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MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

I remember being vaguely disturbed when waking up one morning to see zig and zag on UK channel 4's big breakfast. It was definitely no Den.

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MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

Thing is there's clear evidence that kids missing out socialisation had negative long term impacts. Kids being taught entirely distance learning with little appropriate preparation are likely to also have some negative learning outcomes. Parents not able to work remotely are going to be limited in their ability to work, in lower income households or single parent ones that is going to have a big impact.

Obviously those impacts need to be balanced against the health worries of the virus pandemic for the kids and health concerns for teachers. Not to go all Ladder curve but there is a point where reopening schools is going to be the less harmful option and that will be a point before the virus is eliminated (never) or a reliable vaccine is made available. If 0 risk is your requirement then you are going to be accepting greater risk and harms from school shut down such as higher rates of behavioural disorders through lack of socialisation or slowed development for younger people.

If other countries with similar levels of spread have reopened without disaster then you've got to make a pretty good argument why Ireland should accept the harm from school closures continue. Strongly different reopening approaches or a wholly different education system would be enough but it doesn't sound like Ireland is radically different from the Nordics in terms of class sizes or facilities.

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

I'd argue based on the number of black people Gardai have interacted with as a proportion of interactions even if there's systemic racism you're pretty unlikely to be be able to get statistical evidence versus unfortunate accident. Basically it's such an edge case, and that Gardai killing anyone is already an edge case, that relying on statistics is pretty useless since numbers are too small to differentiate between a trend and an outlier.

Blut seems to think, being a charitable reading, that racism or corruption necessarily require the kind of active bigotry you see in the worst portrayals of American cops where they actively single out and harass/kill minorities for fun. Corruption he's judging by the standards of Brazilian police. Neither of those are true and Ireland as a nation definitely has a racism issue that is largely not acknowledged by people because there's been so little exposure to it.

I have a friend who moved back to Ireland with his Argentinean wife. They left after a couple of years because she couldn't deal with people assuming she was her daughter's nanny all the time, as a single example of a pattern of behaviour from people who would assure you that they're not racist and she was just too touchy.

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

Your argument is you can't call the Gardai racist because you have to compare them with police forces outside of Ireland and doing so is detrimental to fights against racism in those other countries?

Like, if I wanted to argue that out of Irish institutions the Gards are more racist and treat minorities worse than, random example, benefits officers then you can't argue that makes them racist because there exist even worse institutions in other countries. Your argument seems to present a kind of race to the bottom situation, where protestors in the US can point to police in Brazil and shout down BLM as being damaging to anti corruption and anti racist efforts in Brazil.

Like, yes it's fine to point out that racism exists in forms, and I'd say anti traveler sentiment is pretty indicative of institutional racism. Travelers are an ethnic group within Ireland. The fact that they're also white and, say, in Brazil wouldn't be differentiated doesn't really change that. Honestly your posting comes across as someone has grown up in a genuinely worse foreign system and are just applying those standards to Ireland, including perceptions of minorities. You can argue it's myopic to judge performance and standards against a goal state but arguing that we need some global ranking and can't use terms like racist unless the police force is in the top 10 worst out whatever is just plain weird.

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

How can British police be racist towards the Irish, I cry, they're all white because whiteness is a skin colour thing totally separate from religion, culture and language.

Edit: you know what, that's stupid poo poo posting. Clearly racism isn't a simplistic thing of skin colour and cultural differences do elicit racial reactions. Sectarian differences in northern Ireland have seen enough blending and intermarrying as well as a power dynamic that it isn't clearly a racist thing but the fact that it's a remnant of a colonial project that clearly empowered one group based around ethnic identity over a massive population means I don't think you can just dismiss a racial element to it.

Again unless you're working with the kind of simple idea of racism that it means you hate people with different skin colour. Rather it means systemically you disempower people you see as lesser or other groups. It might not mean guards picking the black lad out of a group of drunk students and beating him senseless but it could mean assuming he instigated if someone else beats him up. Or that the polish fella whose reporting a theft is making up for the insurance because that's the sort of thing they get up to. Those kind of incidents aren't on the level of coordinated harassment of minority groups but by Blur's standards we can't call it systemic racism because that will legitimise and empower cops in Portland.

MrNemo fucked around with this message at 00:33 on Jan 6, 2021

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

In fairness my first thought was I need to start posting about how Gerry and Martin are back planting packages around Belfast, watch out everyone! In various family chats. I don't think o I've quite gotten to the level of ironically equating Sin Fein and the modern American republican party as terrorist organisations though.

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

Not gonna lie, kind of enjoying the current Tory party pulling off the mask to reveal that the UK means England and maybe the elements of Scotland and Wales that don't speak too weirdly and like to go fox hunting. Unionism is an ideology of the regions, in Westminster it just means there are some extra colours on the flag and everything else is basically the same. Brexit is essentially the first time a UK government has been forced to make a choice between the territorial integrity of the UK and achieving an English political goal and it has been clearly shown that NI, Gibraltar, etc. aren't part of the UK as the British mainland is. It is frustrating to see the same rear end in a top hat politicians who pushed for Brexit so they could guarantee being able to keep abortions illegal and possibly hoped to bring back border checks in Armagh, trying to blame everyone else for the shitshow they campaigned for.

It's far too soon to tell but it's going to be interesting (and potentially horrifying) to see what the aftershocks of Brexit do to the situation in the North.

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

One aspect of the NI situation I always found kind of fascinating was the self-identification with the Israeli situation - Seeing Palestinian flags flying in Nationalist areas and (less frequently) Israeli ones flying from Unionist houses. I suspect that the current Israeli situation would basically be the dream of most Unionists, where Catholic enclaves could be designated as the 'Catholic Ulster Territory' and not part of NI or the Republic and they could have a corrupt government with fringe religious parties basically holding sway over a slightly-more-functional-than-real-life Stormont.

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

That film reminds me a lot of a story my aunt had of an Argentinian student learning English. He'd grown up in Gaiman so spoke Spanish and Welsh and decided to move to Wales to study/work so he wouldn't have to learn a new language. After a couple of weeks he realised he'd need to learn English in order to live in Wales. That was back in the late 90s but I doubt it's very different now.

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

I don't think there's anything about being trans at all. From what little I remember of the old testament, there's rules against being gay but it's pretty much treated the same as rules against masturbaron or adultery. It's basically don't have sex that isn't going to be getting you heirs and continuing the Jewish people. New testament didn't have much focus as most of early church were expecting Christ to come back before any of it mattered too much.

MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

Bigger issue I'd say is the treaty ceding the 6 counties meant the way ended with Ireland controlling 26 more than they did at the start. Ukraine ceding 5 provinces would mean controlling 5 less than at the start.

This isn't going into the question of whether the Unionists in the 6 counties at the time would have acquiesced or successfully taking them would have meant a much longer and bloodier civil war. I don't think there's a real separatist threat in eastern Ukraine any more.

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MrNemo
Aug 26, 2010

"I just love beeting off"

You... Think the 'West' has somehow played a strategic master stroke and baited Russia into invading a neighbouring country to seize territory/implement regime change multiple times over a decade? All in order to put money in the hands of defence contractors?

I mean, I guess do you really think Ukrainians and Russians are just dancing to the tune of some CIA psyop and aren't making any choices for themselves? Cause this seems even more far-fetched than suggesting that the second Iraq war was in fact a Saudi plot to make the US more dependent on their oil resources and in fact we should be mad at the previous Saudi king for all the deaths and chaos in the middle East, let's not discuss the American role.

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