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Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week


Fabulousity posted:

In general the further below the PSU's top output you operate the more efficient it'll run.

This is an antiquated rule of thumb that does not apply to modern high-quality power supplies of the type that gets recommended ITT. Stop repeating it.

The power efficiency curve of a good gold-rated PSU looks something like this:
code:
|  ___________
| /           \
|---------------
 10%          100%
and the drop-off at either end is generally only 5% from their optimum. In terms of efficiency, you do not need to aim for double what your system uses. Not even close. A 300W system does not need a 750W PSU to stay at its best efficiency. And the fact that they drop in efficiency at 10% draw isn't worth thinking about because the difference between 85% efficiency and 90% efficiency at 75W is a couple watts. RGB leds waste more power.


You do want some buffer over your system's expected draw, plus whatever you might need if you think you'll put more power hungry upgrades into it later. Putting a 450W PSU into a system with 400W expected draw will work if it's a good model, but it probably will reduce lifespan compared to a 550. There's no real penalty for overbuying PSU capacity other than purchase price.

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Some Goon
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.



Ehh, efficiency falls of a cliff at very low loads, though without digging through a bunch if PSU reviews I have no idea if any are markedly better than the others.

Either way that is a good-rear end post and I'd like to link in the the OP if you don't mind.

broken pixel
Dec 16, 2011





Hello again, PC building goon friends! My fiance needs an upgrade and we'd like to pass this build by a few people to see where we can improve it. The only thing that probably won't change is the case since that's a personal favorite, and he'd strongly prefer an AMD GPU. Can more than likely drop the PSU to 650W if I'm seeing this right, too.

What country are you in?: United States
What are you using the system for? Frequent gaming, 1440p 60FPS
What's your budget? $1300, though we won't complain about lower
If you’re doing professional work, what software do you need to use? N/A
If you're gaming, what is your monitor resolution / refresh rate? We plan on picking up a 1440p/60Hz for him later this year; he currently has a 1080p/60Hz

PCPartPicker Part List
CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X 3.7 GHz 8-Core Processor ($164.49 @ Amazon)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($29.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK ATX AM4 Motherboard ($106.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB Pro 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 Memory ($136.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($149.99 @ Adorama)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB GAMING OC Video Card ($406.98 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Design Define R6 USB-C Blackout ATX Mid Tower Case ($138.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: Corsair RM (2019) 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($109.99 @ Best Buy)
Total: $1244.40
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-01-28 14:51 EST-0500

Demostrs
Mar 30, 2011

by Nyc_Tattoo


Hmm, would it be fairer to say then that people should aim for double the wattage just for being able to reuse the PSU more easily? I’ve always done it mostly thinking about efficiency, but I still feel like it’s a good rule of thumb with how long the warranties on the models we recommend are and not knowing what crazy system you could put it in circa 2027.

E: Either way right now the cheapest 550W I’d go with (the EVGA G3) is within a few dollars of that 650W G1, so there’s not ample savings to be had. There’s the GA but I’ve heard it’s an even worse G5, so I wouldn’t sacrifice the quality for savings.

Demostrs fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Jan 28, 2020

Some Goon
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.



Odds are strong your system will only get more efficient. Afaik PSUs do lose capacity over time, but I should hope they'll maintain effectiveness during the warranty period.

There's really nothing wrong with buying a higher capacity, except the cost, and usually the difference between 550 and 650 isn't real large.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week


ItBreathes posted:

Ehh, efficiency falls of a cliff at very low loads, though without digging through a bunch if PSU reviews I have no idea if any are markedly better than the others.
Yeah standby efficiency is generally in the 70-80% zone, and it tends to be low regardless of whether the PSU is bronze or platinum. That's why my graph starts at 10%. Standby is like 5-10 watts.

But again, efficiency differences on a 5W draw are tenths of a watt. Not worth thinking about. Turning off lights in your house more often, or setting your PC to power save faster will be vastly more change in electric use.


quote:

Either way that is a good-rear end post and I'd like to link in the the OP if you don't mind.
go for it!

Bryter
Nov 6, 2011

but since we are small we may-
uh, we may be the losers


ItBreathes posted:

Ehh, efficiency falls of a cliff at very low loads, though without digging through a bunch if PSU reviews I have no idea if any are markedly better than the others.

Either way that is a good-rear end post and I'd like to link in the the OP if you don't mind.

80+ Titanium rated PSUs have 90%+ efficiency at 10% load. None of the other certifications have any requirements for loads below 20%.

Also efficiency does fall off at low loads, but it's more like a hillock than a cliff. The y axis on those curves tends to start at like 70%.

Scruff McGruff
Feb 13, 2007

Jesus, kid, you're almost a detective. All you need now is a gun, a gut, and three ex-wives.

broken pixel posted:

Hello again, PC building goon friends! My fiance needs an upgrade and we'd like to pass this build by a few people to see where we can improve it. The only thing that probably won't change is the case since that's a personal favorite, and he'd strongly prefer an AMD GPU. Can more than likely drop the PSU to 650W if I'm seeing this right, too.

What country are you in?: United States
What are you using the system for? Frequent gaming, 1440p 60FPS
What's your budget? $1300, though we won't complain about lower
If you’re doing professional work, what software do you need to use? N/A
If you're gaming, what is your monitor resolution / refresh rate? We plan on picking up a 1440p/60Hz for him later this year; he currently has a 1080p/60Hz

PCPartPicker Part List
CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 2700X 3.7 GHz 8-Core Processor ($164.49 @ Amazon)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($29.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK ATX AM4 Motherboard ($106.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB Pro 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 Memory ($136.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($149.99 @ Adorama)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB GAMING OC Video Card ($406.98 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Design Define R6 USB-C Blackout ATX Mid Tower Case ($138.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: Corsair RM (2019) 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($109.99 @ Best Buy)
Total: $1244.40
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-01-28 14:51 EST-0500

Don't get a Hyper 212, at least not until the updated version comes out. You can get a GAMAXX or Arctic 34 for about the same price and they have better mounting mechanisms and as-good performance.

It's also worth looking at getting a Sabrent Rocket/Inland Premium/Corsair MP510 1TB NVMe drive instead of a sata EVO drive. They're cheaper, virtually the same performance, and don't require any extra cables to connect to your motherboard.

Scruff McGruff fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Jan 28, 2020

Klungar
Feb 12, 2008

Klungo make bessst ever video game, 'Hero Klungo Sssavesss Teh World.'


Can anyone tell me if the internal USB port needed by this Wifi Adapter (https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B07P61CK87) is present on this motherboard (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07FVYKFXF/). The reviews on the B450 with built-in wifi were super sketchy so I'm back to doing an external Wifi/Bluetooth card, but reviews for these types of cards say that connecting to the internal USB port of the motherboard to enable Bluetooth functionality can be problematic.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week


Demostrs posted:

Hmm, would it be fairer to say then that people should aim for double the wattage just for being able to reuse the PSU more easily? I’ve always done it mostly thinking about efficiency, but I still feel like it’s a good rule of thumb with how long the warranties on the models we recommend are and not knowing what crazy system you could put it in circa 2027.

Those are good considerations, but should not be recommendations. As I said, buying more PSU capacity than you need only costs you the money you pay at purchase, and will have little effect on ongoing costs.

However, I don't think the main 2 power-using components, CPU & GPU, will be doubling their power use any time soon. The constraints now are on moving heat out of such a tiny surface area. Chips aren't getting any bigger, so that's unlikely to change. (Unless we get diamond substrate or in-chip microfluid channels or some other crazy future-tech, in which case yay! I'll buy a new PSU to celebrate.) Most people's next computer will be similar to the one they're building now, and if they expect different it's a case by case thing.


Demostrs posted:

E: Either way right now the cheapest 550W I’d go with (the EVGA G3) is within a few dollars of that 650W G1, so there’s not ample savings to be had. There’s the GA but I’ve heard it’s an even worse G5, so I wouldn’t sacrifice the quality for savings.

The crazy logjam of PSUs at $100 and just above does mean you have a whole lot of options once you commit to spending that level. You can also stay at 550 and get a Seasonic Prime Titanium for just a few dollars more than the 750w EVGA if you have stupid-high standards for quality.

Also EVGA I'm just not fully informed on, they change lineups really quick and I don't much like the way they have a dozen different models that seem designed to produce confusion. But the G5 is fine and even their cheaper bronze PSUs are totally acceptable quality (but corsair has better stuff at that price range).

broken pixel
Dec 16, 2011





Scruff McGruff posted:

Don't get a Hyper 212, at least not until the updated version comes out. You can get a GAMAXX or Arctic 34 for about the same price and they have better mounting mechanisms and as-good performance.

It's also worth looking at getting a Sabrent Rocket/Inland Premium/Corsair MP510 1TB NVMe drive instead of a sata EVO drive. They're cheaper, virtually the same performance, and don't require any extra cables to connect to your motherboard.

All right, thank you! I especially didn’t know about the Hyper 212 update.

Thirst Mutilator
Dec 13, 2008


Okay, going to pull the trigger on some parts. My current build:


What I'm going to buy:

PCPartPicker Part List
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($179.99 @ Best Buy)
Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty B450 Gaming-ITX/ac Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard ($119.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix Sport LT 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($74.99 @ Adorama)
Case: Fractal Design Meshify C Mini MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($89.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $464.96
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-01-28 16:32 EST-0500

Any noticeable issues? I notice PCPartPicker mentions that updating BIOS might be required with a CPU that supports the older BIOS version - am I going to be totally hosed if that's the case?

Fabulousity
Dec 29, 2008





Nap Ghost

Klungar posted:

Can anyone tell me if the internal USB port needed by this Wifi Adapter (https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B07P61CK87) is present on this motherboard (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07FVYKFXF/). The reviews on the B450 with built-in wifi were super sketchy so I'm back to doing an external Wifi/Bluetooth card, but reviews for these types of cards say that connecting to the internal USB port of the motherboard to enable Bluetooth functionality can be problematic.

Per that motherboard's manual you'll have two internal USB headers located at the bottom of the board. See the diagram on page 7 - The headers in question are numbered 19 and 20.

Demostrs
Mar 30, 2011

by Nyc_Tattoo


Klyith posted:

Those are good considerations, but should not be recommendations. As I said, buying more PSU capacity than you need only costs you the money you pay at purchase, and will have little effect on ongoing costs.

However, I don't think the main 2 power-using components, CPU & GPU, will be doubling their power use any time soon. The constraints now are on moving heat out of such a tiny surface area. Chips aren't getting any bigger, so that's unlikely to change. (Unless we get diamond substrate or in-chip microfluid channels or some other crazy future-tech, in which case yay! I'll buy a new PSU to celebrate.) Most people's next computer will be similar to the one they're building now, and if they expect different it's a case by case thing.

My concern was more thinking about the idea of needing a completely different system that used HEDT parts, but actually after estimating the power draw of a worst case "I need whatever the 2027 version of the 3990X is" scenario and thinking of its cost you'd probably just buy a new and modern PSU at that point. So, yeah, no point in making a recommendation of "but what if you all of a sudden find yourself in a very fringe use case?"

Also didn't notice the 750W listed for the same price on PCPartpicker, but personally I hate rebates enough that I'd just buy the 650W at Amazon. Easy enough to use those prepaid cards you get from them towards Steam bucks though, so some people might consider it more liquid than I do.

broken pixel posted:

All right, thank you! I especially didn’t know about the Hyper 212 update.

Taking into consideration the suggestions Scruff already gave (the HP EX920 is another NVMe drive in the same class at those he named), I made a few as well to the list: PCPartPicker Part List

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($179.99 @ Best Buy)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Freezer 34 CPU Cooler ($31.95 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX ATX AM4 Motherboard ($114.99 @ B&H)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB Pro 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 Memory ($91.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: HP EX920 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($129.94 @ Amazon)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB GAMING OC Video Card ($406.98 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Design Define R6 USB-C Blackout ATX Mid Tower Case ($138.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS Plus Platinum 550 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($107.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $1202.82
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-01-28 16:52 EST-0500

Right now 6c/12t is plenty for games and the IPC boost the 3600 gets will largely offset the difference in cores between it and the 2700X. The MAX version of the Tomahawk comes with a newer, larger BIOS chip to fit all the new CPU SKUs in its microcode, and getting RAM for it rated for the advertised 3600 MHz speed on the QVL is difficult without it being RGB. You can at least save money with this variant of the Vengeance RGB Pro and consider getting the R6 with a side panel if you wanna see them. There's also the option of getting a set of 3200 MHz RAM on the QVL or getting 3600 that isn't and maybe have to muck around with a Ryzen RAM timing calculator and BIOS settings for a bit to get it working at the proper speeds. I also kinda like the suggestion of the Platinum PSU for a similar price (or at least I think that's what Klyith meant, the cheapest Titanium PSU I see is a Silverstone one), but you could get any of the aforementioned Gold ones too.

Klungar
Feb 12, 2008

Klungo make bessst ever video game, 'Hero Klungo Sssavesss Teh World.'


Fabulousity posted:

Per that motherboard's manual you'll have two internal USB headers located at the bottom of the board. See the diagram on page 7 - The headers in question are numbered 19 and 20.

Beautiful, thank you! Everything bought and on its way!

ozmunkeh
Feb 28, 2008

hey guys what is happening in this thread


Demostrs posted:

Go with something from AMD, it will perform better for cheaper.

This is all great info, thanks. The last time I built with AMD it was on a socket 7 motherboard, so it has been a while. I'll likely play around some more on that site and may be back again.

Basticle
Sep 12, 2011




*edit* disregard

Scyantific
Feb 13, 2011

World's #1 Elder Scrolls Online Fan!


Hello PC Building Thread! Looking to upgrade my 5 year old system, which means I'm building a new one. Going to carry over my peripherals (KB+M/Monitor/etc) so those aren't a factor.
Main Goal: Gaming (Doom Eternal/CP2077/etc at high to max settings), some video editing.

Current system



And here's what I'm currently planning:
PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($179.99 @ Best Buy)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX ATX AM4 Motherboard ($114.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: G.Skill Aegis 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3000 Memory ($62.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Western Digital Blue 1 TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($109.99 @ Amazon)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB PULSE Video Card ($409.00 @ Walmart)
Case: Corsair 270R ATX Mid Tower Case ($64.99 @ Corsair)
Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA G3 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($105.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $1047.93
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-01-28 23:26 EST-0500

I don't care much for overclocking so I probably won't spring for aftermarket cooling unless it's recommended. As far as the rest goes, the gpu is probably the one thing I won't budge on since I'm admittedly a diehard Sapphire fanboy (been using their products since my first HD5850 and I've yet to get a bad card). I may end up snagging some extra storage hard drives for movies/music in case my old HDDs fail later on. Is there anything that I should be on the lookout for?

Any tips/recommendations are appreciated!

TheFluff
Dec 13, 2006

FRIENDS, LISTEN TO ME
I AM A SEAGULL
OF WEALTH AND TASTE


Scyantific posted:

Hello PC Building Thread! Looking to upgrade my 5 year old system, which means I'm building a new one. Going to carry over my peripherals (KB+M/Monitor/etc) so those aren't a factor.
Main Goal: Gaming (Doom Eternal/CP2077/etc at high to max settings), some video editing.

Current system



And here's what I'm currently planning:
PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($179.99 @ Best Buy)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX ATX AM4 Motherboard ($114.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: G.Skill Aegis 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3000 Memory ($62.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Western Digital Blue 1 TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($109.99 @ Amazon)
Video Card: Sapphire Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB PULSE Video Card ($409.00 @ Walmart)
Case: Corsair 270R ATX Mid Tower Case ($64.99 @ Corsair)
Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA G3 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($105.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $1047.93
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-01-28 23:26 EST-0500

I don't care much for overclocking so I probably won't spring for aftermarket cooling unless it's recommended. As far as the rest goes, the gpu is probably the one thing I won't budge on since I'm admittedly a diehard Sapphire fanboy (been using their products since my first HD5850 and I've yet to get a bad card). I may end up snagging some extra storage hard drives for movies/music in case my old HDDs fail later on. Is there anything that I should be on the lookout for?

Any tips/recommendations are appreciated!
Looks good to me for the most part, but if you have a bit of space left in the budget I'd go for a bit faster memory - Ryzen benefits a lot from faster memory (up to DDR4-3600), and it's quite cheap these days. For gaming it's not such a big deal but there's a lot of things in video editing that really wants lots of memory bandwidth too.

I'd also try to set aside money for a monitor upgrade in the near future. A 5700XT is sort of overkill for 1080p 60fps, and 27" 1440p 144Hz IPS monitors with Freesync can be found for around $350 these days, sometimes even less (look for the Nixeus EDG-27S v2, the LG 27GL850 or the LG 27GL83A). High refresh rate 1440p with variable framerate support is a huge upgrade for basically all first-person games and you'll have the hardware to support it.

Thom P. Tiers
May 29, 2008

Red Birds
Red Ass
Red Text

Scyantific posted:


Main Goal: Gaming (Doom Eternal/CP2077/etc at high to max settings), some video editing.


CP2077 is going to have ray tracing which I would consider a "max setting" and I believe only Nvidia cards have that at the moment. Just giving you a heads up.

an actual dog
Nov 18, 2014

woof woof
I am a dog and I'm posting online. it's good to post online with friends.
woof bark woof



Thom P. Tiers posted:

CP2077 is going to have ray tracing which I would consider a "max setting" and I believe only Nvidia cards have that at the moment. Just giving you a heads up.

There is no way in hell that any card you can buy today will make ray tracing worth it. Maybe at 30 fps and that's a big maybe.

Scyantific
Feb 13, 2011

World's #1 Elder Scrolls Online Fan!


Thanks for the responses, I'm gonna spring for the faster RAM and will probably end up going for an aftermarket cooler as well.

As far as ray-tracing goes, I'm not that insistent on max settings so it really doesn't matter to me anyways; I do appreciate the heads up though

Steakandchips
Apr 30, 2009



My current computer:

i7 - 3930k Sandy Bridge E CPU
Noctua NH D14 cooler
32 gigs of DDR3 RAM
1.5tb of SSD space
nVidia 1080 GPU
Very old Dell U2311H pair of monitors

I'll be buying a decent 144hz+ freesync monitor shortly.

1. Does my 3930K bottleneck me for games like the upcoming Doom Eternal?
2. Is it worth selling the 3930k cpu/ram/mobo combo and buying a Ryzen 3600 cpu/ram/mobo combo?

Lockback
Sep 2, 2006

All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.


I'm going to need to finally replace my PSU here before the new GPU line comes out, what are the Corsair lines to avoid/go after?

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

USPOL May

Need a quick sanity check—speccing out a HEDT system for a video editing station, mostly Premiere, some After Effects. https://pcpartpicker.com/list/vRbdrV

Not worried about the system specs (other than actually getting a hold of an 10980XE), that's what they need and it isn't worth the extra couple grand for the AMD TR equivalent, but PC Partpicker is complaining that the Fractal Design Meshify S2 is not dimensionally compatible with the Gigabyte X299 Designare 10G. Fractal's website says compatible with E-ATX up to 285 mm wide, and the Designare 10G is 305mm x 275mm per Gigabyte's website.

Seems like the board should fit fine - any reason to worry that it won't?

(I know I could use the Designare EX, that's what their last system was built on, but they actually do need 10GBE for their workflow and having it 2x built into the motherboard would be extremely nice to have.)

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week


Lockback posted:

I'm going to need to finally replace my PSU here before the new GPU line comes out, what are the Corsair lines to avoid/go after?

CX non-modular if you have limited budget

after that all the gold rated models (RM, TX, RMX) are all great. RM for fully modular, TX for semi-modular but zero fan mode, RMX for both.

Their platinum-rated models like HX and HXi are also great, but have extra features that imo are kinda useless and bump the price a fair bit. I'd rather just get a seasonic prime platinum than spend extra $25 on USB monitoring or a switch for single vs multi 12v rails.

Scruff McGruff
Feb 13, 2007

Jesus, kid, you're almost a detective. All you need now is a gun, a gut, and three ex-wives.

Kalman posted:

Need a quick sanity check—speccing out a HEDT system for a video editing station, mostly Premiere, some After Effects. https://pcpartpicker.com/list/vRbdrV

Not worried about the system specs (other than actually getting a hold of an 10980XE), that's what they need and it isn't worth the extra couple grand for the AMD TR equivalent, but PC Partpicker is complaining that the Fractal Design Meshify S2 is not dimensionally compatible with the Gigabyte X299 Designare 10G. Fractal's website says compatible with E-ATX up to 285 mm wide, and the Designare 10G is 305mm x 275mm per Gigabyte's website.

Seems like the board should fit fine - any reason to worry that it won't?

(I know I could use the Designare EX, that's what their last system was built on, but they actually do need 10GBE for their workflow and having it 2x built into the motherboard would be extremely nice to have.)

I feel like it should be pointed out that, while the extra cost of TR isn't worth it, the biggest competitor for the 10980XE is really the Ryzen 9 3950x which, stock to stock, consistently matches and sometimes outperforms Intel's HEDT offering while being able to utilize the wider selection and higher availability of consumer motherboards. But if that's what they want then there's really no point arguing it. The warning is likely just because EATX isn't specifically listed in the PCpartpicker specs for the S2. If Fractal's info says it supports EATX then it should be fine, it just hasn't been updated on PCPP.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

USPOL May

Scruff McGruff posted:

I feel like it should be pointed out that, while the extra cost of TR isn't worth it, the biggest competitor for the 10980XE is really the Ryzen 9 3950x which, stock to stock, consistently matches and sometimes outperforms Intel's HEDT offering while being able to utilize the wider selection and higher availability of consumer motherboards. But if that's what they want then there's really no point arguing it. The warning is likely just because EATX isn't specifically listed in the PCpartpicker specs for the S2. If Fractal's info says it supports EATX then it should be fine, it just hasn't been updated on PCPP.

For various reasons, AMD is not preferable. (Biggest are Thunderbolt support and ability to upgrade to 256GB RAM when they upgrade to 6K or 8K cameras.). But thanks for the sanity check on the case. (Worst case they return it and reorder but would prefer to avoid.)

broken pixel
Dec 16, 2011





Demostrs posted:

Taking into consideration the suggestions Scruff already gave (the HP EX920 is another NVMe drive in the same class at those he named), I made a few as well to the list: PCPartPicker Part List

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($179.99 @ Best Buy)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Freezer 34 CPU Cooler ($31.95 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX ATX AM4 Motherboard ($114.99 @ B&H)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB Pro 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 Memory ($91.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: HP EX920 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($129.94 @ Amazon)
Video Card: Gigabyte Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB GAMING OC Video Card ($406.98 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Design Define R6 USB-C Blackout ATX Mid Tower Case ($138.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS Plus Platinum 550 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($107.99 @ Amazon)
Total: $1202.82
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-01-28 16:52 EST-0500

Right now 6c/12t is plenty for games and the IPC boost the 3600 gets will largely offset the difference in cores between it and the 2700X. The MAX version of the Tomahawk comes with a newer, larger BIOS chip to fit all the new CPU SKUs in its microcode, and getting RAM for it rated for the advertised 3600 MHz speed on the QVL is difficult without it being RGB. You can at least save money with this variant of the Vengeance RGB Pro and consider getting the R6 with a side panel if you wanna see them. There's also the option of getting a set of 3200 MHz RAM on the QVL or getting 3600 that isn't and maybe have to muck around with a Ryzen RAM timing calculator and BIOS settings for a bit to get it working at the proper speeds. I also kinda like the suggestion of the Platinum PSU for a similar price (or at least I think that's what Klyith meant, the cheapest Titanium PSU I see is a Silverstone one), but you could get any of the aforementioned Gold ones too.
Late response, but thanks for the lookover!

Edit: While I'm here, I might as well ask about my own build. I swapped the CPU, mobo, and RAM (shoutout to heeheex2 for the CPU purchase!) about a year ago and feel good about it, except my GPU has been dragging me down. It doesn't perform as well as it should, and I don't know if there's anything I can do about it. Would I benefit from a new GPU? Is there something else I should consider? In addition to gaming, I also use my setup for design work—typically not video/animation, mostly Photoshop, Illustrator, and InDesign. I'd also like to do 1440p 60Hz since I have a compatible monitor, but I'm okay with running really heavy stuff at 1080p.

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: Intel Core i7-8086K 4 GHz 6-Core Processor
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler
Motherboard: MSI Z370-A PRO ATX LGA1151 Motherboard
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V Series 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory
Storage: Samsung 850 EVO-Series 500 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive
Storage: Western Digital Blue 2 TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive
Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 960 4 GB Video Card
Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA G2 550 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply

Generated by PCPartPicker 2020-01-29 19:22 EST-0500

I trimmed the list down to the core parts, but the complete one is above.

broken pixel fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Jan 30, 2020

Lockback
Sep 2, 2006

All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.


Klyith posted:

CX non-modular if you have limited budget

after that all the gold rated models (RM, TX, RMX) are all great. RM for fully modular, TX for semi-modular but zero fan mode, RMX for both.

Their platinum-rated models like HX and HXi are also great, but have extra features that imo are kinda useless and bump the price a fair bit. I'd rather just get a seasonic prime platinum than spend extra $25 on USB monitoring or a switch for single vs multi 12v rails.

Thanks, perfect rundown!

Yawgmoft
Nov 15, 2004


So I understand this is a good time to upgrade my parts, and I've started to see a good deal of stutter in newer games.

Pretty much all I use my home computer for is gaming- 1440p 120hz, already have a 2070 Super, just need to upgrade my 8gb of DDR3 and five year old i5.

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X
Motherboard: ASUS AM4 TUF Gaming X570-Plus
Memory: G.SKILL 32GB (2 x 16GB) Ripjaws V Series DDR4 PC4-25600 3200MHz

I coupled this with a new SSD and it's coming out to a little under 800 dollars. My full budget is a thousand, so if there's anything I really don't need (like maybe the motherboard or CPU can be downgraded), or if I can get some real gains for a few hundred more dollars (like if 3600 memory will give me better return than I think) please let me know.

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust


Grimey Drawer

The Ryzen 3600 and 16 gigs of the same ram will do everything you want. Are you really into PCIE 4.0? Because otherwise the B450 Tomahawk Max is very capable and only costs $115.

HappyCapybaraFamily
Sep 16, 2009

Roger Baolong Thunder Dragon has been fascinated by this sophisticated and scientifically beautiful industry since childhood, and has shown his talent in the design and manufacture of watches.

an actual dog posted:

There is no way in hell that any card you can buy today will make ray tracing worth it. Maybe at 30 fps and that's a big maybe.

Not sure what a reasonable threshold for "worth it" is, but I got a used RTX 2080 for $585 that often gets me 60+ fps in Control with all ray tracing features enabled at 1920×1080 without DLSS, all other graphics settings max I don't think it dips below 40 fps, even during intense battles.

Wolfenstein: Youngblood runs at a similarly playable frame rate.

HappyCapybaraFamily fucked around with this message at 05:24 on Jan 30, 2020

Demostrs
Mar 30, 2011

by Nyc_Tattoo


broken pixel posted:

Edit: While I'm here, I might as well ask about my own build. I swapped the CPU, mobo, and RAM (shoutout to heeheex2 for the CPU purchase!) about a year ago and feel good about it, except my GPU has been dragging me down. It doesn't perform as well as it should, and I don't know if there's anything I can do about it. Would I benefit from a new GPU? Is there something else I should consider? In addition to gaming, I also use my setup for design work—typically not video/animation, mostly Photoshop, Illustrator, and InDesign. I'd also like to do 1440p 60Hz since I have a compatible monitor, but I'm okay with running really heavy stuff at 1080p.

You'd definitely benefit from a new GPU, it just depends on what your budget is. For new cards, the 1660S is a good value that could do a mix of older titles at 1440p and newer ones at 1080: https://www.anandtech.com/show/1501...eview-feat-evga

There's also the 2060 and RX 5700 as upgrades to that, but sadly your case won't be able to fit some of the larger ones like the XFX DD Ultra. While not being the best cooler, it is often one of the cheapest 5700s and at $300 probably the best price-to-performance ratio out there so long as you haven't sworn their drivers off for life. Puget Systems also was noticing that Navi lacks the same optimizations other GPU architectures do in Photoshop, but it's not a large performance delta and may have been fixed since August: https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/a...X-5700-XT-1552/

Demostrs fucked around with this message at 08:48 on Jan 30, 2020

Steakandchips
Apr 30, 2009



Steakandchips posted:

My current computer:

i7 - 3930k Sandy Bridge E CPU
Noctua NH D14 cooler
32 gigs of DDR3 RAM
1.5tb of SSD space
nVidia 1080 GPU
Very old Dell U2311H pair of monitors

I'll be buying a decent 144hz+ freesync monitor shortly.

1. Does my 3930K bottleneck me for games like the upcoming Doom Eternal?
2. Is it worth selling the 3930k cpu/ram/mobo combo and buying a Ryzen 3600 cpu/ram/mobo combo?

Any thoughts on this one?

Stickman
Feb 1, 2004

much, much larger than your hat, but not as large as the moon
-DNA


HappyCapybaraFamily posted:

Not sure what a reasonable threshold for "worth it" is, but I got a used RTX 2080 for $585 that often gets me 60+ fps in Control with all ray tracing features enabled at 1920×1080 without DLSS, all other graphics settings max I don't think it dips below 40 fps, even during intense battles.

Wolfenstein: Youngblood runs at a similarly playable frame rate.

The problem with RTX is that RTX ON often works okay... at a resolution lower than you’d reasonably want to run with RTX off. That means you’re either upscaling with something (and DLSS is mostly a bust), you’ve got two monitors, or you’re wasting some gpu potential in non-RTX games.

It’s not the end of the world, but it’s an annoyance that makes it difficult to properly utilize an RTX card without introducing additional hits to fidelity.

NickBlasta
May 16, 2003

Clearly their proficiency at shooting is supernatural, not practical, in origin.


Steakandchips posted:

1. Does my 3930K bottleneck me for games like the upcoming Doom Eternal?
2. Is it worth selling the 3930k cpu/ram/mobo combo and buying a Ryzen 3600 cpu/ram/mobo combo?

1. It's hard to spec for upcoming games, but likely if you have ok performance in Doom 4 it will be similar in Doom 5.

2. Of course. It's dramatically faster than a 3rd gen intel. But "worth it" is up to you...

Absorbs Smaller Goons
Mar 16, 2006


Steakandchips posted:

My current computer:

i7 - 3930k Sandy Bridge E CPU
Noctua NH D14 cooler
32 gigs of DDR3 RAM
1.5tb of SSD space
nVidia 1080 GPU
Very old Dell U2311H pair of monitors

I'll be buying a decent 144hz+ freesync monitor shortly.

1. Does my 3930K bottleneck me for games like the upcoming Doom Eternal?
2. Is it worth selling the 3930k cpu/ram/mobo combo and buying a Ryzen 3600 cpu/ram/mobo combo?

I went from haswell (i5 4670k) to zen2 (r5 3600) with great 3600 CAS 16 ram and kept my 1060 6GB. Everything I've thrown at it runs great, ryzen coupled with fast ram is a great combo.

1. Debatable but I'd wager it will bottleneck the 1080 enventually (if it doesn't already).
2. Hell yeah if you can scrounge up some dough from selling your stuff you can get a great system for cheap ie. less than 350$ (minus what you get from your sell) for an r5 3600 + MSI MAX mobo + 16GB 3600 ram with low-ish CAS

Steakandchips
Apr 30, 2009



Absorbs Smaller Goons posted:

I went from haswell (i5 4670k) to zen2 (r5 3600) with great 3600 CAS 16 ram and kept my 1060 6GB. Everything I've thrown at it runs great, ryzen coupled with fast ram is a great combo.

1. Debatable but I'd wager it will bottleneck the 1080 enventually (if it doesn't already).
2. Hell yeah if you can scrounge up some dough from selling your stuff you can get a great system for cheap ie. less than 350$ (minus what you get from your sell) for an r5 3600 + MSI MAX mobo + 16GB 3600 ram with low-ish CAS

Thanks mate, this is helpful.

Regarding DDR4 ram for the ryzen 3600: I'll definitely getting some 3600mhz or higher ram, but I am curious about the timings. Does 18-22-22-42 sound ok, for example? Should I get better timing-ed RAM, for game performance?

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HappyCapybaraFamily
Sep 16, 2009

Roger Baolong Thunder Dragon has been fascinated by this sophisticated and scientifically beautiful industry since childhood, and has shown his talent in the design and manufacture of watches.

Stickman posted:

The problem with RTX is that RTX ON often works okay... at a resolution lower than you’d reasonably want to run with RTX off. That means you’re either upscaling with something (and DLSS is mostly a bust), you’ve got two monitors, or you’re wasting some gpu potential in non-RTX games.

It’s not the end of the world, but it’s an annoyance that makes it difficult to properly utilize an RTX card without introducing additional hits to fidelity.

Ah, true enough. It is pretty unreasonable to get an RTX 2080 for 1080p60 gaming reasons

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