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Very entertaining writing, friend. I gotta track down and peruse your previous LP work.  One thing I'll always remember this game for- they stacked enemy monster numbers in some encounters, including most random ones, with party stats. So if your party was modded to have mostly 18s in every ability (as the game allowed you to accomplish by tweaking characters during creation), you would have to fight several times as many monsters as a lower stat party would. The Justice League has to put down armies, the Feebleminded Weaklings have only one or two opponents. Fun times. They didn't do that with later games, thankfully.
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Sep 24, 2019 09:19
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Jason Sextro posted:I just hope you can survive the boredom gauntlet of Secret of the Silver Blades so you can get to the absolute insanity of Pools of Darkness. I want to go on record to say SSB never bored me. But then I was an adolescent last I played it.
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Sep 25, 2019 13:15
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Narsham posted:In theory you could Sleep up to 16 Kobolds but you probably won't ever bother. I disagree. Doing exactly this saved my character's and his party's life multiple times when we raided the notorious AD&D dungeon "Dragon Mountain". There are in-game reasons too. My "Justice League" PoR characters mentioned in one of my previous posts on this thread also faced 16 or more Kobolds in random encounters multiple times thanks to their high stats, and casting Sleep was usually how they won at low levels. Sleep is truly this game's best 1st Level Spell. Sadly, it becomes useless quickly when you no longer regularly encounter monsters vulnerable to it- and in the rare cases at that point when you still encounter said monsters, you have better tools (like Fireball) for the same job.
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Sep 27, 2019 02:30
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The last LP of this game I watched on Youtube relied a lot more on missile weapons. When I was playing, I barely used them. Guess it depends on play style. I personally hated that you have to spend time un-equipping the bow and re-equipping the sword & shield whenever you run out of arrows and there's never enough ammo around when you need it. I hope at some point you'll show off the city of Phlan and all its features. There are some town features in this game they did not repeat in future games (eg hirelings that can take all your good treasure, duels in the training hall, drunken brawls that can turn into TPK) and the jokes for those almost write themselves. I think in later games they had the shops automatically change your money into large coins with pool/share, but I'm not sure.
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Oct 1, 2019 08:22
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Chokes McGee posted:I was going to skip hirelings and duels because I don’t find them interesting or useful, but once we hit our cap, you bet your rear end I’m showing the worlds most lethal drunken pit fight Cool. Looking forward to it. As for duels and hirelings, yeah, they're not useful. Since you're skipping them, I can cover the mechanics in a few paragraphs. If I can please get your permission, I'll do it next post. Sorry, no screenshots, I no longer have this game. Just the memories.
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Oct 1, 2019 09:44
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Thanks for the permission, Chokes (previous page). From my memory and a brief refresher on GameFAQs, here is what I recall of the feature you have chosen to skip over. The Training Master Room In addition to the various rooms in Phlan's Training Hall, there is a central room where you may do two things- Duel & Hire. I am not surprised Chokes is skipping over these features. Neither returned after this game and neither is very useful. But they are important to talk about nevertheless for a few reasons. Mostly because they are there (that's the best reason to explore anything if you didn't know- because it is there!). Let's touch on Duel briefly first. This mechanic pits your chosen character against a clone of themselves suddenly created by game mechanics, then never seen again after the fight. You get no loot from the battle other than exp, so you can't duplicate items by winning. Nevertheless if you are equipped with magic items, your opponent will have the same. It's a good way to challenge your characters, I guess. And if you need just a few more experience to level and you're already at the training hall, it's nice for that too. Otherwise, no real reason to use it. I'll say a lot more about the Hire feature. Consider this a cautionary tale. This game includes the D&D mechanic of Hirelings. Not the fun kind of Hirelings like in Nodwick- you can't use them as Walking Trap Detectors, I mean Scouts. They're just an extra body in combat. Now, given the challenge of game fights already displayed, one or two of those may still be useful. But what this game doesn't tell you is how much it can cost you. It's already been mentioned that most Hireling NPCs are Evil and will turn on you in the final battle. But there is something worse- they cost money to keep around and can be hazardous to your life. Here's the table from GameFAQs of what Hirelings are available (it's random which one you're offered, and you can confirm before hiring)- * 6 in 48 chance: SWORDSMAN (Level 3 Fighter), 3 shares * 10 in 48: WARRIOR (Level 1 Fighter) 1 share * 4 in 48: ACOLYTE (L1 Cleric) 1 share * 5 in 48: HERO (L4 Fighter), 4 shares plus some items * 4 in 48: THEURGIST (L4 Mage), 4 shares plus some items * 6 in 48: ROBBER (L3 Thief), 3 shares plus some items * 5 in 48: CURATE (L3 Cleric), 3 shares plus some items * 8 in 48: EVOKER (L2 Mage), 2 shares The shares is the hireling's cost. It's what they get when you divvy up loot. They usually take and hide their share, as per the game, and you can't take stuff from an NPC unless they're unconscious or dead. Usually, they hide what they take too, so you can't get it and in the case of items they may not even make use of it in combat. So once they get something, consider it gone. Each party member defaults to 1 share, and you can't change this setting. So this means a Hireling can earn 2-4 times the money a PC is earning from fights. "Some items" means exactly that, they can also take special items. And you never even see what you could have gotten if they do! So, a Robber wants to join you for 3 Shares plus items. Yeah, a Robber, that's an accurate description. There are other reasons not to use Hirelings. You can have up to 8 people in a party (6 of which can be player characters), so if you're already capped, plot-given NPCs (we'll see these later) may not join you. Plot-given NPCs also don't take money or items in this game, so they're more useful generally. Hirelings also have Morale, and I had them Surrender or Flee in battle numerous times when I used them. Why'd I use them? I was inexperienced and it seemed like a good idea at the time. But basically, if they fail Morale, they can negate any advantage they provide in combat. Characters who Surrender die automatically. Those who Flee survive but get no rewards from the fight. Unless the rest of the party didn't Flee, somehow the Hirelings still take their shares in that situation.  You also can't control NPCs in combat in this game. They want to waste a spell in a useless situation, you can't stop them. They want to Fireball your own side? Again, you can't stop them. Nor can you give them priority targets or use them tactically- they generally go Leroy Jenkins (recklessly charge in, kill enemies in no particular order) unless equipped with a bow. If they have a bow, they'll hang back and shoot, then go Leroy once they run out of ammo. The Krynn games allowed your Knight players to command NPCs, I think high Charisma maybe even allowed players to command NPCs in the Realms games, but this early it was not a game feature. The out of control spellcasting also got a lot of complaints, which is why there were few NPC mages in future games. I have seen some Pool of Radiance LPers take Hirelings into battle, get them killed, and then revive them as Zombies with Animate Dead, a 3rd Level Cleric Spell that was also not included after this game. You can control Zombies, and they don't take treasure unless you give it to them. Still, this doesn't suit every party. Sadly, there is no way to take NPCs into future games the way you can PCs. I have also seen some LPers take Hirelings like the Hero, who comes with +1 Plate Mail, then get them killed in combat and take the items. I suppose this is easy to do with 'friendly' fire, but I never did it. Matter of honor and all that. Hirelings, overall, are a bust IMO.There are some fights in the game where you may want extra bodies, but beating them anyway is a nice challenge. I did it, and I look forward to seeing Chokes do it too. achtungnight fucked around with this message at 23:14 on Oct 1, 2019 |
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Oct 1, 2019 21:21
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Hold Person is another good spell, generally. But unlike Sleep, there's a saving throw.  One specific situation in Death Knights of Krynn that asks for it specifically is the only time I remember casting Snake Charm in a Gold Box game. Otherwise, just kill the drat snakes!Poor Orkington family... I LOLed at the monster D&D session. And I don't blame you for waiting on that one Rope Guild fight. I wonder if Lassie knows about this well.
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Oct 7, 2019 04:30
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Hey, at least you got a polearm. My last trip to the Polearm Emporium didn't go as well- http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0136.html
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Oct 7, 2019 21:27
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Stinking Cloud is indeed a great spell. Even if those caught in it make their saving throw, their THAC0 is still reduced because they're coughing. You do have to make sure your party stays out of it, though. I've had more than one fight ruined because I assumed my saves were good enough that a fighter or cleric could enter a stinking cloud without any problems. Better to stay out entirely than risk bad luck. Charm Person and Ray of Enfeeblement are spells that I generally don't find very useful. However if the enemy casts them and my group fails save, that can be a bad day. Until I got a certain 3rd Level Spell (Dispel Magic) and maybe even afterwards, I usually devoted a spell slot or two to Charm Person for nullification purposes. One Charm cancels another, if you didn't know. Can be useful to turn my party members back to my side if they fall to an enemy Charm. Then again, they still get a save, and I've had that fail a few times. There are also not too many non-boss enemies in PoR that can cast Charm.Heads-up- You may want to grab Knock at next level. Last time I checked Game FAQs about PoR, they reminded me there's a plot door that requires Knock and no scrolls with it in the game (file this under dick moves). 4th Level is probably the best time, since most of the third tier spells are so darn good. The politically correct term for Lizardmen these days is Lizardfolk. I doubt anybody will ever get around to correcting old games though.
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Oct 14, 2019 09:13
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Randalor posted:So does the game tell you once you've cleared an area of random encounters, or are you supposed to just assume that everyone is dead once they stop trying to kill you? If I recall correctly, it doesn’t tell you. You just stop having random encounters. Then you can rest safely in the area. Of course this was the only game in the series where you could clear all the randoms from an area just by attrition, and I’m not sure it was possible with every area either.
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Oct 14, 2019 14:25
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The Mustache disguises were funny. Wonder if they'll get the chance to be used again.
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Oct 21, 2019 11:53
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I don’t think the gods and their religions ever get much character in these games other than “we’re evil, you will bow to us or die!” or “we’re cool, you want some healing?”
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Oct 21, 2019 21:09
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They did, modified in various ways. Going into details and differences would risk spoilers, so I won't say too much. Basically there were novels written based on the games (Pool of Radiance and part of Pools of Darkness anyway, Curse of the Azure Bonds was a sequel to a book and Secret of the Silver Blades never got any love) and those became part of the official lore. I'll let you read the books on your own if you want to see how, I wasn't much of a fan myself. I agree that the parts of the Realms we see in the games aren't a great place to live. If I had to live in this universe, I'd prefer somewhere with more stable and supportive politics. Of course, there aren't much opportunities for adventure in those places, all said and done.
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Oct 21, 2019 22:13
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I'll add my two cents to the troll encounter. The hard part is avoiding or tanking the trolls' multiple attacks. The really bad part is that they won't stay down unless burned. So it's either wait till you have L5 Mages and Fireball, get Burning Hands (a possible waste of a spell slot), or carry Oil Flasks (available from Phlan stores) and fling them at the Trolls. You want to get the Trolls down to below 5 HP, then toss the Flasks for a death blow. They only do 1d4 damage anyway, so you better hope you roll high. Thankfully the game won't let the Troll regenerate non-burned wounds and still get up, but with 3 HP back from regen each round, you still need to get them on that round when they're low and roll high. You can't burn their corpse once they're down either, they disappear once they're down and don't reappear till they're almost fully healed. A possible solution is for someone to stand where the body was, the game won't bring them back in that case due to AI limits, but you want the ability to move in combat, right? Once you have Fireball, this encounter isn't too bad. And it's worth a good bit of EXP too.
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Oct 22, 2019 03:28
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I definitely agree an encounter with three Trolls at this potentially low level is a dick move. Most D&D parties, below 5th level a single Troll is a tough boss encounter. Only Killer GMs put in multiple Trolls with multiple other monsters against low level parties. Yes, a lot of encounters in this game are challenging (most tabletop low level parties I know blink at 70 goblins) but this is especially so.
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Oct 22, 2019 13:21
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Ironic that one of my favorite D&D magic items is the artificial strength booster known as the Giant Strength Girdle.
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Oct 24, 2019 05:55
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I had no idea there were undead in the textile house. I suppose you'll talk more about them in the future. There are many types of undead in D&D, just about all have some BS about them.
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Oct 30, 2019 10:23
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Hobologist posted:Of course there's a save for losing levels from getting hit by a wight. That save must have been added in later editions of D&D, because in the D&D I played and read back when this game came out I don't recall a save for level drain from the wight or any of its undead cousins that also drain levels (wraith, specter, vampire, energy drain casting lich). A ghoul's paralyzing touch, yes, but not the level-draining touch of a wight.
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Nov 1, 2019 04:48
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If you can get the Madman to a temple, they’ll take him off your hands. Till then, like a previous poster said, it’s risky having him around. Level drain is bad news. Sadly we’re not done with risking it by a long shot.
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Nov 12, 2019 11:51
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It’s kinda hard to imagine who in the game programming team thought dumping dead party members in a ditch was better than giving them ‘’a solemn roadside funeral’ but there you go.
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Nov 12, 2019 21:30
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If we’re discussing the Manual of Bodily Health, it’s in the library and I think you missed it. You may need to search the premises again. I confirmed the item.’s location using GameFAQs and will say no more about it at this time.
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Nov 19, 2019 21:49
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Randalor posted:That's an interesting way to spell "hilarious". Is the Deck of Many Things in the Gold Box games at all, or were there some things just too... unstable for the engine to handle? Also, what about bags of holding and portable hole interactions? None of these items are in the games, sadly. A Bag of Holding is an adventuring necessity and my party had many good times with the Deck back in the day.
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Nov 21, 2019 17:57
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Ah ok, carry on then. 👍
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Nov 21, 2019 22:47
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Per the D&D Monster Manual, Giant Scorpions get 3 attacks per round- 2 pincers and the tail sting. Only the latter is poison, and it can strike with a bonus if both pincers hit. So you only need to save vs. poison once in any case. This monster didn't appear in future Gold Box Games, possibly because of the complicated attack rolls. Loved the Exorcism jokes. Frogs are poisonous also, but they usually die too fast for it to be a concern. Giant Spiders now, I'm not too good with those... I believe those ghosts in the barracks are wraiths if you have to fight them, or maybe specters. Either one is bad. Wraiths drain 1 level per hit, but you need enchanted weapons to damage them. Martinez is definitely a specter. The Sokal Keep Orc fight is bad enough I'd have undead aiding the players if I were DM and they gave the passwords. But of course the game doesn't think of that. Ugh.
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Nov 25, 2019 11:10
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Yeah, Hirelings can be useful as distractions in big fights like this. I recall having my Hireling Heroes bravely charge the Orc horde (wasn’t my choice but it worked) or pepper them with arrows and thus get their initial attention while everyone else ran for the choke point. The NPCs usually died doing so but it was their own fault, so no big deal. They’d kill their share before they fell, and my guys were set up to kill the rest by then. It worked often because as Chokes said, the AI’s tactical grasp is lacking. But that trick will be off the table in games without abundant NPC Hirelings. I think Frogs also appear in a couple set encounters in the Well, Slums, or Warehouse.
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Nov 25, 2019 21:48
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I think it’s largely a way to power down the party if necessary. There’s an Oriental Adventures undead that drains the pluses from gear which exists for similar reasons.
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Nov 28, 2019 02:26
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There are many reasons to WANT to forget the graveyard exists.
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Dec 1, 2019 11:24
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TheGreatEvilKing posted:Do evil clerics in 1e command instead of destroy? Evil Clerics can also, if I recall correctly, Bolster Undead to make them more difficult to turn. This is what happens if they use their power on undead they already command. The Evil and Good Clerics can get into an opposed Wisdom check or something to determine whose faith is strongest, with bonuses for whose temple they're in, level, and so forth.
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Dec 2, 2019 04:11
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Is that why I always had so much trouble doing the Graveyard last?
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Dec 3, 2019 23:47
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Does this mean we can get increasing random encounters with undead in other areas if you put off the Graveyard? It would be more effective than a frantic council in addressing the problem for most adventurous parties I know.
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Dec 4, 2019 00:14
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Koval Mansion is a fun level, more so with a bad Thief than a skilled one. The scrolls are very much worth the trip. I wonder how long Chokes will delay the Graveyard mission...
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Dec 4, 2019 08:40
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I know the next part that's coming (from your update preview title) and yeah, it's boring. No spoilers, so I can't say why yet. Just know that your LP is good enough I'm still awaiting the boring parts with bated breath. 
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Dec 12, 2019 18:11
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I vote we check out the Hobgoblin Lair at some point. It’s never actually mentioned anywhere else in game unless you stumble into it. Other monsters’ lairs, yes, but not that one. I usually retconned it as a neutral party of unfortunate monsters caught too close to the war. (Note- there are plenty of other monsters in the same situation but we don’t have directions to their lairs.)
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Dec 19, 2019 16:17
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It's a random encounter? I never knew that. Guess I didn't play the game as much as you did. Ah well.quote:It's just a snake in a cave. The quickest encounter in the game.
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Dec 19, 2019 17:46
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I should mention again Dragon Mountain, a D&D adventure that featured several thousand of the buggers. I remember it included rules for mass combat and killing several each round. There were also frequent surprise exceptions to those rules to spook the players. “These kobolds live in swampy tunnels so the mud and foul air will inhibit you but not them- they have adapted.” “The kobold champion is actually a polymorphed giant- he has 150 hit points and hits like a truck.” Stuff like that. And at the end you face a Great Wrym Red Dragon. It was a fun adventure. It didn’t include Tucker’s Kobolds though. I’m not sure if they preceded Dragon Mountain or were inspired by it.
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Dec 21, 2019 10:17
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They were trap masters in Dragon Mountain, and that was 2nd Edition. So they've been trap masters for a while. BTW, I remember another fun gimmick from that dungeon. Narrow as hell corridors where only one PC can advance at a time and can only employ short or piercing weapons. You end up with a huge line of kobolds- or their bodies- blocking your advance in these corridors. And sometimes there are lots of little holes in the walls, floor, or ceiling just the right size for them to poke a spear through. But you can't get a target on the other side. Rushing through such corridors as best you could dodging spear jabs till you reached a more open area was all you could do.
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Dec 22, 2019 00:16
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[sees update title, imagines the party dressing up as Foot Ninjas with the character of Chokes' choice putting on Shredder gauntlets, then grins] In your defense, Chokes, those who drink the water of the Stojanow River have experienced hallucinations and paralysis. It's remarkably similar to ghoul attack symptoms. Teleport Mazes are a bane on gamers everywhere. Polluting evil wizards are also a stubborn fantasy cliché. I never encountered the priest when I played this dungeon. Then again, I was always heading for the exit quick as possible for obvious reasons. This game is part of why I hate copy protection with a passion. The journal entries say Yarash's particular strain of nerdy obsession is creating a magical hybrid of a lizardman and a sahuagin (nasty fish people). Yeah, I don't see the value to society in it either. Or why you need a polluted river and a teleport maze to accomplish it. Woo hoo! FIREBALL! The next mission should be a lot of fun.
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Dec 28, 2019 23:21
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Looking forward to the next update. Happy New Year!
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Jan 9, 2020 12:50
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Per GameFAQs, you can go into the Captain’s quarters after bribing the guards, then start a brawl with him and his personal bodyguards. They’re all mid to high level (Captain is 10, others 4-5) fighters, it’s a tough fight. If you win, though, you can get the loot Chokes mentioned for beating them and nobody else attacks unless you start more trouble. You can also start a brawl in the middle of the camp by trying to free the slaves or attacking buccaneers. This gets you 4 waves of Buccaneers you can sweep and some mid level fighters. The Captain and his posse then show up as Wave 5 unless they’re already dead. The Captain’s loot is worth the fight, it includes a +4 long sword, +3 plate mail, and +2 shield per Game FAQs. He’s a 10th level fighter though (110 hp, -6 ac) and there are 15 4th level fighters and 50 buccaneers in his last wave, so you probably want to kill him first. You can’t go back in the base after saving or failing to save the boy either. So that loot may be gone. If you refuse to fight for the old Lizardman, Dryth kills him and then attacks you with 12 other Lizardmen backing him up. Beating this fight still resolves things, but there’s no extra loot. There is some in the pools in the Keep catacombs, however, including a +2 shield. Lots of lizards down there, though. Edit- Sorry, did not realize this was all coming next update. I thought we were already done with these areas. My bad. achtungnight fucked around with this message at 16:12 on Jan 20, 2020 |
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Jan 20, 2020 12:00
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Ack , I’m sorry. Didn’t realize “All- inclusive” meant the other possibilities were coming. I shaded my previous post, though you’ll have to get the quote in your post. If more is necessary please let me know. Again, I’m sorry, man. Laughed a lot at the ghoul ambassador and makeup btw.
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Jan 20, 2020 16:15
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