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Batterypowered7 posted:It was good enough for the Gameboy and the SNES! And a fair few DOS programs and games. Probably bits and pieces of later software, too; C compilers used to be worse at optimisation and projects used to be smaller.
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Mar 25, 2021 16:36
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Plinkey posted:Honestly python is the second worst way to learn to program behind Javascript lol
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Mar 25, 2021 17:02
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I enrolled in computer college due to the pandemic and have been learning C#, JS/Web design, SQL, and Linux So far C# and SQL have been my favorites. Things are generally sensible and consistent. The biggest struggle is figuring out the correct syntax sometimes. Javascript on the other hand sucks and I hate it. Debugging is much more difficult and it often feels like I'm dealing with a Frankenstein slapped together language like English
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Mar 25, 2021 18:49
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Away all Goats posted:So far C# and SQL have been my favorites. Things are generally sensible and consistent. The biggest struggle is figuring out the correct syntax sometimes. If you like C# and SQL you should check out LINQ and Entity Framework, they really simplify databases to the point where you barely need to write any actual SQL queries. Away all Goats posted:Javascript on the other hand sucks and I hate it. Debugging is much more difficult and it often feels like I'm dealing with a Frankenstein slapped together language like English Plain JS sucks and I don't like working with it but TypeScript makes it much more approachable and closer to C#. It doesn't help as much with debugging but at least it prevents you from making a bunch of stupid errors that JS would happily let you make until runtime, like passing an array instead of a number or whatever dumb poo poo it doesn't care about.
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Mar 25, 2021 19:25
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Away all Goats posted:Javascript on the other hand sucks and I hate it. Debugging is much more difficult and it often feels like I'm dealing with a Frankenstein slapped together language like English This just means you're ready to join us as old men shaking our fists at the youth and their weird culture - skipping directly past the optimistic youth phase. Just wait until we tell you about the state of the frameworks and build tools. (Typescript does look kind of neat, though.) If you like C# , you may also be reasonably comfortable with Java. It's slightly clunkier, but compared to most other languages they're practically siblings.
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Mar 25, 2021 20:38
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Computer viking posted:If you like C# , you may also be reasonably comfortable with Java. It's slightly clunkier, but compared to most other languages they're practically siblings. I had multiple semesters of Java in college and my main complaint about Java was that all the free IDEs I tried really sucked. Netbeans was slow as hell and the primary purpose of Eclipse was to constantly crash. Nowadays there are more options though, and Visual Studio Code probably supports Java better than any of the programs I used.
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Mar 25, 2021 20:53
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BonerKid posted:I had multiple semesters of Java in college and my main complaint about Java was that all the free IDEs I tried really sucked. Netbeans was slow as hell and the primary purpose of Eclipse was to constantly crash. Nowadays there are more options though, and Visual Studio Code probably supports Java better than any of the programs I used. I must have been fortunate. I used Eclipse all throughout college to program in both C++ and Java without any issues.
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Mar 25, 2021 21:03
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BonerKid posted:If you like C# and SQL you should check out LINQ and Entity Framework, they really simplify databases to the point where you barely need to write any actual SQL queries. Just be careful with this because it can scale terribly for a lot of data. If things seem slow check out what the linq is compiling to on your sql server. Linq is great for in memory data manipulation and filtering though.
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Mar 25, 2021 21:06
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I thought Netbeans was ok when I used it on ca 2008 vintage hardware - but yes, a little bit slow. I liked it better than Eclipse at the time, but I haven't written any Java for years. Java people I have talked to all love IntelliJ, but that's obviously not free.
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Mar 25, 2021 22:12
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Computer viking posted:I thought Netbeans was ok when I used it on ca 2008 vintage hardware - but yes, a little bit slow. I liked it better than Eclipse at the time, but I haven't written any Java for years. Java people I have talked to all love IntelliJ, but that's obviously not free. IntelliJ community edition is free, just not as many bells and whistles as paid, and its what all the developers use where I work. Well except for 2 that use eclipse, and no one can help. Or just do it old school and do it all command line and the text editor of your choice.
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Mar 25, 2021 22:52
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MarxCarl posted:IntelliJ community edition is free, just not as many bells and whistles as paid, and its what all the developers use where I work. Well except for 2 that use eclipse, and no one can help. Or just do it old school and do it all command line and the text editor of your choice. IntelliJ products (looking at you, RubyMine) are bloated piles of trash that hog inordinate amounts of system resources. I spent a few weeks setting up VIM, and ZSH, and never looked back.
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Mar 26, 2021 00:09
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Scald posted:IntelliJ products (looking at you, RubyMine) are bloated piles of trash that hog inordinate amounts of system resources. I spent a few weeks setting up VIM, and ZSH, and never looked back. Did it take you a few weeks because you couldn't figure out how to exit out of Vim?
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Mar 26, 2021 00:10
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the ballmer peak is real and i utilize it often that might help
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Mar 26, 2021 00:11
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https://github.com/hakluke/how-to-exit-vim
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Mar 26, 2021 00:14
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Batterypowered7 posted:Did it take you a few weeks because you couldn't figure out how to exit out of Vim? Rebinding the meta key is but a part of the process.
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Mar 26, 2021 00:14
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was about to say "just do :q" but then i realized That's The Joke
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Mar 26, 2021 00:16
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[esc]wq! gently caress I INSERTED SOMETHING SOMEHOW
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Mar 26, 2021 00:19
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Plinkey posted:[esc]wq! surely you dont need the ! if youre also doing w
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Mar 26, 2021 00:21
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I remember when I first learned how to exit vim. What a day!
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Mar 26, 2021 00:28
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https://www.gnu.org/fun/jokes/ed-msg.html
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Mar 26, 2021 00:30
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hbag posted:surely you dont need the ! if youre also doing w i dont even know what the ! means, its just habit from vxworks on test flight radar systems
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Mar 26, 2021 00:35
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Plinkey posted:i dont even know what the ! means, its just habit from vxworks on test flight radar systems it basically means "gently caress you do it anyway", particularly when vi starts bitching that you have unsaved work when you try and exit
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Mar 26, 2021 00:36
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hbag posted:it basically means "gently caress you do it anyway", particularly when vi starts bitching that you have unsaved work when you try and exit that makes sense, since it was the manual for the system and we were spending like 20k an hour flying around
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Mar 26, 2021 00:38
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w is write, q is quit, so q! Is "quit, even if there are unsaved changes" and wq is "save and quit". Presumably wq! is "try to save, then quit even if it fails"?
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Mar 26, 2021 01:21
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Computer viking posted:w is write, q is quit, so q! Is "quit, even if there are unsaved changes" and wq is "save and quit". Presumably wq! is "try to save, then quit even if it fails"? Wouldn't have to worry about all that if you just used Ed.
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Mar 26, 2021 01:24
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Batterypowered7 posted:Did it take you a few weeks because you couldn't figure out how to exit out of Vim? I was going to make a joke of some ridiculous way to exit vim by killing the process in another window but it turns out there is an entire github page just to that. lmao
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Mar 26, 2021 01:28
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Who else owns a laminated vim cheat sheet??
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Mar 26, 2021 03:38
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re: Vim chat, what's up with the Vim vs. Emacs factions that I seem to see all over the internet? What's so great about either? For reference, I mostly do Python stuff in Windows for science-related tasks, but I've been meaning to learn Linux since I know the command line tools are really powerful and whatnot.
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Mar 26, 2021 03:47
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Zugzwang posted:re: Vim chat, what's up with the Vim vs. Emacs factions that I seem to see all over the internet? What's so great about either? https://xkcd.com/378/
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Mar 26, 2021 03:51
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i use doom emacs so i can piss off everyone at the same time
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Mar 26, 2021 04:04
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Plinkey posted:Honestly python is the second worst way to learn to program behind Javascript Not everyone desires to be a c++ developer, maybe they want to have a job in an easier language??
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Mar 26, 2021 05:34
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JavaScript and Python are fun, I use them in production code at my job in Data Visualization Why yes, Goons did call me a hipster not-real-developer when I asked for advice in the Newbie thread 7 years ago One more reason I started the OG thread
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Mar 26, 2021 06:01
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Muk Dumpster posted:Not everyone desires to be a c++ developer, maybe they want to have a job in an easier language?? 
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Mar 26, 2021 06:03
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Zugzwang posted:re: Vim chat, what's up with the Vim vs. Emacs factions that I seem to see all over the internet? What's so great about either? Which is better is just personal preference, so at its core it’s just a nerd fight. It’s been going on since at least the 70’s. Just use what you like and move on. This has a decent comparison of the 2 https://linuxhint.com/vim_vs_emacs/ TLDR nerds fight over anything. Both have benefits and weaknesses, though vim is superior cause it’s not a bloated freaking operating system and Richard Stallman isn’t attached to it.
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Mar 26, 2021 12:01
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Zugzwang posted:re: Vim chat, what's up with the Vim vs. Emacs factions that I seem to see all over the internet? What's so great about either? These days, I think the emacs/vim animosity is sort of a standing joke; they're both marginal and hardcore enough that it no longer feels like a culture war. Historically, vim was the "I just want a small text editor that's smart enough to not be annoying to program in" choice. The keybindings have a learning curve, but they allow you do do a lot of text operations very fast when you know them. Emacs is heavier, though to a degree you won't notice anymore - I think it the joke used to be "Eight Megabytes [of RAM] And Constantly Swapping". What you get for that mind-boggling waste of memory is something vaguely related to a modern IDE: You can have multiple documents (including temporary ones to dump text in for a bit), the UI is kind-of menu and drop-down inspired, and the entire program is written in a real programming language that you can interact with and extend from inside the editor. This means you can write your own macros and give them keyboard shortcuts, for one thing. There are also emacs addons that add things like an email client, a calendar, a (supposedly good) project tracking system, and of course you can use it as a calculator, just to start somewhere. In modern parlance, vim is kind of towards the Notepad++/Sublime text/BBedit end of things - it edits text well, does highlighting and indentation, and if you're adventurous I guess you can bolt on some form of code completion. Emacs is somewhat akin to using Visual Studio for everything, I guess? The ability to poke around in the internals and add code while running, and working with your document as data is more unusual (though not something you need to use) - it's kind of a LISP hallmark. (I use ee as my CLI editor, but can fall back to vim if needed. This gives me about the same street cred as only programming in Visual Basic for Applications.) Computer viking fucked around with this message at 12:17 on Mar 26, 2021 |
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Mar 26, 2021 12:10
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Muk Dumpster posted:Not everyone desires to be a c++ developer, maybe they want to have a job in an easier language?? what? the difficulty of using C++ isn't that it's strongly typed, it's that it forces you to do a lot of your own memory management (the better to give you flexibility and the ability to write extremely performant code), and doesn't come with a lot of conveniences out of the box. you can have a strongly typed language with a large standard library, for example C#
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Mar 26, 2021 12:47
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Muk Dumpster posted:Not everyone desires to be a c++ developer, maybe they want to have a job in an easier language?? If you don't learn c++ how are you going to disassemble a dll and modify a single function for a goon private game server of a 20 year old game? This and nothing else is the purpose of being a programmer.
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Mar 26, 2021 14:59
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Everyone who programs seriously should learn how to use a statically typed language at some point, but there's no need for that to be your first language. In my experience it's easier for people who started with a statically typed language to switch to something dynamically typed than it is to go the other way, but it's also easier to get started with something dynamically typed, so there's no really clear best choice there.
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Mar 26, 2021 15:08
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Muk Dumpster posted:Not everyone desires to be a c++ developer, maybe they want to have a job in an easier language?? Everyone should feel the pain and triumph of seeing how much faster it is to sort an array of structs by pointers vs moving the objects in memory
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Mar 26, 2021 15:16
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Plinkey posted:Everyone should feel the pain and triumph of seeing how much faster it is to sort an array of structs by pointers vs moving the objects in memory What language are you thinking of that has c style passed-by-value structs but doesn't have pointers available. Lisp?
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Mar 26, 2021 15:49
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