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The_Franz posted:Mukasey: I understand there has to be a perception that justice was done. I'm reminded of the case of Stefan Irving - he was a predatory, and got only 21 years. Don't destroy the prime of this kind young man's life. Let him meet a partner and have a baby. no! we must not let him father the kwisatz haderach
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Mar 28, 2024 16:01
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i'm just trying to wrap my head around $23.6 quintillion in claims i don't even think there's that much circulating cash, total lol
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Mar 28, 2024 16:02
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Beeftweeter posted:i'm just trying to wrap my head around $23.6 quintillion in claims there is probably a single $23.6 quintillion claim form filed. it is very common in bankruptcies some nutter files a ludicrious claim. that said the amount of claims to reconcile is likely a nightmare since every single time they'll have to object saying "no, they get a dollar amount" some pro se creditor is going to write a letter to the judge saying THATS NOT FAIR they'll have to respond to
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Mar 28, 2024 16:03
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Beeftweeter posted:i'm just trying to wrap my head around $23.6 quintillion in claims there isn't, the gross world product is a few tens of trillions I assume this is all creditors estimating what their gains would have been based on the initial investment ten years ago and the current value of bitcoin
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Mar 28, 2024 16:04
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Beeftweeter posted:i'm just trying to wrap my head around $23.6 quintillion in claims im gonna peg physical cash at 100 trillion
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Mar 28, 2024 16:04
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Carthag Tuek posted:no! we must not let him father the kwisatz haderach Let us not deny a man-shrimp a shrimp child
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Mar 28, 2024 16:05
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evilweasel posted:there is probably a single $23.6 quintillion claim form filed. it is very common in bankruptcies some nutter files a ludicrious claim. these are crypto people though, so there are probably multiple nutters filing claims for hundreds of trillions
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Mar 28, 2024 16:07
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evilweasel posted:there is probably a single $23.6 quintillion claim form filed. it is very common in bankruptcies some nutter files a ludicrious claim. that said the amount of claims to reconcile is likely a nightmare since every single time they'll have to object saying "no, they get a dollar amount" some pro se creditor is going to write a letter to the judge saying THATS NOT FAIR they'll have to respond to well that seems pretty frivolous and disingenuous (for john ray to say, anyway). unless they were a creditor, wouldn't they be entitled to pretty much nothing regardless?
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Mar 28, 2024 16:08
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notwithoutmyanus posted:Let us not deny a man-shrimp a shrimp child forgive me shrimp hulud!
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Mar 28, 2024 16:10
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The_Franz posted:these are crypto people though, so there are probably multiple nutters filing claims for hundreds of trillions sadly it seems the customer claims are not on the claims registry so i can't check usually though it's only one or two with insane claims (often clearly mentally ill), but there is certainly hundreds of billions to a trillion or two of not-entirely-mentally-ill claims Beeftweeter posted:well that seems pretty frivolous and disingenuous (for john ray to say, anyway). unless they were a creditor, wouldn't they be entitled to pretty much nothing regardless? you have to treat every filed claim form as a legitimate claim until it's disallowed by the court. so you effectively cannot make distributions until you disallow enough claims, since if you make a 25% distribution you have to hold 25% of the value of every claim you plan to object to, no matter how obviously meritless.
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Mar 28, 2024 16:11
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oh man his parents are 100% going to pay for a surrogate while he's locked up forever aren't they? they can't deny the world their The Best Genes [that produced a multiple addict crime goblin]
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Mar 28, 2024 16:11
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quote:Seeming to acknowledge his looming prison sentence, he said: "My useful life is probably over. It's been over for a while now." bro your useful life was over the day you got into crypto
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Mar 28, 2024 16:12
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The_Franz posted:found this guy who seems to be transcribing it in another thread thanks, that’s the same guy that followed the trial too. i thought all the nitter things got killed off, i’m glad i don’t have to follow on x dot com
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Mar 28, 2024 16:12
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Beeftweeter posted:well that seems pretty frivolous and disingenuous (for john ray to say, anyway). wouldn't they be entitled to pretty much nothing regardless? i don't think it's disingenuous. they have an insane amount of claims, and people are valuing them based upon crypto's rise. say i got $250m worth of bitcoin when it was $20k/coin on ftx. bitcoin is now $71k. my $250m in bitcoin should be worth $12,500,000,000,000. you then add in all the people that had however much of whatever shitcoin that has also risen in value with bitcoin and it adds up to an insane amount of money. ray has to go through and figure out what the actual cash value of these accounts were when the company filed bankruptcy and pay them that. this is a monumental task especially because everyone thinks they're entitled to so much more than they are.
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Mar 28, 2024 16:15
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Mr. Nice! posted:i don't think it's disingenuous. they have an insane amount of claims, and people are valuing them based upon crypto's rise. yeah there's absolutely no dispute it's a monumental task i just expect that you can get that number from the quadrillions to the mere trillion or two, potentially down to hundreds of billions, with a simple omnibus objection you could put together in a week. it's getting it from hundreds of billions to the actual billions owed that is the real monumental task.
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Mar 28, 2024 16:17
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evilweasel posted:sadly it seems the customer claims are not on the claims registry so i can't check well considering there probably isn't ~$6.5*10^18 floating around either and likely won't be for several hundred or thousand years i guess john ray really does have his work cut out for him
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Mar 28, 2024 16:17
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haveblue posted:bro your useful life was over the day you got into
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Mar 28, 2024 16:18
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evilweasel posted:lol sam has veered into openly lying to the court after the court found he committed perjury ehhhhh you can't really perjure yourself with the core question(s) of fact of a case, even after a conviction. that said, lol he hasn't accepted that the horse has left the barn. he's guilty. it's time to show contrition.
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Mar 28, 2024 16:20
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quote:Judge Kaplan: I've considered the guidelines and the 3553 factors. Much of what was said about the defendant's background is undisputed. He was privileged, had loving and devoted parents, he had every advantage they could confer on him, he went to MIT i don't think this is a good opening for ol' sammy
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Mar 28, 2024 16:20
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notwithoutmyanus posted:Let us not deny a man-shrimp a shrimp child 
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Mar 28, 2024 16:21
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Potato Salad posted:ehhhhh you can't really perjure yourself with the core question(s) of fact of a case, even after a conviction. you probably won't get prosecuted for it, but the judge is allowed to find you perjured yourself as relevant to sentencing - and judge kaplan explicitly did https://x.com/innercitypress/status/1773349731638394936?s=20
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Mar 28, 2024 16:22
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qirex posted:oh man his parents are 100% going to pay for a surrogate while he's locked up forever aren't they? they can't deny the world their The Best Genes [that produced a multiple addict crime goblin] their hosed up grandgollum
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Mar 28, 2024 16:22
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Mr. Nice! posted:i don't think it's disingenuous. they have an insane amount of claims, and people are valuing them based upon crypto's rise. i think it's not that complicated, people shouldn't be expecting to get the current value of bitcoin. which by the way has probably been pumped up by hackers running crypto miners on thousands of AI compute clusters (ironically called "Ray AI" lol) https://arstechnica.com/security/2024/03/thousands-of-servers-hacked-in-ongoing-attack-targeting-ray-ai-framework/
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Mar 28, 2024 16:23
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Beeftweeter posted:i think it's not that complicated, people shouldn't be expecting to get the current value of bitcoin. which by the way has probably been pumped up by hackers running crypto miners on thousands of AI compute clusters (ironically called "Ray AI" lol) that's still the basis for a lot of the numbers in people's claims even if it isn't valid, and it is complicated to figure out exactly what every single one of them is owed. he has to respond to every claim.
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Mar 28, 2024 16:25
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quote:Mukasey: Madoff stole from Holocaust survivors. That is not Sam. He did not want to personally inflict pain on anyone in any way. Sam was not a ruthless financial serial killer. He wasn't predatory. He makes decisions with math in his head, not malice in his heart lmao, the pseudo  by counsel.
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Mar 28, 2024 16:25
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Mr. Nice! posted:that's still the basis for a lot of the numbers in people's claims even if it isn't valid, and it is complicated to figure out exactly what every single one of them is owed. yeah i get it, it's more that the people making claims don't either way i wouldn't expect most bagholders to be given any bitcoin at all, considering sam had it pretty much all converted into various things (crypto, actual physical assets, etc). and even if they were then it wouldn't be at its current value
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Mar 28, 2024 16:29
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lmao judge kaplan is bringing bio the greatest hits he just repeated the “gently caress regulators” thing
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Mar 28, 2024 16:30
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Mr. Nice! posted:that's still the basis for a lot of the numbers in people's claims, and it is complicated to figure out exactly what every single one of them is owed. so in practice, not really what you do is you take the pile of claims forms, stack them incredibly high, sky-high. you then have someone enter their identifying information into a database along with the amount of money they claimed. you then compare that database to ftx's internal database, which you've already used to multiply the assets by the prices fixed by the bankruptcy court (they got this order already) to arrive at a fixed value. in reality, this internal database is what people are going to get and you don't care what they claimed. it's just a matter of going through the appropriate legal hoops to modify their claims. you then just file endless omnibus objections saying "person X claimed $500k, our books and records say $3.41, allow their claim at $3.41" with like 200 claims per objection (exact amount depends on the tolerance of the judge). you never actually bother to read the claim forms, aside from the grunt labor who typed the information into the database. if someone responds to the objection, you might bother to read the claim form if their response raises any sort of real issue, otherwise you just file an omnibus response saying "fifty people responded saying various things you've already ruled on, overrule those objections" the problem comes in just churning through tens of thousands of claims, dealing with the responses, and certainly some of the nutters will file appeals
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Mar 28, 2024 16:30
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fins posted:lmao, the pseudo "your honor, this is patently ridiculous. there simply aren't that many holocaust survivors left around for my client to bilk"
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Mar 28, 2024 16:30
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Eeyo posted:lmao judge kaplan is bringing bio the greatest hits https://x.com/innercitypress/status/1773372247769592014?s=20 yeah that's not a great quote to have when you're pleading to be allowed back into society someday
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Mar 28, 2024 16:31
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look, I flipped a coin and the earth wasn't destroyed, that's a solid track record that justifies letting me flip it again
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Mar 28, 2024 16:36
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"your honor, may i remind the court that a coin flip isn't actually even money? sam had said that he'd take that bet with heads making the world twice as good, and there's a slight weight discrepancy making the tails side lighter. now, that may make my client look bad. but who is keeping track of these weights anyway? is it you? him? the jury? no, your honor, the blame here rests with the treasury department" e: actually im not sure who is responsible for coinage weight lol. lets just go with treasury Beeftweeter fucked around with this message at 16:41 on Mar 28, 2024 |
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Mar 28, 2024 16:37
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haveblue posted:look, I flipped a coin and the earth wasn't destroyed, that's a solid track record that justifies letting me flip it again this kinda is the largest scale example of someone misattributing luck as skill/ability
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Mar 28, 2024 16:37
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just wanna point out again that sam bet the wrong way on the coin flip, learning that tails is more likely to land face up is literally statistics 101
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Mar 28, 2024 16:38
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look he had a 50/50 chance of choosing the right weighted side, what more could you want?
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Mar 28, 2024 16:41
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evilweasel posted:you probably won't get prosecuted for it, but the judge is allowed to find you perjured yourself as relevant to sentencing - and judge kaplan explicitly did that wasn't one of the core questions of fact of the case nobody expects you to admit guilt, but you are expected to tell the truth about unrelated topics or tangentially related topics
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Mar 28, 2024 16:41
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Eeyo posted:look he had a 50/50 chance of choosing the right weighted side, what more could you want? an ~80% chance of tails landing face up
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Mar 28, 2024 16:42
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Potato Salad posted:that wasn't one of the core questions of fact of the case i thought he was charged in a superseding indictment with witness tampering too though. so that would make it a core question?
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Mar 28, 2024 16:43
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ugh he's getting less than 50 years
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Mar 28, 2024 16:44
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evilweasel posted:ugh he's getting less than 50 years he'd still be 70 by the time he gets out lol
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Mar 28, 2024 16:47
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