|
Terrible Opinions posted:The problem with a lot of timetravel is that you either need to decide "yes change is possible and fine" in which case the Doctor should have already killed Hitler. He has time travel and he supposedly cares about earth. Or you make time travel something where you shouldn't or can't change the past in which case you can't get anything out of Hitler besides catharsis. I mean, yes. But consider that the "the doctor killed hitler" series would diverge so much from our world it would be impenetrable to get into based on the amount of social change and difference in the 'modern day' characters. It would be mostly unrelatable. The thing is, Doctor Who is fundamentally a kid's show. The marketing and the rest of the ~stuff~ is aimed primarily at children and teenagers, despite the majority of the viewers being adults. Children do not tend to give that much of a crap about this kind of thing as you would think, and it does have it's own (constantly rewritten) internal logic. It's more space opera than say, Star Trek, where the writers used and wrote technical manuals of the complex systems involved, and then converted scripts using those systems. I think it's kind of foolish to expect anything on that level from something that's been on-air for just over half a century.
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 03:17
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 09:28 |
|
|
Yeah so don't write an episode that requires you to make a point of not killing hitler in it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 03:20
|
|
|
Or an episode about torture in a kids show. Dr. Who is not a kids show
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 04:01
|
|
|
If you wanted to kill Hitler in a plausible way that isn't murdering a minor with the benefit of time travel's hindsight, nobody seems to remember that he fought in WWI, and is known to have barely survived on several occasions.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 07:56
|
|
|
Or just have the judge put him to death for treason like he should have been, instead of being given a light rear end prison sentence.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 08:00
|
|
|
Captain Monkey posted:You can’t give the person-about-to-die a life without altering the timeline. alexandriao posted:I mean, yes. But consider that the "the doctor killed hitler" series would diverge so much from our world it would be impenetrable to get into based on the amount of social change and difference in the 'modern day' characters. It would be mostly unrelatable.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 08:07
|
|
|
Terrible Opinions posted:I figured this only comes up because there are real tangible issues with messing with the timeline. If none have been found so far first target is probably Columbus tbh. This reminds me of the sheer insanity that is Pastwatch: The Redemption of Christopher Columbus, written by notable shithead Orson Scott Card. Some people invent time travel and find out that Columbus was inspired to sail west due to the intervention of another set of time travelers, who set him on that path explicitly to subjugate the Americas, because left to their own devices, a central american empire rose and conquered Europe and instituted mass human sacrifice. The problem is solved when they figure out how to send an actual humans back in time to make sure no one subjugates anyone. Someone tells Columbus what he did in an alternate timeline and he gets all weepy about it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 14:14
|
|
|
RBA Starblade posted:I know exactly two things about Stargate: 1. Kurt Russell was in the movie and 2. There's a funny scene where the egyptian styled aliens show off their martial prowess by shooting their laser sticks badly and some soldier goes "lol welcome to earth" and sprays a machine gun and everyone agrees that machine guns are pretty cool. Apparently you only know 1 thing about stargate because #2 never happens.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 15:49
|
|
|
banned from Starbucks posted:Apparently you only know 1 thing about stargate because #2 never happens. season 5 episode 18 "The Warrior" edit: found the clip https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjlCVW_ouL8 blatman has a new favorite as of 19:06 on Aug 10, 2020 |
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 19:04
|
|
|
Boxman posted:This reminds me of the sheer insanity that is Pastwatch: The Redemption of Christopher Columbus, written by notable shithead Orson Scott Card. Some people invent time travel and find out that Columbus was inspired to sail west due to the intervention of another set of time travelers, who set him on that path explicitly to subjugate the Americas, because left to their own devices, a central american empire rose and conquered Europe and instituted mass human sacrifice. And the 2 people going back manage to fix everything and we have a utopian future; thanks to blocking the influence of those Evil Europeans and Evil Aztecs, there is no slavery or human sacrifice, which were apparently the two Great Sins of humanity. I read the book at the height of my Card fandom, and even then, i thought it was bullshit. The Atlantis/Noah storyline got turned into an interesting short story, though.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 19:17
|
|
|
CharlestheHammer posted:Or an episode about torture in a kids show. avatar / post combo. British TV is not as squeamish as American TV. We don't have as loud of a puritannical section telling us we cannot have xyz on TV. Thus, Wikipedia posted:Doctor Who has always appeared initially on the BBC's mainstream BBC One channel, where it is regarded as a family show, drawing audiences of many millions of viewers And according to the Radio Times Linked Article Above posted:The majority of Doctor Who episodes in the modern series have been rated PG (Parental Guidance) by the British Board of Film Classification (BBFC), meaning that they should be fine for most kids but parents should consider whether it’s suitable if the child is under 8 or more sensitive. quote:Christopher Eccleston’s year as the Doctor included two 12-rated episodes (The Unquiet Dead and Dalek) while David Tennant’s longer stint in the Tardis saw four (Tooth and Claw, Planet of the Ood, The Doctor’s Daughter and The Waters of Mars) and Matt Smith’s Doctor only racked up two (The God Complex and The Angels Take Manhattan). "Let's Kill Hitler" was rated PG. For kids. It's a kid's show.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 22:01
|
|
|
The magic stuff in the later seasons of Farscape is really really lovely. I didn't mind the death stuff with Zhaan, but I really, really do not care for whatever the gently caress Noranti is doing with her powders and visions that she mentions in the second(?) episode can somehow change the loving past?? Like... What???
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 22:10
|
|
|
Lol usually it’s the opposite and someone is pigheadedly insistent something is not a kid show. Wild to see it from it the opposite angle. Though I’m glad the smug Euro stereotype is still a thing. Dr. Who isn’t a kids show either and and it’s a lame excuse especially after arguing that it being a kids show doesn’t limit it unless it’s convent to my argument then it does
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2020 22:23
|
|
|
blatman posted:season 5 episode 18 "The Warrior" alexandriao posted:The magic stuff in the later seasons of Farscape is really really lovely. I didn't mind the death stuff with Zhaan, but I really, really do not care for whatever the gently caress Noranti is doing with her powders and visions that she mentions in the second(?) episode can somehow change the loving past?? Like... What??? CharlestheHammer posted:Dr. Who isn’t a kids show
|
|
#
?
Aug 11, 2020 07:53
|
|
|
Tiggum posted:Have you never watched it? Watch an episode like Rosa or Orphan 55 and then try to tell me it was written for adults. It's meant to be a family show that appeals to as wide an age range as possible.
|
|
#
?
Aug 11, 2020 08:06
|
|
|
Doctor Spaceman posted:It's meant to be a family show that appeals to as wide an age range as possible. So, just like pretty much every half-decent kids show?
|
|
#
?
Aug 11, 2020 10:01
|
|
|
Tiggum posted:So, just like pretty much every half-decent kids show? No, not really. Kids shows also don't tend to be broadcast in the evening on major channels either.
|
|
#
?
Aug 11, 2020 11:14
|
|
|
Tiggum posted:Season one has an episode where they fight an immortal space wizard. There was always a lot of magic in Farscape. I always figured that was clarke's law though CharlestheHammer posted:Lol usually it’s the opposite and someone is pigheadedly insistent something is not a kid show. IT IS LITERALLY RATED "PG". IN OTHER WORDS, FOR CHILDREN. I have grown up in Britain and literally EVERYONE considers it a KIDS SHOW THAT ADULTS ALSO WATCH. Literally EVERYONE here who is into it WATCHED IT AS A CHILD. edit: also I asked the UK Chat Thread alexandriao has a new favorite as of 13:28 on Aug 11, 2020 |
|
#
?
Aug 11, 2020 12:15
|
|
|
alexandriao posted:I always figured that was clarke's law though I would have agreed with this post before I read it
|
|
#
?
Aug 11, 2020 12:36
|
|
|
The tradition with Doctor Who that's older than all of us is that children may be hiding behind the couch as they watch it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 11, 2020 12:42
|
|
|
Dabir posted:I would have agreed with this post before I read it wait do you mean that or do you mean Dabir posted:I would have agreed with this post, before I read it
|
|
#
?
Aug 11, 2020 12:59
|
|
|
Tiggum posted:Have you never watched it? Watch an episode like Rosa or Orphan 55 and then try to tell me it was written for adults. On the other hand, Love and Monsters, where a woman is trapped forever in a Hellish existence of living as a blowjob-giving piece of asphalt. You know...for kids! DrBouvenstein has a new favorite as of 13:35 on Aug 12, 2020 |
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 13:28
|
|
|
Doctor Who's always been pretty ridiculous but everything I hear about the revival seasons has it go even more up its own rear end recursively.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 16:42
|
|
|
Doctor Who is a bit too dark for a kids' show and a bit too whimsical for an adults' show so it's mostly beloved by nerds.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 19:56
|
|
|
DrBouvenstein posted:Overall, Babylon 5 is pretty tight-paced and doesn't have a ton of bad "filler" episodes (season 5 notwithstanding.) Yeah, and you went on to describe probably the two most infamous stinkers. B5, though, with its A plot/B plot (sometimes C plot) structure, managed to put at least some worthwhile development even into the otherwise most pointless episodes.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 20:00
|
|
|
DrBouvenstein posted:On the other hand, Love and Monsters, where a woman is trapped forever in a Hellish existence of living as a blowjob-giving piece of asphalt. That's... kind of a weird reading of the scene, given pavement-lady is seen to be in a happy and loving relationship with a guy who clearly thinks the world of her. I mean, yeah, her situation sucks, but if you're gonna go and tell literally every quadrapalegic in the world that their existence is a living hell then I imagine you're gonna meet with a lot of people telling you to gently caress off.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 21:13
|
|
|
alexandriao posted:IT IS LITERALLY RATED "PG". IN OTHER WORDS, FOR CHILDREN At least in the US, that isn't what PG means. Rating is only about presence/absence of sex/violence/scaryness, not audience. Like a hypothetical 3 hour documentary about the history of Formal British Tea etiquette would probably be a G rating, but not be aimed at children.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 21:21
|
|
|
Foxfire_ posted:At least in the US, that isn't what PG means. Rating is only about presence/absence of sex/violence/scaryness, not audience. Like a hypothetical 3 hour documentary about the history of Formal British Tea etiquette would probably be a G rating, but not be aimed at children. Only think aimed at children in the US is guns.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 22:12
|
|
|
Foxfire_ posted:At least in the US, that isn't what PG means. Rating is only about presence/absence of sex/violence/scaryness, not audience. Like a hypothetical 3 hour documentary about the history of Formal British Tea etiquette would probably be a G rating, but not be aimed at children. I think the all caps poster might have been being sarcastic.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 22:14
|
|
|
Foxfire_ posted:Like a hypothetical 3 hour documentary about the history of Formal British Tea etiquette would probably be a G rating, but not be aimed at children. That's maybe the worst possible example, I'm positive that in the UK a 3 hour docco on tea etiquette would be aimed at children gotta get em started early
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 23:01
|
|
|
Absurd Alhazred posted:Only think aimed at children in the US is guns. 
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2020 23:15
|
|
|
CharlestheHammer posted:He also backpedaled on the whole idea that it was comparing to real slavery. Which got undercut slightly because a black character makes that comparison in game There's a scene at the end of the game where all the robots sit down and sing we shall overcome
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2020 01:31
|
|
|
Boxman posted:This reminds me of the sheer insanity that is Pastwatch: The Redemption of Christopher Columbus, written by notable shithead Orson Scott Card. Some people invent time travel and find out that Columbus was inspired to sail west due to the intervention of another set of time travelers, who set him on that path explicitly to subjugate the Americas, because left to their own devices, a central american empire rose and conquered Europe and instituted mass human sacrifice. Why do they send him with supplies when they could just find the version that appeared with whatever supplies they wanted? Why do they kill the guy at all, and just look at his time-clone? Why don't they just look at the spot in the multiverse with the outcome they wanted and declare the job complete? Also, they never mention it, but this means that when it's time to retrieve the agents, they just... hope that the most unlikely thing in the universe happens? And it does?
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2020 09:34
|
|
|
John Lee posted:To me, that's not the dumb part of that dumbass book. It's dropped casually some ways through the book that they can't actually send people back in time at all. They have a time-viewing device, and a disintegrator. They just blow up a guy, then look for a spot in the multiverse where he appears, in the past, coalescing randomly out of particles. Did you confuse this book with Timeline by Michael Crichton or did two people use the exact same incredibly stupid form of "time travel"?
|
|
#
?
Aug 19, 2020 09:44
|
|
|
Last year I read the Frontlines series by Marko Kloos, it follows a guy who joins the military just in time for a giant alien race to target the solar system for colonisation. It does the same thing a lot of sci-fi does where you don't see the greater consequence of peoples actions and generally that doesn't spoil a story. However, in one book they find a couple of the aliens living in the ice caps in Greenland so they lob a few nukes to kill them off and everything is hunky dory. I may have this wrong but it felt like that would probably melt the ice in Greenland and have devastating effects on large parts of the world.
|
|
#
?
Sep 19, 2020 17:44
|
|
|
bessantj posted:Last year I read the Frontlines series by Marko Kloos, it follows a guy who joins the military just in time for a giant alien race to target the solar system for colonisation. It does the same thing a lot of sci-fi does where you don't see the greater consequence of peoples actions and generally that doesn't spoil a story. However, in one book they find a couple of the aliens living in the ice caps in Greenland so they lob a few nukes to kill them off and everything is hunky dory. I may have this wrong but it felt like that would probably melt the ice in Greenland and have devastating effects on large parts of the world. They lobbed a couple of nukes at Japan and it didn't melt the ice on Mt. Fuji. Why would Greenland be different? Nuclear weapons are pretty powerful on a human scale, but on a geological scale they're pretty trivial compared to even a small volcano. Of course, if you launch enough to cause a nuclear winter, then you can cause some real danage. Edit: random googling suggests it would take 10^23kJ to melt Greenland, and a strategic nuclear weapon maybe releases 10^10kJ of heat. Even if we hit Greenland with every nuclear weapon ever created, we would be at least 7 orders of magnitude short of the energy required. Bug Squash has a new favorite as of 22:01 on Sep 19, 2020 |
|
#
?
Sep 19, 2020 21:47
|
|
|
Bug Squash posted:They lobbed a couple of nukes at Japan and it didn't melt the ice on Mt. Fuji. Why would Greenland be different? Well these were into a crevice in a glacier and I wasn't thinking the whole of the ice shelf in Greenland, should have been more accurate there. But I accept I'm wrong.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2020 07:57
|
|
|
Tiggum posted:Did you confuse this book with Timeline by Michael Crichton or did two people use the exact same incredibly stupid form of "time travel"? Honestly either one seems pretty plausible.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2020 10:18
|
|
|
The conundrum with Time Travel is theres basically three ways to do it and it's wrong to act on any of them. If your working on Terminator 1 "Closed Loop" rules then theres no point in traveling because you always time traveled and nothing will change, you just wasted everyones time (pun not intended). If your working on Terminator 2 "Going back creates a new future" rules then you shouldn't go back except in the most extreme case of preventing humanities extinction via something like a robo-pocolypse (where everyone will die anyway). Because going back is literally murdering everyone currently alive by erasing the present with a different one with different, not currently existing people who didn't ask to be born. No good you do will ever be outweighed by the blood of billions of innocents on your hands. If your working on Terminator 3 and onward "You can change history but it will self-correct but only kinda" rules then you shouldn't because you're making a lovely story because these rules don't make any sense and ruin characterization. Unfortunately this is by far the most common ruleset.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2020 07:44
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 25, 2024 09:28 |
|
|
galagazombie posted:The conundrum with Time Travel is theres basically three ways to do it and it's wrong to act on any of them. My friend, let me introduce you to a little Netflix TV show called Dark.
|
|
#
?
Sep 26, 2020 07:50
|
|