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Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Payndz posted:

Mention of the Butlerian Jihad made me think: it's been a long time since I read past the first book (think I got as far as God-Emperor in my teens), but is Ix the only known world that isn't a feudal nightmare run by warring aristocrats or conquered by brutal religious fanatics? I remember thinking it sounded like the only planet where I might remotely want to live; is there a catch?

A planet of office pod drones. It isn't any less horrific, just a different flavor.

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Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Anne Frank Funk posted:

What if that dude died battling his addiction to sex

The Great Abstainarian Jihad

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Jewmanji posted:

I never understand where this notion that Dune has to look totally extravagant comes from. Itís not in the text. Lynch and Jodorowsky both took the fairly sparse physical descriptions and ran wild, but itís not some great act of apostasy to render the visuals in a more subdued fashion. Thereís plenty of striking visuals in the trailers, it just doesnít smack you in the face with colors.

Itís the David Lean influence. Lawrence of Arabia was an influence of Dune and any desert call back since.

Have to say Iím not fan of the washed out monochrome because itís over used. Seems to be in fashion but itís unappealing.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



DeafNote posted:

I dont know, I like the anger myself. It doesnt sound to me like the typical wailing woman (ala Zach Snyder cut or half the James Horner scores)
Here is the actual zimmer track. The trailer spliced it in with some trailer music from another guy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdtiYwSP9ko

Where's the Toto?

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Strom Cuzewon posted:

I really hope we get the scene where Jamis' kids are uncomfortably okay with Paul murdering their Dad. Such a great look at Fremen psychology.

Will we get singing from Chalamet and Brolin?

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



bawfuls posted:

Don't force a notoriously difficult book to get into on someone who isn't into it just so you don't have to answer questions about a movie. Be grateful your wife is wiling to go see the nerd movie with you and be wiling to answer her questions. If you really can't handle that then suck it up and see the movie alone.

Just force your wife to listen to the audiobook. Theyíre floating around YouTube all the time.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



One gets the impression that as devious as he was, the Baron was a tool and only so useful.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



PeterWeller posted:

Not they would, just that they could.

They could kill the "legitimate" export of the Spice and still get it from the Fremen smugglers, though.



Yeah, it's Paul talking about his ability to destroy the entire Spice ecology. It can also apply to the Guild's power over Spice export.

If the Fremen kill the entire ecology of spice they're also killing themselves, with the spice addiction all throughout their culture. But martyrdom is the reward of the faithful.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



quote:

Feyd

Martman posted:

But who's playing him though

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Martman posted:

I've started to think maybe the hardest part of adapting Dune is the action. So much of the imagery requires epic scale, insane visuals, etc., but then you get to the way fights work and everything turns into a kung-fu scene where multiple characters are making decisions in a tenth of a second and someone kicks someone so hard that they die instantly. Honestly this is the thing I'm most worried about with Villeneuve's version... has he ever really tackled a fight scene like this? The brief glimpses of melee combat we've seen in the trailers have felt kind of basic to me, and I think it will lose a lot if the punching and sword fighting feels generic and sterile rather than visceral and crucial to revealing the way the characters think.

Momoa has stated that his action choreography is more like ballet than the usual "fight" scene.

Edit: Have you ever seen Sicario?

Automatic Slim fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Aug 8, 2021

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Ccs posted:

But actually they just filmed the first part. Wonít it be super difficult to get all these huge actors back for a second movie and not run into scheduling conflicts?

Sequel appearances are written into the initial contract, or they better be. Studios screw up but that would be a doozy.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007




Itís Lawerance of Arabia on psychedelics. LoA came out in Ď62 and thatís when Herbert started writing Dune.

And like the real life Lawerance of Arabia, thereís a sad after life when the story ends.

Villeneuve is going to have to address this one way or another whether he wants to or not.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Postorder Trollet89 posted:

I get your point but he won't have to. The first book does warn us quite convincingly, even if it absolves Paul of some blame.

Yes.

The book lays it out well. My favorite line in the book is when Jessica chides to Paul, ďno religion is simpleĒ.

Social Media will do as it does and some will try to score what points they want without context or reading the book.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



I said come in! posted:

Dune doesn't have a white savior plot though.

Dune is a warning against saviors and personality cults.

That won't stop people from posting that the movie does. Villeneuve gives a good answer on that though.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



The United States posted:

Villeneuve pronunciation count incrementing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zq6_vQXRK5U

I really doubt the ~first movie~ of this adaptation gets that far into it though

SHISHKABOB posted:

It's not white savior at all. The Fremen are just there to be used, the story isn't about saving them. The story is about the intergalactic feudal system and the conflicts therein.


Doesn't matter. Clicks must be baited, agendas must be scored.

If Villeneuve makes a point of Fremen being pawns as much as much as Paul being swept away by history, that would be an excellent stroke.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Gonz posted:

Still supremely disappointed that we were never given this.



It's probably better it wasn't. This looks like everyone making it was high on cocaine and the only way to enjoy it is to be high on cocaine.
Star Wars ended up using a lot of concepts and artists after Jodorowsky's version was scrapped and the world is better for it.

Wondering what would've been is probably more fun that what they would've actually made.

Automatic Slim fucked around with this message at 17:20 on Sep 8, 2021

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007




Going all in on the Dali.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Groovelord Neato posted:

The story by Peter Troyer in this Vice piece is about Clarke but doesn't name him:

https://www.vice.com/en/article/bjxp5m/we-asked-people-what-childhood-moment-shaped-them-the-most

That is dark.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



sean10mm posted:

As somebody who remembers the 1980s this feels overly generous to the attitudes of the 1980s. It might have been MORE homophobic in a lot of places than the 1970s. Reagan got away with letting AIDS kill everyone for years because the [insert relevant slur] had it coming. poo poo, Lynch made Dune MORE overtly homophobic when he made his movie about it!

Broadly speaking you're meant to be critical of Leto II's supposed wisdom because his entire gimmick is manipulating humanity to achieve some end only he can see. Plus everything he said about female armies not being rapey because of the lack of man gay something something is disproved in the next book that jumps straight into rape-powered conquest: the vagina years. I have no idea if he meant to do that all along, or if he looked back and went "Yeah, maybe I need to change course on that line of thinking, huh?"

I think the real answer was Herbert was homophobic and that comes through, but also he was a weird guy who was constantly loving with the reader and just coming up with weird poo poo. I think just the fact that Leto II had a female army AT ALL was meant to be a WHOA THERE poo poo'S GETTING CRAZY, HUH?! move in 1981, but it doesn't land like it used to now that women graduate the Army's psychotic Ranger School regularly.

Homophobia was an accepted facet of popular entertainment in the 80s. Reagan totally ignored AIDS because it wasn't killing his preferred voting block yet, just homosexual men and foreign/poor people of color. Having lived in that era and watching clips from that time recently, it's shocking what mainstream entertainment thought acceptable then vs. now.

Frank Herbert was a man of his time. A lot of now unpalatable views that were matter of course back in the day. We can either chose keep embracing the good and reject the bad or throw it out all together, but not everything Leto II monologued can be covered with "he's a tyrant, that's not Herbert's real opinion".

Having said that, the entire plot of Dune is a reaction to machinations of a group of women. It starts with a quote from a woman, the first scene is two women talking, the last scene of the original book has two women talking about a third woman in one of the cattiest things ever written in science fiction. It was a progressive work in a lot of ways but also full of cringe inducing plots and ideas.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Eason the Fifth posted:

This made me look up which came first. I thought for sure that the publication of Dune largely predated the first comic with Wakanda, but I was wrong -- Dune came out in 65, and the first series with Wakanda came out in 66, not even a year apart. Still blows my mind that either or both of these came out during the era depicted in Mad Men.

Decolonization was a thing back then.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Nail Rat posted:

Sting could be Emperor Shaddam IV though.

And Harry Styles can be Feyd.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Strong adaptation. Any alterations and cuts from the book are quibbles. Some visuals not seen in the book just at to the weird "alienness" of the setting.
It's unfortunate we couldn't spend more time with Thufir and Yueh, but the treatment of Jamis was really compelling and his actor was fun to watch. Kynes' death works in the context of this movie.
Have to agree with the overabundance of Chani/dove commercial comment. Seeing more altered visions of her would've been more interesting.


It's a testament to Villeneuve's skill at the pacing of this movie. Forty-five minutes in I was surprised how much and little happened in regards to plot but was fascinated all the way.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Defiance Industries posted:

Jamis' actor was great, he grabbed his small amount of screen time and squeezes every drop out of it.

Yes.

I was disappointed we didn't spend more time with Thufir and Yueh. I've never seen those actors before but they were
both very charismatic. Jamis, has more time and weight than in the book and the actor took the ball and ran with it.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Groovelord Neato posted:

The actor who played Thufir has been in a bunch of stuff but I recognized him as a regular judge on the Law and Orders.

Looking up IMDb credits, Stephen McKinley Henderson has been in a lot of stuff, he's one of those, "Oh, it's that guy."

Babs Olusanmokun (Jamis) is playing Dr. M'Benga in Star Trek: Strange New Worlds. That's something to look forward to.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Hobo Clown posted:

Cool movie, story would feel incomplete though if they never make a follow up.

Apparently I've been pronouncing a lot of this stuff incorrectly



Herbert was pretty open about "proper" pronunciation, apparently. He was okay with readers deciding what ever.
That dictionary in the back of Dune didn't come with a pronunciation guide.


Maxwell Lord posted:

I still think ďHar-KOHN-ensĒ sounds better.

:same:

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Electromax posted:

I enjoyed this vid where director breaks down that scene and explains why he chose to film it that way.

https://youtu.be/GoAA0sYkLI0

Thanks for this.

There's a look that Timothťe Chalamet gives to Charlotte Rampling near the end of that scene that foreshadows the entire plot of Dune. That's masterful direction.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Count Fenring is the new Tom Bombadil, lol.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007




Brody's review seems to set up Lynch's version as a high bar to vault over. Itís not. Itís just a take of someone elseís story that succeeds or fails on its own merits. One can have their preferences but it seems a lot of people place Lynch's version on a pedestal due to nostalgia rather than its own qualities.

Brody has a point that Villeneuve setting is more austere or empty but there are more details in other facets of movie. Lynch's version is something to neither to pay homage to nor react against. Villeneuve wisely makes a fresh start (with some nods to the games, apparently) when imagining Herbert's material.

Regarding the Gom Jabbar scene, Lynchís version is detailed, sure, but thereís an exchange of looks in Villeneuve's version that is one of the most masterful uses of foreshadowing ever. If youíve read the book you know what to look for and itís already its own payoff.

Like or dislike the 2021 version, but the constant referral and comparison to the Ď84 version is excessive and unnecessary.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



shrike82 posted:



and the odd thing is that it actually clashes directly with the book itself which is rich in its baroqueness, not just of the substance of the politics but the aesthetics
the descriptions of giedi prime are pretty lurid in the book yet the movie just paints it as blandly austere as salusa secundus and arrakis

This is a good point. Decadent excess of the wealth of the great houses wouldíve been a great contrast austere brutality of Arrakis' desert. I did like the Salusa Secondous setting though.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



porfiria posted:

Who should they cast as the Emperor? I say Ian McDiarmid or Michael Cera.

David Lynch











e: Just kidding. Seriously, Samuel L. Jackson.

Automatic Slim fucked around with this message at 23:51 on Oct 26, 2021

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



4000 Dollar Suit posted:

please no, I'm so Sam Jackson'd out,

also it should be Charles Dance

Right. The perpetual F bombs would bump Part 2 to an "R" rating post haste.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



AlternateAccount posted:

Do whatever you have to do to get David Lynch in that chair. If it takes a golden dolphin shitter throne, do it.

:getin:

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



The only choice to play the Emperor is Werner Herzog.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



The casting is so good in this version of Dune. One of the reasons I wish more time was spent with Thufir and Yueh is the actors are so interesting to watch. Jamis' actor came out ahead and got a lot of range for a short amount of time. Even the Herald, a bit part, made a solid impression. Herald could make a fortune with gender reveal parties and subpoena summons.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



I.G. posted:

In the book Leto's shield is down when he's shot by the dartgun. I have no idea why they changed it so that his shield was active in the movie--it just confuses the audience and makes it seem like the shields don't work well.

Because everyone watching it is going say out loud, "Why didn't he have his shield up," and that would be an excellent question.
This guy has lived a lifetime of conditioned paranoia and assassination attempts. Having your shield around and on when it gets suspicious is the only way to go.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



ALFbrot posted:

One bit I loved that I haven't seen anybody mention was when Paul and Jessica were starting up Kynes' hidden ornithopter and there was that common "there's problems getting it started and our pursuers are going to be here any moment!" bit, where Jessica keeps tensely looking towards the blackened door. You fully expect the Sardaukar to show up in the typical "stormtroopers shooting at the Millenium Falcon just as it flies away" manner, but they just... don't. They followed Kynes instead.

This was the most tense moment of the movie for me and the pay off is it didn't happen. Villaneuve addressed the tension in that situation but didn't abuse it. It also lulls us into false safety when the Sardaukar kill Kynes.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



BlankSystemDaemon posted:

Gonna need a lot of more than stitches, since his head is chopped off with a knife and then unceremoniously dropped on the floor.

Ghola Yueh spider.

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Werner Herzog

Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



Uncle Boogeyman posted:

I revisited the Lynch Dune after the Villeneuve Dune and I dunno if this is an unpopular opinion but they both rule.

It has its fans. It could be because of nostalgia or itís own wonky weirdness or Lynch or all three.

It had potential and fell short but admirable ambition. You canít even start a Dune project without ambition.

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Automatic Slim
Jul 1, 2007



WarMECH posted:

I just remembered the movie makes a big deal about Jessica hiring the Shadout Mapes and then she's in one other scene but she's dead.

Her function is to posit that Paul is a super savior. Prove that he is a super savior. Demonstrate Letoís compassion before his betrayal.

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