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LGD
Sep 25, 2004



surprised Clancychat hasn't touched upon Without Remorse, the definitely-not-extremely-racist Death Wish-esque (with added MIA POW flavor) origin story of John Clark



e: incidentally supposedly Michael B. Jordan is going to be playing Clark in a two-film adaptation of Without Remorse and Rainbow Six, which should be suitably insane

Without Remorse is supposedly coming out in late 2020 lol

LGD has issued a correction as of 17:52 on Sep 11, 2019

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LGD
Sep 25, 2004



StashAugustine posted:

i actually liked hunt for red october even if it is red scare poo poo

I liked the movie adaptation, though it may come from my dad taking me to see it when I was 5 (probably mostly because he wanted to see it, I was obviously not following much of it at all lol)


Pener Kropoopkin posted:

When I was in Middle School I started reading Tom Clancy books that were in my classroom's library and like every other war obsessed dork I thought he was great because of how much detail he'd go into describing weapons porn. Anyway I remember reading a Clancy book where the main plot thread was that there was a French Nazi conspiracy to make white people racist by producing racist video games. So it's funny that now we live in a world where Tom Clancy games are just fascist.

I can't find the title for it now, but I know it existed because Jack Ryan had a bit role in it.

was it one of the licensed novels written by other people? it sounds like some garbage from the Op-Center or Net Force series (wiki browsing suggests maybe Games of State?)

LGD has issued a correction as of 06:06 on Sep 13, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Freaking Crumbum posted:

so as a point of comparison, i happened to see the original rocky last week (which i hadn't watched in some years) and the scene where he goes on a date with adriene and coerces her into his apartment and forces himself onto her was massively uncomfortable to watch. it's definitely not something that should have been glorified when it was new, but obviously social norms were different and it was more socially acceptable to be a creepy predator towards women back then.

is 30 rock bad like that, where there's genuinely objectionable stuff in it that shouldn't have been cool even when it was new, or is it more cringeworthy retrospection where knowing what we know now about the world, the show wasn't half as clever and subversive as it appeared to be? i feel like 30 rock and parks & rec are both the same kind of vapid obama-era liberal fantasy world, but if there's really lovely stuff in there that everybody just ignored before that could certainly change my opinion on it.

having rewatched it recently I think it's the latter and it's not nearly as cringeworthy as parks and rec was (even at the time), though the more overt political commentary tends to be some of the weaker material on the show

the stuff the show incorporates that people might find genuinely objectionable (i.e. Jenna and Tracy trying to do a race/gender swap, Pete having sex with his sleeping wife, Jack imitating Tracy's extended family in a therapy session) is universally (as far as I noticed) done with full awareness of that fact - execution also matters a lot, for example imagine how disastrous something like this scene might have been on a different show


e: tbh the part of the show that's going to age most poorly is probably a lot of the topical pop culture stuff, which was frequently clever/funny but is so ingrained into the show that I think it'll make it less engaging to anyone who didn't live through the time period

LGD has issued a correction as of 03:36 on Sep 19, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



A Big Fuckin Hornet posted:

i always thought liz "why arent more women on death row" lemon was a parody of woke white feminism but now im not so sure that wasnt just an exaggeration of her actual politics.

I always thought it was fairly obvious it was both

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



BUSH 2112 posted:

so i finally listened to Hamilton and now i'm loving obsessed with it and i'm just wondering how much of a douchebag i am

mildly - I’ll say it’s absolutely worth seeing live if you get the opportunity, the choreography and staging elevates the material/theatrical experience a LOT

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



anyway I've learned to accept I'm fairly basic, so my favorite musical is Chicago which imo stands out from the vast majority of musical theater in how consistently it maintains such a high level of quality in terms of both music and choreography through the entire run-time

LGD has issued a correction as of 23:15 on Oct 3, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Some Guy TT posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNFf7nMIGnE

listen to the way theyre laughing at him they think the whole thing is a joke im convinced hamilton is one of those andrew lloyd weber situations where nobody had the heart to tell lin manuel miranda that his idea was incredibly stupid


oh that sounds good her video about beauty and the beast was great but i never tried watching anything else she did because youtube kept trying to push me on to her video about how brilliant guardians of the galaxy 2 was and i was just uh lets quit while were ahead here

that one is actually good, but if you're still scared it might change your mind about guardians 2 there are a bunch of others that are well worth a watch - since we're on the subject of musical theater, her dissection of Rent (which tangentially touches on Hamilton) is well worth a watch

but yes, Lindsay is a really good critic (and twitter follow), who definitely is happy wallowing in trash

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



CharlestheHammer posted:

joker is apparently crushing box office numbers so expect this manufactured outrage a lot more often.

I'm excited for a new wave of dumb-as-gently caress edgelord movies in a couple of years

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



https://twitter.com/electrolemon/status/1182047291084959744?s=20


(also Trey and Matt are pretty unambiguously two of the best currently in the business where musical theater is concerned)

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



https://twitter.com/pixelatedboat/status/1180125483628810240?s=20

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Fleetwood posted:

I started reading the comic recently and so far I think the show version of Homelander is better

it is

the comic's twist ultimate twist with him/midnighterblack noir was pretty good, but I think the show was correct in concluding they shouldn't really do the same thing and the role is really elevated by Antony Starr's acting

LGD has issued a correction as of 21:58 on Oct 22, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Freaking Crumbum posted:

wasn't mandarin from iron man 2 anti-MIC and basically only working with tony's tech so that he could take him down? i might be misremembering his motivations as i haven't seen the movie in years

nah, whiplash's motivations were sympathetic (Howard Stark had his father deported for trying to profit off of something he was largely responsible for inventing and he died in a gulag), but neither of the villains in Iron Man 2 or 3 are particularly ideologically opposed to the MIC

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



HerraS posted:

Mandarin in 3 was an interesting villain until they pulled the whole 'lol hes just an actor pretending' bullshit

I mean Ben Kinglsey is a great actor, but having the scary terrorist explicitly be a role designed to trade on every orientalist stereotype possible in order to cover up fatal drug side effects definitely seems like the more interesting story

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



KomradeX posted:

Considering the dreadful state of media and Scorsese's and Coppola's arguments had got me thinking over the past 19 years, are they're any movies, maybe besides the first Matrix , head there been, I guess iconic? Maybe I'm just out of touch



LGD
Sep 25, 2004



more seriously it's pretty much impossible to tell what will stand the test of time and what won't - it's obvious some stuff will age badly, but there are also things that take quite a lot of time to catch on and well-crafted works that seem like they'll stand the test of time but whose appeal turns out to be more temporally limited


plus "iconic" is pretty nebulous and subjective to begin with - are we talking about films that are deemed classics/important by aficionados and/or films that have long-lasting and outsized cultural penetration/influence?

(the problems with the former are fairly obvious, and the later definition may imply Idiocracy is "iconic")

LGD has issued a correction as of 19:21 on Oct 24, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



https://twitter.com/CCIGTKUA/status/1191460268527833088?s=20

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



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e:
as you can tell I'm very excited

cats maybe look a little less freaky in this? and the surrounding framing device looks even dumber

cats is an incredibly, incredibly stupid musical and I don't know that putting more emphasis on what passes for its "plot" was the correct creative decision

and Macavity appearing to have a large speaking role and being able to vanish into magical sparkles is certainly... a choice you can make

e2: though I guess he is described as having the ability to levitate and Mr Mistoffelees is a thing, and some versions depict him as having hypnotic powers, so I suppose there is no reason he shouldn't be a straight up evil wizard in the film I guess

LGD has issued a correction as of 23:50 on Nov 19, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Freaking Crumbum posted:

"you're a colossal gently caress-up on a scale of magnitude that is difficult to over-exaggerate and your reckless actions are both wildly illegal AND have placed hundreds of innocent lives in danger. despite all that, a woman is still going to end up wiping your butt and fixing all of the problems you've caused, and we'll all like that somehow absolves your astounding incompetence."

also the whole issue where while that's what the movie tells you, what the movie actually shows is that Poe's ostensible fuckup didn't actually hurt the rebel cause at all and may in fact have been the correct decision, and the women who ostensibly needed to fix his mistakes (inc Leia) are actually tremendously incompetent


its almost like TLJ is an incredibly poorly conceived movie, executed badly

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



22 Eargesplitten posted:

What was the story of the start of filiming? Something like the director expected to have a script ready for him and Kathleen Kennedy gives him a couple pages of plot notes and says "We start filming in two weeks."

I only have limited recollection/interest, but my impression was that Abrams had essentially sketched out the arc of the three movies broadly but they gave the director creative control and Johnson basically went "lol no" and decided to take a nice long, indulgent squat over the punch bowl


given her respective successes/failures my impression is that Kathleen Kennedy does an excellent job supporting strong directors in achieving their vision, which yields good results when she's paired with someone like Spielberg, but probably isn't an ideal fit for running a franchise like Star Wars

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Mercrom posted:

this is definitely the best thing that ever happened to star wars

nah, that only works from the standpoint of "gently caress star wars"

the problem with TLJ isn't that it tears down Abrams hackish work and the edifice of Star Wars generally, it's that it does so while not replacing it with anything or demonstrating Johnson to be anything but a hack/incredibly poor filmmaker himself

the film itself is parasitic/derivative in the extreme and doesn't work (to the limited extent it can be said to) without the broader context of Star Wars, and is entirely reliant on the goodwill established towards characters by previous film(s) to get anyone to give the slightest gently caress re: what is happening onscreen (which is generally quite bad, even by the degenerate standards of the Star Wars franchise)

LGD has issued a correction as of 19:16 on Nov 20, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Echo Chamber posted:

Can Star Wars have it's own containment thread? lol

One thing I occasionally think about is how Roger Ebert was one of my big "smart guy with opinions" heroes back in the day but I've accepted the fact that had he lived into the Trump presidency, he would've become the exact kind of liberal that I loathe now.

I think it would have been easy for him to transition from being a gamer heel to a Berniebro heel, and stubbornly stick to the white Berniebro narrative because of his extremely online-ness. He was a pretty big admirer of Obama and seemed indifferent at best towards Rahm Emanuel's mayorship of Chicago.

Granted, the problems with his health maybe could have pushed him towards MFA. But I wouldn't bet on it.

Unsure what Ebert's essays in response to the Me Too era would have been like. Ebert was probably one of the more compartmentalized film critics when it comes to issues like "the art vs. the artist" debate.

When it comes to dealing with Trump himself, I imagine Ebert retweeting McResistance memes mostly.

Granted, none of this can be tested and this is all speculation so I'm not going to hold the hypothetical against him.

sure, and lots of historically admirable people would come across as weird or reactionary if they were transported to the modern day, especially when you're assuming a decent level of diminished capacity and inclination towards being hidebound

Ebert is obviously more recent (and you're probably right about his trajectory), but tbh I wouldn't feel compelled to spend much time speculating on his hypothetical terrible twitter takes as a current media personality, rather than his actual contributions to film criticism

LGD has issued a correction as of 19:57 on Nov 20, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



yeah I don't remember that from HnK or SnK at all - are you confusing it with another manga, like Riki-Oh?

which is fairly C-SPAM




e: if you're not familiar with Riki-Oh (or the awesome ultra-violent live-action martial arts movie based on an incredibly, incredibly small fraction of it), I highly recommend you give it a read, since it's a HnK-esque romp mixed with an absurdly hilarious butchering of western history, religion, mysticism, etc.
this reddit post does a good job summarizing it if you want to know how crazy it gets

LGD has issued a correction as of 05:07 on Nov 26, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



https://twitter.com/THR/status/1202241181398290432?s=20


uhhhh


e: though it appears Depp's production company is denying his involvement

LGD has issued a correction as of 18:54 on Dec 4, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



MizPiz posted:

I've been rewatching 30 Rock and I can't help but wonder how it'd be received if it came out today. While a lot of the jokes are quite obviously problematic in today's climate (e.g. a surprising amount of blackface), it does hit enough lib buttons that it would have it's defenders.

I think it’d probably be fine, but it would be an entirely different show - a lot of the humor was highly topical, and while it did an amazing job skewering upper class lib cultural/lifestyle pretensions it’s commentary on (then) current political events and figures tended to be among its weakest material

blackface wasn’t more culturally accepted during that time period, 30 Rock largely escaped controversy about it and other “problematic” material because it was always *extremely* self-aware of the cultural/historical context and the butt of the joke was always the ignorance and self-absorption of specific characters (and it’s generally also a commentary about the aforementioned cultural/historic context)

also, as general dog pointed out, the jokes were generally funny

I think as a show it’ll have some difficulty standing the test of time, but that’s more due to the afforementioned topicality than because future audiences would be outraged by, say, the scene where Jack does voices for all of Tracy’s family during therapy

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



BENGHAZI 2 posted:

the only part of that show i ever saw was alex baldwin demanding they pretape coverage for disasters and they're brainstorming things that could happen and someone says "a tornado hits a handgun factory"

and five minutes later you cut to deniro saying we all remember where we were when that tornado hit the handgun factory

its lib as hell but its also my favorite sitcom of all time

Operation Righteous Cowboy Lightning (the episode you saw) is actually a pretty good example of the topicality and why I'm concerned about how it'll age - the disaster only affecting Mel Gibson's private island will probably be funny for a long time because that's who he is in cultural consciousness, but the extra joke about Jon Gosselin being his houseguest is increasingly more likely to prompt a "who?" as time goes on than actually land


MizPiz posted:

My comment was more of a "libs would cancel the show every week if it was produced today" take. It's just a great contrast to the hypersensitivity to negativity that characterizes the overtly liberal shows airing today, especially since there are a few jokes that were :chloe: when it first aired.

eh

even speaking in generalities, its a network sitcom that was actually funny, it rarely takes when people try to #cancel those for spurious reasons, plus its not like 30 Rock didn't have people trying at the time (or its own share of legit controversies, which did, for example, result in the pretty bad "Idiots Are People Too/Two" two-parter)

the different style can be partially attributed to legit differences in the comedic/cultural zeitgeist, but also (imo) to a greater degree of confidence on the part of the creators - it's hard to think of too many shows that talked as much poo poo about the network airing them as 30 Rock did


Pener Kropoopkin posted:

I'm so glad I never watched a single episode of Lost. Even when my friends were into it, before the final season was over, I just had a feeling it'd be a waste of time.

similar - I did watch the first season (partway through its airing) on the recommendation of some people and then just noped out completely during the first episode of season 2

LGD has issued a correction as of 04:04 on Dec 17, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Pener Kropoopkin posted:

I can understand liking 30 Rock, Hell I like most of it but - favorite of all time? My dude have you seen Always Sunny? Have you seen Veep?

I have, both are excellent of course, and I'm not trying to claim it isn't arbitrary/subjective

I'm essentially basing "favorite" on which sitcom I've been most consistently inclined to put on in the background when I'm cooking or working over the last decade

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Presenting Nipples posted:

Every main character has an arc and is transformed by the end of TLJ. The movie clearly challenged fans as it showed half the fan-base to be fashy.

lmao

nope

e:

Serf posted:

its a case where johnson made his movie and the studio made their movie and a team of overworked editors then had to weld them together into one incoherent mess

eh, I don't know - if the studio was genuinely being that heavy handed I don't think they'd have let a lot of what actually went on in TLJ stand

plus, while it's a good explanation for how incoherent the movie was (and I know it's not what you're saying), I often find this take is a way for people to excuse Johnson (who has made really good non-Star Wars movies) by implying his half was the "good" one and was let down by studio hacks, but that just isn't so - for example the hilariously hackish attempt to set up his very own sequel series via the kid on the casino planet

e2: anyway, the real choice for holiday movie we should all be seeing is CATS which a Variety reviewer has already described as "way too horny for its own good"

LGD has issued a correction as of 18:10 on Dec 18, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



CATS is going to be a must-see

https://twitter.com/thelindsayellis/status/1207171398419927041?s=20

https://twitter.com/thelindsayellis/status/1207172749304578048?s=20

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Forceholy posted:

They could have just killed off Leia, but they didn't have the balls.

Laura Dern's character could have been interesting if they didn't gently caress up her storyline. The hard rear end superior taking down the hotshot is a trope as old as time, which is fine. However, there was no need to keep her plan secret from the crew for the sake of tension only to culminate in a cool looking futile sacrificial effort.

it also helps if the hard-rear end is shown to be competent and their takedowns of the hotshot well-justified, while TLJ tells us that's the case but what's actually shown throughout the course of the movie is pretty much the opposite

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Freaking Crumbum posted:

the major failure of the disney SW trilogy is that it had anything to do with any of the characters from the OT. like, what are the astronomical loving odds that events which decide the fate of the entire galaxy keep being centered around the same 3 loving people (and now their kids). the disney trilogy should have been set two thousand years after rotj so that they could carve out their own space with their own characters, but instead we have the loving skywalker clan mucking poo poo up for an entire galaxy's worth of sentient life for the umpteenth time.

Kotor and Kotor 2 are widely regarded to be some of the best star wars media ever released, and they had absolutely nothing to do with anything from the OT or the PT. if some nerds writing video game fan fiction of the star wars universe can come up with compelling characters and interesting plot points that don't touch any of the original source material, you've got to believe disney can find somebody somewhere with the same level of writing chops to churn out something actually interesting

the odds were basically 100% because its a space opera that is concerned with Jedi/the Force and when the OT left off Luke was the inheritor of that mystic tradition and Star Wars had (for whatever reason) positioned the OT as the middle of a 9 part series, so expecting some continuity between characters was entirely logical (as was expecting some separation, both due to the passage of time IRL but also the conventions of multi-generational epics) - even if they'd gone several thousand years in the future you'd expect Luke to be referenced as like The Founder or to show up in a mysterious hologram somewhere, etc.

time skips or separating from the OT are really good ideas, but that's not what they were aiming for with the sequel trilogy

and gently caress, this is actually one of the things TFA did well, in that it introduced a bunch of new characters that we actually gave a gently caress about and were interested in and largely reduced the OT characters to supporting roles

Han was kind of central but in terms of the galaxy as a whole he's a nobody and matters most for his relation to Kylo/Ben (and he, y'know, dies), Leia leads what is portrayed as a small band of military hardliners that is apparently largely ignored by the Republican government/military, and Luke has become a reclusive hermit

TLJ could have easily made OT characters far less prominent by deciding to continue to focus on new characters and actually taking an interest in whatever the heck is going on with Republican politics/military forces instead of making Leia's group inexplicably the only foe of a First Order that somehow became the Empire 2.0 offscreen between films and making its bizarre character choices about Luke central to everything (that wasn't the world's least compelling chase scene and the associated tension-killing side-trip to the prequels via the casino planet)

LGD has issued a correction as of 21:47 on Dec 18, 2019

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



https://twitter.com/BeninaStern/status/1207704703141695488?s=20

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



MonsieurChoc posted:

Wives of samurai were trained in archery and spearfighting.

naginata are a type of polearm, not a spear (yari)

:goonsay:

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Gallipoli is pretty good imo

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



BOGO LOAD posted:

the worst one of those was “O’Brien takes his family on a picnic.”

*O’Brien’s daughter falls into a time portal and comes out a feral 18 year old*

no, given how hard the writers always poo poo on him, that description sounds absolutely correct to me

like what else *could* possibly happen?

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



KomradeX posted:

Not to take away from Trek chat, but A Little Hatred, from Joe Abercrombie is that cool left wing fantasy story in like an early industrial period right? Or is that another book?

that's the one, the timeline of his First Law setting has been continuously advancing (A Little Hatred is ~30 years after the original trilogy iirc)

its also the start of a new trilogy

LGD has issued a correction as of 00:28 on Jan 30, 2020

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Barry Convex posted:

https://twitter.com/Lin_Manuel/stat...nuel-miranda%2F

hopefully this means we'll be spared a proper film adaptation from happening anytime soon

it's going to have the same relationship to the eventual film that the 1996 recording of Cats the stage musical does to Cats the movie, hth

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



https://twitter.com/TheAVClub/status/1239680408729640961?s=20

our long national nightmare is (temporarily) over

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



https://twitter.com/jackwaz/status/1240135051288948742?s=20

#ReleaseTheButtholeCut

LGD
Sep 25, 2004



Fleetwood posted:

marvel is obsessed with idpol, it's infuriating

look, there is no reason whatsoever to think Marvel might be rancidly neoliberal



or that its efforts at representation have looooonnnnnnggggg been ham-handed and poorly handled

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LGD
Sep 25, 2004



finally, hard proof that dudes rock

https://twitter.com/willmenaker/status/1265695407893594113?s=20

also that there are generational/demographic differences in the way people use imdb rankings that correlate with gender

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