Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Jazerus posted:

mostly because they don't read each others' work. most star wars authors, historically, started writing based on what they knew from the movies and a few plot points that lucasfilm wanted them to hit. having even a passing familiarity with the prominent species in the galaxy (according to the EU, because the movies avoid putting anything like that into context) was generally not a requirement.

Star Wars does/did have a continuity team in charge of tracking on all this stuff and making sure no one got too out of line. Rest assured that someone approved everything in this thread.


SlothfulCobra posted:

This is Voolvif Monn, the wolfman jedi.



Genndy Tartakovsky's Clone Wars miniseries had an online vote on which of 3 Jedi to put into an upcoming episode, and he was what the internet chose, probably because of furries. When the episode came out, his scene was boring and ultimately pointless and would be entirely forgettable if you didn't know that he was the result of some internet thing. He also got trapped in a bubble in a later montage of Anakin being cool.

The two runner-up Jedi, the Talz Foul Moudama and the Ithorian Roron Corobb, would join Shaak Ti in defending Supreme Chancellor Palpatine in a much longer and cooler sequence where each of them showcased their unique skills and powers before ultimately being brutally slaughtered by General Grievous, which is what would happen to most Jedi soon anyways.

Suck it, internet.

At a fairly tight two hours, the Tartakovsky Clone Wars series is still the best Clone Wars thing we've ever gotten, although not even he can make Anakin or Padme any good.


Vernii posted:

That was afterwards actually. She got together a meeting of a bunch of admirals and was like "i'm in charge now" and when they laughed at her she nerve gassed them all. Then she used her fleet to nuke a bunch of civilian targets before picking a fighting with those trainees and uselessly squandering her fleet once again.


Also the original designer of the Death Star was some guy named Bevel Lemelisk who kept getting executed and cloned by Palpatine every time he hosed up or the emperor just felt like it. This includes being eaten by piranha beetles and thrown into a pool of molten copper. Eventually the New Republic arrested and killed him too.

Yeah, and his final project is building a superlaser for a Hutt (Darksaber) that doesn't work because they fast-tracked the production with incompetent nanobots. If the New Republic hadn't shown up to stop them, it wouldn't have made any difference, as the Darksaber blows up when they try to fire it.


This card game sucks super balls but it was all me and my friends were playing in high school in the 90's. At no point was it ever balanced or fun.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_Customizable_Card_Game

quote:

While Decipher oversaw the game, no card was ever banned from tournament play. Instead, when a card or strategy was deemed abusive or too powerful, Decipher chose to release "magic bullets," new cards which were specifically designed to counter the offending strategy. In some cases, Decipher also used errata, modifications to game text of a card that supersede the actual printed version. The use of errata also contributes to a steep learning curve, since players need to be aware of the current meta-game at all times.

This is insanely terrible design, but of course there's an entire cult of people playing this game 19 years after it went out of print.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Agnostalgia posted:

I played the terrible star wars CCG as a kid. The "best" games were the ones where one player had a deck focused on ground battles and the other had a deck focused on ships and you spent the whole game not interacting with each other at all.

You could also play a deck intended to never interact with your opponent, where you just force drained their territories and skipped town before the much slower Imperial ships could do anything.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Hazo posted:

Don’t do this. It was fun but don’t act like it was in any way “good”. Threepio striptease? Dooku’s only line being “Indeed”? Anakin and mutant mole people? Cmon.

Nothing's perfect! Anakin and the Mole People is the worst episode, followed up by any episode following Padme and C-3P0.

Notably the Clone Wars TV series does a lot more to follow up on this depiction of the Clone Wars than what we ended up with in Episode III. The failure of the prequels is epitomized in Lucas somehow wasting Christopher Lee as a bad guy.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Hazo posted:

I mean yeah, there were some fantastic moments (Ventress fight, Anakin’s phantom limb Force choke, everything on Coruscant) but the series as whole doesn’t deserve the weird reverence it’s somehow obtained. Also the horrible mole people subplot went on for like four episodes.

I recall one Mole People episode that felt like it went on for like 22m. Perhaps because I experienced Clone Wars after the fact I didn't realize it went on a number of weeks.

It gets the weird reverence because of Tartakovsky animation and the breath of fresh air it was compared to the prequels (it was very night and day, especially in 2005). It's not a coincidence that the Clone Wars TV show has also come to be well-regarded, but struggled from its association with the prequels and its own piece of poo poo kickoff movie.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Voting Floater posted:

Today, I learned that Tarkin was a 100% total badass who was covered in scars from fighting tigers as a kid and constantly fantasized about stripping off and knife-fighting random junior officers. Obviously.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mQVlvRmnEc

That Youtube channel is a treasure trove of dumb Star Wars lore.

My other favorite is the clone who wants to be Darth Vader's friend, but discovers to his lasting bitterness that evil is bad.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


SolarFire2 posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ou7BN6NdK2E

Robot Chicken had a bit that hit that concept on the head.

The best part about Pruneface in particular is that in the actual shot where he shows up, the scene is lit really poorly so he barely shows up.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Hazo posted:

I guess it’s just weird to me that they kept the name and everything from a book that had a bunch of gross weird stuff like elderly witch titties and rancors and exploding teeth torture and rape guns and alien princes and threepio singing songs about Han being great

They’ve shown before they’re willing to canonize old EU stuff while slapping a different label on it (Korriban/Moribund comes to mind). Maybe they just really like the way Dathomir sounded.

Hell the entirety of Episode IX is just a montage of EU ideas

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.



Love that his flavor quote is tearing him down

"I bet you wish you had unpacked Luke Skywalker"

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Cornwind Evil posted:

It really does show that the whole sequel trilogy has Legends DNA all through it.

"Here's the Empire's successors. Their Star Destroyer is twice as big as the Empire's basic Star Destroyer and they built a weapon into a planet that drains stars to power it and can shoot interstellar distances in minutes in a way that allows people on planets to see the shots like they were jet trails." Okay fine, somewhat acceptable if that was basically all they had-"They have a whole bunch of the better Star Destroyers and ones twice as big as those who can take out whole fleets and oh look the guy in charge flies around in a ship three times as big as the Super Star Destroyer Executor and also they have a portable low powered death star laser". Well I suppose some indulgence is "And another hidden part of the Empire built hundreds of OTHER Star Destroyers who also all had stripped down Death Star lasers."

Speaking of the Darksaber, there was its proto-form from the comic, the Tarkin, which was bigged up for being even more dangerous than the Death Star for the same reason the Darksaber ended up sucking so badly, barring the whole 'cheaping out on construction' parts. Also, it supposedly existed because the writer of the comic, David Michelinie, went to his bosses and said "Hey, I'm gonna have the Empire built a second Death Star' and they were like NO NO NO YOU CAN'T DO THAT without saying just why (the comic came out in mid 1981), so he did the Tarkin instead.

Seriously, with all the poo poo that the Empire had built/was building in the old EU, the First Order's excesses seem positively spartan.

TBF it's totally on-brand for the Empire to be building wunderwaffen but very off-brand for any of it to ever work

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


SlothfulCobra posted:

I can't remember how many people in Tales from Jabba's Palace end up dying when Jabba's barge exploded. I remember a lot of them looted whatever they could after Jabba died and ran.

And then a lot of the survivors got their brains taken out by the Bomarr Monks, who were the original builders of the palace and took back control after Jabba died. They even got a little aggressive baiting in more criminals to remove their brains. Weird guys.

A lot of weird poo poo goes on at Tatooine for being such a "backwater"

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Tulip posted:

I could very easily be convinced that Star Wars, as a universe, has a tighter real estate market than New York. People will mumble stuff about millions of stars and poo poo and then they keep going to the same like five locations and all you ever see is either desert or the size of a small suburb. Extremely claustrophobic.

Every planet has a single biome and one underpopulated city, so it's more like every planet is just a backwater village in the middle of the same economic depression going on in the entire galaxy.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Tulip posted:

Something that rules about star wars is how fast things are. This is the distance traveled in ep 1 by Darth Maul in 9 hours:



Which I measured at 48% as long as the top-bottom diameter of the galaxy. The Star Wars galaxy, to my knowledge, is 110,000 light years diameter, so we're talking 53,000 ish light years over 9 hours, or close on 6000 light years per hour.

Now, was Maul's vehicle particularly fast? I mean probably. But also strategic speeds seem to be something that go up with speed and he was in a tiny rear end little ship so maybe larger ships are faster? Maybe by the time of the main episodes hyperdrives were even better.

In any event, the longest distance in star wars can be done in one day and that is very, very funny to me.

I feel like this is more an example of got_season_8_travel.txt than an explanation of how space travel works in Star Wars, which is always extremely fudgy anyway, even by soft sci fi standards.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Hazo posted:

This is an excellent way of putting it. So much of Legends (and even a whole-rear end video game) was based on Luke's New Jedi Order, which was established in a trilogy that also included energy-sucking cave spiders; dark possessions from a super-evil Sith lord that lived, like, around the block; all-male jedi hot tub training sessions; Vader grave robbery; Tarkin's astoundingly incompetent ex; Wedge just sort of finding a jedi-detecting radio; frog rape dungeons; and probably way more insane poo poo than what I've already listed.

See here we make the classic mistake of ragging on something by making it sound 5,000 times cooler/funnier than it is

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Without looking at a plot summary, there's like a weird star being with a cult or something who can block the Force, and Luke has to investigate. I think the kids do things here and there but honestly they're kidnapped or something every other week.

It's insanely boring, and I kinda feel the same way about Star Wars books on this tier that I do about Dragonlance books; as soon as you read other Star Wars/D&D spinoff books, you realize that if the books can't be good, they can at least be interesting.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Cornwind Evil posted:

Speaking of 'The Empire is a bunch of incompetent shits' makes me think of something I noticed about the Bane line of Sith.

Bane's whole idea was 'Too many Sith weakens them, it allows weaker Sith to gang up on and kill stronger ones, then they fall apart etc etc", ergo there could only be two, and either the apprentice would surpass the master or there would be constant dead apprentices until they did, and eventually there would be a strong enough Sith to destroy the Jedi.

Except the Bane-line Sith who get the majority of the attention, or did, NONE of them followed Bane's plan. Bane's own apprentice Zannah was content to just wait for Bane to die of old age (which assumingly would be the safeguard if the master died before a selected apprentice was ready): Bane had to force her hand and during the process he used an attempted Dark Side possession technique that if it had worked would have overwritten Zannah's mind (it was in fact written that it might have worked, though I think the official line was that it didn't, but Zannah picked up some of Bane's traits in fighting off the possession). Skip ahead to near the films' times: Darth Plagueis' master wanted to basically turn himself into a swarm of memetic bacteria or something to constantly recreate his body and hence live forever, Plagueis of course wanted to be immortal, and Sidious/Palpatine wanted to clone himself; none of them followed the idea that they would either destroy the Jedi or be another stair on the path to this.

Which of course makes sense, because to be a Sith is to be a selfish rear end in a top hat. Bane was trying to herd the proverbial mass of cats.

Also according to the EU and even the shows, both Sidious and Vader had a bunch of semi-secret apprentices who totally weren't Sith, no really.

This ranged from people who were being groomed to help each Sith kill off the other, to an entire dojo of inquisikids

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


fartknocker posted:

Yeah, both the Clone Wars and the Jedi purge (And also the rise of Palpatine/the Empire) were treated as separate events prior to Revenge of the Sith. Exactly how long it took to wipe out the Jedi is also another matter. Now, it’s pretty much a coup-de-grace that gets most of them almost instantly, but a lot of older sources took it to be something that lasted months or even years, with Jedi going into hiding and Force-sensitive people being hunted down for even longer (Elements of that still remain, of course) and left a lot open to interpretations.

Yeah right now the situation is they got most of the Jedi right away but Vader still spends a lot of the intervening 20ish years offscreen (and sometimes onscreen) hunting down "rogue" Jedi.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


Asterite34 posted:

Find/replace all instances of the word "Force" with "Plot" and you get a more honest Star Wars script.

e: Regarding the Force having any sort of will, wasn't George's vaguely alluded to ideas for the Sequel Trilogy gonna be about drilling down into what the Force actually is, with the implication it was gonna be, like, a galaxy-spanning artificial construct full of its disembodied transhuman builders subtly manipulating events, and being the actual literal "will" of the Force?

But they already made the Matrix sequels

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


I don't need elite pilots as the Empire, I need enough recruits to blot out the sun with TIE fighters to get across that I have a 100-to-1 numerical advantage, using fighters built by the lowest bidder.

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


SolarFire2 posted:

Actually pre-TLJ most of the writing was concerned with how hyperspace ramming wasn't possible, because it's such an obvious idea for anyone with a basic understanding of physics. Why would you need a deathstar when you can just strap a hyperdrive to a decently sized asteroid and ram it into a planet at the speed of light? It might now blow the planet to smithereens but it will release enough energy to kill everything on the planet a thousand times over.

Now we're getting towards a future society discovering a past civilization in a galaxy far, far away that blew themselves to smithereens in a bitter planet-destroying war.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Sodomy Hussein
Oct 9, 2005

Everything is subject to the needs of intelligence, for geniuses like me. If we actually solve problems, people won't need me and people like me, and this is a travesty without end. You have to squeeze the poor so they know their place, and you fucking commies forget that.


SlothfulCobra posted:

I'm reading a lot of speculation and not enough facts. I will correct this.

So these guys and these guys are basically the same species. Mostly. There's a little in-universe controversy over that.

The first guys are Duros from the planet Duro. They have an extremely old society that lays claim to being one of the first to develop hyperspace. As a result of that, the planet Duro has been left heavily polluted by eons of heavy industry, and most of the planet's population has to live in orbital cities instead of on the planet's surface. Duros throughout the galaxy have a reputation as excellent pilots and explorers, but that also leads to a sort of tragedy for their society in that so many of them spread throughout the galaxy instead of sticking around to improve things.

The second guys are Neimoidians, who are apparently the result of some colonization project by the Duros long ago. Their main world is Neimoidia, but there are a number of other colony worlds (called "purse worlds") under the same political umbrella, the richest and most powerful being Cato Neimoidia. There's some genetic drift between them and the Duros, but the biggest difference is a cultural one, and most of that seems to spring from one particular practice: While Duros prefer to form more traditional family units, Neimoidians are raised in communal hives and grub hatcheries where they are neglected by caretakers and must learn to be greedy to get enough food to survive. That is credited as the reason Neimoidians are as ruthless as they are in the corporate world, and it also turned out to be a liability towards the end of the Clone Wars when during the retaking of Nemoidian worlds for the Republic, a number of grub hatcheries were bombed and the species as a whole was devastated.

And through all of the stuff written about the similarities between the species, there's a lot of stuff and accounts of Duros being extremely offended by being mistaken for Neimoidians or associated with them, but it's weird how it's so one-sided and there's no accounts of Neimoidians being offended at being associated with the Duros, which you'd think if they're so greedy and wealthy there'd be some kind of elitism in there. Or maybe writers go a bit overboard in demonizing the one race because they're villains in the movie.

I never really saw Neimodians as particularly greedy, just dumb as rocks, which would be the expected byproduct of being consistently malnourished in their hatcheries.

The Republic is also described as a place where capitalist bureaucrats would be common.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply