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I marathoned this from start to finish recently, was the s1 ending reveal a big deal? It felt really predictable by the time they got there but maybe live it was a shocker or something. Also this show's plot is what I imagine having adhd feels like, but on the flip side the whole thing had a very hitchhikers guide junior vibe throughout so that was cool.
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Aug 10, 2020 01:31
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zer0spunk posted:I marathoned this from start to finish recently, was the s1 ending reveal a big deal? It felt really predictable by the time they got there but maybe live it was a shocker or something. Even if you figured out the twist before the show makes it plain, the fact is that it becomes a completely different show after the reveal.
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Aug 10, 2020 02:19
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It does a weird halfway thing in that first season. When they start revealing more of the main 4's backstory and personality traits it becomes fairly obvious they aren't in the good place..but at the same time a lot of little things don't make much sense if they had that twist plotted out from the get-go as anything but audience misdirection..like one episode ending on the cliffhanger of the sinkhole expanding and michael and janet freaking out, alone. Which really doesn't make any sense given the reveal..like there's foreshadowing to get there but also misdirects, it's interesting.
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Aug 10, 2020 02:26
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zer0spunk posted:It does a weird halfway thing in that first season. When they start revealing more of the main 4's backstory and personality traits it becomes fairly obvious they aren't in the good place..but at the same time a lot of little things don't make much sense if they had that twist plotted out from the get-go as anything but audience misdirection..like one episode ending on the cliffhanger of the sinkhole expanding and michael and janet freaking out, alone. Which really doesn't make any sense given the reveal..like there's foreshadowing to get there but also misdirects, it's interesting. They made it very clear in the writer's room that Michael was under no circumstances allowed to be seen alone, because then he would just drop the act. Janet, however, counts as making him not-alone, remember.
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Aug 10, 2020 02:29
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silvergoose posted:They made it very clear in the writer's room that Michael was under no circumstances allowed to be seen alone, because then he would just drop the act. Oh neat, now I'm trying to remember if they explained that he snagged her in that first season or not in the reveal episode. If they didn't maybe I assumed she was "in" on it and glossed over that by the time they hit the reveal. Watching it back to back with no gap was intense, so many things happen at a breakneck speed (and then kinda spin the wheels a bit in s3)...overall I dug it (ted danson on earth was a great way to go out, sad they didn't pull a cheers gag)
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Aug 10, 2020 02:34
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zer0spunk posted:Oh neat, now I'm trying to remember if they explained that he snagged her in that first season or not in the reveal episode. If they didn't maybe I assumed she was "in" on it and glossed over that by the time they hit the reveal. Watching it back to back with no gap was intense, so many things happen at a breakneck speed (and then kinda spin the wheels a bit in s3)...overall I dug it (ted danson on earth was a great way to go out, sad they didn't pull a cheers gag) Season 2 early on. Shows Michael sneaking into the Janet warehouse and him talking with Shawn about why they need a good place janet (bad janet explodes when she tries to be nice instead of farting in people's faces).
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Aug 10, 2020 02:35
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silvergoose posted:Season 2 early on. Shows Michael sneaking into the Janet warehouse and him talking with Shawn about why they need a good place janet (bad janet explodes when she tries to be nice instead of farting in people's faces). ha, so the misdirect in season 1 only seems like a mistake until you hit season 2 and realize he kidnapped her (and then i think s4 flashbacks when you see him initially tricking her in the first days of the building) since it seems like you dug into the supplemental stuff, how much of the show did they make up as they went vs how much was plotted from the get go?
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Aug 10, 2020 02:38
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zer0spunk posted:ha, so the misdirect in season 1 only seems like a mistake until you hit season 2 and realize he kidnapped her (and then i think s4 flashbacks when you see him initially tricking her in the first days of the building) A *shitton* was plotted from the get go. Season 1 was basically plotted before they started writing at all, the other seasons they started figuring out as soon as it made sense I guess? Schur was pretty focused. I'd highly recommend the podcast, Shawn's actor does interviews with a bunch of cast but also backstage folks like costume, producers, the composer. It's good stuff.
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Aug 10, 2020 02:41
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zer0spunk posted:ha, so the misdirect in season 1 only seems like a mistake until you hit season 2 and realize he kidnapped her (and then i think s4 flashbacks when you see him initially tricking her in the first days of the building) Michael states at the end of s1 that Janet isn't one of them, during the reveal sequence.
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Aug 10, 2020 02:45
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not having him alone in any scene is pretty slick, i fell for it haha. i wanna say the sinkhole thing happens a bit before things that cement the twist right? like tahani being number 327 or what have you on the list she shouldn't be seeing
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Aug 10, 2020 02:50
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zer0spunk posted:not having him alone in any scene is pretty slick, i fell for it haha. i wanna say the sinkhole thing happens a bit before things that cement the twist right? like tahani being number 327 or what have you on the list she shouldn't be seeing They also made sure not to dress him in red (to avoid devil allusions).
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Aug 10, 2020 02:53
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Ted Danson plays the lovable kook aw-shucks thing perfectly in that initial first loop or whatever we should call it, he's not the tell, for me anyway. Tahani did it for me, for sure. The moment they start to delve into the inferiority complex and narcissism traits (which is pretty quick) you question how she'd be there when the show hits you with the moral guidelines to get into the "good place" super fast and often
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Aug 10, 2020 02:57
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zer0spunk posted:Ted Danson plays the lovable kook aw-shucks thing perfectly in that initial first loop or whatever we should call it, he's not the tell, for me anyway. It's amazing just how right Eleanor is!
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Aug 10, 2020 02:59
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silvergoose posted:It's amazing just how right Eleanor is! I really didn't see Chidi's indecision as the same level of damning behavior they cast on everyone else for the most part, even when the show goes out of its way to demonstrate it with the actual trolley dilemma brought to life but that's probably subjective e: dude just wants to do some research before he picks, chill! zer0spunk fucked around with this message at 03:04 on Aug 10, 2020 |
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Aug 10, 2020 03:02
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As it turns out, about 7 billion people who didn't have the same level of damning behavior as Eleanor went to the bad place too!
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Aug 10, 2020 03:06
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Argue posted:As it turns out, about 7 billion people who didn't have the same level of damning behavior as Eleanor went to the bad place too! haha fair, the entire system is ridiculous as shown many times in the plot i guess he just stands out from that initial four when you look at them in comparison. that scene where he freaks out in this last season over having a small file and doing nothing didn't seem all that bad lol. is having a boring life better than having a wild rear end life where you have multiple stone cold steve austin run ins from a moral/ethical standpoint? show was good 
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Aug 10, 2020 03:12
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I actually like Chidi's relatively 'kind' flaw being treated as something significant because it really is his biggest flaw. His inability to make decisions constantly hurts his life and the lives of those around him and it isn't because he is malicious or cowardly or anything, it is just a flaw in who he is. Which means it becomes more and more significant when he *does* make decisions and why it means so much at the end that he makes the choice to move on before Eleanor does. He is making his own genuine decision out of his own genuine belief and he isn't double guessing himself. It is really satisfying how all the characters grow in such a natural way that the ending for each is a perfect culmination of their character. Jason is never a smart man but he becomes a wise man in his own way. Tahani devotes herself to helping others and is happy to do so. Chidi becomes comfortable with himself and willing to make decisions. And Eleanor as a person may no longer be there but her essence goes on to make the universe better and kinder no matter how selfish and self-centered she might have been in life. God drat I love TGP. it is really stunning just how *good* a show it is.
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Aug 10, 2020 03:25
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"is inaction worse then the wrong choice" is a pretty fun can of worms to get into..i'm also  with the way this show revolved around philosophy so well, in a mainstream network sitcom no less. i was trying to think about how you can sum this show up to recommend it to other people, without ruining a lot of it.
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Aug 10, 2020 03:32
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silvergoose posted:A *shitton* was plotted from the get go. Season 1 was basically plotted before they started writing at all, the other seasons they started figuring out as soon as it made sense I guess? Schur was pretty focused. Absolutely re: the podcast. I've watched this show through probably two or three times at this point, but going through the first half of S1 was kind of shocking with all of the dialogue breadcrumbs they leave regarding how things will go. We got through season 1! Auntie was too tired to say much but the Bad Place reveal totally caught her off guard. I'll ask her more tomorrow before she leaves. And then I'll  a USB drive of season 4 to her because I'm pretty sure it's not on Netflix.
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Aug 10, 2020 03:36
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zer0spunk posted:I really didn't see Chidi's indecision as the same level of damning behavior they cast on everyone else for the most part, even when the show goes out of its way to demonstrate it with the actual trolley dilemma brought to life The thing is that you can definitely tell that Chidi and Tahani do not belong in the same Good Place. There is a utilitarian argument that Tahani could deserve to get into Heaven on the strength of her charitable arguments despite her moral flaws, and there is an argument that Chidi could deserve to get into Heaven on the depth of his moral character despite his general uselessness, but they logically shouldn't both make it in on the same scoring system.
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Aug 10, 2020 03:41
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Tahani's motivations were corrupt, same reason Eleanor's little scoring stopwatch did jackshit when she was hanging out holding the door for everybody. She didn't do good deeds; she attempted and failed to impress her folks. Chidi is a bit tougher since his fatal flaw was a bit more roundabout. But I think you're right on the money when you talk about his uselessness, because even as a professor of moral philosophy, his compunctions led him to behave very amorally. And the Good Place/points system seems to acknowledge good works compounded with good intentions, and Chidi didn't even have a good work. I actually believe S1 Michael when he says that Chidi's 3600 page dissertation was incomprehensible even to him. And if Chidi really had good intentions, would he have ruined his best friend's wedding like that?
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Aug 10, 2020 04:00
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It's simpler than you might think. Chidi is an example of good intentions without good works, Tahani is an example of good works without good intentions, and both are required to score a decent amount of points with the Good Place's accounting system.
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Aug 10, 2020 04:38
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zer0spunk posted:"is inaction worse then the wrong choice" is a pretty fun can of worms to get into..i'm also Oh yeah they hired a philosophy professor to teach and train the writers, because of course they did.
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Aug 10, 2020 10:37
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I forget the exact specifics, but on a recent Poscast, Mike Schur mentioned that he's currently working on a book based on what he learned about being good while writing the show. Here's hoping it's as impenetrable as Chidi's thesis
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Aug 10, 2020 11:37
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I would love to
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Aug 10, 2020 11:44
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I love to imagine Michael was genuinely stumped by Chidi’s doorstopper. That wasn’t an act at all, it’s just that impenetrable.
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Aug 10, 2020 11:47
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zer0spunk posted:I marathoned this from start to finish recently, was the s1 ending reveal a big deal? It felt really predictable by the time they got there but maybe live it was a shocker or something. A bit late to the party, but on my first watch I took it at face value and did buy Michael as a sort-of bumbling first-timer, and I guess I didn't think too hard about why the wrong people ended up in the good place, it just drove the drama. But on the other hand, the reveal was extremely delicious, in no small part due to Ted Danson's complete 180 in personality and acting. That sinister laugh was the pay-off for season 1 for me! In my defence, this was my first Schur show (yes, I know...), and I think I was expecting 'just' a normal comedy, just about Heaven. So I was pleasantly surprised!
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Aug 10, 2020 13:22
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I thought the reveal was just going to be that nobody in the neighborhood actually belonged and it was a huge screw up.
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Aug 10, 2020 13:36
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Kazy posted:I thought the reveal was just going to be that nobody in the neighborhood actually belonged and it was a huge screw up.
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Aug 10, 2020 14:09
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Kazy posted:I thought the reveal was just going to be that nobody in the neighborhood actually belonged and it was a huge screw up. That's the thing: it's obvious that something is up but the exact details are uncertain enough to make the payoff from the reveal worth it.
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Aug 10, 2020 14:12
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zer0spunk posted:...overall I dug it (ted danson on earth was a great way to go out, sad they didn't pull a cheers gag) They did the Cheers gag earlier, when he is the bartender with the towel over the shoulder at Eleanor's birthday. Seeing him behind the bar was an amazing moment, I think. But Cheers was a staple of my childhood so it may not have the same impact for everyone.
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Aug 10, 2020 16:03
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Ishamael posted:They did the Cheers gag earlier, when he is the bartender with the towel over the shoulder at Eleanor's birthday. i mean, yeah, but i was hoping for more of a john ritter in stay tuned thing, less subtle with it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKBsohgTKiY idk, have the establishing shot of the bar be cheers or something. i'm sure people would have hated it, i would have ate it up e: i woulda made the guy who hands him the loyalty card letter kelsey grammer or something and got booed out of the writers room zer0spunk fucked around with this message at 16:34 on Aug 10, 2020 |
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Aug 10, 2020 16:25
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Huh, rewatching and I realised I missed that there's a quick "1.2 Jeremy Bearemys later" between them coming up with the new afterlife tests with Vicky and the system being put into production/the gang getting into the good place. It seems like a JB is subjectively at least a year, so there was a quite a skip there, kinda sad we didn't see more of the process of refinement.
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Aug 28, 2020 04:19
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A Jeremy Bearimy is the entirety of time. So they went from Big Bang to heat death of the universe and then a little past that. Lot of that in the final episodes!
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Aug 28, 2020 04:31
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MikeJF posted:Huh, rewatching and I realised I missed that there's a quick "1.2 Jeremy Bearemys later" between them coming up with the new afterlife tests with Vicky and the system being put into production/the gang getting into the good place. It seems like a JB is subjectively at least a year, so there was a quite a skip there, kinda sad we didn't see more of the process of refinement. There is no Jeremy Bearemy equivalent. It's just Jeremy Bearemy. That's the joke that's the point.
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Aug 28, 2020 04:38
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A beariny is simultaneously about a year and an eternity, which makes much more sense now than when it was introduced.
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Aug 28, 2020 04:42
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Thranguy posted:A beariny is simultaneously about a year and an eternity, which makes much more sense now than when it was introduced. Don’t forget the dot which is Tuesdays, and also July, and sometimes never.
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Aug 28, 2020 21:35
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Promoted Pawn posted:Don’t forget the dot which is Tuesdays, and also July, and sometimes never. And her birthday! Not a girl.
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Aug 29, 2020 21:52
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SunshineDanceParty posted:There is no Jeremy Bearemy equivalent. It's just Jeremy Bearemy. That's the joke that's the point. It's not equivalent, but subjectively it seems like it's quite a while. My point was that we skipped a lot of development in that screen!
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Aug 30, 2020 04:06
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Zedd posted:And her birthday! Nope, she pointed at some other part if the main line.
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Aug 30, 2020 08:52
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