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Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Hal Incandenza posted:

Steaks thing sounds... Unlikely

regardless of whether my self-guard counted, the indisputable fact is two separate kills were blocked last night on one or more of the people i voted

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hambeet
Sep 13, 2002



Mr. Steak posted:

im not targeting myself.


i thought i could but now im not so sure because i was using a separate command ##extravote per amni's request, and now that i only have 1 vote, that could be construed as faking a day action. but i guess it's soft-confirmed by me suddenly never using extra votes

yeah you unvoted, my bad.

Leith Maclaine
Mar 2, 2018

Adventure comes from insufficient planning.

My information involves entirely different people than Steaks and is nothing concrete due to the weakness in the power currently. There are enough holes in my information that I can't even call people out based on it. Might be time to go back to vote patterns again.

Opopanax
Aug 8, 2007

Oh no, not me
We never lost control




I'm going to plant myself in the "steak's stuff sounds like it's made up" camp for now

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

Yeah... I'm staying to feel that way as well

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

SalTheBard posted:

Yeah... I'm starting to feel that way as well

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Mr. Steak posted:

regardless of whether my self-guard counted, the indisputable fact is two separate kills were blocked last night on one or more of the people i voted

Indisputable to you I guess but since the rest of us have nothing but your word to go on that's pretty worthless info right now

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




And let's be honest steak your word carries very little value based on history

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




You claimed watcher correct? I find it even more unlikely that two separate people tried to kill someone who was watched

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Hal Incandenza posted:

You claimed watcher correct? I find it even more unlikely that two separate people tried to kill someone who was watched

Oh wait you said you somehow bodyguard yourself I forgot so I guess everyone could be trying to kill you except for the third killer we also have

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Hal Incandenza posted:

You claimed watcher correct? I find it even more unlikely that two separate people tried to kill someone who was watched

it happened, so im trying to figure out what went on.

there are already 2 kills accounted for now that we have cpig's flip, so the only mysteries are:

-what's the 3rd kill?
-which one killed cpig?
-who got cpig's 1-shot vig?

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


i know i make poo poo up in mafia, but this would be a huge step up from even my most outrageous lies.

for one, it'd necessitate me sacrificing whatever my real ability is, to keep up the charade that i lost the extra votes.

for two, if the cpig vig targeted someone besides the 3 i guarded, they could counter my claim, with 0 risk because they dont even have the vig anymore.

these are things i'd consider before lying

Leith Maclaine
Mar 2, 2018

Adventure comes from insufficient planning.

I am just making sure I understand this right,

Originally you had an 2 extra votes power, that got upgraded to what you said was 3 votes plus watching them, and that was a lie, and it is actually 3 votes plus bodyguarding them, and you can decide to use 1 of the 3 to bodyguard yourself so that once we get down to 4 or so people, you can freeze everything in place at night?

Am I understanding that right?

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Leith Maclaine posted:

I am just making sure I understand this right,

Originally you had an 2 extra votes power, that got upgraded to what you said was 3 votes plus watching them, and that was a lie, and it is actually 3 votes plus bodyguarding them, and you can decide to use 1 of the 3 to bodyguard yourself so that once we get down to 4 or so people, you can freeze everything in place at night?

Am I understanding that right?

thats exactly right, though i never confirmed with the mod if i can self-guard. i just self-voted and assumed it would work because in the text of my upgrade it would. idk if that was a possibility amni overlooked or if he'd allow it. i never asked. however, that has little bearing on my 2 lost votes. that's not a guess. i was informed that they're gone, and according to the text of my ability update, the only way to lose them is a bodyguard effect being "spent"

charms
Oct 14, 2012




Mr. Steak posted:

for two, if the cpig vig targeted someone besides the 3 i guarded, they could counter my claim, with 0 risk because they dont even have the vig anymore.

I'm having trouble with this one. If CapitalistPig gave the vig to someone, and that got ironically turned around on them... what exactly does that give the shooter on you?

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


charms posted:

I'm having trouble with this one. If CapitalistPig gave the vig to someone, and that got ironically turned around on them... what exactly does that give the shooter on you?

i mean, thats possible. theres a 1 in 3 chance i suppose. but if i wanted to make a lie capitalizing on the assumption that cpig's gifted vig was used and blocked, i'd just claim one popped guard, not two. i mean, geez.

does nobody want to claim that 1-shot vig? if not i'll have to assume scum got it

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Hal Incandenza posted:

And let's be honest steak your word carries very little value based on history

i'd like to be clear that my "history" is made up of improbably frequent scum games. so of course this would be true

Hal Insandenza
Feb 12, 2004




Mr. Steak posted:

i'd like to be clear that my "history" is made up of improbably frequent scum games. so of course this would be true

Let's not forget survivor cop

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Hal Incandenza posted:

Let's not forget survivor cop

that doesnt count cuz i helped town win by tricking scum with a gambit.

hmmMMMM sound familiar?

lol

Lumpen
Apr 2, 2004

I'd been happy, and I was happy still. For all to be accomplished,
for me to feel less lonely,
all that remained to hope
was that on the day of my execution
there should be a huge crowd of spectators and that they should
greet me with howls of execration.


Plaster Town Cop

I think it's highly "convenient* that when there is a way to demonstrate Mr. Steak's claim (he should have been able to identify the messenger if he watched), suddenly that claim was a lie and a new claim is created, but also he won't demonstrate that the extravotes are gone.

Both claims also very self-serving as far as manipulating power roles and providing an excuse for Steak not being dead the next day.

Maybe CPig gave Steak (or another of the SAAPs) the Vig, and Steak went all through D2 creating a gambit setting them up to use it as an extra Secret Alliance nightkill?

If that was the case then one kill did get stopped, they would not both target CPig. If Sal is Town and his claim of Jailer is true, then he may have jailed a killer or a victim. Since he already claimed Jailer he should probably claim his N2 target.

Mr. Steak, if you are telling the truth, please ask the mod if you can demonstrate your extravotes are gone.

I am inclined to 'Liminate All Liars.

Lumpen
Apr 2, 2004

I'd been happy, and I was happy still. For all to be accomplished,
for me to feel less lonely,
all that remained to hope
was that on the day of my execution
there should be a huge crowd of spectators and that they should
greet me with howls of execration.


Plaster Town Cop

I was probably right with my first instincts on D1 and I won't take the chance of being punked by an admitted liar.
##vote Mr. Steak

b-minus1
Jul 24, 2008

She's a maniac, maniac
on the floor
And she's dancing like she's never danced before


Sal, who did you jail n2

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Lumpen posted:

I am inclined to 'Liminate All Liars.

that's very fair.

tbh, as much as i'd like to clear up the ambiguity around my votes, i'd feel extremely weird asking the mod permission to use an action that would do nothing. i feel like part of the spirit of the rule "don't fake day actions" is to prevent people from submitting actions that do nothing, to mod-confirm some fact about their role.

call my stubbornness suspicious, but im a huge honkin stickler for mafia rules. im not into pushing the envelope to put the mod in a strange position of deciding whether or not to confirm a player's role. that's not the point of mafia. you'll have to just believe me based on the other facts.

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

b-minus1 posted:

Sal, who did you jail n2

Hum.

Opopanax
Aug 8, 2007

Oh no, not me
We never lost control




Lumpen posted:

I think it's highly "convenient* that when there is a way to demonstrate Mr. Steak's claim (he should have been able to identify the messenger if he watched), suddenly that claim was a lie and a new claim is created, but also he won't demonstrate that the extravotes are gone.


I hate to say it but this is a very good catch.

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Lumpen posted:

I think it's highly "convenient* that when there is a way to demonstrate Mr. Steak's claim (he should have been able to identify the messenger if he watched), suddenly that claim was a lie and a new claim is created, but also he won't demonstrate that the extravotes are gone.

Retro Futurist posted:

I hate to say it but this is a very good catch.

i wouldnt say the progression of the discussion points to this being my thinking.

first, i respond to lumpen perpetuating my investigative-role claim while dodging his question. yes, that is oddly convenient. and now we know why.

but why then, as a gambit, would i suddenly change my mind about the lie with literally zero prompting, pull a complete 180 on what im claiming while also ratcheting it up to 11...?

i know somebody is going to answer something like "nothing's out of the question for you, steak" but contrary to popular belief i do have logic in my behaviors.

Lumpen
Apr 2, 2004

I'd been happy, and I was happy still. For all to be accomplished,
for me to feel less lonely,
all that remained to hope
was that on the day of my execution
there should be a huge crowd of spectators and that they should
greet me with howls of execration.


Plaster Town Cop

In this understated response, Sal is claiming that he Jailed Mr. Humalong N2.

Uhhh, why? I couldn't find any alignment call about him by you at all.
Sal's only utterance about Humalong in the entire game was early on D1:

SalTheBard posted:

<3 Mr Scumalong!

At the end of D2, Sal's stayed suspects were ETR and xiw.

SalTheBard posted:

I'm going to go ahead and vote for Xiw (yes I'm aware that I quote ETR's post)

##vote xiw

But like goddamn Xiw and ETR just dropping in at the end of the day to be like "Lol sorry getting caught up!" is so loving scummy it's un loving believable.

SalTheBard posted:

I feel ETR's poo poo posting speaks for itself. Xiw I'm still going to watch you but like I think the evidence at this point is overwhelming ##vote ETR

So the claimed choice of Humalong to Jail makes no sense in the context of Sal's purported reads. If he really thought xiw was Secret Alliance, why not Jail him to try and prevent a kill?

Lumpen
Apr 2, 2004

I'd been happy, and I was happy still. For all to be accomplished,
for me to feel less lonely,
all that remained to hope
was that on the day of my execution
there should be a huge crowd of spectators and that they should
greet me with howls of execration.


Plaster Town Cop

Mr. Steak posted:

i know somebody is going to answer something like "nothing's out of the question for you, steak" but contrary to popular belief i do have logic in my behaviors.
Counterpoint, in a recent game, Steak voluntarily and without pressure revealed himself as the third Mason in an Unconfirmed Masonry after the two other Mason's had been NKed' N1 and N2 and both flipped Town. He was immediately voted out as the Informed Minority Mason.

Highly illogical.

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Lumpen posted:

Counterpoint, in a recent game, Steak voluntarily and without pressure revealed himself as the third Mason in an Unconfirmed Masonry after the two other Mason's had been NKed' N1 and N2 and both flipped Town. He was immediately voted out as the Informed Minority Mason.

Highly illogical.

i was actually voted out because people just didnt believe i was a mason at all haha

SalTheBard
Jan 26, 2005


I forgot to post my food for USPOL Thanksgiving but that's okay too!




Fallen Rib

Hum was coming at me pretty hard on the end of D2 so that was pretty much the reason. In hindsight I think Xiw would've made the most sense, but yeah.

Opopanax
Aug 8, 2007

Oh no, not me
We never lost control




Steak remind me who you targeted last night

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Retro Futurist posted:

Steak remind me who you targeted last night

myself, lumpen, hambeet

Leith Maclaine
Mar 2, 2018

Adventure comes from insufficient planning.

Lumpen posted:

Counterpoint, in a recent game, Steak voluntarily and without pressure revealed himself as the third Mason in an Unconfirmed Masonry after the two other Mason's had been NKed' N1 and N2 and both flipped Town. He was immediately voted out as the Informed Minority Mason.

Highly illogical.

Always wait for Steak to make a mis-steak. :)

Opopanax
Aug 8, 2007

Oh no, not me
We never lost control




Mr. Steak posted:

myself, lumpen, hambeet

I'm not convinced those gel with your posting. Ham at least you claim a town read on, then Lumpen comes out of nowhere. otoh you seem pretty sure Sal is scum and they've claimed a potentially pro town role, yet you didn't pick them

Mr. Humalong
May 7, 2007




That explains my action failing on beet

Mr. Humalong
May 7, 2007



##vote steak

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


Retro Futurist posted:

I'm not convinced those gel with your posting. Ham at least you claim a town read on, then Lumpen comes out of nowhere. otoh you seem pretty sure Sal is scum and they've claimed a potentially pro town role, yet you didn't pick them

i unvoted sal when he was at danger of being lunched. my targets must be voted for at the end of the day by me, so i had to take into account the unintended effect of my vote being on him.

and my vote (read: target) on lumpen was there since way early in the day, with me explicitly stating a town read of him.

so..

??

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


wait, when do i seem sure sal is scum? lol are you confusing me with someone else?

Mr. Steak
May 8, 2013

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


i still feel good about my vote on humalong

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Opopanax
Aug 8, 2007

Oh no, not me
We never lost control




Mr. Steak posted:

wait, when do i seem sure sal is scum? lol are you confusing me with someone else?

Whoops I meant town

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