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Jazerus
May 24, 2011



so how do you think the wizarding world is handling brexit?

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Jazerus
May 24, 2011



furthermore, do you think the wizards told bojo about the ministry of magic

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



so is anyone else in the "hated the sixth book, loved the sixth movie" camp?

it's honestly the only film in the whole series that i think holds up outside the perspective of a megafan and/or child. michael gambon was obviously cast specifically to be HBP-dumbledore, which he does a fantastic job of unlike his total botching of the still-mostly-whimsical dumbledore of 3-5. daniel radcliffe is obviously having a blast. and the dude who played slughorn just nailed it. i don't think any of the other films really captured the spirit of the books in the same way, they were too busy shuttling around between plot points to do school life stuff. but HBP is allll school life, and it makes for a very light-hearted fun ride.

except in the book, the emotional tenor is just bleak and mean and sucks all of the fun out of everything. harry is terrible, hermione is suddenly really terrible, and ron is...there. i guess he's fine and having a good time playing quidditch and poo poo.

i think reading HBP was the first time i realized that rowling was planning to drive the series straight into the ground at the end and deathly hallows was just a sad confirmation that she had no idea how the gently caress to end the thing

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



the absolute worst part of book 7 is how it hinges on a bunch of wand loyalty bullshit that was never discussed previously. not even a hint that wands changing owners is a thing, in fact, strong evidence to the contrary is present through the rest of the series!

you'd think ollivander might hand his customers a pamphlet about the topic if your wand might decide it likes somebody else better for a variety of obscure reasons

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Guy A. Person posted:

I feel like there's a few reasons it wouldn't be common knowledge. One big one going into Hogwarts is that it's probably a bad idea to tell a bunch of kids that they can gently caress up each other's ability to use their wands by stealing them (although, this doesn't explain why someone like Lucius never told Draco since it's the exact type of poo poo he does in earlier books so Draco constantly has the upper hand against his peers). Another is that -- outside the Order and the death eaters -- the vast majority of wizards are non-combatants and/or totally gormless so it's not something that's likely ever to come up, and would likely just lead to a bunch of annoying questions for wizard IT (e.g. "if I forget my wand on the bus and a stranger hands it to me, do they own it now??").

But yeah it absolutely should have come up sooner particularly in both books 2 and 5 where kids are practicing Expeliarmus and wands are flying all over the goddamn place.

personally i choose to presume that you can never lose ownership of a wand (other than the elder wand, which seems more sentient than the rest), but a wand can choose to accept additional masters and seizing the wand in combat virtually guarantees its allegiance. the elder wand detected that another wand owned by its master was being wielded by harry and said "oh, okay, dude beat the gently caress out of my master so gently caress that guy" and accepted harry, not in some metaphysical way at the moment that harry disarmed draco, but during the final battle.

it's the only way any of it can make sense in the context of expelliarmus being a trivial, basic spell

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



reignofevil posted:

It's time we admit that Arthur Weasley has a crippling addiction to gambling.

arthur spends half his paycheck on valuable muggle artifacts that some bozo picked up for 5 pounds at the grocery store and then resold for 50 galleons

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



i'm arthur weasley and i pay 20 galleons for a toilet plunger that i don't understand and will never use

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



josh04 posted:

Look, there's one kind of.magic stronger even than pure motherly love, and that's property rights. Malfoy paid for that mansion!

ah. the ancient arcane art of praxeology

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



no blue women, 5/10

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



there are like 5 actually competent death eaters. bellatrix, snape, lucius, rookwood, and...uh...dolohov maybe?

i've always gotten the impression that the older generation that voldemort started the organization with was more competent but they're literally all dead

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Fantastic Foreskin posted:

From what I remember (and its been forever and day since I've read LotR), its implied Tom's power is geographically limited.

But yeah, you be an immortal god-like being and try giving a gently caress after a while. Gandalf has to go rein in his brother.

nah tom's limited range is self-imposed because he doesn't want to leave his wife, who is a river. he can go anywhere.

he's god-like in a sense, but his agency is limited by his nature. he only understands mortals in a very abstract way, doesn't even seem to understand the ring or why someone would want it. his immunity to the ring comes from that, not any godly resistance. he's not going to go traipsing around to do anything about it because he doesn't really do things, period. he's not a person, not in the same way that mortals are, or maiar like gandalf, or even the valar.

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



amigolupus posted:

So who would be the Tom Bombadil of Harry Potter? I don't mean in the 'doesn't care about the plight of others' way because that'd be all the characters. I mean in the 'you can cut this notable person out and it wouldn't change a single thing about the overarching story' sort of way.

harry potter

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



does harry even learn a single spell after the "knock someone unconscious" spell? i mean i guess "render people helpless and then knock them out" is the basic skillset of a wannabe cop but his total lack of interest in anything that isn't really mundane is dumb as hell

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Sydin posted:

He picks up patronus in PoA and a decent handful of utility and offensive spells in Goblet to prepare for the dragon and the maze, all of which he imparts to his secret club in OotP. That's also the first one where he uses an unforgivable curse, and in HBP he learns Snape's dark magic spell and almost kills Draco with it. He doesn't learn anything new in the final book but it's the one where he starts flinging the imperius curse around left and right on top of crucio.

The lack of spell diversity among the core trio is pretty lame, particularly from Hermione who's supposed to be some spellcasting genius. You hear cool poo poo in Goblet about how Krum transfigured himself into a wereshark for the lake challenge or the duel in OotP where Dumbledore animates a ton of statues to intercept killing spells and dogpile Voldy, but the core trio just never really bothers beyond charms, DatDA, and in the last book a shitload of unforgivable curses.

okay but he learns stupefy in OotP i think. as soon as he gets the Cop Spell he stops, i think sectumsempra is legit the only spell he learns after stupefy. the unforgivables don't really count because you apparently don't have to put any effort into mastering them, which i guess makes sense. they're especially reviled because they're both easy and awful

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Cranappleberry posted:

They were all atwitter with much aghast groaning when a "shrill" young woman made them get up and do stuff and started talking about "rights" and "corruption"

and then they all flooded the papers with cynical articles about hermione's horrific anticentaurism, leading to her being forced to resign in "disgrace", and it was business as usual again

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Zesty posted:

Hermione kidnapped a woman and stuck her in a jar for a month, and then blackmailed that woman to let her go.

Because she wrote bullshit tabloid articles.

But it's okay. JK Rowling made sure we knew how mannish and unattractive she was so it's okay for her to experience extrajudicial hell.

tell me that you wouldn't put david brooks in a jar, if given the chance

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



getting Your Boy into Those Newfangled Machines was the done thing in the late 80s and early 90s, britain had a stronger computer culture than most places at the time (but worse computers )

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



CainFortea posted:

He could just drop a small chunk of his fortune and improve the life of his best friend's family, who took him in and treated him with love and kindness the likes of which he'd never seen, with a snap.

Never does.

why that wouldn't be proper, they're of irish descent after all. what would they even do with the money, etc. etc.

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



amigolupus posted:

You're thinking of Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality, which a goon tried to read through in this thread. The author, Eliezer Yudkowsky, isn't even an AI researcher, it's just some dude with a blog who thinks intelligence = superiority. They wrote a Harry Potter AU with the intent of using it as a teaching tool to others about Enlightenment and Rationality, but it's about as useful as trying to claim TVTropes is a good learning tool on writing.

A few of the things I remember about the fic that got mentioned in the thread are:
- Hariezer Yudotter is such an entitled and obnoxious little sociopath who will lie to, manipulate and outwit anyone and everyone who tries to be a teacher to him, because the author has contempt for school systems.
- 11-year old Yudotter and Draco discussing Pureblood Politics AKA how Draco will rape 10-year old Luna Lovegood as soon as he's old enough to do so.
- Quirrelmort of all people being turned into this Cool and Mysterious and Rational mentor figure to Yudotter. I think he lasts several years instead of just one, and changes the DADA class into an Enders' Game team battle ripoff.
- Hermione attempts to be Rational and fawn/study under Yudotter. This includes trying to lead a feminist group in Hogwarts and failing miserably because she wasn't Smart enough.
- A loving crapton of scientific and AI terms thrown around in the story. Actual science goons in the thread would point out poo poo that Yudotter either gets completely wrong or uses in the wrong context.

As for the cult itself, Yudotter founded MIRI, the "Machine Intelligence Research Institution". The main thing they're researching goes like this:

1) One day there's going to be a really powerful AI that can do almost anything. To make sure it doesn't eradicate humans, we should do everything we can to make sure the AI favors humans.
1.5) Donate to their cult now!
2) If the AI is omnipotent, then the most Rational Decision that's best for the world would be to help it come into existence faster. Inversely, the worst thing (from the AI's perspective) is to delay its glorious ascencion. The AI is also omniscient and will know who are the ones who donated for its birth.
2.5) Have you donated yet? Because you should, so the almighty AI knows you're a Rational person!
3) The AI is like Santa and has a nice and naughty list. The AI will motivate the sickos who didn't donate by simulating a virtual version of you, and then torturing it. Hell, it could simulate torturing billions of you!
4) In fact, you might be a simulation right now and not even know it! So be sure to donate now in order to save yourself, because that's what Rational people do!
5) ???????
5) Profit!

as much as i hate to defend yud in any way, two things are wrong in this post

1. quirrell still only lasted a year. the fic itself, in fact, only covers first year. yud, btw, couldn't even be bothered to read the first book, something that a twelve year old could do in an afternoon; his fic is based on the movie and also other fanfiction, but not the book.

2. yud does not use roko's basilisk (the torture AI) as incentive for his cultists. ostensibly, MIRI exists to facilitate the existence of an AI that wouldn't do the basilisk thing because it has a sense of right and wrong (MIRI really exists to be a group of people who constantly tell yud what a smart boy he is) and for many years yud considered "knowledge" of the basilisk to be extremely dangerous because if you fall for it you're going to work against MIRI's goal of a moral ("Friendly") AI

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Zore posted:

He was halfblood, his dad was a wizard and mom was a muggle which is why they were targeted by Greyback iirc.

his dad tried to get greyback executed because werewolves are "soulless, evil, deserving nothing but death" apparently

if one thing is true about wizards, it's that they try as hard as possible to get murdered by saying bigoted poo poo constantly

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Edgar Allen Ho posted:

There's also a french mythological creature that is house elf-ish. They do farm work for you if you respect them and come gently caress up your poo poo and steal your kids like fey pranksters if you disrespect them. Kinda a better deal all around than the literal slave elves.

house elves are brownies that have had some kind of nasty slavery spell put on their entire species imo

probably britain is the only nation that hasn't voluntarily removed the spell, if anyone else even did it to begin with. the other students shunned hermione's campaign to free the house elves mostly because her ideas sounded dangerously french

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Edgar Allen Ho posted:

well yeah, JK Rowling was an extremely hetero extremely cis (and also extremely trash terf centrist gammon) woman trying to write from the perspective of a hetero teenaged boy. So you get poo poo like "Sirius loomed sexily from the doorway, his tight abs and thin-yet-oh-so-toned arms crossed hornily while his long dark hair hung just so down to his shoulders. Also Ginny was there and she smelled nice and was good sports, what a hottie."

you're thinking of cassandra claire

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Asterite34 posted:

The indefensible part was sending him back to the orphanage during the summer, because Wizard Child Protective Services apparently aren't a thing and now you've put him back in a place he hates, only now he's more powerful and knowledgeable about wizard bigotry.

don't forget the part where they sent him back to london every summer....during world war loving 2!!

he does at least manage to ride out all but a few days of the blitz at hogwarts but still, goddamn dumbledore!!!

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



yes but to be fair, divination class appears to be mostly about staring at chicken entrails while arithmancy involves commanding the universe to do a statistical analysis for you that is guaranteed to be accurate

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



reignofevil posted:

I'd read about Cop Hagrid.... wait that'd just pretty much be fantastic beasts....

hagrid would be a cop

on the side of the animals. some people refer to them as "ecoterrorists"

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Ccs posted:

Is there a consensus about when JKR's writing really turned for the worse? Was it when she moved away from the more middle-grade writing of the series toward the death and destruction of the last book? Or did it take until The Cursed Child and the recent Fantastic Beasts movies for her writing to really degrade?

I have too much nostalgia wrapped up in the original 7 books to say any of them were written badly but everything I've seen of Cursed Child just seems comically bad and while the first Fantastic Beasts was sort of alright, Crimes of Grindlewald was an incoherent mess.

cursed child is absolutely on another tier of bad from the first seven books, but HBP is where the wheels really start falling off imo. OotP is a possible candidate but i think it's reasonably solid in comparison.

FunkyAl posted:

riker pooping and vomiting on the holodeck.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GM-e46xdcUo

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



SlothfulCobra posted:

Are the Fantastic Beast movies intended for children? Nothing I've seen about them really seems to indicate that to me.

Also if they're following the flow of the books/previous movie series and pandering to people who are already fans of the franchise, it seems more natural that they'd be for adults who followed along as the series matured from being for pre-teens to late teens. A lot of franchises targeted primarily at children need to reorganize and refocus at some point to draw in the next generation, but I don't think I've really seen signs of that with Harry Potter yet.

FB1 seemed...kind of immature, yeah. in a different way than the original books and films. it was more cartoonish. i didn't see FB2 tho.

i don't think the franchise is really interested in continuing to pander to the original audience that are now adults, nor reorganizing and refocusing, just luring kids into picking up the pre-existing material with various ancillary pieces of trash that will get them asking about the books

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Panic! At The Tesco posted:

I always wonder if the high school JK Rowling went to had a house system and took it super seriously.

We had houses in my normal Scottish high school back in the late 90's/early 00's but nobody gave a poo poo about them and they didn't matter for anything.

it's just another riff on how wizards are a hundred years behind the times

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Guy A. Person posted:

The fourth year starts with the cool lesson on Nifflers and then they spend a bunch of the year raising Blast Ended Screwts for the tournament, which is weird but honestly an ongoing project about actually raising a magical creature is pretty in line with the class (instead of just having a spotlight creature every week).

the only thing sort of dodgy about the skrewts is that they're an experimental cross-breed but honestly that just makes it even cooler as a class project. they're doing original research in like 8th grade

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Regalingualius posted:

-Harry goes through a whole crisis of realizing that he was largely coasting through Hogwarts, and basically has to learn how to learn all over again, struggling with most of his coursework. Also maybe some actual expounding on his relationship with Ginny?

i literally don't think harry ever learned how to learn. do we ever even see him count beyond like, twenty in any detail??? i firmly believe that he's very nearly illiterate and innumerate because his early good grades were harshly punished. the dude is at like a third grade level in his muggle education

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Algol Star posted:

Honestly it's amazing how good of a satire jkr wrote without meaning to at all.

it seems to me that when she was a poor single mother the satire was entirely conscious and intentional, so plot points and character details that she dreamed up in the first couple of years writing the series retain that spirit throughout. but then her brain broke and she no longer understood the satirical elements of the setting. altho i always liked the detail that vernon is an avid daily mail reader

the ministry being deeply evil in a very mundane governmental kind of way and eventually folding to voldemort without a fight was probably conceived of during the planning stages of book 2 or 3 at the latest

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Cranappleberry posted:

oh hell yea we get to talk about Vernon Dursley. Mr. Dursley was the director of a firm called Grunnings, which made drills. He was a big, beefy man with hardly any neck, although he did have a very large mustache.

lmbo

aunt marge is absolutely outraged that brexit means she's getting kicked out of spain (she voted for it)

halokiller posted:

So what happened to the dementors, you know the unkillable, soul-sucking demon monsters?

harry catches criminals and hands them over to the dementors of course. he's a cop

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



reignofevil posted:

There were killing curses being thrown around the school because of Dumbledore's decisions. You can't point to the concept of keeping a student safe as justification for endangering every single student there. Especially the muggleborns who would have died ugly if some other things Dumbledore had never anticipated for had happened that evening and the death eaters took the school.

yes but have you considered that draco is a rich failson who cannot be blamed for his mistakes

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Cranappleberry posted:

I am up here just screaming at Keanu Reeves. You fools. You jackasses.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzYulkD13D0

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



josh04 posted:

Have we considered the possibility that Voldemort came back wrong? That the tactical, manipulative genius who wreaked havoc on the wizard world fifteen years earlier actually lost a whole lot of lateral thinking power when he got turned into a shrimp man, and the idiot king who can't murder a child, of books five, six and seven, is coasting entirely on rep?

it turns out that splitting your soul up is kind of a bad idea. makes you smell bad and think like a moron.

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



SlothfulCobra posted:

The whole point of slurpin' that blood was so that it would help Voldemort, so I don't see why the curse wouldn't affect Voldemort just like the magic nutrients.

drat unicorns must have a shitload of adrenochrome

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Rockstar Massacre posted:

Voldemort making significant magical items and stashing them in prominent places makes sense for reasons other than his ego; he was basically experimenting with close to unknown and barely documented magic on himself to a degree that had probably never been done before.

So it might help to have the results of those experiments accessible and easy to identify. He plans on living forever, so thinking long-term is a good move.

sure, you should still send one to mars or something even if you want the rest hanging around tho

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Sydin posted:

Close to unknown and barely document magic that was apparently just freely available in the Hogwarts library if you knew what book to look for.

i'm the guy who ordered a book called magicke most evile for the school library

Jazerus
May 24, 2011



muscles like this! posted:

Something I was thinking about today was that it is kind of messed up that the students provide their own brooms for Quidditch. That kind of seems like something you would use standardized brooms for to avoid rich students having an unfair advantage.

im not sure you understand britain

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Jazerus
May 24, 2011



Regalingualius posted:

Why not formally turn the Snitch into the instant win condition it practically already is, but add in some constraints to the rest of the game? Like, highest scorer after half an hour is the winner, or whoever reaches some high watermark score? That way there’s still the tension of whether Harry’s going to be the one to catch it, as well as the obvious setup for a final match that goes down to the wire with Gryffindor about to lose if he doesn’t do it.

that would have made sense for rowling to write, if she had been attempting to write a coherent sport at all. remember this is the lady who had like 3 real sports scenes in her, and once they were written she simply came up with excuses for why harry wasn't going to play that year. it's intended as yet another weird wizard cultural detail.

but i've seen fairly decent arguments that the rules of quidditch as written are workable on a league level, just not the school level. if everyone is good at the game, and the snitch is set to a much higher "difficulty setting", then 150 points is not an instant win but a tie-breaker as games tend to run longer and rack up much higher scores than hogwarts quidditch. the seeker is effectively the least important person on a team; still important, but increasingly less so as the match wears on

Jazerus fucked around with this message at 04:44 on May 15, 2021

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