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mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



General Dog posted:

Speaking of, what’s the word on the horse testicles in this game?

Can't speak for the horses, but ...

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mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



plasm posted:

Killing a protagonist and taking the antagonist’s viewpoint has been done to death recently and to me it comes across as a bit lazy.

Can you name a few games that did that? I can't think of one off the tip of my head and quiete frankly, I was pretty floored when I realized they were going for this in TLOU2 - it only fully dawned on me when I opened the character screen and saw that Abby had her own supplement skill progression. Up to that point I thought it was just another interlude like the other flashbacks of her.

Although it would be pointless to name other games, since it would ruin the surprise. So nevermind then.

I guess I'm just a chump who fully fell for it this time, and I mean that in the best way possible. I thought it was a ballsy move that paid off in the long run.

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



RottenK posted:

lots of people legit didn't get that Joel is a bad, or at least morally complicated person

I would argue that it's fairly hard to keep riding that high horse of being a moral beacon of light in a world of unprecedented turmoil.

I would even wager that most people have done some ambiguous if not downright atrocious poo poo 2-3 years into a literal zombie apocalypse with warring factions, scarce resources and a collapsed society. Those who didn't are probably the corpses you see sitting in chairs all over the world, being dead but really nice fellas.

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



JBP posted:

Ellie becomes a hosed up emotional cripple with no friends and a hosed hand then wanders off into the forests. The end

Ellie goes back to Jackson. Tommy walks up to her: "Well, did you kill her this time, Ellie?"

Ellie, looking down at her feet, shuffling some dirt: "No."

Tommy: "Goddamnit, Ellie. You made a promise. Pack your bags and go again. You got 8 more fingers!"

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



Indecisive posted:

Looking at a map of Seattle the space needle is like.. half a mile from the convention center, which is definitely on the 'mainland' in TLOU2 and not the island, so I'm guessing creative liberties were taken

I figured that due to the flooding in Seattle, maybe the sea levels have risen and split some parts off the mainland?

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



bobjr posted:

I do like how Ellie weaponizes her immunity a few times in the game.

That little, hardly noticeable smirk when the ponytailed Rattler points out she's been bitten and is running out of time ... :discourse:

mcbexx fucked around with this message at 01:18 on Jun 30, 2020

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



I wonder what the ratio is between people who saw the first gameplay trailer (Ellie vs. Seraphites in the Hillcrest Mall) who cheered Ellie on and went "Holy poo poo, look at the combat and those insane kills, game is going to be siiiiiick" and those who said "Uh-oh, this game looks kinda violent. I don't think I will enjoy this. I hope there'll be a button to talk things over in civilized discourse this time."

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



Indecisive posted:

because it's generally understood that game 1 joel is a huge piece of poo poo

No it's loving not. Jesus, the lack of people being able to see nuance in a character is so loving aggravating.

Joel has survived 20 years in a zombie apocalypse when we meet him after the prologue where Sarah dies.

20 years.

It's made pretty clear that he has been surviving in a lawless, dog eat dog world with scarce resources, warring factions and scattered groups ranging from from bumbling bandits to cannibalistic communes.

Everyone gets their hands dirty in order to survive. I've said it before - there are plenty of people in the story who managed to keep their hands clean. You can find their decayed corpses sitting around all over in the abandoned apartments.

Joel is more than hesitant to take on the mission to smuggle Ellie cross country. When he argues with her after she steals a horse and rides off in Jackson he wants to get rid of her as soon as possible, saying "he sure as hell is not her father". Then they're slowly starting to form this strong bond and she becomes his surrogate daughter (after, remember, he tragically lost his first daughter 20 years ago.)

They finally arrive at their destination, only to find out the Fireflies, who have been painted to be some sort of "good" rebel group, are also pieces of poo poo - knocking out a man who is clearly not a threat and is trying to resucitate an unconcious teenager, explaining to him they will kill his surrogate daughter for the chance at a vaccine (without her knowledge or consent) and threatening to kill him "if he tries anything".

See, I don't have a daughter myself and I don't know if you do, but I can empathize enough to see that the decision to just give up your child "for a greater good", even if guaranteed or not (and the story and logic implies it's far from guaranteed), is not a black and white issue.

That leaves the final scene of the first game.
What's done is done. What are Joel's options? Admitting what he did in the hospital to a 14 year old child who has just revealed she's riddled with survivor's guilt? What good would that do?

Yes, to an extent lying to her at this point is selfish, because he does not want to lose what has basically become his family. Maybe he feels the need to justify what he did in the hospital by protecting and keeping care of Ellie from now on onwards (we learn he is overprotective even 4 years later in Jackson at the start of the events in TLOU2)

Is he a coward for avoiding the confrontation? Sure.
Does that make him a monster? Or more human?

It's baffling to me that, all this considered, someone could say

Indecisive posted:

it's generally understood that game 1 joel is a huge piece of poo poo

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



Necrothatcher posted:

within the context of the game's storytelling structure, they are not villains


Retroactively, David and his cannibal commune did nothing wrong.

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



stev posted:

Now I'm imagining her stopping mid swing to turn to the audience and sing a song about the conflict brewing in her heart.


Jump to 30:45

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJJfUTVIE98

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



Bloodcider posted:

I haven't finished the game yet and I think I've got a ways to go. Do you unlock anything afterwards like in their other games, like costumes and filters etc?

Yes, there's a lot of concept art and an very detailed model viewer where you can unlock stuff with earned points

mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



johncandy posted:

Holy gently caress 60 cutscenes? I ended up skipping about 20 of them.

johncandy posted:

Story was whatever.

I'm not going to look up if there's an SA smiley for "hmm, that's a headscratcher", just imagine I put it here. Twice.

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mcbexx
Jul 4, 2004

British dentistry is
not on trial here!



Mandrel posted:

it bummed me out because I was hoping she’d be something new and distinct from Ellie or Joel, really lean into her size and strength, but instead she actually ends up feeling weaker and more limited than Ellie (with the return of the shivs and all).

Uh oh, looks like someone did not skill into the Momentum ability.

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