was Raw meant for more developmental or less over talent or something like that?

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010



Meltzer said around the time Invasion was going to begin, Vince was calling him regularly, picking his brain for what Dave felt would be the best booking plan. Dave said buy the contracts of the major stars, let them get heat on the WWE guys and dominate, then have your top guys fight them off and retain some of the top WCW guys to help your star power.

Vince of course, did a mutated version of that where most of the top guys didn't get brought in until much later if at all, and most of them got buried. Plus you have to insert all of the McMahons, from Vince to Shecky.

1glitch0
Sep 4, 2018

DEAN OF THE LOCAL ARCADE


dracula vladdy AF posted:

I don't know a whole lot about wrestling history. Back in the 2000s there were a bunch of SmackDown branded games, before they started doing Smackdown vs Raw and eventually just having more general WWE games. Why was it SmackDown specifically that got games to begin with, instead of Raw? Was it a popularity thing, or was Raw meant for more developmental or less over talent or something like that?

IIRC it was because Smackdown was "The Rock's show". Raw has always been the flagship, even when it isn't.

Diabolik900
Mar 28, 2007



dracula vladdy AF posted:

I don't know a whole lot about wrestling history. Back in the 2000s there were a bunch of SmackDown branded games, before they started doing Smackdown vs Raw and eventually just having more general WWE games. Why was it SmackDown specifically that got games to begin with, instead of Raw? Was it a popularity thing, or was Raw meant for more developmental or less over talent or something like that?

It was just a name. The series started before the brand split, so SmackDown was just the name of one of their shows, and didnít specifically denote only half the roster. And even after the brand split, the games still included both brands.

Davros1
Jul 19, 2007

You've got to admit, you are kind of implausible





dracula vladdy AF posted:

I don't know a whole lot about wrestling history. Back in the 2000s there were a bunch of SmackDown branded games, before they started doing Smackdown vs Raw and eventually just having more general WWE games. Why was it SmackDown specifically that got games to begin with, instead of Raw? Was it a popularity thing, or was Raw meant for more developmental or less over talent or something like that?

They went with Smackdown because it was the Rock's catchphrase and new show, but it was only for the Playstation. The Xbox got their own game named after "Raw", and the N64/Gamecube had games named after PPVs. But the Smackdown games proved to be the most popular, so they eventually evolved into that series.

saffi faildotter
Mar 2, 2007



dracula vladdy AF posted:

I don't know a whole lot about wrestling history. Back in the 2000s there were a bunch of SmackDown branded games, before they started doing Smackdown vs Raw and eventually just having more general WWE games. Why was it SmackDown specifically that got games to begin with, instead of Raw? Was it a popularity thing, or was Raw meant for more developmental or less over talent or something like that?

There were Raw games for the original Xbox and they were terrible - they made Raw and Raw 2 before switching to Wrestlemania 21 because Raw as a gaming brand was so poo poo, then WM21 was even worse. The Gamecube had Wrestlemania X8 and XIX before swapping to Day of Reckoning, then when new consoles came around they just made everything SvR. X8 I think is the one where you can hurl hapless construction workers to their deaths.

e: nope, that's XIX, you're trying to destroy Wrestlemania and Vince McMahon and this involves beating up construction crews, destroying merchandise, etc.

saffi faildotter fucked around with this message at 22:10 on Apr 3, 2021

sticklefifer
Nov 11, 2003

TOO EASY

Vagabundo posted:

JBL is a land of contrasts.

He also came down firmly on the side of BLM.
I know a few "fiscally conservative/socially liberal" people, and knowing what I know about real life JBL he's probably that. Like they care about justice and regulations not oppressing marginalized people, but not enough to do anything systemic about it because that's expensive.

Stealth Tiger
Nov 14, 2009



Raw 2 let you drop an anvil on Goldust's head, it was great

Nick Jr. Face
Apr 23, 2010







sticklefifer posted:

I know a few "fiscally conservative/socially liberal" people, and knowing what I know about real life JBL he's probably that. Like they care about justice and regulations not oppressing marginalized people, but not enough to do anything systemic about it because that's expensive.
I used to tell people the same thing about myself before I got out of my dipshit suburban bubble

Lamuella
Jun 26, 2003

It's like goldy or bronzy, but made of iron.




sticklefifer posted:

I know a few "fiscally conservative/socially liberal" people, and knowing what I know about real life JBL he's probably that. Like they care about justice and regulations not oppressing marginalized people, but not enough to do anything systemic about it because that's expensive.

Basically he's this guy.

Only registered members can see post attachments!

Web Jew.0
May 13, 2009


Bushmeister posted:

After some Discord talk about Jericho's impending retirement and how he's obviously going to go out as a babyface in the end, made me think: what big names, if any, have retired from in-ring competition as heels to the end? Career heels like Abdullah The Butcher seem, if they make it that far, to become kind of beloved figures in the end so you can't really count on that. Did anyone ever walk away from the ring for good while doing the full MJF shtick?

Batista

jesus WEP
Oct 17, 2004



Fun Shoe

nope lol

1glitch0
Sep 4, 2018

DEAN OF THE LOCAL ARCADE


Bushmeister posted:

After some Discord talk about Jericho's impending retirement and how he's obviously going to go out as a babyface in the end, made me think: what big names, if any, have retired from in-ring competition as heels to the end? Career heels like Abdullah The Butcher seem, if they make it that far, to become kind of beloved figures in the end so you can't really count on that. Did anyone ever walk away from the ring for good while doing the full MJF shtick?

Ted DiBiase?

Nystral
Feb 6, 2002

Every man likes a pretty girl with him at a skeleton dance.


1glitch0 posted:

Ted DiBiase?

Didnít he turn face while at WCW and working with the Steiners against the NWO?

1glitch0
Sep 4, 2018

DEAN OF THE LOCAL ARCADE


Nystral posted:

Didnít he turn face while at WCW and working with the Steiners against the NWO?

Hmm, maybe. I literally have no memory of that, but I believe you. Anything could happen during the NWO era!

Moe_Rahn
Jun 1, 2006

I got a question
why they hatin' on me?
I ain't did nothin' to 'em
but count this money
and put my team on
got my whole clique stunnin'
boy wassup
yeeeeeaaaaaahhhh

Stealth Tiger posted:

Raw 2 let you drop an anvil on Goldust's head, it was great
I maintain that Stone Cold Set's Some Trap's is one of the funniest videos in the history of the world

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXfLotjWlrE

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


Nystral posted:

Didnít he turn face while at WCW and working with the Steiners against the NWO?

He did, but was just as a manager. Even as a wrestler he had one last run in All Japan after the WWF which is what convinced him to retire since the new style was so hard on his body.

Cerebral Bore
Apr 21, 2010




Fun Shoe

MassRafTer posted:

He did, but was just as a manager. Even as a wrestler he had one last run in All Japan after the WWF which is what convinced him to retire since the new style was so hard on his body.

I've actually never thought of that, but it makes a lot of sense. I'd imagine going from 1993 WWF to 1993 All Japan would be one hell of a culture shock.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


Cerebral Bore posted:

I've actually never thought of that, but it makes a lot of sense. I'd imagine going from 1993 WWF to 1993 All Japan would be one hell of a culture shock.

The difference between All Japan when he left and came back is wild to think about.

The Grey
Mar 2, 2004



sticklefifer posted:

I know a few "fiscally conservative/socially liberal" people, and knowing what I know about real life JBL he's probably that. Like they care about justice and regulations not oppressing marginalized people, but not enough to do anything systemic about it because that's expensive.

This is how Jesse Ventura got elected governor.

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010



The Grey posted:

This is how Jesse Ventura got elected governor.

Well, that and his opponents had the charisma of a ham sandwich that was left in the rain

Vagabundo
Mar 20, 2007

Ya like Little Wayne?


Nystral posted:

Didnít he turn face while at WCW and working with the Steiners against the NWO?

Won't Heenan count as well?

TheKingslayer
Sep 3, 2008

There are no men like me. There's only me.





El Gallinero Gros posted:

Well, that and his opponents had the charisma of a ham sandwich that was left in the rain

I love that one Jesse interview where a reporter pushes him on something and Jesse responds by saying, "Oh yeah well look at these pipes?" And flexes and then starts calling the reporter a wimp.

Seams
Feb 3, 2005


Jesse Ventura rules

Admiral Joeslop
Jul 8, 2010






Did Heenan ever manage anyone as a face after he established himself as a heel manager? Was he ever really a face in WCW besides opposing the nWo?

CombineThresher
Apr 10, 2006

GIT R DONNE



Admiral Joeslop posted:

Did Heenan ever manage anyone as a face after he established himself as a heel manager? Was he ever really a face in WCW besides opposing the nWo?

This probably doesn't count, but he guest-managed a face tag team in ROH against two heels managed by Cornette.

Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.

As Jesse Ventura once said, "drat it Leslie Knope, what have you gotten me into this time?"

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003

Get running
Start pumping your bunions, I'm coming
I'm the dumbest, who flamethrow your function to Funyons
Flame your crew quicker than Trump fucks his youngest
Now face the flame fuckers your fame and fate's done with





TheKingslayer posted:

I love that one Jesse interview where a reporter pushes him on something and Jesse responds by saying, "Oh yeah well look at these pipes?" And flexes and then starts calling the reporter a wimp.

Ah, so there's where 10 got it from.

collocation
Jun 17, 2018



Admiral Joeslop posted:

Did Heenan ever manage anyone as a face after he established himself as a heel manager? Was he ever really a face in WCW besides opposing the nWo?

He managed Colt as a face for a night in ROH.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


The two matches where Heenan and Cornette manage against each other in ROH are basically exactly the same but are both some of the most fun stuff you can watch. Not the last entertaining thing Cornette has been involved with, but one of them.

collocation
Jun 17, 2018



MassRafTer posted:

The two matches where Heenan and Cornette manage against each other in ROH are basically exactly the same but are both some of the most fun stuff you can watch. Not the last entertaining thing Cornette has been involved with, but one of them.

It was really cool seeing how joyful Colt was about having Heenan there.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


collocation posted:

It was really cool seeing how joyful Colt was about having Heenan there.

It's especially cool after how lame the Steamboat vs Foley feud and resulting tag match came off.

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bessantj
Jul 27, 2004




I've just seen the two part Dark Side of the Right episodes on Chris Benoit and was wondering of William Regal ever spoke at length about Benoit's death? There was an interesting comment from Jericho, he says he wasn't at the memorial show, he was at home with a bottle of vodka trying to process Benoit's death. Then he sees Regal come on the screen and say something like "All I'll say is Chris Benoiot was one of the hardest workers in wrestling." After he saw that Jericho said knew that what he had heard wasn't the whole story.

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