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Mortabis
Jul 8, 2010


MikeCrotch posted:

One thing with nuclear power is that if you are an environmentalist who believes in decarbonising as much as possible by 2025-2030 nuclear power plants just take so long to build they don't really help, so you would be better off with renewables and reducing demand (or so the argument goes).

There's no good reason for your timeframe to be that short. If we needed to decarbonize by then we'd be screwed anyway since it takes so long for CO2 to come out of the atmosphere. Anyway there's absolutely no way anyone is going to decarbonize in five years, that's absurd, whether or not nuclear power is involved.

Mortabis fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Jan 13, 2020

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ulmont
Sep 15, 2010

IF I EVER MISS VOTING IN AN ELECTION (EVEN AMERICAN IDOL) ,OR HAVE UNPAID PARKING TICKETS, PLEASE TAKE AWAY MY FRANCHISE


Captain Log posted:

Is there any good reason for countries like Germany abandoning nuclear power? Oh is it just people overreacting? I thought cleanly done nuclear power was better for the environment than many things. But I know dick all about any of this stuff.

It ultimately boils down to if you trust the same kind of people who joke about fooling the government regulators* in charge of making sure people don't die with the ability to make nuclear-grade fuckups or not. A lot of people have chosen "not."

*Boeing 737 MAX. Articles all over but here's https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/...7-messages.html

EDIT: but discussions about whether nuclear power is a good idea or not are (a) basically religious and (b) better for the Energy Generation thread, where they are used to the derails.

StandardVC10
Feb 6, 2007

Dreams, Amelia - dreams and false alarms

Megamarm

Wingnut Ninja posted:

Was it the Cutlass that has such awful engines that one returning to base with an engine failure was once told to wait because there were two other jets, also with engine failure, in the pattern in front of him? I remember it was one of those early 50's jets like the Cutlass or the Demon.

Believe that was the Cutlass, yes. Demon was a single, so engine failure would be a... more substantial issue.

edit: as originally projected, the F7U-3 was supposed to have 7,000 lbs. of thrust from each engine and 10,000 on afterburner; the actual production engines delivered only 4,800 dry / 6500 afterburning.

StandardVC10 fucked around with this message at 01:15 on Jan 13, 2020

Dante80
Mar 23, 2015



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtcBKQ9ealA#t=11s

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006



ulmont posted:

It ultimately boils down to if you trust the same kind of people who joke about fooling the government regulators* in charge of making sure people don't die with the ability to make nuclear-grade fuckups or not. A lot of people have chosen "not."

*Boeing 737 MAX. Articles all over but here's https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/...7-messages.html

Do you trust those same people to run coal ash dumps?

edit: I was in Germany when Fukishima went down. Things got so stupid, so fast.

ulmont
Sep 15, 2010

IF I EVER MISS VOTING IN AN ELECTION (EVEN AMERICAN IDOL) ,OR HAVE UNPAID PARKING TICKETS, PLEASE TAKE AWAY MY FRANCHISE


Cyrano4747 posted:

Do you trust those same people to run coal ash dumps?

I was speaking for Germans there (note the impersonal nature of the question).

Personally, no, but I think there's less possible damage from a coal ash dump than a nuclear power plant. The trends seem to be in favor of solar + wind + other renewables as a medium to long term strategy, and strongly against any new construction of nuclear, so while I wouldn't bother shutting down any existing nuclear power plants I don't think building any new ones is a good idea.

*Look at the history of Vogtle in Georgia near South Carolina. It's impossible to build a new nuclear plant in the US.

Gnoman
Feb 11, 2014


Captain Log posted:

Is there any good reason for countries like Germany abandoning nuclear power? Oh is it just people overreacting? I thought cleanly done nuclear power was better for the environment than many things. But I know dick all about any of this stuff.


Nuclear's a scary word! Scary words are evil! That means nuclear power is evil!


That's pretty much it - just unjustified panic.

Captain Log
Oct 2, 2006

Captain Log posted:

"I AINT DYING! Choo choo motherfucker!"



Fun Shoe

Cyrano4747 posted:

Do you trust those same people to run coal ash dumps?

edit: I was in Germany when Fukishima went down. Things got so stupid, so fast.

Tell us about it. I was in Germany right after we invaded Iraq. That was weird, because every single German thought all Americans were rabidly pro war, which I was not. (Specifically, the Iraq Invasion/Occupation part)

Mortabis
Jul 8, 2010


ulmont posted:

I was speaking for Germans there (note the impersonal nature of the question).

Personally, no, but I think there's less possible damage from a coal ash dump than a nuclear power plant. The trends seem to be in favor of solar + wind + other renewables as a medium to long term strategy, and strongly against any new construction of nuclear, so while I wouldn't bother shutting down any existing nuclear power plants I don't think building any new ones is a good idea.

Solar and wind are not practical sources of baseload power. Nuclear power is. Nuclear accidents are extremely uncommon and have caused very few casualties.

AlexanderCA
Jul 21, 2010


Should the old thread be Goldmined or something?

MRC48B
Apr 2, 2012




holy moly an actual hover tank.

Cat Mattress
Jul 14, 2012

I don't find this sort of thing funny


Captain Log posted:

Is there any good reason for countries like Germany abandoning nuclear power?

Because of Helmut Coal.

Also they figure that NATO nuclear sharing is enough too get them a seat at the Big Boys' table, so why bother investing money in maintaining their own nuclear expertise?

Memento
Aug 25, 2009




Clapping Larry

AlexanderCA posted:

Should the old thread be Goldmined or something?

Yes it should, Cyrano can probably make that happen.

Also, while it didn't get the 5* average it deserved, it came so close to the next best thing.

madeintaipei
Jul 13, 2012



Cat Mattress posted:

Because of Helmut Coal.

Lol. I love this, thank you.

Arglebargle III
Feb 21, 2006


MY GIMMICK IS POSTING GIBBERISH



While I'm all for nuclear power (fossil fuel extraction directly kills ten times more in a year than nuke plants ever have, not counting pollution) Westinghouse bankrupted itself building four new nuke plants in the American South. That's not encouraging. Would be interesting to pop over to the energy generation thread and ask why that happened.

Anyway to keep it Cold War, my vote for dumbest Cold War aircraft would also be the Thunderscreech.

Arglebargle III
Feb 21, 2006


MY GIMMICK IS POSTING GIBBERISH



Speaking of Britain, who did that long effortpost on how Cold War era Britain pissed away its empire through arrogance and incompetence?

StandardVC10
Feb 6, 2007

Dreams, Amelia - dreams and false alarms

Megamarm

Arglebargle III posted:

Speaking of Britain, who did that long effortpost on how Cold War era Britain pissed away its empire through arrogance and incompetence?

I think that may have been in one of the Milhist threads?

AlexanderCA
Jul 21, 2010


Memento posted:


Also, while it didn't get the 5* average it deserved, it came so close to the next best thing.



That might be my fault, I just voted it 5 when I posted that question.

mlmp08
Jul 11, 2004


Nap Ghost

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85MDZfZr1ag

Vavrek
Mar 2, 2013

I like your style hombre, but this is no laughing matter. Assault on a police officer. Theft of police property. Illegal possession of a firearm. FIVE counts of attempted murder. That comes to... 29 dollars and 40 cents. Cash, cheque, or credit card?

Somebody Awful posted:

Also, make sure to read the end notes and citations and take any statement that cites Grigori Medvedev with a large grain of sand and boron, especially if it's a dramatic scene. Medvedev invented a bunch of bullshit to sex up his own account of Chernobyl, published relatively soon after the event, and subsequent authors have been largely content to repeat his lies even when they're flatly contradicted by the testimony of pretty much everyone who was actually there and lived to tell about it. Nobody had heated arguments in the control room. Nobody went into the reactor hall and saw channel caps bouncing up and down. Nobody, so far as has been credibly determined, got close enough to actually see the destroyed reactor and report back.

What is the cost of lies? Thirty years of tainted scholarship.

Really? His account is the main one I've read, and I bought it specifically because I assumed someone who was on site so soon after the event, and had previous experience with the plant, would have a good and interesting perspective. I'd certainly like to add something else to my reading list if he's unreliable.

Smiling Jack
Dec 2, 2001

I sucked a dick for bus fare and then I walked home.



mlmp08
Jul 11, 2004


Nap Ghost

Here are some missiles doing missile things.

AIM-9X
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YMSfg26YSQ

THAAD shooting an MRBM dropped out of a C-17:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYr6hYVpxxw

Saudi F-15 intercepts of Houthi drones:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNpr24uLr-g#t=32s

The missile rides low, because it knows it doesn't ride high
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LjN3UclYzU

B-1Bs are kind of missiles?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kfp-G4NWyJs

Cessna
Feb 20, 2013

KHABAHBLOOOM

MRC48B posted:

We should make an AIRPOWER/90s thread, where we can talk about stuff like:

How awesome the A-12 Avenger 2 will be.

The V-22 and Comanche will get fielded any day now!

and man, did you notice how charismatic that new president of Serbia is?

"We should go back to Iraq and finish the job!"

"The USMC's new AAAV is going to revolutionize amphibious warfare!"

Dante80
Mar 23, 2015



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIzXI-mlJjs

Hannibal Rex
Feb 13, 2010


U.S. FIRST STRIKE
USSR FIRST STRIKE
NATO / WARSAW PACT
FAR EAST STRATEGY
US USSR ESCALATION
MIDDLE EAST WAR
USSR CHINA ATTACK
INDIA PAKISTAN WAR
MEDITERRANEAN WAR
HONGKONG VARIANT
SEATO DECAPITATING
CUBAN PROVOCATION
ATLANTIC HEAVY
CUBAN PARAMILITARY
NICARAGUAN PREEMPTIVE
PACIFIC TERRITORIAL
BURMESE THEATERWIDE
TURKISH DECOY
ANGENTINA ESCALATION
ICELAND MAXIMUM
ARABIAN THEATERWIDE
U.S. SUBVERSION
AUSTRALIAN MANEUVER
SUDAN SURPRISE
NATO TERRITORIAL
ZAIRE ALLIANCE
ICELAND INCIDENT
ENGLISH ESCALATION
MIDDLE EAST HEAVY
MEXICAN TAKEOVER
CHAD ALERT
SAUDI MANEUVER
AFRICAN TERRITORIAL
ETHIOPIAN ESCALATION
TURKISH HEAVY
NATO INCURSION
U.S. DEFENSE
CAMBODIAN HEAVY
PACT MEDIUM
ARCTIC MINIMAL
MEXICAN DOMESTIC
TAIWAN THEATERWIDE
PACIFIC MANEUVER
PORTUGAL REVOLUTION
ALBANIAN DECOY
PALESTINIAN LOCAL
MOROCCAN MINIMAL
BAVARIAN DIVERSITY
CZECH OPTION
FRENCH ALLIANCE
ARABIAN CLANDESTINE
GABON REBELLION
NORTHERN MAXIMUM
DANISH PARAMILITARY
SEATO TAKEOVER
HAWAIIAN ESCALATION
IRANIAN MANEUVER
NATO CONTAINMENT
SWISS INCIDENT
CUBAN MINIMAL
CHAD ALERT
ICELAND ESCALATION
VIETNAMESE RETALIATIO
SYRIAN PROVOCATION
LIBYAN LOCAL
GABON TAKEOVER
ROMANIAN WAR
MIDDLE EAST OFFENSIVE
DENMARK MASSIVE
CHILE CONFRONTATION
S.AFRICAN SUBVERSION
USSR ALERT
NICARAGUAN THRUST
GREENLAND DOMESTIC
ICELAND HEAVY
KENYA OPTION
PACIFIC DEFENSE
UGANDA MAXIMUM
THAI SUBVERSION
ROMANIAN STRIKE
PAKISTAN SOVEREIGNTY
AFGHAN MISDIRECTION
ETHIOPIAN LOCAL
ITALIAN TAKEOVER
VIETNAMESE INCIDENT
ENGLISH PREEMPTIVE
DENMARK ALTERNATE
THAI CONFRONTATION
TAIWAN SURPRISE
BRAZILIAN STRIKE
VENEZUELA SUDDEN
MAYLASIAN ALERT
ISREAL DISCRETIONARY
LIBYAN ACTION
PALISTINIAN TACTICAL
NATO ALTERNATE
CYPRESS MANEUVER
EGYPT MISDIRECTION
BANGLADESH THRUST
KENYA DEFENSE
BANGLADESH CONTAINMENT
VIETNAMESE STRIKE
ALBANIAN CONTAINMENT
GABON SURPRISE
IRAQ SOVEREIGNTY
VIETNAMESE SUDDEN
LEBANON INTERDICTION
TAIWAN DOMESTIC
ALGERIAN SOVEREIGNTY
ARABIAN STRIKE
ATLANTIC SUDDEN
MONGOLIAN THRUST
POLISH DECOY
ALASKAN DISCRETIONARY
CANADIAN THRUST
ARABIAN LIGHT
S.AFRICAN DOMESTIC
TUNISIAN INCIDENT
MALAYSIAN MANEUVER
JAMAICA DECOY
MALAYSIAN MINIMAL
RUSSIAN SOVEREIGNTY
CHAD OPTION
BANGLADESH WAR
BURMESE CONTAINMENT
ASIAN THEATERWIDE
BULGARIAN CLANDESTINE
GREENLAND INCURSION
EGYPT SURGICAL
CZECH HEAVY
TAIWAN CONFRONTATION
GREENLAND MAXIMUM
UGANDA OFFENSIVE
CASPIAN DEFENSE

OP is off to a good start.

Carth Dookie
Jan 28, 2013



Grimey Drawer

MikeCrotch posted:

One thing with nuclear power is that if you are an environmentalist who believes in decarbonising as much as possible by 2025-2030 nuclear power plants just take so long to build they don't really help, so you would be better off with renewables and reducing demand (or so the argument goes).


India is going all in on thorium reactors and expects to start having them go online starting 2025 and China will follow soon after. 2.3 billion people abandoning coal as a power source is a drat good start. Fully embracing electric vehicles in major markets around the same time will help. Now if we could plant a few billion trees and do something about microplastics as well, we might survive.

Smiling Jack
Dec 2, 2001

I sucked a dick for bus fare and then I walked home.





The only way to win any of those games is not to play.

goatsestretchgoals
Jun 4, 2011

in soviet russia, you shove robot

Nicaraguan thirst sounds like a short lived Gatorade flavor.

stealie72
Jan 10, 2007

Their eyes locked and suddenly there was the sound of breaking glass.


The most obscure strain names at a really weird dispensary.

Dante80
Mar 23, 2015



BAVARIAN DIVERSITY

CarForumPoster
Jun 26, 2013



I cant see an E2C with that antenna and not think “dunce cap”.

Nebakenezzer
Sep 13, 2005

The Mote in God's Eye



mlmp08 posted:

Here are some missiles doing missile things.

AIM-9X
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YMSfg26YSQ

THAAD shooting an MRBM dropped out of a C-17:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYr6hYVpxxw

Saudi F-15 intercepts of Houthi drones:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNpr24uLr-g#t=32s

The missile rides low, because it knows it doesn't ride high
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LjN3UclYzU

B-1Bs are kind of missiles?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kfp-G4NWyJs

Request: that ABM point defense missile that launched via explosive and went so fast that was radiant with plasma

Neophyte
Apr 23, 2006

perennially

Taco Defender

CHAD ALERT
WOOP WOOP
CHAD ALERT
POP COLLAR
WOOP WOOP
POP COLLAR
WOOP WOOP

Smiling Jack
Dec 2, 2001

I sucked a dick for bus fare and then I walked home.



Nebakenezzer posted:

Request: that ABM point defense missile that launched via explosive and went so fast that was radiant with plasma


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvZGaMt7UgQ


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msXtgTVMcuA

Somebody Awful
Nov 27, 2011

Don't let Lowtax go down with the ship. Do your part for these dead gay forums.


Vavrek posted:

I assumed someone who was on site so soon after the event, and had previous experience with the plant, would have a good and interesting perspective.

Medvedev oversold his qualifications. He worked at Chernobyl during the plant's construction in the early 1970s, but left before it came online and never had hands-on operational experience there.

Unfortunately a lot of good material is still stranded behind the RU-EN language barrier. Some very dedicated people have been working to find and translate original documents, including Dyatlov's memoirs and the testimony compiled by Shcherbak and Karpan. You can find bits and pieces on r/Chernobyl, but I don't think anyone's put it all together in one coherent narrative yet.

Xerxes17
Feb 17, 2011

Gold is for the Mistress - silver for the maid.
Copper for the craftsman, cunning at his trade.
"Good!" said the Baron, sitting in his hall,
"But Iron - Cold Iron - is master of them all."


I got onto the OP!

But at least on the awful app the links are broken

Guest2553
Aug 3, 2012


CarForumPoster posted:

I cant see an E2C with that antenna and not think “dunce cap”.

CAEWWS's advanced employment course is called TOP DOME

Neophyte
Apr 23, 2006

perennially

Taco Defender

SERVICE GUARANTEES CITIZENSHIP ATOMICS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62zu9CQj2_I

thatbastardken
Apr 23, 2010

strewth


Mortabis posted:

Solar and wind are not practical sources of baseload power. Nuclear power is. Nuclear accidents are extremely uncommon and have caused very few casualties.

baseload power isn't what you think it is. it's the minimum demand on the system required to keep large power plants economical to operate, not the minimum required supply.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/science...d-power/9033336

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_load

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Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006



AlexanderCA posted:

Should the old thread be Goldmined or something?

Sure. Report a post in it or make a QCS thread or something so I remember.

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