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Peachfart posted:Also, that they don't bother to develop any characters except Michael. Who is still pretty badly developed. And he was even worse.
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Jul 18, 2020 09:07
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Saru's writing is just a mess. His arc was clearly set up to be overcoming/learning to be brave in the face of his natural fear instincts. Then they decided his species was oppressed and being killed pre-secondary-puberty in the lead up to season 2, and who cares if it doesn't fit with any of the previous references. And the second puberty solved all of his cowardice issues and freed his people!
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Jul 18, 2020 09:54
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Wasn't it Patrick Stewart that pushed for action man? And didn't want a happy future, but wanted it to reflect the present and be full of conflict?
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Jul 20, 2020 07:06
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G-III posted:Here's how you fix picard: Q shows up, snaps his fingers, and places picard in a not lovely show written by people who aren't assholes. There, saved your whole fuckin franchise, CBS. Pay me. *CBS sues you because they lost the one draw the series had*
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Jul 22, 2020 10:26
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Doggles posted:Yup. Discovery season 3 is going to be Andromeda in the same way Picard was Mass Effect.
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Jul 26, 2020 07:37
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I haven't seen Picard - just the RLM review. But Icheb's eyeball getting ripped out is a bridge too far. There is no situation where I want to watch a person strapped down and their eyeball being removed (okay, maybe a medical show, maybe). You're leaving sci-fi at that point and heading into the gore genre. Talk about it? Yeah sure. Imply it and cut away? Gross, but tolerable if there's a good reason. Show it in detail? Turning that show off. I'm not a genre purist, but I don't know why some people think it's acceptable to shove realistic gore into other types of show - it's not okay to shove pornography in unexpectedly, why violence?
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Jul 26, 2020 09:35
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galenanorth posted:It was necessary to convey the artist's true vision by doing the writing for a season arc show on the fly with each episode being filmed as soon as it's written. That way, if they decide something doesn't make sense for the arc they can't change it, but at least CBS saves money, and then the eyeball gore shows they care about the artistic process I've always struggled with the avant-garde. Is it a comment that the artistic process itself can be incredibly painful for both the artist and the observer - the artist literally giving part of themselves while the audience looks on, disgusted?
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Jul 27, 2020 00:24
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galenanorth posted:https://www.indiewire.com/2020/02/star-trek-picard-twist-most-violent-scene-icheb-seven-of-nine-1202212586/ Yeah, okay, having him be brutalised drives her motivation. But she just sees the aftermath - why do we, the audience, need to see his eyeball getting ripped out? You can't have him strapped down, screaming, while terrifying machines come towards him then cut away? And have him moaning and begging to die when Seven comes upon him? Even that would be more gratuitous than we need.
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Jul 27, 2020 01:41
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I wonder if they're going to do the Interstellar thing where their families left them messages over the years?
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Jul 27, 2020 06:50
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TheCenturion posted:If you're going to have a 10-episode prestige-style show, to my mind, you start with ten completed, coherent scripts. If on script four you realize that something isn't turning out the way you want, you go back and edit the other scripts to fit your change. Things can play out very differently in front of the camera than you expect from how a script reads. You don't want a situation where they're continually going back and making changes over and over and they wear everyone down and run out of budget. Actors and crew aren't robots, they start to feel defeated pretty quickly if there are too many changes or you have to go over the same thing many times. piratepilates posted:It's hope. Hope will save the day. I feel like 5 minutes ago everyone was making GBS threads on Discovery for being too modern grimdark, and now everyone's making GBS threads on it because they think it'll be too optimistic and hopeful, I just 
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Jul 28, 2020 00:54
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Yeah, I can accept that - people don't think it'll be able to pull off what it's going for. Michael is not an inspiring character (though she's framed as one), and she'll probably be the one driving it. At least restoring the federation and its values is an optimistic premise.
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Jul 28, 2020 01:38
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feedmyleg posted:Let's all just go ahead and lower our expectations about them doing anything interesting with the premise. Gonna save a lot of heartbreak.  (No "oooh, look how WEIRD it is to have a WOMAN in charge" or "oooh, our crew DOESN'T stone the GAYS, praise us for othering these people by drawing attention to them as a separate group but NOT murdering them") Just give me some good old fashioned crab bucket mentality of people not wanting better things for their kids.
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Jul 28, 2020 02:00
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Why do people keep making me defend Discovery? I'm a fan, but there's a lot wrong with it. And some opinions on it's failures are just wrong. The show is not about technobabble. Like, at all. Season 1 is about the road to hell being paved with good intentions. Season 2 is more muddled but it's about family (cue Carrie Fisher). There are a few awkward lines about science and maths, and they're so cringey they're very easy to recall. But let's tech the tech to reverse the polarity of the electron flow to the deflector is much more prevalent in, say, Voyager.
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Jul 28, 2020 10:38
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Gravitas Shortfall posted:Characters are introduced just to be killed an episode or two later for nonsensical reasons because there's no time to develop them into people the audience actually care about, not with the Plot to service. The perfect time to give Airiam some airtime and establish her relationship with some characters would have been when they go to rescue Tilly from May. There was no good reason to take Michael. Airiam would have had advantages over your average human in a place that tries to break down organic matter - I can't help but think it was some writer's idea at some point since they point out they're not keen on eating the metal of the ship. Give her Michael's screentime in that and a little peppered through the next 3 episodes, and the Daedalus episode wouldn't have felt so forced and may have actually had some emotion to it. It's not that everything is in service to the Plot, it's that everything is in service to Michael being the Main Character.
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Jul 28, 2020 12:33
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Alchenar posted:The lesson the Disco crew learns from their time in the Mirror Universe is 'Nukes are great and win wars'.
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Jul 29, 2020 08:54
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Alchenar posted:No they just threaten to blow up the Klingon homeworld with a nuke and set up a puppet government who's legitimacy relies entirely on the threat of that nuclear blackmail, which is entirely a different thing. The nuke - which was planned by the admiralty, not the Discovery crew - is given to a woman who truly loves everything Klingon and believes in unification rather than warring amongst themselves, and gave up pretty much everything trying to achieve that. She's the one with the threats - as far as the other Klingons know L'Rell set up the bomb herself. Importantly L'Rell has the detonator - there is no puppet government. L'Rell will always put Klingon interests first, and the federation does not have the threat of blowing up their homeworld because they no longer have the detonator.
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Jul 30, 2020 09:31
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Alchenar posted:L'Rell is a Bond Villain.
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Jul 30, 2020 10:29
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Hooray! Discovery Season 3 out October 15! (I'm a bit behind with news) https://twitter.com/Jemppu/status/1288987612305293314?s=20
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Aug 22, 2020 03:47
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Tiggum posted:Do all these characters even have names? Jett Reno, [...security lady], Linus, Tracey Pollard, Hugh Culber, Paul Stamets, Sylvia Tilly, Michael Burnham, Saru, [Kayla?], Owosekun, [???I think it's a short name], Nielssen (sp?), Bryce. I could probably remember them all given time - and would certainly picture them if given the name. Exactly how I remember most Star Trek series (a few main people and the occasional weird alien). Right now I could literally not tell you George Takei's character's name (but I'd recognise it/it'll probably come to me in 10 minutes). If your implication is that there are few named characters, there's also a bunch that didn't make it through season 1 or make it to this picture like Lorca, Georgiou, Cornwell, Landry, and a bunch from the enterprise.
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Aug 22, 2020 05:58
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The_Doctor posted:Other places online discussing Trek seem to be mad there’s women, POC, gay people, etc in Trek now, and many complaints about how it’s ‘shoving the SJW agenda down people’s throats’, and how it’s now full of ‘leftist propaganda’.  Super Deuce posted:Which is stupid, because Star Trek exists better in the low budget high episode count world than this Michael Bay-esque explosion fest we get now. Star Trek is a huge brand now - I don't think you can go low budget anymore even if you wanted to. The expectations of actors, crew, and effects are higher for a recognisable brand (as well as the expectations of the audience) - and rightly so considering the money it makes.
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Aug 23, 2020 11:21
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MikeJF posted:There's just a whole new tier that's been opened up by 'prestige' where you have absurdly high budgets with short, extremely refined (in theory) single ongoing storyline seasons, and the argument is that Star Trek doesn't necessarily belong in that. It could still be a high-end show on the upper end of a standard TV production. I like the ongoing storylines and character development/growth. It's another layer of exploration. I think it's also something that is expected outside of prestige shows because people don't miss episodes anymore. 4000 Dollar Suit posted:still waiting for RLM to tell everyone what to think. My money's on they won't like it - they seem to have a hard on for TNG, and in my experience, people that bang on about TNG declare just about everything else "not real Star Trek" even though Star Trek has been so many different things.
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Aug 23, 2020 12:55
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HD DAD posted:However, there is most definitely a sizable portion of the fan base that for which Trek is sacred and solemn and must be taken as very serious media, because otherwise they have trouble defending being obsessed with a fairly silly sci-fi franchise, and are secretly embarrassed about it.
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Aug 24, 2020 08:18
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Taear posted:I'm sorta sad this one [Lower Decks] is doing so badly compared to Disco/Picard (who people on the internet love but I've never met anyone who has actually watched them) Plus, as far as I know it's only been released in the US - and virtually nobody cares enough to pirate it. Would you?
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Aug 25, 2020 08:35
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Taear posted:I'm sorta sad this one is doing so badly compared to Disco/Picard (who people on the internet love but I've never met anyone who has actually watched them) Taear posted:Discovery and Picard are far easier to watch here as well compared to in the US and while I did see Disco season 2 advertised a bit it really didn't seem to take off. The Bloop posted:I don't understand the hyperbolic complaints about the look either, but you at least present them as subjective None of the characters are interestingly designed. No longer bound by having to fit an actor into costumes/prostheses they went with: boring looking human, another boring looking human, a boring looking pastel coloured human(oid), and a boring looking human with poo poo stuck on their face. And such interesting looking animation as: head and torso flatly facing the camera and moving arms and eyes about to convey that they're interacting with the person next to them. I mean, I'd possibly give at least the first episode a try if it was on Netflix. But given the reviews it's getting and that it already doesn't look like something I'd watch, I'm not going out of my way to get at it. I don't know if I represent a large percentage of possible audience, but just throwing out some ideas why it may not be a runaway success.
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Aug 26, 2020 08:01
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Taear posted:Lower Decks has worse reviews than Disco/Picard but nobody talks about Disco/Picard in the UK at all[...] Were you working for your current company when S1 or S2 were released? My gut feeling is that they push whatever is currently 'hot' and for example, earlier this year I would guess that would have been The Witcher in the nerd category. Phylodox posted:I liked Picard right up until they got to the robot planet, then it kinda fell apart a bit. I probably would have liked those last few episodes a bit more if I’d never played Mass Effect.
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Aug 27, 2020 01:31
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What do you think their priorities were? From the RLM review (which I found really unhelpful and repetitive), it sounds like it was heavy on sending a message on social issues, but treated them quite shallowly without actually exploring causes or realistic consequences. Is that fair? Also, if the 'plagiarism' is really just the concept that an evil AI wants to kill people... yeah, that's not plagiarism.
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Aug 27, 2020 11:48
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Arglebargle III posted:Kind of like how the replicator in Discovery complains when they order burgers and a burrito. A replicator could make anything nutritious I would think - hide a bunch of vitamins in the burger bun (which is secretly full of fibre)
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Aug 29, 2020 02:21
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twistedmentat posted:I don't think its unrealistic that if you have a higher rank you get more perks. I mean you get your own room, why not get access to fancier but not necessarily better food. I assumed this was a function of scarcity - on board a ship there is a limit of available space, so the higher ranks get more space. I don't really see a replicator being limited in such a way - but it's a magic box, so I guess it could work on rules of fancy foods being more resource intensive.
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Aug 29, 2020 03:44
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Super Deuce posted:Can't imagine this will bode any better. Nobody associates Paramount properties with Paramount. Paramount is a recognisable movie brand, whereas the only reason I know CBS even exists is because (people make fun) of CBS All Access - and I have no idea what kind of programming it does other than Discovery. Paramount I would assume from the name would have a bunch of good movies at least, even if I can't specifically recall which ones Paramount are responsible for.
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Sep 16, 2020 09:22
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Marshal Radisic posted:I think someone else in the thread said that the reason that TNG didn't use the turtlenecks with the TOS movie uniforms was because the turtlenecks were made with something called "trapunto quilting", a process which required incredibly rare sewing machines and needles.
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Oct 14, 2020 08:43
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I don't think I like the idea of the federation basically being a religion. Unless they go all in with it and have parallels with T'Kuvma and Michael Burnham. The first episode seems to really be focused on trying to make her connect with the audience though, so I doubt it. I know they were manipulating me, but I liked Book automatically through cute kitty transference (transfurence). They're going to skip over the interesting bits with the crew aren't they? And have Michael rejoin them ages later when all the drama has been resolved and the ship repaired. I really want to be wrong. On dilithium chat: It was easy to miss, but Book says that he had a dilithium recrystaliser (that broke in the crash).
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Oct 18, 2020 02:50
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He's not a real person. The way he is presented is that every day is the same for him: gets woken up by a sweet birdy alarm clock, brushes his teeth, sits at his desk and scans for signals, rinse, repeat. I was fully expecting it to turn out that he's an AI who's gone a bit weird over time and imitates human behaviour like sleeping and teeth brushing.
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Oct 18, 2020 02:57
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Wait, wasn't the sphere data in the suit? The suit that she ordered to self destruct? That suits coming back up one way or another. Wild speculation time: Putting the data destruction to one side, maybe the bomb she sent to the future blew up something important, so the future people tried to stop the federation before they could build the suit-bomb but didn't realise it came from the even distant-er past.
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Oct 18, 2020 05:47
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Seemlar posted:The sphere data is in the Discovery, that's why they sent the Discovery into the future. I though she told it to go to the future and explode after setting the last signal this episode though? Might have misheard, I'll need to rewatch. I've liked most of the promo images on Netflix for the series, but I have to say, this is the ugliest one I've seen: 
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Oct 18, 2020 10:39
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My wild, unsupported speculation is that the two "episodes" were meant to be woven together, but the editors are so piss-poor they couldn't make it work (or the directors have too much control and came up with the lovely idea to separate them after filming) The first episode is badly stitched together to maybe make the audience wonder if Discovery made it through... I mean, nobody buys that Discovery wasn't going to make it through and Michael is all alone for a second. The second episode is badly stitched together to maybe make the audience wonder if Michael made it through/mystery of when/where they are (all the sensors going down) It's hard to definitively tell because the editing is not great at the best of times but it looks like we're meant to cut between the two stories and think they're running in parallel, and then have the Michael reveal at the end of the two parter. Overall enjoyed ep 2. Charming actors still charming. All the makeup work is getting better every season. Ice effects were pretty bad looking, but I think the vision was greater than the budget for that, and it's still fine.
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Oct 23, 2020 10:23
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I think they all the shuttles got armed and sent out to fight in the battle at the end of season two. So they either would have gotten blown up or left behind.
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Oct 23, 2020 12:08
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Detmer's got ptsd, she's not AI possessed. She was flying the Shenzhou (with two good eyes) when Michael started a war and got most of the crew killed or disabled. Her head injury was in a similar spot to the one that caused her to need an implant. And the person who helped her through her feelings about cybernetics last time (Airiam) is dead. Hopefully it's leading into the ship acquiring a counsellor. While I buy that Lorca wouldn't allow a counsellor on board, and Pike was too temporary to make that sort of decision, the crew is full of people with lots of issues. Grand Fromage posted:If they removed Mirror Georgiou entirely and had Michael recede into the ensemble I think the crew would work. They could even take some time to like, develop the half of the bridge crew that we still know nothing about in season 3. The Black dude, the Asian dude, the big head insect alien, uh... not sure who else is on the bridge. At least Detmer and Owo have had a bit of time. If they stopped trying to push Michael as a main character and having her involved in everything the show would be much, much stronger.
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Oct 23, 2020 23:43
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Grand Fromage posted:Now that they're in season three they could at least like, give the Black and Asian dude names and jobs. I think they're comms and tactical after seeing the latest episode?  
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Oct 24, 2020 00:53
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Arquinsiel posted:The character suffers because it's the Michael Burnham Show This is so true of every character. I've said it before in the thread but Airiam should have been the one to go to the mycelial network last season, not Michael - it'd make sense story-wise as she'd be less at risk to be eaten, and it would have been a good opportunity to learn more about her and connect with her before they killed her off a couple of episodes later. Michael is the third wheel in the Stamets-Tilly friendship. The time loop/Harry Mudd episode should have been focused around Stamets. The Terralysium episode should have been a jointly focused Owo-Pike episode, he's new to the crew so asking about her backstory makes sense. Why is Michael there? Her character is the least human-acting human on board by design. Send Bryce down, presumably communications officer means they have some communications skills, not just that they know how to press buttons. Saru fares a little better, but his two focal episodes (the communications crystal episode and his home planet episode) spend way too much time on Michael, and not enough on him.
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Oct 24, 2020 01:50
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Evil Georgiou makes no drat sense and that irritates me. Nobody becomes evil emperor because they're the most rear end-kickingest, that's dumb. Lorca turned dumb as soon as he was revealed to the audience as well. She should be incredibly manipulative, turning people against each other and making them dependent on her approval. She should already be captain by now with nobody realising what her real evil scheme is. Instead, her power is that she can do some fancy martial arts moves that would only be helpful in close quarters, and gets the people in power off-side by being bloodthirsty.
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Oct 24, 2020 03:22
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