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No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


As I get older I feel like I'm less and less bothered by art being left incomplete. Honestly it's usually better than being completed badly. Que sera sera, a good adaptation of the first half of dune still adds something to the world. The case to worry about may actually be the movie doing just barely okay enough to make a scaled back half measure version of part 2

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No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I'm sure being in a theater with few enough people and a good enough respirator is a pretty minor level of risk but I'm just not feeling it. Despite denis tears I'm glad it will be on hbo max, though of course I wish the bean counter stuff behind the scenes was such that he could be happier about it

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Ehrlich's review is about as mean as could conceivably be but my gut feeling is it gets at some hard truths about the whole project. Guess we'll have to see

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


The guild are just sort of hapless tools, I don't think the BG respected them enough to bring them in on anything until edric's power was useful for the conspiracy in messiah. My question is what edric thought the guild stood to gain by getting rid of paul. I guess the answer is probably "more spice" :catdrugs:

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I respect that denis's vision of dune goes so as far as turning the planet into dune via NFTs. Not often you see a true visionary

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


We all underestimated the lasting influence solo a star wars story would have on cinematography here in hell world

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


The main thing I was envisioning was lots and lots of concrete. So as you can imagine feeling pretty blessed

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Forktoss posted:

Thinking about what this movie picks up from the Lynch version that isn't from the books, the Baron flying around with his floaters is a Lynch thing, isn't it? In the book he has them to make him lighter, but I don't remember him straight-up hovering in midair at any point.

Well, kinda.

The Baron fell back. His eyes bulged as he stared at a red slash on his left palm. "You... you...." He rolled sideways in his suspensors, a sagging mass of flesh supported inches off the floor with head lolling and mouth hanging open.

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Cognac McCarthy posted:

So I just finished God Emperor. Are Heretics and Chapterhouse any good, or are they at least interesting? I'm weighing continuing the series vs. reading something else entirely. God Emperor ends much more conclusively than any book in the series so it seems like Herbert himself was sorta done at that point

https://lareviewofbooks.org/article/heresies-of-dune/ posted:

Herbert’s last Dune novels are not for the weak. Written quickly while the IRS hounded the author for unpaid taxes, their plots tend toward the baroque, with major characters respawned ceaselessly, often as clones. Impatient with the subtle parables of his first book, Herbert let his caustic views bleed onto the page. In Book 5, the word liberal, used in a context entirely unrelated to politics, is enough to set the novel’s hero off. She lives 25,000 years in the future, yet just hearing someone say “liberal” puts her in mind of the 20th century and “how much viciousness lay concealed in that word” — “how much secret ego demanding to feel superior.” “Liberal bigots are the ones to trouble me the most,” another character opines. “Liberal governments always develop into aristocracies.”

At the end of the series, the heroes fight off “ravening hordes” from the galaxy’s edge: “terrorists” who, in a disturbing twist, have become “bureaucrats.” These implacable foes operate, Herbert explains, by using “the lie that taxes solve all problems” and by deploying “a social security system to quiet the masses.” They prey on the “middle class.”

I know we hate some libs around here ourselves but uh, those books aren't doing it for the good reasons

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I wouldn't sign on to that. Though they don't totally work for the most part, the non-failson dune sequels are still operating on an entirely higher order of creativity and writing quality than the star war EU

No Mods No Masters fucked around with this message at 14:30 on Oct 7, 2021

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Denis seems like a tough guy to be friends with. But I think he and kojima should be friends

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Yeah, I think going to a movie theater is probably pretty benign if you're willing to correctly wear a respirator. For me it's basically a tradeoff of comfort of not having to do that and not having to deal with other people's obnoxious theater habits vs not getting imax and having to watch it with hbo's lovely compression. I lean on the side of watching it at home but I understand other people's preferences lining up differently. Thanks for reading my nuanced view

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Did you really think rebecca ferguson was jessica chastain or is that a bit. But yeah she was great, best performance in the film by a large margin

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Dr.Radical posted:

Has anyone seen any bad reviews yet? Everything I’ve seen has been good outside of Leslie Lee of Struggle Session podcast trashing it. He said Jessica only shows up to cry which lol were we watching the same movie?

This still seems to be the representative strong hater review.

I have to say that I liked the movie quite a bit more than I thought I was going to, but it still kind of falls in the noble failure or maybe narrow success category to me, so I kind of see some of his points. 2049 to me is something where there is a really good core story polluted by too much extraneous crap. This feels like the opposite in a way, lots of really good ingredients not quite totally coming together into something that puts its own point or spin on the material

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I feel like for Frank the root source of the fremen's power was ecological consciousness. They deeply understood and adapted to their environment in a way none of the other powers in the setting had even begun to fathom. It has some cross currents with noble savage tropes but isn't really the same thing

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Hakkesshu posted:

I think it's more that the Sardaukar have no idea what they're up against and also they are at an extreme disadvantage in that environment. Obviously the Fremen are real good at fighting, but I always thought it was a Vietnam parallel more than anything, considering when the book came out.

I like denis's recurring thing with the fremen coming up out of the sand, nice visual metaphor for this

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Hodgepodge posted:

The white saviour trope is both explicitly used and subverted in various ways in the books. Paul knows his story is also the story of the Fremen being used and their resulting success obliterating their culture, within his lifetime.

e: the ecological aspect is maybe the best part of Dune and about half of why it stood out in the first place.

Yeah I don't really disagree. And I feel another muddying factor is that the fremen kind of deploy these tropes themselves, first one way when they want to fly under the radar and mask that there are many millions of them and that they are highly industrialized, then the other way when the jihad begins and they want to project unstoppable inhuman murder power

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I think my favorite paul scene in this was when he tries to pitch kynes on 'lol just make me the emperor'. I think that scene conveyed his intelligence/charisma/developing instincts moreso than anywhere else did, while also nicely showing that he has a really long way to go still

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Many saints is probably the worst thing I watched this year. In his defense perhaps david chase used up all of his power resisting the studio's demands for someone to say gabbagool

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I guess maybe there just isn't enough space in a movie adaptation of dune for a depiction of the baron that doesn't have to resort to "loooooves disgusting fluids" to convey that he's a bad guy. There's a reason people go to bat for the miniseries version despite, well, it being the dune miniseries

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


It doesn't get much more "brains scrambled by jododune" than thinking the harkonnens should have a gigeresque aesthetic. Get your own ideas denis

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Steve Yun posted:

Would this movie be okay for a 12 year old

I think it's fine. The average 12 year old on the average day probably sees and hears crazier poo poo in fortnite

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


They cut thufir in particular to the bone, I could certainly see omitting him in part 2

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I thought the baron was saying "join her" as in "nice we get to stitch some more segments onto the spider"

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


If you look into that place, you'll find kevin j anderson looking back at you. For he is the kwisatz haderhack

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I do feel like it would be a challenge to take feyd's design in an interesting direction while sticking with the (bad) denis harkonnen style. If I wanted a generic callow pale goth guy, I would simply <insert your own end of the joke here>

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Giedi prime sucked. These are the richest guys in the universe and they fuckin love to party, surely they would live inside a hr giger colon

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


It could be trolling but I don't think it has to be taken that way. That's basically what kojima said in his review, that denis is kind of wasted on tentpole blockbusters. I'm somewhat sympathetic to it

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


David lynch probably doesn't really care, he disowned the movie and stopped thinking about it almost 40 fuckin years ago. Respect

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Gonz posted:

Film it NEXT YEAR and release it in 2023, WB/Legendary.

Don’t make us wait 3-4 years.

They say they're going to, Oct 2023. I feel that's aggressive and it will probably slip though

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


He was great as *checks notes* Druig

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


The knife fights are kinda just going through the motions, and there are a lot of them. It's high on the list of problems of the film, maybe at the top

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I get being able to look past the knife fights, I mostly feel that way myself. But when the tension in the movie is always building up to a knife fight and the knife fight is always blah it's hard to say it doesn't lead to a structural problem

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


LionArcher posted:

problems with the best film of the year? Because it's a fantastic film.

I like it well enough but yeah I don't think it was perfect. Best film of the year maybe, but that's not exactly a fierce competition

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


They should have deliberately triggered the reaction to take out the targets then. Bing bong so simple

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I feel it's important to show that regardless of being really evil there are valuable traits in the harkonnens that the BG want in the KH and indeed paul manifests. Lynch dune didn't get this in the slightest bit, denis dune maybe gets it a tiny bit but the harks kinda suck in it in general

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I was laughing earlier thinking about how dumb it is when chani tells paul, an outsider who she has known for 3 minutes, about jamis's knife fighting weakness. Another wise denis omission

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


I wouldn't say they were realistic, they tried for fantastical but knife fights aren't really denis's area of expertise and so they ended up kinda bland and boring despite it. That said, even if we grant they were going for realistic- is that really the right direction to go for the way the book describes the knife fights? I'd say not really

No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


Captain von Trapp posted:

Here's a quick and surely point-missing logistical question: in the books, how do the Fremen physically get off the planet to do their Jihad? Extorting the Guild with the threat of cutting off the spice? Getting blasted on drugs and flying the ships themselves?

I think it's definitely the former, Paul was holding all spice production hostage and so the guild had to comply. Of course they were so uneasy about this that then dune messiah happened

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No Mods No Masters
Oct 3, 2004

You thought, "A robber must hate you to want to take from you"
The robber don't hate you


The whole jamis fight sequence is not a highlight of the book honestly. Chani is actually the worst part but it's all a little sloppy

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