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pixaal
Jan 8, 2004

All ice cream is now for all beings, no matter how many legs.


Anonymous Zebra posted:

The fun question is "What the gently caress were they regularly flying through the Rings to need them to be that big?!" This is a civilization that built a machine that humans mistook for a planet. They aimed big.

Why couldn't the rings be big because it's a highway and you have quintillions of private ships that need to pass?

Proto Molecule is not the species but the tool. The species is dead.

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Zazz Razzamatazz
Apr 19, 2016

No hunks allowed, ya dangus

Slashrat posted:

I didn't get the impression that the PM civ built the planet from scratch, but rather just repurposed an existing planet (and an array of attendant moons moved into orbit) into a single piece of machinery. Iirc it was mentioned that the geological record had evidence of three different biological eras; The one that came before the protomolecule and was wiped out when the planet was repurposed. Whatever the PM civ was and then finally the biological era that evolved after the PM civ was itself wiped out by its enemies.

Doesn't change that the PM civ built big though.

As for the ring size, the protomocule still seems to require raw resources proportional to what it is constructing, so the rings might just be that big in order to facilitate hauling asteroids and small planetary bodies through to the system where the materials are actually needed.

I assumed they were referring to the control sphere in the slow zone. I think the characters mistook it for a planet or moon the first time they saw it.

Owling Howl
Jul 17, 2019

No one cares.

Phobophilia posted:

Marco, like Ashford and Murtry and Mao and Errinwright, fall into the mil-sci-fi novel antagonist trap of being a relentless one-note assholes.

Pretty stark contrast to Clarissa.

Anonymous Zebra
Oct 21, 2005
Blending in like it ain't no thang

Slashrat posted:

I didn't get the impression that the PM civ built the planet from scratch, but rather just repurposed an existing planet (and an array of attendant moons moved into orbit) into a single piece of machinery. Iirc it was mentioned that the geological record had evidence of three different biological eras; The one that came before the protomolecule and was wiped out when the planet was repurposed. Whatever the PM civ was and then finally the biological era that evolved after the PM civ was itself wiped out by its enemies.

I'd need to go back and watch the conversation again, but I believe the three "eras" of biology on Ilus were the Proto-species, the new life forms that evolved after the builders got wiped out a billion years ago, and then Earth-based beings. She was basically saying that the Belters had no idea what effect humans living on that planet would have on the creatures that lived there, and also no idea what effect those creatures would have on humans.

Zazz Razzamatazz posted:

I assumed they were referring to the control sphere in the slow zone. I think the characters mistook it for a planet or moon the first time they saw it.

Nah, I was talking about Ilus. While they never dig too deep past the crust, there are implications that the entire thing is one giant structure that they are living on the surface of, and which has been covered by junk over the last billion years. In the book they theorize that it might have been a machine meant to artificially create lithium and other rare minerals, and that the Belters have essentially been "mining" into a giant storage tank of the stuff. The "moons" are also weapons and defense platforms that just resemble moons. The reason one of them starts melting is because it's firing some kind of particle weapon that is literally melting all the "dust" that has accumulated over the lens over the billion years it's been inactive. Although Slashrat may be correct in that there originally was a planet there, and they just hollowed it out to make their machine. I have reasons that I won't get into here to believe that they could built planet sized stuff from scratch.

pixaal posted:

Why couldn't the rings be big because it's a highway and you have quintillions of private ships that need to pass?

Proto Molecule is not the species but the tool. The species is dead.

Yup, something I love about this is that humanity is basically only able to interact with the AIs left behind by this dead species. And not even their most sophisticated AIs. but the program that controls their automatic brick layer, and the home security system AI.

Anonymous Zebra fucked around with this message at 16:39 on Oct 13, 2020

Toxic Fart Syndrome
Jul 2, 2006

*hits A-THREAD-5*

Only 3.6 Roentgoons per hour ... not great, not terrible.




...the meter only goes to 3.6...



Pork Pro

Slashrat posted:

I didn't get the impression that the PM civ built the planet from scratch, but rather just repurposed an existing planet (and an array of attendant moons moved into orbit) into a single piece of machinery. Iirc it was mentioned that the geological record had evidence of three different biological eras; The one that came before the protomolecule and was wiped out when the planet was repurposed. Whatever the PM civ was and then finally the biological era that evolved after the PM civ was itself wiped out by its enemies.

Doesn't change that the PM civ built big though.

As for the ring size, the protomocule still seems to require raw resources proportional to what it is constructing, so the rings might just be that big in order to facilitate hauling asteroids and small planetary bodies through to the system where the materials are actually needed.

Anonymous Zebra posted:

I'd need to go back and watch the conversation again, but I believe the three "eras" of biology on Ilus were the Proto-species, the new life forms that evolved after the builders got wiped out a billion years ago, and then Earth-based beings. She was basically saying that the Belters had no idea what effect humans living on that planet would have on the creatures that lived there, and also no idea what effect those creatures would have on humans.

They touch on this in the show, but go deeper in the books. The three "layers" of life were pre-Protomolecule, Protomolecule, and post-Protomolecule. The scientists from RCE speculated that Ilus was hit with a Pheobe-like object which hijacked early life on the planet and repurposed it. Probably what Phoebe was going to do to Earth: turn it into a giant powerstation and shoot a ring-gate off to send it all back to the Home System.

etalian
Mar 20, 2006



Next season looks like more fun violent Amos adventures like visiting neo baltimore.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?




This is the season where I'm jealous of people who haven't read the books. I can't wait.

uber_stoat
Jan 21, 2001





Pillbug

etalian posted:

Next season looks like more fun violent Amos adventures like visiting neo baltimore.

you're in for a treat.

Tighclops
Jan 23, 2008

Unable to deal with it


Grimey Drawer

Grand Fromage posted:

This is the season where I'm jealous of people who haven't read the books. I can't wait.

hi it's me it's the guy who hemmed and hawwed about ordering the books back in the day and literally had the page open to buy them when I saw the announcement that they were making a series and thought "nah I'll just wait for that instead"

I figure once the show finishes and inevitably get the hankering for more I'll have all the books waiting for me

AntherUslessPoster
Feb 12, 2019

...bites the dust






Grand Fromage posted:

This is the season where I'm jealous of people who haven't read the books. I can't wait.

On a scale from STTNG to B5 please indicate expected experiences?

Drone Jett
Feb 21, 2017


College Slice

AntherUslessPoster posted:

On a scale from STTNG to B5 please indicate expected experiences?

GoT S3

MA-Horus
Dec 3, 2006

I'm sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome I am.



AntherUslessPoster posted:

On a scale from STTNG to B5 please indicate expected experiences?

Sheridan declaring B5s independence
Best of Both Worlds.

Hitch your tits and pucker up. S5 is gonna peel the paint.

Toxic Fart Syndrome
Jul 2, 2006

*hits A-THREAD-5*

Only 3.6 Roentgoons per hour ... not great, not terrible.




...the meter only goes to 3.6...



Pork Pro

The book this season is based on is very boring, actually. I had a really hard time paying attention.

I am not being ironic. 90% is actually very, very boring.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?




AntherUslessPoster posted:

On a scale from STTNG to B5 please indicate expected experiences?

B5 season 3/4.

Anonymous Zebra
Oct 21, 2005
Blending in like it ain't no thang

I like all the books, but when I got reading this one I was like, "Oh, this is where all the characterization of the cast came from for the TV show." It was such a monumental step up in writing from the previous four, and basically set things up for all the following books. Basically all the Roci crew get some really nice fleshed out storylines, and I'm convinced that it's this book alone that made Wes want to play Amos. It's just fantastic.

etalian
Mar 20, 2006



uber_stoat posted:

you're in for a treat.

Id like to think the most recent season was sort in the exposition trap setting up the next season, not as much action and explaining new things like gates more.

Looks like of the main arcs for the next season is the uneasy peace between the main factions ending with the OPA unified factions doing a first strike against earth. It also ties into who was buying all Martian military mothballed equipment in the recent season.

TommyGun85
Jun 5, 2013


Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:

The book this season is based on is very boring, actually. I had a really hard time paying attention.

I am not being ironic. 90% is actually very, very boring.

Agreed 100% I thiught it was incredibly overrated.

Madurai
Jun 26, 2012



Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:

The book this season is based on is very boring, actually. I had a really hard time paying attention.

I am not being ironic. 90% is actually very, very boring.

This is a weird take on the best book in the series.

Nail Rat
Dec 29, 2000

Haters gonna hate


I really loved Babylon's Ashes but it's incredibly divisive. Either you think it's one of the best or you think it's one of the worst. Nobody thinks it's middle of the pack.

edit: didn't see it mentioned so they announced today that on December 16th they will release the first 3 episodes, and then it's weekly after that for the rest of them. I think this is new news but I could be wrong. I kind of like going back to a weekly release (with a little mini binge to start).

Nail Rat fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Oct 14, 2020

Chalks
Sep 30, 2009



Nail Rat posted:

I really loved Babylon's Ashes but it's incredibly divisive. Either you think it's one of the best or you think it's one of the worst. Nobody thinks it's middle of the pack.

edit: didn't see it mentioned so they announced today that on December 16th they will release the first 3 episodes, and then it's weekly after that for the rest of them. I think this is new news but I could be wrong. I kind of like going back to a weekly release (with a little mini binge to start).

Yeah, I agree. Although part of me will be desperate to watch the next episode immediately, I also miss discussing the episodes with people as they air and speculating about what's going to happen and you really miss out on that when they dump a whole series at once.

I like that they're experimenting with different release schedules trying to find out what people prefer.

Jager
Aug 4, 2003

Eeww!


Having experienced this release schedule with The Boys, I'm ok with it. I feel like a mini-binge of the first three episodes is good relief from months between the seasons. This is then balanced by a one episode a week release that allows for discussion, speculation, and extended hype. I like being able to binge older shows to catch up on seasons worth of content but releasing a new season all at once is like a sugar rush; it only feels good for a very short period of time. I wouldn't be surprised if this release pattern becomes the standard because it gives people a reason to subscribe for longer to whatever service it is on.

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust


Grimey Drawer

Amazon recently released all of Utopia at once. There doesn't seem to be any reasoning for it. Maybe if they know the show is good they'll spread it out. Amazon also made a weekly aftershow for The Boys so I'm not sure why they don't have one for The Expanse. Get Adam Savage to host and geek out with the actors and writers.

uber_stoat
Jan 21, 2001





Pillbug

Mu Zeta posted:

Amazon recently released all of Utopia at once. There doesn't seem to be any reasoning for it. Maybe if they know the show is good they'll spread it out. Amazon also made a weekly aftershow for The Boys so I'm not sure why they don't have one for The Expanse. Get Adam Savage to host and geek out with the actors and writers.

https://twitter.com/ExpanseOnPrime/...3170737152?s=20

Anonymous Zebra
Oct 21, 2005
Blending in like it ain't no thang

Something that some of these streaming services apparently noticed was what happened with "The Witcher" vs. what happened with "The Mandalorian". Disney+ released Mandalorian episodically once a week while Netflix dumped Witcher all out at once. While you could argue about which of these two shows is better, what was seen was that Mandalorian generated buzz for LONGER than the Witcher. Each episode being separated caused people to make Baby Yoda memes, gush about Baby Yoda on Twitter, and seemed to allow new viewers to "catch-up" with current viewers fairly easily. Basically word of mouth made more people watch the show, which made more word of mouth, and this went on for several months and was very sucessful.

In contrast, The Witcher generated a whole lot of buzz too, but it died down a hell of a lot faster. We still got some memes with 'Toss a Coin to your Witcher', but nothing to the same degree as with The Mandalorian. People binged the show, told their friends to binge it, and then...kind of moved on. I think streaming services took note of this and are deciding to spread out shows a little more now if it's one they think is going to be a major word-of-mouth show.

kerwyn
Aug 21, 2007


Nail Rat posted:

I really loved Babylon's Ashes but it's incredibly divisive. Either you think it's one of the best or you think it's one of the worst. Nobody thinks it's middle of the pack.

edit: didn't see it mentioned so they announced today that on December 16th they will release the first 3 episodes, and then it's weekly after that for the rest of them. I think this is new news but I could be wrong. I kind of like going back to a weekly release (with a little mini binge to start).

Eh, I'd honestly put it middle of the pack, but on the lower end. I don't think I outright hated a single book and even put Cibola Burn higher than a lot.

Tiamat's Wrath was my absolute favorite though. (Nemesis Games a close second)

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.



Anonymous Zebra posted:

Something that some of these streaming services apparently noticed was what happened with "The Witcher" vs. what happened with "The Mandalorian". Disney+ released Mandalorian episodically once a week while Netflix dumped Witcher all out at once. While you could argue about which of these two shows is better, what was seen was that Mandalorian generated buzz for LONGER than the Witcher. Each episode being separated caused people to make Baby Yoda memes, gush about Baby Yoda on Twitter, and seemed to allow new viewers to "catch-up" with current viewers fairly easily. Basically word of mouth made more people watch the show, which made more word of mouth, and this went on for several months and was very sucessful.

In contrast, The Witcher generated a whole lot of buzz too, but it died down a hell of a lot faster. We still got some memes with 'Toss a Coin to your Witcher', but nothing to the same degree as with The Mandalorian. People binged the show, told their friends to binge it, and then...kind of moved on. I think streaming services took note of this and are deciding to spread out shows a little more now if it's one they think is going to be a major word-of-mouth show.

Man, can you imagine the size of the promotion that the person who thinks up selling advertising time in the middle of the episodes is going to get? Like, that's a whole other income stream they've been missing out on this whole time.

banned from Starbucks
Jul 18, 2004






I never read this book. Does everyone kinda go off and do their own thing this season or just Amos?

Zazz Razzamatazz
Apr 19, 2016

No hunks allowed, ya dangus

Jager posted:

Having experienced this release schedule with The Boys, I'm ok with it. I feel like a mini-binge of the first three episodes is good relief from months between the seasons. This is then balanced by a one episode a week release that allows for discussion, speculation, and extended hype. I like being able to binge older shows to catch up on seasons worth of content but releasing a new season all at once is like a sugar rush; it only feels good for a very short period of time. I wouldn't be surprised if this release pattern becomes the standard because it gives people a reason to subscribe for longer to whatever service it is on.

Plus the fist episode of a season can be a bit heavy on "plot catch-up" stuff, giving us the first three helps hook people in more.

I didn't mind that rollout for The Boys, yeah I would have been happy to binge it, but it was fun discussing and guessing. Plus waiting for it all week the finale felt a little more like an event?

Drone Jett
Feb 21, 2017


College Slice

banned from Starbucks posted:

I never read this book. Does everyone kinda go off and do their own thing this season or just Amos?

Everyone but Holden leaves the Rocinante on a personal errand or side quest.

Anonymous Zebra
Oct 21, 2005
Blending in like it ain't no thang

Solice Kirsk posted:

Man, can you imagine the size of the promotion that the person who thinks up selling advertising time in the middle of the episodes is going to get? Like, that's a whole other income stream they've been missing out on this whole time.

Jesus, don't accidentally give them ideas.

GodFish
Oct 10, 2012

We're your first, last, and only line of defense. We live in secret. We exist in shadow.

And we dress in black.


Amazon already puts ads at the front of its prime exclusive shows. They're skippable but it's extremely annoying and insulting.

Toxic Fart Syndrome
Jul 2, 2006

*hits A-THREAD-5*

Only 3.6 Roentgoons per hour ... not great, not terrible.




...the meter only goes to 3.6...



Pork Pro

Solice Kirsk posted:

Man, can you imagine the size of the promotion that the person who thinks up selling advertising time in the middle of the episodes is going to get? Like, that's a whole other income stream they've been missing out on this whole time.

Nail Rat
Dec 29, 2000

Haters gonna hate


kerwyn posted:

Eh, I'd honestly put it middle of the pack, but on the lower end. I don't think I outright hated a single book and even put Cibola Burn higher than a lot.

Tiamat's Wrath was my absolute favorite though. (Nemesis Games a close second)

Oh, this season is based on Nemesis Games, not Babylon's Ashes. I mixed my titles up.

Nemesis Games, that's the one that everyone either hates or loves.

My top 3 are probably Tiamat's Wrath, Nemesis Games, and Leviathan Wakes (just for setting everything up) in no particular order.

emanresu tnuocca
Sep 2, 2011

Clarke has more acting talent in her brows than most other actors, including herself, have in their entire body.



https://www.reddit.com/r/television..._the_choice_of/

quote:

"It's bad for the shows. You spend all year making a show and it gets into the public consciousness for a week and then disappears. I think it's part of what has led to our current, "three seasons then auto cancelled" streaming service model."

uber_stoat
Jan 21, 2001





Pillbug


honestly, as much as i enjoy disappearing into a binge watch k-hole, this is probably true. going to be the new normal going forward i guess.

Nail Rat
Dec 29, 2000

Haters gonna hate


I think that's true and I think it's especially dangerous for a show like the Expanse which is trying (successfully it seems) to finally establish itself. It's going to help to have people talking about it for 7 weeks instead of 1 week; gets more people to check it out.

CainsDescendant
Dec 6, 2007

Human nature

Yeah, it was really disappointing to see the buzz about season 4 cut off so quickly after the cancellation kerfuffle put so many more eyes on it. You could certainly argue that season 4 was a little lackluster after how bonkers season 3 was, but I definitely felt like it was the full drop working against it. Most expanse communities I followed tried various ways to break up discussion so no one spoiled anyone else and mostly it led to no one talking about it at all other than "that was good! Can't wait for next season". It's really surprising to me how many folks are really angry they won't be able to binge s5, judging by the response on Ty's twitter, because I'm really excited to space it out again.

Dreylad
Jun 19, 2001


I think I may end up appreciating Season 4 as a small story in between big epic moments that have already happened and are going to probably come up this season. There are parts that definitely drag, but I still like the Illum storyline a lot.

404notfound
Mar 5, 2006

stop staring at me



Hopping online to see what everybody is saying after an episode is a big part of the experience for me, so I much prefer a weekly release. Bingeing a show is nice for something I've seen before, but I want time to digest new stuff

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Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust


Grimey Drawer

CainsDescendant posted:

Yeah, it was really disappointing to see the buzz about season 4 cut off so quickly after the cancellation kerfuffle put so many more eyes on it. You could certainly argue that season 4 was a little lackluster after how bonkers season 3 was, but I definitely felt like it was the full drop working against it. Most expanse communities I followed tried various ways to break up discussion so no one spoiled anyone else and mostly it led to no one talking about it at all other than "that was good! Can't wait for next season". It's really surprising to me how many folks are really angry they won't be able to binge s5, judging by the response on Ty's twitter, because I'm really excited to space it out again.

It just wasn't an exciting season and I think conversation would have dropped off the same way whether it was binged or not. I plan on re-watching the whole series for the first time before 5 drops and I'm probably skipping season 4.

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