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Happy Noodle Boy
Jul 3, 2002

Don't fuckle with Shuckle(s)

Like that other Shuckle, but far different.


canyoneer posted:



SUPERHOT VR - SteamVR | Rift
A unique first person action game where you punch, shoot, slash and throw objects at Red Glass Men in open white room environments. The catch is that time only moves when you move. It's part puzzle game figuring out through trial and error what it takes to survive each round.
Really great intro to VR and an experience that plays best in VR.


You forgot to mention the best part. Every time you beat a level the game goes SUPER. HOT. SUPER. HOT.

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EbolaIvory
Jul 6, 2007

NOM NOM NOM

Happy Noodle Boy posted:

You forgot to mention the best part. Every time you beat a level the game goes SUPER. HOT. SUPER. HOT.

SUPER

https://clips.twitch.tv/WrongAgreeableBunnyBloodTrail


HOT

Zero VGS
Aug 16, 2002
"It has gunfights and shit!"


Lipstick Apathy

Taintrunner posted:

Going to strongly disagree with the OP. If you're focused on racing and flying sims while dabbling in other stuff, buy a Rift S. Splurge for an Index if you really want to. The Quest library is pretty limited and all of those games are available on Rift S anyways.

There's some debate on just how good the tethering of the Quest is going to be while Carmack and Oculus are both recommending the Rift S still as the best experience of PC driven VR.

This is nuts to me that we're in a new thread and people are still buying and recommending Rift S over Quest. Yeah I'm butthurt about Oculus sending scary-grams about developer mode, but still Quest has far more utility than S at this point. Wireless tethering is *already* at acceptable latency, I can say firsthand.

Go look at comments on the Quest Link announcements and it's just pages and pages of Rift S users bemoaning their purchase decision.

Anyway like I mentioned in the last thread, buy a Quest from Walmart and it has free next-day shipping an a 90-day return window (confirmed the one I got delivered today is returnable through Jan 14th). No harm in trying it out, and see how this tethering and hand tracking shakes out next month. Worst comes to worst it's a free 3-month rental.

Zero VGS fucked around with this message at 22:43 on Oct 11, 2019

EbolaIvory
Jul 6, 2007

NOM NOM NOM

Zero VGS posted:

This is nuts to me that we're in a new thread and people are still buying and recommending Rift S over Quest. Yeah I'm butthurt about Oculus sending scary-grams about developer mode, but still I as a Quest user it has far more utility than S at this point. Wireless tethering is *already* at acceptable latency, I can say firsthand.

Go look at comments on the Quest Link announcements and it's just pages and pages of Rift S users bemoaning their purchase decision.

Anyway like I mentioned in the last thread, buy a Quest from Walmart and it has free next-day shipping an a 90-day return window (confirmed the one I got delivered today is returnable through Jan 14th). No harm in trying it out, and see how this tethering and hand tracking shakes out next month. Worst comes to worst it's a free 3-month rental.



I think its hilarious that people are already recommending the quest over the rift s before link is even available.

Its cute really.



I get it. Its a 2 in one device now. But come on. Recommending it as the choice for PC first? Ehhhhhhh

NRVNQSR
Mar 1, 2009


If the Rift S were cheaper then I could see decent arguments for it over the Quest; better screen, more comfortable, avoids the uncertainty of how Quest tethering will work.

But at the same price as the Quest? Unless you can get a 90 day no questions asked return window I would say that buying an S right now is straight up a bad decision. At least wait a month to see how Link reviews, or for the S's price to drop.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?




Rift S is still better for flight sims, right now. It's also affordable and capable of roomscale dedicated PCVR, right now. Let's recommend Quest for those use cases when Quest Link is out, and when we're certain of its quality. Or recommend waiting.

And even with Link, S isn't outright bad. It's just worse.

Jim Silly-Balls
Jun 6, 2001

Fondle my shiny metal ass



canyoneer posted:

Also, please add this image to the OP


It is shameful to post this without an accompanying review of Gorn, the game most likely to cause this scene

Tip
Mar 21, 2006

Your move, creep.



NRVNQSR posted:

If the Rift S were cheaper then I could see decent arguments for it over the Quest; better screen, more comfortable, avoids the uncertainty of how Quest tethering will work.

But at the same price as the Quest? Unless you can get a 90 day no questions asked return window I would say that buying an S right now is straight up a bad decision. At least wait a month to see how Link reviews, or for the S's price to drop.

The Rift S is a good bit cheaper considering it comes with a cable, the cable for the Quest is $79.

Lemming
Apr 21, 2008



Nap Ghost

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

Rift S is still better for flight sims, right now. It's also affordable and capable of roomscale dedicated PCVR, right now. Let's recommend Quest for those use cases when Quest Link is out, and when we're certain of its quality. Or recommend waiting.

And even with Link, S isn't outright bad. It's just worse.

It's already not clear cut that you should get an S over a Quest even if you have a good gaming computer without the link, considering the various upsides of the Quest. With the value of the link on top it makes it the clear answer for the vast majority of people. Like for anyone buying into VR right now I think the most reasonable choices are Quest or Index if money is no object.

Like all the extra information is there, Quest is just the short answer to the question of "what should I get"

Zero VGS
Aug 16, 2002
"It has gunfights and shit!"


Lipstick Apathy

EbolaIvory posted:

I think its hilarious that people are already recommending the quest over the rift s before link is even available.

Its cute really.



I get it. Its a 2 in one device now. But come on. Recommending it as the choice for PC first? Ehhhhhhh

I sincerely recommend it over the Rift S for PC with only the wireless tethering now, if your IPD isn't within a few millimeters of the ideal and/or you have any friends who would want to share and might be in the same situation. Palmer Luckey was 100% right to go out of his way and write an essay warning people. I'm 59 IPD and my boyfriend is 67 lol, we call it hunter and prey.

NRVNQSR
Mar 1, 2009


Tip posted:

The Rift S is a good bit cheaper considering it comes with a cable, the cable for the Quest is $79.

I was under the impression you could use the cable that comes with the Quest, and the $79 one is only if you want longer reach? For me the Quest's bundled 3m cable covers my whole tiny playspace, but yes, the shorter cable length would be another potential mark against it compared to the S.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?




Lemming posted:

It's already not clear cut that you should get an S over a Quest even if you have a good gaming computer without the link, considering the various upsides of the Quest. With the value of the link on top it makes it the clear answer for the vast majority of people. Like for anyone buying into VR right now I think the most reasonable choices are Quest or Index if money is no object.

Like all the extra information is there, Quest is just the short answer to the question of "what should I get"

I don't believe the Quest to have too many upsides other than being wireless and standalone, neither of which apply to flight sims. I'd say it's clear cut for that particular scenario. And if for whatever reason, you don't get any benefit from the former two, S is still better.

Majority of cases will definitely be in Quest's favour when the Link releases, if it's good. But, can't play Onward or Pavlov (though I think this is coming, just without cross-play with the existing audience) and it's awkward as sin from what I gather to mod Beat Saber.

And god. I wouldn't trust myself with Gorn and Quest.

EbolaIvory
Jul 6, 2007

NOM NOM NOM

Lemming posted:

It's already not clear cut that you should get an S over a Quest even if you have a good gaming computer without the link, considering the various upsides of the Quest. With the value of the link on top it makes it the clear answer for the vast majority of people. Like for anyone buying into VR right now I think the most reasonable choices are Quest or Index if money is no object.

Like all the extra information is there, Quest is just the short answer to the question of "what should I get"

But selling it as a PCVR headset, No.

I agree with it being the go to recommend for average people dipping into VR for sure.

Blade Runner
Aug 14, 2015



I think the Quest is just going to be the best for the majority of people, and even if you feel that you only really want to do PC VR stuff, the ability to do the fully wireless and take it wherever is just too much of a utility to pass up. Want to bring it to a party, your backyard, etc.?

For reference, I have the Index, so I'm pretty on the side of "PC VR is best"

EbolaIvory
Jul 6, 2007

NOM NOM NOM

Blade Runner posted:

I think the Quest is just going to be the best for the majority of people, and even if you feel that you only really want to do PC VR stuff, the ability to do the fully wireless and take it wherever is just too much of a utility to pass up. Want to bring it to a party, your backyard, etc.?

For reference, I have the Index, so I'm pretty on the side of "PC VR is best"

Yeah keep in mind I'm not talking poo poo on the quest. Love mine, Was in the first ad for it, bla bla. I just would never tell someone "buy this for PCVR".

Zero VGS
Aug 16, 2002
"It has gunfights and shit!"


Lipstick Apathy

NRVNQSR posted:

I was under the impression you could use the cable that comes with the Quest, and the $79 one is only if you want longer reach? For me the Quest's bundled 3m cable covers my whole tiny playspace, but yes, the shorter cable length would be another potential mark against it compared to the S.

Yes, they said the included Quest cable can work, or any Amazon cable you buy that isn't garbage.

The $79 version is so expensive because it is fiber optic. The end of each plug converts the data signal to light which it sends over a polymer-plastic fiber optic cable. It has two smaller power wires alongside the optical within the insulation, with positive/negative electricity to power the headset. This allows the cable to be longer while being impervious to interference (power wires don't care about interference/shielding, only copper data wires).

Monoprice sells 100-foot HDMI and USB cables with the same technology. I use them at home and they've put up with me stepping on them (I ran them under the living room rug) for over a year now.

Blade Runner
Aug 14, 2015



EbolaIvory posted:

Yeah keep in mind I'm not talking poo poo on the quest. Love mine, Was in the first ad for it, bla bla. I just would never tell someone "buy this for PCVR".

If you know for a fact that you only ever wanna do PCVR and don't ever wanna do anything else, the S is probably better enough at it to be worth picking up. If there's any chance you might wanna bring your headset to a party, travel with it, take it to other rooms of your house, then the Quest seems better. I guess I'd tell people "buy this for PCVR" only because if they're new to VR enough to be asking for a recommendation at all, they're probably going to get some use out of being able to go untethered.

Mr Luxury Yacht
Apr 16, 2012




Yeah if someone is considering flight sims (which are a huge use case for VR) and whatnot I think it's irresponsible to only recommend the Quest at this point.

If I can read the dials and displays in DCS on the Rift S but they're blurry or screen doored on the Quest with the link, then the Rift S is the only choice out of the two.

It'd make a hell of a lot more sense to say "Wait to buy either until November when the Link gets into people's hands outside of controlled Oculus demos"

DisposableHero
Feb 25, 2005
bah weep granna weep ninny bong

If this thread and the previous one taught me anything it's that individual experience, tolerance and preferences vary so much with VR it's not helpful to make any sort of blanket recommendation.

Except perhaps that if you want stand alone vr get a quest since it's the only game in town.

Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.


I've been playing H3VR over ALVR with my lovely router, and it's just so much better than my Rift. If I wanted to spend a bunch of money on a fancy USB Wifi adapter and use that to broadcast a direct signal from my computer instead of using my lovely router it would be even better, but any additional latency is basically imperceptible to me and the only downside is the relatively frequent buffering things that make it look like I'm in an .avi with lovely codec problems, which is probably caused by my router and/or PC settings.

If they can get as good as that without the buffering through a cable, I'm in.

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

Hi, Everybody!


Got to see a HTC Cosmos being used at PAX-AUS as a demo unit. Iiiit lost a controller in SteamVR and they'd clearly been repeatedly having trouble with it getting a guy to play Beat Saber. Worked okay intermittently though!

Luneshot
Mar 10, 2014



I've got no interest in standalone VR, and will almost certainly be using a headset for only PC gaming, most of which is going to be stuff like Elite:Dangerous and other seated experiences. I genuinely think the Rift S would be better for my needs.

Is there any appreciable chance of a Rift S price cut in the near future, or should I just see if I can get one cheap off someone upgrading to a Quest?

jubjub64
Feb 17, 2011


Luneshot posted:

I've got no interest in standalone VR, and will almost certainly be using a headset for only PC gaming, most of which is going to be stuff like Elite:Dangerous and other seated experiences. I genuinely think the Rift S would be better for my needs.

Is there any appreciable chance of a Rift S price cut in the near future, or should I just see if I can get one cheap off someone upgrading to a Quest?

If you can wait until the quest link cable is released then you could probably get a better deal.

Clitch
Feb 26, 2002

Ten Billion Percent
SHINY


I've gone over to two friends' houses already, pulled out the Quest, loaded up the fit and focus thing, and handed it over.

"Here. Put this on your face, and figure it out."

They've both drawn out a guardian space and started playing inside of 5 minutes. My wife had the same experience.

Quest is a low barrier to a solid 6DOF experience, and now computer touchers can have their PCVR sex dungeons as well as a casual, take-anywhere HMD that's the best answer to, "But isn't VR janky, fiddly, and overpriced?"

It could give VR the second debut to a mass market that it really needs.

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

Hi, Everybody!


Clitch posted:

It could give VR the second debut to a mass market that it really needs.

It pretty much has since it launched. Facebook's apparently been VERY happy with its sales numbers, as have developers. A few have even said they've had some of their strongest sales on it. Making it tetherable to a PC's only going to push those sales higher, especially if developers start offering cross-buy.

Tip
Mar 21, 2006

Your move, creep.



NRVNQSR posted:

I was under the impression you could use the cable that comes with the Quest, and the $79 one is only if you want longer reach? For me the Quest's bundled 3m cable covers my whole tiny playspace, but yes, the shorter cable length would be another potential mark against it compared to the S.

I have a pretty small playspace and when I got the Rift CV1 I thought the 4 meter cable would be fine, but it turned out to be pretty inadequate. Just going to the far corner of my playspace and turning around once was enough to run out of cord. I ended up needing to buy an extension to be able to play comfortably.

Even now with Rift S's 5 meter cable I wish it was longer. I don't think many people are going to find 3 meters adequate.

Personally, I'm very happy with my Rift S. I did think about selling it after hearing about the Quest link, but after thinking about it for a while I don't really have a great need for a portable VR system so the tradeoffs aren't worth it for me yet.

However, once they offer a wireless add-on for it, at an agreeable price, I will totally switch. I would love to play my PCVR games without any wires.

OctaviusBeaver
Apr 30, 2009

Say what now?

I never got into Echo VR before but I spent about an hour vs bots tonight and it is really, really fun. Anybody who hasn't tried it before should give it a shot. I'm considering getting a Quest just for that once it releases.

Nektu
Jul 4, 2007

FUKKEN FUUUUUUCK


Cybernetic Crumb

Jim Silly-Balls posted:

Buy the index. Pimax might go out of business tomorrow.

Is this based on something or just a general remark?

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

Hi, Everybody!


I think HTC's really trying to make the Cosmos A Thing, because there were several used in PAX-AUS's VR Free-Play area this year. Looked like there might've been tracking issues with all of them sadly, as everyone seemed to be favouring one hand heavily for Job Simulator and tucking the other controller out of tracking range.

To be clear; it looks like it works fine when the tracking wants to behave, it's just that it looks awful prone to misbehaving. There were Rift S's in use everywhere too that were working without issue.


Nektu posted:

Is this based on something or just a general remark?

Pimax is entirely a kickstarted business. It looks to be doing okay, but it's one of those things that if it vanished overnight in a puff of bankruptcy nobody would be surprised.

EbolaIvory
Jul 6, 2007

NOM NOM NOM

Neddy Seagoon posted:

I think HTC's really trying to make the Cosmos A Thing

That and viveport is the focus right now.

People underestimating it makes sense. And they need some help with focus. But yeah. Thats the goal it seems currently.

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

Hi, Everybody!


EbolaIvory posted:

That and viveport is the focus right now.

People underestimating it makes sense. And they need some help with focus. But yeah. Thats the goal it seems currently.

If it was about $200-300USD cheaper and the tracking didn't have issues, I think it'd stand an okay chance of competing against the Rift S. As-is... yeah, nah. They're really delusional about stepping to Facebook with it, especially with the Quest being able to tether now. They've got the Cosmos coming and going, for a much better service, product, and price.

Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.


$700 is laughable.

ROFLBOT
Apr 1, 2005



Neddy Seagoon posted:

I think HTC's really trying to make the Cosmos A Thing, because there were several used in PAX-AUS's VR Free-Play area this year. Looked like there might've been tracking issues with all of them sadly, as everyone seemed to be favouring one hand heavily for Job Simulator and tucking the other controller out of tracking range.

To be clear; it looks like it works fine when the tracking wants to behave, it's just that it looks awful prone to misbehaving. There were Rift S's in use everywhere too that were working without issue.


Pimax is entirely a kickstarted business. It looks to be doing okay, but it's one of those things that if it vanished overnight in a puff of bankruptcy nobody would be surprised.

Remember the level of whining about Rift S tracking when it first came out? So as unsurprising as it is that HTC haters would instantly dismiss the Cosmos as a complete dud, this thread should at least attempt some degree of balance if it is to be an accurate source of info for VR newbies.

Rift S tracking didnt get good until a number of updates had been pushed out, lets see how HTC go now that they are in the same position. The Cosmos at least deserves some information in the OP other than outright dismissal.

And i say this as a Rift S owner. Which brings me onto another point that seems to get overlooked, the Quests sole selling point is freedom from being tethered to a set playing area. Which is great if you have a desktop PC. So what if you have a gaming laptop which these days are easily capable of the CPU/GPU grunt to drive VR?

The Quest doesnt have quite the same advantage when you can already get your VR on instantly anywhere within reach of a power point. Hence me still going for the S despite knowing the Q link was a thing. I think that needs to be pointed out.

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

Hi, Everybody!


ROFLBOT posted:

Remember the level of whining about Rift S tracking when it first came out? So as unsurprising as it is that HTC haters would instantly dismiss the Cosmos as a complete dud, this thread should at least attempt some degree of balance if it is to be an accurate source of info for VR newbies.

Rift S tracking didnt get good until a number of updates had been pushed out, lets see how HTC go now that they are in the same position. The Cosmos at least deserves some information in the OP other than outright dismissal.

And i say this as a Rift S owner. Which brings me onto another point that seems to get overlooked, the Quests sole selling point is freedom from being tethered to a set playing area. Which is great if you have a desktop PC. So what if you have a gaming laptop which these days are easily capable of the CPU/GPU grunt to drive VR?

The Quest doesnt have quite the same advantage when you can already get your VR on instantly anywhere within reach of a power point. Hence me still going for the S despite knowing the Q link was a thing. I think that needs to be pointed out.

I have personally seen the Cosmos in use. Today. Several of them, in fact. All of them had intermittent tracking issues that other headsets did not in the same environment. It's also far more expensive than its competition. This isn't hating on it, the math and facts are simply not in its favour. Even the reviews have consistently been "Well it works okay, sometimes, but why would you get one at this price?"

edit: The Cosmos also use RGB cameras for tracking instead of IR like the Facebook headsets, which apparently makes it harder to track objects and is probably the reason for the over-bright lightbars, so it potentially might not be fixable like the Rift S's was.

Neddy Seagoon fucked around with this message at 08:28 on Oct 12, 2019

ROFLBOT
Apr 1, 2005



For sure, im not saying no one should criticise the pricing or whatever other aspects objectively (hell, i have...) but my point is the Rift S was in a similar position when it came out and now 6 months on with lots of tweaking its turned out to be a great headset.

The Cosmos has been out, all of 2 weeks and HTC has already acknowledged issues and pushed out at least one update. Lets at least give it some space in the OP and see how it goes...

ROFLBOT fucked around with this message at 09:01 on Oct 12, 2019

EbolaIvory
Jul 6, 2007

NOM NOM NOM

ROFLBOT posted:

The Cosmos has been out, all of 2 weeks and HTC has already acknowledged issues and pushed out at least one update. Lets at least give it some space in the OP and see how it goes...

Yep. Exactly this. I'll freely admit its not looking great and I was super excited. But hey, itll only get better.

As far as price. Yeah, HTC can't afford to lose the same kinda money Oculus can on hardware. Sucks but thats the facts. It gets better itll be worth it imo.


Still hecking waiting for mine. -_-

Neddy Seagoon posted:

If it was about $200-300USD cheaper and the tracking didn't have issues, I think it'd stand an okay chance of competing against the Rift S. As-is... yeah, nah. They're really delusional about stepping to Facebook with it, especially with the Quest being able to tether now. They've got the Cosmos coming and going, for a much better service, product, and price.



Yeah but does it not deserve a mention? I mean it does have use cases. Even if the tracking is never up to my level of BS play, It should be fine for a ton of other content creation and games.

I'm still excited for it. Just, Hoping HTC keeps working on things. I mean Viveport is tons better these days. So things are looking up.

EbolaIvory fucked around with this message at 09:09 on Oct 12, 2019

SCheeseman
Apr 23, 2003



ROFLBOT posted:

For sure, im not saying no one should criticise the pricing or whatever other aspects objectively (hell, i have...) but my point is the Rift S was in a similar position when it came out and now 6 months on with lots of tweaking its turned out to be a great headset.

The Cosmos has been out, all of 2 weeks and HTC has already pushed out at least one update. Lets at least give it some space in the OP and see how it goes...

The Cosmos was a last minute add, even putting aside the terrible tracking the headset is otherwise unremarkable. I was considering writing something more comprehensive up but the reviews all came through so universally poor that it didn't seem worth the time.

There is no niche that the Cosmos covers where another headset wouldn't be a better fit. Perhaps for wireless with inside-out tracking, but if you're gonna set up an antenna then you might as well set up some base stations too so the tracking doesn't suck, so might as well get a Vive Pro.

Oh fine I'll write something geez

Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

Hi, Everybody!


EbolaIvory posted:

Even if the tracking is never up to my level of BS play, It should be fine for a ton of other content creation and games.

It really wasn't from watching them in use today. I didn't even set out looking to hate the thing when I saw the Cosmos today at PAX-AUS (I thought it was neat in fact), but it was just very disappointing watching them repeatedly have difficulties they shouldn't have.

Neddy Seagoon fucked around with this message at 09:27 on Oct 12, 2019

EbolaIvory
Jul 6, 2007

NOM NOM NOM

Neddy Seagoon posted:

It really wasn't from watching them in use today. I didn't even set out looking to hate the thing when I saw the Cosmos today at PAX-AUS (I thought it was neat in fact), but it was just very disappointing watching them repeatedly have difficulties they shouldn't have.

I'm starting to wonder if thats why influencers haven't been getting em yet.... >_>

They know for sure the first thing I'm doing it booting up Beat Saber. <_<

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Neddy Seagoon
Oct 12, 2012

Hi, Everybody!


EbolaIvory posted:

I'm starting to wonder if thats why influencers haven't been getting em yet.... >_>

They know for sure the first thing I'm doing it booting up Beat Saber. <_<

First one I saw was running Beat Saber. The environment was admittedly a little darker than average (it was out in the main exhibition hall where it's always a little dark), but one of the controllers consistently decided it was done existing in SteamVR after a few moments of use in a relatively-fast song. Walked past the same area later and it looked like it was still having issues. And like I mentioned at the time, the ones out in the Free-play area (which is very well-lit) seemed to have issues of their own; Both stations in question were playing Job Simulator, and the users seemed to be pretty deliberately holding a controller to their chest out of the tracking camera's visibility in an identical fashion. I get that different users have their own foibles and habits with VR, especially newbies, but it looked a little too similar and purposeful. Especially compared to everyone else trying stuff on the Rift S's and PSVR sets.

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