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NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Tasoth posted:

Jumping in late to the Demon chat.

If I remember right, there is an Exploit or Embed (Demon magic powers) that lets you replicate supernatural effects. Not sure what book it is in.
Both effects you're thinking of are from Flower of Hell, the DtD player's guide. Deep Cover is an Embed that lets you register as some type of supernatural when using Spoof instead of just pinging as a human. Show of Power is an Exploit that lets you outright fake any supernatural effect you've perceived that isn't a DtD power, at either 1 success or at 3 for an exceptional success. Both are pretty cool for keeping everyone else guessing and/or perpetuating a supernatural Cover.

e;f,b

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NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Is there anything mentioned in that Dragonlance box set about the origin of gully dwarves, kender, etc.? I recall someone in the very abortive Let's Read thread saying that gully dwarves were a sideways miscegenation reference, which if true is quite :stonk:

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Libertad! posted:

I have plans to re-review the Key of Destiny adventure path, but the old threads that host it give me a malware warning (from minmaxboards.com apparently, a now-defunct site) so out of respect to peoples' computers I'd start it anew rather than continue from where I left off. It's a major undertaking of 3 sourcebooks nearing 800 pages total, so it'd likely be a later review if at all.
minmax went under? What happened? Did they get hacked again, or just disappear due to waning interest in 3E?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






I mean, I've slowly come to realize that I'm spoiled compared to the average American food sahel, let alone British cuisine. I didn't know that most kale was green until my twenties because my parents grew a purple varietal. If my father weren't really territorial in the kitchen I probably would have learned a lot from him and his wall of cookbooks.

What I'm saying is :justpost:.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






I'm surprised you didn't mention Neiglish Rot in that teardown. :vomarine:

Given the roller coaster of 2E adventures, I'd be interested to see an assessment of 4E's printed adventures. Hopefully C7 have learned the lesson that GW didn't?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






wdarkk posted:

I've had Lancer ever since the kickstarter, but never really had much chance to mess around with it. How hard would it be to hack it to run Super Robot Wars? The narrative/mech split feels incredibly SRW.
What are you looking for when you say you want to "run Super Robot Wars"? I've seen very little SRW and the bits I have seen were poorly explained. The best I got was "mech crossovers with some kind of tactical grid fighting".

Lancer is very much a tactical combat game with the traditional battlegrid, but it's not encounter-to-encounter. Instead much of its DNA ultimately derives from D&D (4E in particular), so you've got a far-future Adventuring Day made up of several encounters that each contribute attrition on the party. (Lancer's Adventuring Day is a lot more loose than anything I've seen in D&D, but you shouldn't ignore it.) Additionally there's an emphasis on mixing up your encounter objectives; don't just make everything into "defeat your opponents".

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






wdarkk posted:

I guess my question is, how hard would it be to make thinly-veiled knockoffs of the Gundam, Getter, and Mazinger? The Getter would probably be the sticking point since it has three pilots (who would probably all be controlled by one player, because come on).
What do each of those do so far as mecha go? "Using weapons" is easy enough, but I'm not familiar with those beyond "names exist". In the case of the Getter, how does it having three pilots influence what it does and how? (To compare it with something I'm more familiar with, the mechs in Pacific Rim have two pilots for story reasons but that doesn't change their functions beyond our fictional standards for mecha.)

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Nessus posted:

Yeah I just have no idea how Lancer works mechanically, most of the discourse is about it having Good Politics. In D&D terms it would not be inaccurate to give the Gundam or Mazinger a high AC, it would just represent different things, and Mazinger would probably have additional damage reduction effects on top of that, while the Gundam would not.

Does the attrition thing represent a campaign or is it meant to be like explicitly "a single extended sortie"?
Those two could probably work. I don't believe Lancer has anything to mimic the Mazinger's berserker mode (getting stronger with damage) but otherwise you can just call it a day narratively with more focus on HP and recovery. As for the Getter, uh...either find ways to bring and/or use a variety of weapons (multiple mounts, certain talents, the Uncle-Class COMP/CON) or just reflavor something that innately has versatility like the Ushabti Omnigun on the Pegasus. As above, combiners are right out.

As for the attrition thing it's more the "single extended sortie":
  • If you have an hour you can rest, to spend repairs to replenish mech HP and otherwise replenish things that are per-encounter.
  • Full Repairs take 10 hours, and are thus more limited. You get to replenish all your resources during one but the GM might give you Power at a Cost if you're in a desperate situation.
  • The baseline is for PCs to go 1-2 encounters between rests and 3-4 encounters between Full Repairs. Fudge if necessary.
  • You level up at the end of whatever mission you're on, independent of the rest/Full Repair mechanics.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Cythereal posted:

Ultroloths are the big cheeses of the yugoloths and at CR 16 are going to get blapped out of existence by :smugwizard: because most of their CR is invested in big numbers rather than magic.
3.0 was also infamous for overestimating CRs even by the general standards of D&D 3E. I think people estimated that ultroloth at something more like CR 13 or lower. (There was one nutjob on the Wizards forums who swore up and down that No Really the ultroloth was CR 16; they got laughed out.)

The Chad Jihad posted:

Kolyarut:" A pact is a pact, my good bitch" *smashes crystal holding elder evil*
I mean, if you want to review that book then :justpost:

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Wasn't Accursed co-developed by forumsgoer Croatian Alzheimers?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Everyone posted:

[Jim Butcher is bad at research]I want to upgrade Wrigley Field by adding a huge parking lot to it[/Jim Butcher is bad at research].
What's going on here? It's been years since I stopped paying attention to Dresden Files stuff and I don't remember that bit. And I've never been to Chicago except for the airport.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






At least when as per local tradition I soak my fries in vinegar, I know there's not much potato flavor that's getting covered up in the first place. That's part of the point of french fry condiments, to impart actual flavor to what's otherwise starch and cooking oil.

Meanwhile weird hot dog variations exist all over. I'd probably try most of them if given the opportunity, because gently caress it why not! There's no one right way to cook nearly everything. (NB: 0 != 1)

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Oh, when did they add a nun character?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Omnicrom posted:

She was in the base set of the 2e Board Game. They're bringing her over into the card game in October's expansion (along with A student/deep one hybrid, a fisherman/deep one hybrid, James Bond but a woman from the 1920s so more awesome, and a famous stage magician who learned actual magic). Note that said nun can't actually use a sawed off shotgun because she's insufficiently Roguish. So for the record you can be a monster killing Nun with one or more of a Machete, a magical cursed blade, a magical non-cursed blade, a Shotgun, a .45 Thompson, a Flamethrower, or a Yithian Lightning Gun. However you cannot be a monster killing Nun with a Switchblade, Garrote Wire, Different kind of .45 thompson, .41 Deringer, Fancy looking Flintlock, or Sawed Off Shotgun.

Arkham Horror is way Pulpy to its benefit. If you run into The King in Yellow, you absolutely can light him on fire and you better believe that does something. The real challenge is not whether or not you can beat Hastur with a flamethrower because you totally can, the real thing you have to be worrying about is whether you have enough fuel in the tank to do it, and if you don't then thankfully the person playing your priest buddy can provide you with some blessed gasoline the deals bonus damage because that's a card you can play.
I looked her up and wow how did I forget Sister Mary. Probably because there are a lot of strange characters to that game and she's comparatively normal. My favorite was the gravedigger, William Yorick, even with his cripplingly low Speed. Did they rebalance Patrice Hathaway to be less overpowered or is she still as nuts as before?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Do we need the pizza alignment chart to settle this? :v:

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Nessus posted:

If you drink the Black Blood of the Earth three times, do you become a Gaian fomor?
No you just become really wired because you drank too much coffee concentrate. (Yes I know it's a reference; Phil Broughton himself notes this.)

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






megane posted:

If you're on Windows 10: hold the Win key and press ; to bring up a little window, then accented letters are under Ω -> Ç .
:psyduck: WTF is this wizardry? How did I never hear of this before?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






JcDent posted:

#1 rule for smart bombs is not to make them smart enough to object.
Wasn't that the premise of Dark Star?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






CroatianAlzheimers posted:

Rising Tempest. Brother Szobchak is introduced on page 79. They did a great piece of art for him, too.
I had to look him up manually and his name is actually spelled Szobczak, Ctrl-F or Ctrl-Shift-F got me nothing for Szobchak. And he's distinct from Goremann the Elder in Rites of Battle, so that makes for two black comedy goofball dreadnoughts in DW rather than just one. :v:

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






"DM empowerment" and the It's All Optional paragraph comprise another iteration of those lazy sidebars you see in older White Wolf games (or their reprints half the time). You're told that if you don't like the rules, you can just change them maaaan~. Just because you can change the rules, doesn't mean that you'll be good at it or that you should have to in the first place. You paid money for what might as well be an incomplete product! All of that is just an excuse to not actually stand by or follow through with the rules and guidelines. If the designers have so much confidence in the text they wrote, why do they feel the need to hedge like this?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Feats proper started out in 3e, where the big draw was that they would open up more character options because you got 7 over your adventuring career independent of your class. In practice this was not true because a lot of feats plugged directly into class features, and because some class features (hello fighter) were just about getting more feats from a curated list. Add to this that the design space of "what is a feat" was poorly defined, so you could have Toughness (+3 HP) and Leadership (get a minion at level - 2) in the same book. There was even a sentiment in those days that Feats Should Be Nice Not Necessary, a response to how some feats were so defining that the gap between the haves and have-nots was insurmountable. Natural Spell for druids, Adaptive Style for swordsages, etc. Finally, well...there were far too many feats. The final total was somewhere in the four digits.

4e kept feats around largely because it was an evolution of 3e but with some actual design work put in. The design space of what a feat meant was tightened up considerably, so while one character might be notably more powerful than another based on feats they could still participate side-by-side. Ironically even more feats were tailored to classes, but by the same token this was intentional and so the designers were more confident about using them as class extensions. As for the problems, well, there were still a lot of feats. And some of them were stealth math fixes that should have been folded into errata or something.

AFAIK 5e has gone back to the 3e methods of "we'll just wing it" but more so because they're "optional" and you're choosing between them and ASIs. At least they haven't published a sourcebook's worth of feats yet.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Everyone posted:

I remember trying to play 3rd ed. and living in terror that my character would suffocate or die from a hernia because he forgot to take the Breath Oxygen or Take a poo poo Feat. Not literally but the idea that at any given point, I'd miss taking some vitally necessary thing without which my character would be useless from that point forward.

TheGreatEvilKing posted:

I have no idea how you were supposed to play 3rd ed without charop forums.
A lot of those problems were "solved" by papering over issues with your group. And the CharOp forums did have discussions about this and what it meant! I recall Caelic's 10 Rules for Practical Optimization about how people shouldn't just work inside this theorycrafting bubble, the Oberoni Fallacy as a statement that "if you fix a problem that does not negate the existence of the problem in the first place", or JaronK's Tier System which was all about organizing classes into groups for ease of interaction with each other. (Like how wizards and fighters together is a poor idea, but wizards and bards or bards and fighters could do alright separately.)

All this had to be teased together after the fact, because 3e wasn't good about communicating what it was supposed to be about. To its credit the DMG talks about the adventuring day and encounter pacing. There's even a one-page discussion on wandering monsters! But then all the player-facing stuff is this toolkit stuff, where the designers just threw in whatever they thought of from moment to moment without a proper sense of curation or what a Taunt feat means in the context of exception-based design. NPC statblocks that aren't just Elf Expert 7 are mostly about combat material, and most PC resources are combat-facing*, so regardless of whether adventure writers want people to try to talk their way past monsters they're going to look at most problems with swords in hand.

I played 3e three times, in 2004/2005/2013. No one in the group had a clue about optimization in 2004 so we just winged it because it was what we had. In 2005, well, I played a druid and accidentally broke the GM's encounters. (Yay CoDzilla!) In 2013 I was far and away the most knowledgeable person and 3e was what the group had voted for. I sucked it up and deliberately avoided making a combat monster, choosing instead to play a support character.

*The single most broken item in 3e was the Wand of Cure Light Wounds because it completely invalidated the core gameplay loop for half the printed classes. More and more I realize that people who didn't like 4e healing surges fundamentally don't actually want to play D&D.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






TheGreatEvilKing posted:

The "core gameplay loop" of fighter/blaster wizard/single-hand rogue tumbling into flanking position/healbot cleric is busted and hates you. Attempting to fight something like a hydra, troll, or frost giant in melee is an exercise is losing because those jerks have more HP, arbitrary amounts of natural armor, and vicious melee attack chains that will put warrior classes in the dumpster. Fighting anything else is a crapshoot of whether or not the DM understands how well the game really works and whether or not they're going to have monsters deliberately lowball tactics to not splatter people all over the floor. God help you if you run into a mind flayer or a demon or something, you're probably going to die, and your healer sure can't keep up with incoming damage.

If we're talking about the adventuring day, I've literally never seen healing used in combat until people actually went down, and most damage mitigation is just stacking crowd control to create the Bioware Zone a la Dragon Age origins and then shooting everything inside to death. You still ran out of spell slots to power your CC spells, and at that point those spell slots are the only thing standing between the party and getting mind controlled to death. High power 3.5 is a silly place.
Fighter/blaster wizard/etc. was the way D&D ended up playtested but I'm not claiming that was the actual core gameplay loop. In particular that was a response to how late 2e worked, where the casters could just go nova with a full complement of spells and then use some obscure 2nd-level cleric spell for a quick rest and refresh. (Ask NinjaDebugger for more details, they were around for the playtest scene from there through 4e.) The core gameplay loop of the adventuring day is more generally about husbanding your resources over a series of encounters (since the late 90's: combats) and dealing with the attrition thereof. Engaging with this doesn't require in-combat healing, so long as you can still treat HP and by extension things that replenish it as daily resources. Unfortunately this is a single point of failure; if you invalidate HP as a daily resource then you decouple anyone who solely uses that to connect with the adventuring day.

Regardless, the way "you were supposed to play 3rd ed without charop forums" was gentleman's agreements. :v: Not claiming it's a good answer, but it was the answer.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






The Lone Badger posted:

Doesn't banning charop forums means there's an even wider power gulf? Between people who crunch the optimisation math themselves, and those that don't.
The comment wasn't about banning charop forums but instead about not having to rely on them.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Night10194 posted:

Basically all of base 40kRP is a matter of 'There are 4 guns that matter and a couple melee weapons, use these and throw out the other hundreds of pages of identically expensive/difficult to use weapons that are strictly worse.'
:eng101: Seven guns and melee weapons!

:eng99: But yes, there's so much wasted space in the armory. If I'm going to be tasked with pushing around numbers, keep me doing it and engaged with it. I'm playing a game here, not moonlighting as an unpaid tax accountant.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






How does it compare to Genefunk 2090? That was another cyberpunk 5e clone crowfunded recently.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Skaven

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Slaanesh please.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






PeterWeller posted:

That's exactly what it is. Everything that happens in the Time of Troubles happens as an explanation for the rules differences between 1E and 2E. Mystra died to explain why some spells have been slightly revised. That's basically the entire point of this silly affair.
This is why I laugh when Realms nerds complain about the changes made between 3E and 4E. The problem wasn't that a bunch of writers blew things up for a diegetic explanation of edition changes, it's that the entire structure of the Realms requires pounding narrative elements into D&D mechanics-shaped holes in the first place! When you look at things from that perspective, having world-changing events to explain a new edition is the least bad option.

IIRC this also happened multiple times with Shadowrun, so it's not like it's an issue specific to D&D.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Zak obviously hasn't read Flatland in the slightest, because it's not a very long book and it's not remotely about puzzles. Some of it's math but that's so much set dressing for proto-feminist social satire. Edwin Abbott even had to say so in the forward to the second edition because readers were getting confused by the first one.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Weren't you the Bog Shaman or whatever who didn't get to do anything for three rounds of lovely combat?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






joylessdivision posted:

Kult sounds like a worse version of the World of Darkness setting, with even worse mechanics and writing somehow

I'm genuinely impressed? Deeply confused? Both?

Quick update on Mage 1 reading: It is....it's dumb as hell. I don't know if I love how dumb it is or kind of hate it for how dumb it is. I am annoyed that the "Storytelling" chapter is talking about how to use the rules or not, while not having actually discussed the god drat rules of the game yet.
Oh, did they put the Cowardice Box that far up front?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






As an autistic trans person lemme tell you, I played several changelings back in the day.

No signs at all! :hmmno:

Siivola posted:

In my circles the Expanded Psionics Handbook was considered fine, and it basically became the go-to replacement for Vancian casters for groups that really cared about class balance. It fixed the previous editions' insistence that psionics are not magic and therefore incompatible with existing rules, and the power design was way tighter than anything they ever managed for spells.

So of course nerds said it was the most broken thing since the Vow of Poverty Monk. :v:
3.0 psionics were vile, and even in prior editions it was just one unwieldy subsystem after another that players wisely avoided. 3.5 psionics had an enormous reputational barrier to overcome. (It didn't help that nerds weren't as good at analysis as they thought they were.)

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






disposablewords posted:

Everything set up like that in Eberron is for your game to resolve if you want to, there's no real metaplot. And that's something I strongly appreciate about the setting, especially coming on the heels of the metaplot-heavy 90s in RPGs, including D&D.
Keith Baker has been very vocal about this, and considering the hideous mess that FR metastasized into since the 90s I am happy that he put his foot down. There are actually a bunch of tie-in novels that explore interesting questions like "what happens if the Mark of Death didn't end with Vol?", if that floats your boat. They're just not implicitly required like the tie-ins for settings like FR or DL.

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






I took one look at this and tossed it squarely into my Objectively Bad pile, but TBF I have never actually played it. Maybe Traveller can salvage it?

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NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






quote:


If you're only going to read one Ursula K Leguin book, this is a good one.

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